OTish: Hypothetical P5 realignment

[jason21psu]

Ran across this blog on my Facebook feed. It's an interesting but never-gonna-happen idea. Good off-season fodder.

http://big12fanatics.com/ccl/

This would be your new division:

What do you think?

 

[RUtix4me]

Drop the three NC schools add, WV, PSU and Pitt.

Temple not in this?

 

[jason21psu]

Drop the three NC schools add, WV, PSU and Pitt.

Temple not in this?

In the article it explains his methodology but basically Temple was left out because he needed more western teams.

The east division where PSU, Pitt, and WVU are slotted also had Ohio State, michigan, Michigan State, Norte Dame, Indiana, Cincinnati, and Purdue.

 

[krup]

So you strip the best football schools (excepting VTech) from the early 90's Big East/ACC and throw the leftovers into a conference? Strong pass.

 

[jason21psu]

So you strip the best football schools (excepting VTech) from the early 90's Big East/ACC and throw the leftovers into a conference? Strong pass.

I'm trying to think from a RU perspective which admittedly isn't the easiest but in some ways I think it's actually pretty good for you guys. Your road to the playoff (which he proposed as 8 or 16 teams) got a lot easier. There's no consistently dominant program in your conference. I would think some school fills that role, why not you? You're in the biggest population footprint of any of the 8 proposed conferences by 12 million people, good for TV contracts/networks. Pretty good recruiting areas. I guess looking at it through a historical lens it's not super desirable but looking at it through the future potential lens I think it's pretty good.

 

[RedTeam01]

Post this on the uconn site. There'd be sticky keyboards for days.

 

[krup]

I'm trying to think from a RU perspective which admittedly isn't the easiest but in some ways I think it's actually pretty good for you guys. Your road to the playoff (which he proposed as 8 or 16 teams) got a lot easier. There's no consistently dominant program in your conference. I would think some school fills that role, why not you? You're in the biggest population footprint of any of the 8 proposed conferences by 12 million people, good for TV contracts/networks. Pretty good recruiting areas. I guess looking at it through a historical lens it's not super desirable but looking at it through the future potential lens I think it's pretty good.

It is a conference that would be constantly denigrated by the rest of college football because of its lack of traditional football powers , regardless of how well they did on the field, just like the old Big East was.

 

[tico brown]

People always trying to reinvent the wheel for no reason.

 

[Jersey Boys]

 

[vkj91]

Id like to see a conference with PSU, Baylor, FSU and a few others. We could call it the Big Rape.

 

[wheezer]

ask me 10 years ago and I might have signed up for it.... no way now

 

[bac2therac]

this is stupid, what is the point

 

[Queztastic]

Drop the three NC schools add, WV, PSU and Pitt.

If we are doing this exercise, then these three should be included instead of the NC schools. The East or Northeast includes Pennsylvania. If you go by Lambert Trophy eligibility, it consists of Pennsylvania, New Jersey, New York, and New England, with teams in surrounding states such as Maryland, West Virginia and Virginia must play half of their games against Eastern teams to be eligible. More history between those teams than the NC teams.

That being said, the B1G is where RU belongs. As an institution, its much more akin to the large public land-grant colleges ofthe Big Ten as opposed to smaller private schools such as BC and Syracuse. I get that the football schedule is murderer's row, but this where the school belongs. I also wouldn't be surprised if at one point the division requirement was eliminated by the NCAA. the ACC already wants it and the Big 12 also voted for it. Once the Big Ten or SEC decides to go to 16 teams, then the division setup doesn't really work anymore. In my opinion, the B1G would go to 2 or 3 locked-rivals every year with all other teams rotating through. Top 2 teams in the league then play in the conf champ game. Yes, even if its an OSU / UMich rematch.

 

[tico brown]

this is stupid, what is the point

A Northeast Conference without Pitt, WV, PSU, and even Temple is stupid. Hey, I got an ideas... I'm gonna write a blog of a national conference with religious schools only, THE GOD:
BC
ND
TCU
Baylor
Wake Forrest
BYU
SMU

We may only have 7 teams but we are CONFERENCE OF THE GODS, DAMMIT!!!!

 

[Upstream]

Ran across this blog on my Facebook feed. It's an interesting but never-gonna-happen idea. Good off-season fodder.

It's not an interesting idea. It is a stupid idea. It is a stupid idea. It is a stupid idea because the underlying assumption of how conferences should be set up does not make sense in today's reality.

This realignment makes the assumption that geographic proximity is the most important driver in how conferences should be aligned. And while that may have been true 75 years ago, it doesn't make sense today.

75 years ago, geographic proximity was important because travel time and travel costs were an important factor and was mostly correlated to distance. The cost of getting there (air or bus) was much greater than the cost of being there (hotel and food). Today, travel cost is a much smaller portion of athletic department budgets, and the cost of being there is a much bigger portion of the travel cost. And travel time is not as big of a deal, since air travel is more economical. Today, I can fly from New Brunswick to Madison Wisc in about the same time it takes to drive to Syracuse.

Goegraphic coverage today is more important than geographic proximity. That is why, when the SEC and Big Ten expanded, they added teams from outside their existing geographic footprint, rather than proximate teams from inside their footprint.

Also, the proposed realignment misses another big factor in conference alignment: having schools that are similar in mission. The Big Ten works because all the schools have similar missions in being major research institutions (even Northwestern, which is smaller and private, is still a major research institution). The Big East failed, at the other extreme, because the schools had completely different missions.

 

[srru86]

No thanks

 

[wheezer]

In the article it explains his methodology but basically Temple was left out because he needed more western teams.

The east division where PSU, Pitt, and WVU are slotted also had Ohio State, michigan, Michigan State, Norte Dame, Indiana, Cincinnati, and Purdue.

----
the west is much more attractive..... not as good as B1G east and not worth changing to

 

[BigLou]

Actually, contrary to what the OP says, this is not interesting at all.

From an RU fan perspective, considering this idea is sort of like dreaming about banging Lena Dunham while your lying in bed with Kate Upton.

 

[Beancounter88]

These articles are always interesting to me. Biggest flaw IMO is that he's treating it like an All-Star game - almost every state has to have a team (only ones that don't have a team are Dakotas, Montana and Alaska). Too many teams included overall. Obviously, big revenue teams would never go for and college football would risk diluting their product with too many meaningless games. I do wonder if this "academic mission in the conference" stuff is real or BS sometimes. Schools really need to play each other in football to work together in researching medical advances?

 

[vkj91]

Actually, contrary to what the OP says, this is not interesting at all.

From an RU fan perspective, considering this idea is sort of like dreaming about banging Lena Dunham while your lying in bed with Kate Upton.

Think Lena Dunham would be in the Big Rape with PSU and Baylor. Maybe she could be the commissioner?

 

[Upstream]

I do wonder if this "academic mission in the conference" stuff is real or BS sometimes. Schools really need to play each other in football to work together in researching medical advances?

No, obviously schools don't need to play each other in football to work together in medical research.

The point about similar missions has more to do with similar schools having similar objectives and goals, which allow them to have similar thinking and goals in setting conference policy and rules.

 

[RUJohnny99]

It looks like someone just threw all the leftovers into their own conference.

Just like Gavitt & Tranghese did in 1990.

 

[jason21psu]

People always trying to reinvent the wheel for no reason.

this is stupid, what is the point

It's not an interesting idea. It is a stupid idea. It is a stupid idea. It is a stupid idea because the underlying assumption of how conferences should be set up does not make sense in today's reality.

Actually, contrary to what the OP says, this is not interesting at all.

From an RU fan perspective, considering this idea is sort of like dreaming about banging Lena Dunham while your lying in bed with Kate Upton.

You guys know it's not my idea, right? It's a blog called B12 fanatics. I think most of you do but I want to make sure.

It's the off-season, signing day has come and gone, all we have left until spring practice is realignment talk.

I thought it'd be interesting since you just moved conferences 3 years ago. To me it's a blog with the objective of staving off the B12's implosion.

 

[jason21psu]

It is a conference that would be constantly denigrated by the rest of college football because of its lack of traditional football powers , regardless of how well they did on the field, just like the old Big East was.

Does it matter though? In this format you get one repsentive with an 8 team playoff and 2 with a 16. Then you just have to win the playoff games.

In all honesty don't you think it's a more straight forward and realistic path towards being a dominant program. As is you're going to have a heck of a time just getting consistently into the top 3 of the B1G east.

 

[Caliknight]

Sure, let's move from the upper east side to Queens.

John O, please delete this stupidity and ban the OP.

 

[BigLou]

Does it matter though? In this format you get one repsentive with an 8 team playoff and 2 with a 16. Then you just have to win the playoff games.

In all honesty don't you think it's a more straight forward and realistic path towards being a dominant program. As is you're going to have a heck of a time just getting consistently into the top 3 of the B1G east.

There it is - the not so subtle put down of Rutgers by a PSU fan. That was the point of starting this thread wasn't it?

 

[RJM_Go_RU]

Actually, contrary to what the OP says, this is not interesting at all.

From an RU fan perspective, considering this idea is sort of like dreaming about banging Lena Dunham while your lying in bed with Kate Upton.

I have to admit-that's funny (and accurate).

 

[czxqa]

A Northeast Conference without Pitt, WV, PSU, and even Temple is stupid. Hey, I got an ideas... I'm gonna write a blog of a national conference with religious schools only, THE GOD:
BC
ND
TCU
Baylor
Wake Forrest
BYU
SMU

We may only have 7 teams but we are CONFERENCE OF THE GODS, DAMMIT!!!!

Duke, Northwestern and Syracuse are nominally Methodist and Tulsa is a Presbyterian school, so that would get you to 11.

 

[krup]

Does it matter though? In this format you get one repsentive with an 8 team playoff and 2 with a 16. Then you just have to win the playoff games.

In all honesty don't you think it's a more straight forward and realistic path towards being a dominant program. As is you're going to have a heck of a time just getting consistently into the top 3 of the B1G east.

Those of us around for the Big East recognize that even if this conference started with automatic bid(s), almost immediately the narrative would start that it isn't deserved and that they should lose it in favor of runner ups from "better" conferences.

No conference like this (without a program that is an elite brand) would survive.

 

[jason21psu]

There it is - the not so subtle put down of Rutgers by a PSU fan. That was the point of starting this thread wasn't it?

Seriously? It's not a put down. It's honest. Granted it's only been 3 years but the next time you finish in the top 3 of the B1G east will be the first. I'm sorry if a honest assessment is so offensive to you.

 

[vkj91]

Seriously? It's not a put down. It's honest. Granted it's only been 3 years but the next time you finish in the top 3 of the B1G east will be the first. I'm sorry if a honest assessment is so offensive to you.

To be fair, we are still in the early planning stages of implementing our cover up anything for the good of football strategy. Got any tips for us?

 

[BigLou]

Seriously? It's not a put down. It's honest. Granted it's only been 3 years but the next time you finish in the top 3 of the B1G east will be the first. I'm sorry if a honest assessment is so offensive to you.

Take a walk.

And as the father of a recent Penn State grad I'm probably a voice of reason on this board in Rutgers/Penn State matters. In fact, I was at the Rose Bowl (great time at the Penn State Alumni tailgate party). But I can spot a DB when I see one.
Take your post to BWI.

 

[tico brown]

Duke, Northwestern and Syracuse are nominally Methodist and Tulsa is a Presbyterian school, so that would get you to 11.

I honestly thought that about Duke, Nowestern and Syracuse were just very expensive private schools. I guess GOD'S BASKETBALL CONFERENCE just got better.

 

[srru86]

You guys know it's not my idea, right?

We know.

But it is interesting that a Nit fan is telling us about a scenario that carves off the two eastern most representatives in the B1G and leaves the PSU with the boys from the Midwest. Careful I'd imagine many B1G fan bases would still like to cast you back to your eastern origins.

It's the off-season, signing day has come and gone, all we have left until spring practice is realignment talk.

Personally I find most realignment talk underwhelming. Most of it is driven by people with very little knowledge predicting scenarios that often about as likely as unicorns showing up.

Though we do have dumber threads here admittedly.

To me it's a blog with the objective of staving off the B12's implosion.

You might want to share with the Texas fans.

 

[jason21psu]

Take a walk.

And as the father of a recent Penn State grad I'm probably a voice of reason on this board in Rutgers/Penn State matters. In fact, I was at the Rose Bowl (great time at the Penn State Alumni tailgate party). But I can spot a DB when I see one.
Take your post to BWI.

I wasn't the one that started down the road of bashing the hypothetical conference. I think there are a lot of positives to it. I'm sorry some of you can't see it.

Swap th NC teams for Us, Pitt, and WVU like someone else suggested and I wouldn't be offended. I think many of the benefits I suggested earlier would work out for us.

 

[koleszar]

Seriously? It's not a put down. It's honest. Granted it's only been 3 years but the next time you finish in the top 3 of the B1G east will be the first. I'm sorry if a honest assessment is so offensive to you.

I really don't think psu fans are regarded too high in their views of what constitutes an honest assessment. You know with recent history and all that transpired.

 

[RUfinal4]

I like the idea but instead of 8 10 team divisions I would go with 10 8 team divisions.

This way you have 7 division games, 1 FCS / easy game, and 4 scheduled games based on a scheduling alliance.

So my adjustment would be:
- 10 divisions with 8 teams
- 5 conferences of 2 divisions each
- scheduling alliance allows for 1 FCS game, 3 other division games
- 1 other game

So if the Rutgers and Penn St divisions were part of the same conference the 2 champs meet in a championship game for an auto-bid to the 8 team playoff.

After 5 championship games there will be 3 at large teams selected for the playoff.

 

[tico brown]

You guys know it's not my idea, right? It's a blog called B12 fanatics. I think most of you do but I want to make sure.

It's the off-season, signing day has come and gone, all we have left until spring practice is realignment talk.

I thought it'd be interesting since you just moved conferences 3 years ago. To me it's a blog with the objective of staving off the B12's implosion.

I would like for you to show me where I said this lame brained idea was yours. This idea is stupid, no matter who made it up.

 

[Upstream]

Granted it's only been 3 years but the next time you finish in the top 3 of the B1G east will be the first.

I think you just proved his point.

 

[czxqa]

So you strip the best football schools (excepting VTech) from the early 90's Big East/ACC and throw the leftovers into a conference? Strong pass.

The guy's actual proposal reads more like an NFL style 80 team mega-conference, or league. He doesn't really get into the finances, but based on the way everything is written, I get the impression his assumption is it's a single league negotiating on behalf of all 80 schools. The base assumption is that someone can convince all five power conferences to just go ahead and merge and add 15 more mouths to feed rather than waiting for the inevitable collapse of the B12 and picking off the best schools they can get their hands on. Ridiculous.