Rutgers Wrestling ---- NCAA Tournament / Updates & Results (All Sessions)

[belushijo]

Koleszar, let's try to keep some perspective here. I was responding to someone who said being a 21 year old college freshman is embarassing. Couple things: (1) he will complete his freshmen year being 20; and (2) Joey is a hell of wrestler and even better youngman. He has nothing to be embarassed about.

Never understood why some people try to throw shade on these kids using the 'age' argument (not saying you are koleszar).

He deferred enrollment by a year after graduating Blair and focused on freestyle, because ultimately he has Olympic aspirations. If he continues to wrestle another three consecutive years, his eligiblity will be used up by 2019 and he will graduate at 23 years old. Pretty standard for any redshirt athlete. I understand McKenna didn't technically use a redshirt yet and he still could. But at the moment, his age isn't all that surprising considering.

 

[kjb32812]

While he's not an out and out troll, imo he is borderline troll. Twice last week I caught him making statements that were out and out false about our program. 1 I mentioned Ashnault would be a 4-6 he said no way, as Ash got lucky not having to wrestle the top 2 seeds at the Big 10 tourny, a day later Ash was named 4 seed, 2 then I said RU wrestling was on the Upswing as witnessed by our top 5-10 incoming recruiting class, he retorted that I was wrong that he read it was about 75. I quickly proved him wrong by linking the proof. There are other instances, but those 2 recent ones are the freshest in my mind . Those that know me know I'm a reasonable guy. KGB is no fan of RU. And his own board probably gives him a hard time because he is lacking in wrestling knowledge, which is why he probably posts here more than there.

Just to set the record straight, I have said from Day One that your wrestling program would be the biggest benefactor of joining the B1G. I have also watched your fanbase (on this board, the free board and tMB) begin to get excited about a sport they never even watched before. To me, that's good for both RU and college wrestling in general. In regards to Ash and his seeding, I didn't think he would benefit after not getting a chance to avenge his losses. I don't recall using the word lucky and my comments certainly weren't over the top or even remotely trolling. In regards to the recruiting class, I admitted my mistake in that exact thread and even provided the link that confused me.

Finally, my wrestling knowledge is limited and I have said as much in numerous threads on my own site as well as tMB. I played hoops my entire life and never wrestled. However, I had several friends who did (one 3x PA place winner who wrestled at IU) so I'm also not completely illiterate about the sport. You are correct that the PSU wrestling board as well as the Iowa one are places where I generally lurk and try to learn.

 

[Veiox]

Koleszar, let's try to keep some perspective here. I was responding to someone who said being a 21 year old college freshman is embarassing. Couple things: (1) he will complete his freshmen year being 20; and (2) Joey is a hell of wrestler and even better youngman. He has nothing to be embarassed about.

Never understood why some people try to throw shade on these kids using the 'age' argument (not saying you are koleszar).

He deferred enrollment by a year after graduating Blair and focused on freestyle, because ultimately he has Olympic aspirations. If he continues to wrestle another three consecutive years, his eligiblity will be used up by 2019 and he will graduate at 23 years old. Pretty standard for any redshirt athlete. I understand McKenna didn't technically use a redshirt yet and he still could. But at the moment, his age isn't all that surprising considering.

I agree with everything you say about Mckenna...great kid and great wrestler. Nothing he has done is embarrassing in the least. Great job period.

I brought up his age initially just as an observation that he is not a typical 17/18 year old frosh. Nothing embarrassing in that fact. Just an observation.

However, I am not a huge fan of recent trends in sports. A few years ago I saw a track athlete from another country lauded for her frosh season performance. Later I found out she was 22 years old. Technically she was a frosh but to me not really. Multiple kids I grew up with stayed back on purpose to get an extra year of training and strength for HS sports. Not a fan of that concept but it is what it is.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

I agree with everything you say about Mckenna...great kid and great wrestler. Nothing he has done is embarrassing in the least. Great job period.

I brought up his age initially just as an observation that he is not a typical 17/18 year old frosh. Nothing embarrassing in that fact. Just an observation.

However, I am not a huge fan of recent trends in sports. A few years ago I saw a track athlete from another country lauded for her frosh season performance. Later I found out she was 22 years old. Technically she was a frosh but to me not really. Multiple kids I grew up with stayed back on purpose to get an extra year of training and strength for HS sports. Not a fan of that concept but it is what it is.

Hate to break the news to you but they've kept kids back for football a year, even 2, nearly half a century now in some parts of the country. All those great Nebraska OL's were filled with 22-24 year olds and the same can be said for many other schools.

Nothing "recent" about this "trend."

 

[Veiox]

Hate to break the news to you but they've kept kids back for football a year, even 2, nearly half a century now in some parts of the country. All those great Nebraska OL's were filled with 22-24 year olds and the same can be said for many other schools.

Nothing "recent" about this "trend."

The recent trend I was alluding to was more the olympic type sports. I could be wrong but I didn't think it happened in sports like track, wrestling, lacrosse, baseball, etc. Now those sports are catching up to football.

 

[RU93]

Koleszar, let's try to keep some perspective here. I was responding to someone who said being a 21 year old college freshman is embarassing. Couple things: (1) he will complete his freshmen year being 20; and (2) Joey is a hell of wrestler and even better youngman. He has nothing to be embarassed about.

Never understood why some people try to throw shade on these kids using the 'age' argument (not saying you are koleszar).

He deferred enrollment by a year after graduating Blair and focused on freestyle, because ultimately he has Olympic aspirations. If he continues to wrestle another three consecutive years, his eligiblity will be used up by 2019 and he will graduate at 23 years old. Pretty standard for any redshirt athlete. I understand McKenna didn't technically use a redshirt yet and he still could. But at the moment, his age isn't all that surprising considering.

Maybe he's a nice kid, but I wasn't talking about his personality. I actually think it's a flat out cheating. I see it all the time now where parents hold kids back a year and bigger kids do better b/c they are physically stronger, bigger and more mature mentally. I really think there should be an age guideline in place for NCAA where at a certain age, you are a certain grade.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

I've been trying to find out for a couple of days now, if we finish 15th is that our best team finish ever?

Best finish ever for Rutgers Wrestling. Josh made 100% sure to announce it last night at the social.

 

[PhilaPhans]

So here's a question. Northern Colorado took 72nd place at the NCAA Tournament with -1 team points. Any idea what happened there?

 

[kjb32812]

So here's a question. Northern Colorado took 72nd place at the NCAA Tournament with -1 team points. Any idea what happened there?

Coach got a misconduct penalty I believe.

 

[belushijo]

Maybe he's a nice kid, but I wasn't talking about his personality. I actually think it's a flat out cheating. I see it all the time now where parents hold kids back a year and bigger kids do better b/c they are physically stronger, bigger and more mature mentally. I really think there should be an age guideline in place for NCAA where at a certain age, you are a certain grade.

Are you trying to say the reason he beat AA is because he 'cheated' by deferring enrollment one year to concentrate on freestyle?

 

[Tango Two]

Post Tournament Video From RVision:

 

[RU93]

Are you trying to say the reason he beat AA is because he 'cheated' by deferring enrollment one year to concentrate on freestyle?

No, he won. He's no freshmen though.

 

[belushijo]

No, he won. He's no freshmen though.

Facts be damned!!

 

[AreYouNUTS]

So here's a question. Northern Colorado took 72nd place at the NCAA Tournament with -1 team points. Any idea what happened there?

2 kids won their 1st wrestle-back matches?

 

[RU93]

2 kids won their 1st wrestle-back matches?

The team point was Negative 1. (not positive 1)

 

[AreYouNUTS]

The team point was Negative 1. (not positive 1)

Ahh had to be some kind of team penalty then, right?

 

[jerzey devil]

Maybe he's a nice kid, but I wasn't talking about his personality. I actually think it's a flat out cheating. I see it all the time now where parents hold kids back a year and bigger kids do better b/c they are physically stronger, bigger and more mature mentally. I really think there should be an age guideline in place for NCAA where at a certain age, you are a certain grade.

Did a whole lotta good for Campolattano in college

 

[otter97]

Did a whole lotta good for Campolattano in college

this is a hot topic, and one which I agree (Ru93, Veiox) should be addressed.

its not cheating, but when folks try to underscore an achievement by saying, "look this athlete is so exceptional for what they achieved because he/she was a freshman," its just no accurate.

kinda of like the steibler/Dake debate and Pico.
Dake won his last title at the same age as Steibler won either his first or second (can't remember which one). Both amazing accomplishments, but in comparison Dake's achievement was that much more impressive (in my opinion).

Arron Pico has been carving up on the circuit for years with a 2 year advantage from his grade. he's so gifted that he has skipped the high school level of competition altogether and is going his international route. but was it fair for the 10 years he did compete?

McKenna and AA are essentially the same age, no shame in losing to him.

in general, I don't want my kids competing against kids 2 years older than them, especially under the age of 16. it can be demoralizing and may lead to injury or loss of interest to the sport. My opinion is someone needs to step in and prevent this from happening, and should probably come from the schools or districts, ensuring the right age kids are in the right classes. If kids stay back for academic reasons, maybe they should not for athletic reasons.

 

[jerzey devil]

this is a hot topic, and one which I agree (Ru93, Veiox) should be addressed.

its not cheating, but when folks try to underscore an achievement by saying, "look this athlete is so exceptional for what they achieved because he/she was a freshman," its just no accurate.

kinda of like the steibler/Dake debate and Pico.
Dake won his last title at the same age as Steibler won either his first or second (can't remember which one). Both amazing accomplishments, but in comparison Dake's achievement was that much more impressive (in my opinion).

Arron Pico has been carving up on the circuit for years with a 2 year advantage from his grade. he's so gifted that he has skipped the high school level of competition altogether and is going his international route. but was it fair for the 10 years he did compete?

McKenna and AA are essentially the same age, no shame in losing to him.

in general, I don't want my kids competing against kids 2 years older than them, especially under the age of 16. it can be demoralizing and may lead to injury or loss of interest to the sport. My opinion is someone needs to step in and prevent this from happening, and should probably come from the schools or districts, ensuring the right age kids are in the right classes. If kids stay back for academic reasons, maybe they should not for athletic reasons.

In that, I totally agree.. Camp won his 4th state title as a 19 yr old senior...Note really that fair there... But I feel that there is a huge difference between a 19 yr old vs a 17 yr old... Then a 25 yr old vs a 23 yr old!

 

[PhilaPhans]

If we're talking about NJSIAA:

An athlete becomes ineligible for high school athletics if he/she reaches the age of 19 prior to September 1. Any athlete reaching age 19 on or after September 1 shall be eligible for that school year.

(Think of this as the Mohamed Sanu rule.)

An athlete becomes ineligible for Junior High School or 9th grade athletics if he/she attains the age of 16 prior to September 1.

When it comes to college athletics, whatever age you are, so be it. I believe the 5 year clock starts once they enroll in a college of any sorts. I'm surprised more military don't take advantage and participate in more college sports once their tours are done.

Then you've got the BYU team probably all in their late 20s due to mission trips. Are you really going to penalize athletes for stuff like the two cases I've stated?

And so what if a kid failed high school or stayed back in elementary (for college purposes)?

I don't get all the people being upset about this stuff. The main goal of many of these top college wrestlers are to AA, wrestle internationally, hopefully make the Olympics/Worlds, and make some endorsements before switching over to the real world and making money. Any extra time spent in college does what for a wrestler?

 

[otter97]

Then you've got the BYU team probably all in their late 20s due to mission trips. Are you really going to penalize athletes for stuff like the two cases I've stated?

And so what if a kid failed high school or stayed back in elementary (for college purposes)?

The issue is when parents intentionally keep their children behind a grade so they have an edge in sports. If they fail and need to repeat for academics, thats fine. However, if this happens in high school, maybe they shouldn't get a 5th year of competitive athletics. Why should some kids have an unfair edge?

I don't get all the people being upset about this stuff. The main goal of many of these top college wrestlers are to AA, wrestle internationally, hopefully make the Olympics/Worlds, and make some endorsements before switching over to the real world and making money. Any extra time spent in college does what for a wrestler?

For college its not the same issue, as athletes have all gone through puberty. For college the issue is the semantics of how to keep the record books fair. For some fans, this is a big issue.

 

[PhilaPhans]

They don't get a 5th year of competitive athletics. You play 4 years. Any 5th year must be done before high school. Mind you, most top basketball kids somehow repeat a middle school year. I don't disagree with that. But there are limitations in play, just like college to an extent. You get 4 years to play and you can't be 19 yet. It's not like a high school kid is 22 facing a 14 year old.

 

[PhilaPhans]

Interesting follow-up from an article on the subject (nj.com):

Those high-profile repeaters also have helped create the latest wrinkle to the repeating trend: Players reclassifying up a year during high school, in most cases back to their original grade. The past two years, stars such as Towns, Noel, Seldon, Vonleh, Wiggins and Dakari Johnson — who began his high school career at St. Patrick High in Elizabeth — have each reclassified to graduate high school sooner.

Towns, for example, will skip his junior year when school starts in September, and move from a sophomore to a senior. The 7-footer from Piscataway said he’s taking six classes online this summer and studying for about three hours most days to make up the difference.

“Me and my family talked about it, and it just felt like it was the best decision for me basketball-wise, to go and move to the next grade,” Towns said. “Especially with this year’s recruiting class, I think almost all top 10 players did it and they all reclassified up. It’s one of those things that just seems to be happening now.”

Coaches say players who reclassify often are the same ones who originally repeated a grade to gain an edge. Once it is determined they were good enough to move to the next level, they reclassified.

http://www.nj.com/hssports/blog/boy..._staying_back_in_middle_school_to_get_an.html

 

[Road Crew STU]

They don't get a 5th year of competitive athletics. You play 4 years. Any 5th year must be done before high school. Mind you, most top basketball kids somehow repeat a middle school year. I don't disagree with that. But there are limitations in play, just like college to an extent. You get 4 years to play and you can't be 19 yet. It's not like a high school kid is 22 facing a 14 year old.

Except for the Hakim brother (can't remember if it was Sam or Tim).

Turns out he was 21 or 22 when he won the state title wrestling for Randolph. I believe they stripped him of the metal years later.

 

[Tango Two]

It was a change in footwear that coincided with Anthony Perrotti’s monumental run to an All-American finish in 2014.
Sporting Nike sneakers, Perrotti lost his debut match at the NCAA Championships in Oklahoma City two years ago. The then-sophomore won his next match in the subsequent session, but he would need to record three straight wins in wrestle backs the following day to become an All-American.

http://www.dailytargum.com/article/...er-with-impressive-run-to-all-american-finish