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Seriously, how many players are we away from,the NIT, the NCAA?

ruready4somefootball

ruready4somefootball

Heisman Winner
Nov 10, 2003
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Serious, no flamers. Everybody says it takes so many more players to turn around and keep a program going in the right direction in football, than it does basketball. With that said, what's the number of high quality players we need as a program to turn this ship around? First, back to the days of Coach Waters and a nice NIT run, and then to what now seems like the unthinkable, The Big Dance?
 
Rutgers needs 3 consistent double digit scorers starting and at least 3 bench players that can contribute 6-8 points per game.The goal should be at least 70 points per game.Three point shooting , foul shooting ,depth at point guard , and overall defense are areas that need definite improvement.
 
3 players to get to the NIT? On top of Sanders? Rutgers made the NIT with Waters with less than that.

We need one very good three point shooter and one more big man and I think we are NIT ready. NCAA? Most of these guys are freshman and sophs so I need to see them as seniors, most may end up being just what we need. But current team I am not sure if I wouldn't want to upgrade every player on the team from player 1 to player 12.
 
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We are 30 points away from tournament contenders George Washington and Seton Hall.

Expecting Dailey and Issa to walk into games against those two and against Big Ten teams and get us into the NIT is unrealistic, or am I missing something?

Nigel Johnson is a very nice player and I'm glad he's here but in two years at Kansas State his combined percentage from 3-point range was below 30 percent

Do we expect a 4-man that can start immediately will sign with us in the spring? We don't have one offer out to a player 6-foot-8 or bigger, and I'm not including Taurean Thompson who cut us.

Diallo and Doorson are not the answer at the 5, especially coming off injuries.
 
Last edited:
seels2662 said:
3 players to get to the NIT? On top of Sanders? Rutgers made the NIT with Waters with less than that.

We need one very good three point shooter and one more big man and I think we are NIT ready. NCAA? Most of these guys are freshman and sophs so I need to see them as seniors, most may end up being just what we need. But current team I am not sure if I wouldn't want to upgrade every player on the team from player 1 to player 12.
Click to expand...

Last time we made the NIT was 2005-06. Douby was scoring an absurd 25.6 ppg, with Webb chipping in 9.5 ppg, Inman with 8.7 ppg and Farmer with 8.3 ppg. I don't see Sanders scoring 25.6 ppg... or anyone in the Big Ten for that matter, as no one's done it in a decade.

The time prior to that was 2003-04. We had Shields at 15.5 ppg, Lamizana at 13.4, and Douby at 12.5... along with Webb at 7.2.

The time prior to that was 2001-02. We had Coleman at 16.8, Shields at 11.5, and Kent at 10.5... with Sherrod at 8.6.

Could we make it with Freeman/Sanders/Laurent... along with one of the shooting guards coming in the 7-9 ppg range? It'd take a lot better defense than we've been shown the last couple of years.
 
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It's a different NIT now----harder to make.

Conference Champs from all leagues who don't make the NCAA's are automatically invited.

A Big Ten school would have to have 17-18 wins to get in-----that isn't easy.
 
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The 03-04 team that went to the NIT Finals had: 3 guys who shot over 37% from 3 (Douby, Shields, Webb) and an interior player who was an all conference selection (Lamizana).

I love Sanders. Freeman showed some promise before the injury, and Laurent looks like a young player who could develop. But, this RU team is a long way from that RU team. The other thing that you have to mention is defense. RU is never going to turn around as a program irrespective of talent unless the defense gets much better. I would take a guy like Webb in a second on this team. He would bring some defensive toughness.
 
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essexknight said:
The 03-04 team that went to the NIT Finals had: 3 guys who shot over 37% from 3 (Douby, Shields, Webb) and an interior player who was an all conference selection (Lamizana).

I love Sanders. Freeman showed some promise before the injury, and Laurent looks like a young player who could develop. But, this RU team is a long way from that RU team. The other thing that you have to mention is defense. RU is never going to turn around as a program irrespective of talent unless the defense gets much better. I would take a guy like Webb in a second on this team. He would bring some defensive toughness.
Click to expand...

We have one big man who is good. We need a good 4 or 5 and another good wing or guard to give us a chance.
 
A skilled big man, a top notch wing and a knockdown two guard make us a competitive team.
 
essexknight said:
The 03-04 team that went to the NIT Finals had: 3 guys who shot over 37% from 3 (Douby, Shields, Webb) and an interior player who was an all conference selection (Lamizana).

I love Sanders. Freeman showed some promise before the injury, and Laurent looks like a young player who could develop. But, this RU team is a long way from that RU team. The other thing that you have to mention is defense. RU is never going to turn around as a program irrespective of talent unless the defense gets much better. I would take a guy like Webb in a second on this team. He would bring some defensive toughness.
Click to expand...
The 03-04 team would beat this year's team by 20 - 30 points. That is sobering, because they weren't even really a bubble team if I recall correctly... They simply had a nice run in the NIT into the finals.

Bask to the original question, I feel like Jordan would need more than the average number of good players to make either tournament, and many coaches could do more with less. But with a centerpiece like Corey, I would say another ~ 3 players the level of Freeman/Laurent and another 4 solid role players/depth guys (Mike Williams caliber) could get to the NCAAs. So we're 4 players away but this assumes a year or two to develop together and no attrition and/or continued high-level recruiting to replace losses.
 
ScarletRunner said:
The 03-04 team would beat this year's team by 20 - 30 points. That is sobering, because they weren't even really a bubble team if I recall correctly... They simply had a nice run in the NIT into the finals.

Bask to the original question, I feel like Jordan would need more than the average number of good players to make either tournament, and many coaches could do more with less. But with a centerpiece like Corey, I would say another ~ 3 players the level of Freeman/Laurent and another 4 solid role players/depth guys (Mike Williams caliber) could get to the NCAAs. So we're 4 players away but this assumes a year or two to develop together and no attrition and/or continued high-level recruiting to replace losses.
Click to expand...

Next year's roster without attrition

Sanders
Freeman
Nigel
Laurent
Williams
Foreman
Issa
Dailey
Tripp
Diallo
Doorson
Goode
*Open*
 
2 impact players away from the NIT.
A lights out shooting guard(A Douby)
and an impact big(a Hinson)\
add Sanders and a seasoned supporting cast and things start looking good !
 
3 more legit starters to go with Sanders/Freeman and 3 more legit bench players to go with Laurant/Williams...that makes 6...for the NIT probably 4, 2 and 2
 
Loosing Freeman (indefinite suspension) doesn't help....
but then again it sends a message- and maybe he won't need a decoder
ring to figure it out.

MO
 
Five for NIT or NCAA -- a modest 5, a rebound-first 4, a 3 that can play D, a tall 2 that can shoot, and a back-up 1.

Diallo and Doorson are none of the above. Is one of the '16 kids a shooting 2? Doesn't sound like that. Johnson could be the back-up 1 (despite what Jelly says, the kid refers to himself as a point on his Twitter page).

I'll give you Sanders and a healthy (physical and mental) Freeman as starters. Laurent is a nice back-up 3 on a tournament team. Maybe the same for Williams as a 2 against a small backcourt. Foreman is no more than an 8th or 9th man, unless he really steps up as a junior. So far, the copious playing time doesn't seem to have helped his development.

The real question should be -- how many competent assistant coaches are needed?
 
I look at Seton Hall and they have a very young team with Desi, Ish, Whitehead, Delgado, Carrington. They're all playing well and yes I realize they lost to a good Butler team tonight.

Still you know what you're getting from each player and its a team that can compete with the best teams in their conference.

I'd like to think Tripp and Dailey can develop roles on this team but I don't the staff will be around to see it. And as a fan I know I'll always overrate Rutgers recruits. I was very excited about Foreman and Diallo and one's not doing enough to be a starter and the other cant stay on the floor with fouls and now an injury.

Of course Seton Hall is different case because it signed 2-3 4-stars.

Most underrecruited kids won't make a significant impact until year 2.

Sanders was our only freshman 4-star and he's not surprisingly the biggest producer.
 
Depends on who the players are. If you recruited a STUD 3 man then it would be one player. Sander, Johnson and Freeman can start on a NCAA team with a STUD 3 and Doorson/Diallo just playing D and rebounding. Foreman Williams Laurent Diallo coming off the bench would be fine. But we aren't getting that stud 3 man.
 
Next year's roster without attrition:

Sanders - NCAA quality player, although his numbers are inflated this year due to the situation
Freeman - NCAA quality player, but on a very good team he's like the 5th option on the floor
Nigel - NCAA quality backup
Laurent - NCAA quality depth (he could get better in future years though)
Williams - Nope.
Foreman - Nope.
Issa - (Haven't seen enough of)
Dailey - (Haven't seen enough of)
Tripp - (Haven't seen enough of)
Diallo - Not yet. I was really hoping for more from this kid so far.
Doorson - Everybody needs a spare big man to give 5 fouls.
Goode - Absolutely not.
*Open* - Probably our 5th best player right now.
 
It can happen in a year! It's not football!!!!
Case in point:
7-22 Craig Littlepage
18-13 Bob Wenzel
One Year!!!
 
RutgersMO said:
Loosing Freeman (indefinite suspension) doesn't help....
but then again it sends a message- and maybe he won't need a decoder
ring to figure it out.

MO
Click to expand...
I must be old and stupid. What are you talking about? I thought he was injured. Thanks. $$$$
 
essexknight said:
The 03-04 team that went to the NIT Finals had: 3 guys who shot over 37% from 3 (Douby, Shields, Webb) and an interior player who was an all conference selection (Lamizana).
Click to expand...

To expound upon this, the last NCAA team had Hughes, Duncan, Savage, and Lumpkin who were all skilled 3 point shooters and Dabbs at center could play down low AND hit the 10-12 footer, and Craig Carter while not a huge outside threat was very decent offensively.

so thats FOUR perimeter players who could shoot--in case you guys aren't counting. When you have that it make you difficult to defend. And frankly that team should have been better. Savage missed the 2nd half of the year due to academics.

Which means we still have LONG way to go.
 
RutgersMO said:
Don't know about you're being old / stupid...but article on NJ.com said EJ suspended him indefinitely.

Mods: if this is premium ....please delete.

MO
Click to expand...

He was already injured and not playing this season. Yes he's suspended indefinitely but he has plenty of time to get back on track with his academics for next season.
 
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