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- Thread starter GORU2014
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Well, I'm old, but not that old. So I can only chime in here in the rest :)
Pike > Wenzel
Pike >> Bannon (although Kevin's team were pretty good at the line)
Pike > Waters
Pike >> Fred Hill
Pike >>>Mike Rice(if u can dodge a wrench)
Pike >>> Jordan
Pike > Wenzel
Pike >> Bannon (although Kevin's team were pretty good at the line)
Pike > Waters
Pike >> Fred Hill
Pike >>>Mike Rice(if u can dodge a wrench)
Pike >>> Jordan
Pike >>>>>>>>>>>>> Littlepage
Missing a couple > for Jordan. It was more embarrassing than the Rice "scandal"
Can't coach rebounding quote was one of the saddest quotes I've ever heard from a coach. The play on the court was truly embarrassing. He was nowhere to be seen in HS recruiting too so effort not there either
Tom was just an ok recruiter. The top two scorers on the Final Four team were recruited by the previous coaching staff (Dick Vitale). He was very good at developing players. Bailey and Hinson were not highly rated recruits. Battle was a good recruit who developed into an NBA player under Young. Good game coach but could be too stubborn at times. Good x's and o's guy. Overall I think Young and Pike are pretty even. I'd give Young the edge on offense coaching and Pike the edge on defense. Young played easier schedules, didnt have to compete in the Big Ten. But Young still gets the edge until Pike goes to a Final Four.
Tom Young was a very good coach, really understood what he had and how to use it, (was also a genuinely nice guy, inherited Sellers, Dabney, Palko, Scherer, and Kleinbaum from Lloyd/Vitale. Young recruited Jordan, Colin, Bailey, not sure about Copeland. Did a great job with under the radar guys similar to Pike, biggest issue was recruiting, go undefeated end up in the final four and sign no one, thats a whole other story. Also that was a different Era no internet, recruiting was so much more geographical, Tom's roots were in the DC area. Interestingly Jordan had virtually no offers and Tom picked him up from A.B. Carroll H.S. his first year very late in the cycle, think he had only one other offer from Loyola of Chicago.
Bill Foster was the best coach at Rutgers in my lifetime. Full stop.
Young was excellent in some ways, really limited in others. Over thought his way out of an elite 8 have by freezing the ball to Rutgers detriment.
Pretty good game coach. Fair recruiter. Nice man but didn't relate to all his players. Deep dog house.
Dicky V should have been coach
We'd have national championship banners, plural.
Should have hired V from Bucknell or Iona. It was clear he was going to be a great coach.
L
I think Pike is excellent and still improving
Both.
He built Utah and Duke programs after he built Rutgers.
He built Utah and Duke programs after he built Rutgers.
It is hard to compare Pike and Young recruiting wise
After the big east took off, it was much more difficult for RU to bring in the better players that Young needed with RU in the Atlantic eight, or what ever it was called at the time
Previous to the big east Young could land a couple of first team NJ all state players
and RU did not suffer going against Seton Hall for area players, but fell behind after that
I think Young left RU for that particular reason
had RU joined the big east at its beginning, Young might have been our coach for decades
Pike does not have that disadvantage in recruiting being in the Big 10
After the big east took off, it was much more difficult for RU to bring in the better players that Young needed with RU in the Atlantic eight, or what ever it was called at the time
Previous to the big east Young could land a couple of first team NJ all state players
and RU did not suffer going against Seton Hall for area players, but fell behind after that
I think Young left RU for that particular reason
had RU joined the big east at its beginning, Young might have been our coach for decades
Pike does not have that disadvantage in recruiting being in the Big 10
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I come from the town that Vitale spent time as a coach
I am convinced he would have burned out and have to retire after a few years
The way he coached and what it did to him physically was not common knowledge
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That's what happened in Detroit. I had a sense that in NJ he might have been more sustainable...
The 1966-67 team was a pleasure to watch.
Tom was a really good coach . And a really good big man coach
You need to realize that had the ncaa been 68 teams in that era, Tom goes to 8 NCAA and one NIT in 10 years …leading up to Roy hinsons graduation
Had Rutgers been in the big East …Tom young likely brings Rutgers to the final four a couple of more times and likely wins a National championship …as recruiting took care of itself in the 80s in the bjg east and he was as good a coach as Thompson, carneseca , massimono and boeheim …all of his peers in the 70s
You need to realize that had the ncaa been 68 teams in that era, Tom goes to 8 NCAA and one NIT in 10 years …leading up to Roy hinsons graduation
Had Rutgers been in the big East …Tom young likely brings Rutgers to the final four a couple of more times and likely wins a National championship …as recruiting took care of itself in the 80s in the bjg east and he was as good a coach as Thompson, carneseca , massimono and boeheim …all of his peers in the 70s
Really couldn't work with Gruninger anymore. Who could blame him? Grentz left for the same reason
That take on the rebounding coaching statement is right up there with “I can see Russia from my house.”
Young was also a great coach. His coaching adjustments to get to the tournament the year after the final four run where impressive. He knew he could not win the same way, so he played to his strengths. But I will never forget some of the morons in the crowd screaming that he was “boring“ because the team was running less the next year. By a comfortable margin, Pike is the best overall we have had. As a game day coach, Young was a pretty close second.
This is a really good thread and the insights are great here regarding coaching styles and gameday abilities.
But as others have posted, the Big East decision was a killer for Young. When did the BE form- 1980? Within five years, the league had two national champions and a year in which three of the four final four teams were from the BE. Within that timespan, maybe tack on two more years or so, Seton Hall was leaving us in the dust with local guys that wouldn't consider us anymore.
But as others have posted, the Big East decision was a killer for Young. When did the BE form- 1980? Within five years, the league had two national champions and a year in which three of the four final four teams were from the BE. Within that timespan, maybe tack on two more years or so, Seton Hall was leaving us in the dust with local guys that wouldn't consider us anymore.
There was no mystery
RU was being left behind in the east because the big east started to dominate
The Hall emerged and became better than RU as time went on
He got the offer from down south and took it
That did not work our for him either, long term
I went down the Google rabbit hole on that a while back, probably when he passed away. There's a couple of articles still out there about his dismissal from ODU. Basically the same old story: boosters/fans with an inflated sense of where they should be in the college hoops world.
That could very well be
I stopped following Young after he left us
No coach would have kept our program a top 20 team without being in the big east
imo
We had a few decent teams but not great
In fairness to Jordan and not talked about much his marriage was falling apart as Eddie basically said if you go on Realhousewives of Potomac the marriage was over and they really were not speaking much while he was here.
Not an excuse but it could'nt be easy for Eddie to be taking on the challenge of rebuilding a scandal without the support of Cherise
Not an excuse but it could'nt be easy for Eddie to be taking on the challenge of rebuilding a scandal without the support of Cherise
Thanks for that. That may explain a lot. It was a pretty impossible situation without that anyway.
Coaching has changed so much over the years. One-and Done, transfers, NIL were not even considered back then. A coach was lord of his fiefdom. Some take a shot at Fred Gruninger and the Big East decision, but as far as I know, Fred was fairly hands off with coaches. It's true that Tom Young did not want to drive up and down the eastern seaboard going to AAU games and sit in strange kitchens. Maybe Fred encouraged that once in a budget meeting or something like that -far from constant nagging. Without that effort and a graduate degree from charm school Tom was never going back to the Final 4 at RU. Tom was very intelligent and very forceful. If he could get a player to listen, he would get a lot out of him. Otherwise they could sit and learn on their own. Pikes has dimensions that Young did not have. Their relationship with their teams is altogether different. I don't think Young could coach today. I think Pikes would have been okay in the 70's and 80's, but is more suited to today.
When Tom left, it seemed like he had run his course. I mean he went to ODU not Duke, because he was looking for a spot with less emphasis on recruiting and less emphasis on winning. If you're asking me to choose between a 50 y.o. Young against a 50 y.o. Pikes to head up RU after the Eddie debacle, it would be Pikes by a wide margin. If you're asking me who'd be better at coming up with a new play down by 1 with 10 seconds left and explain it with each player's exact role, spacing, speed, contingency and see it come off as planned, that would be Tom.
When Tom left, it seemed like he had run his course. I mean he went to ODU not Duke, because he was looking for a spot with less emphasis on recruiting and less emphasis on winning. If you're asking me to choose between a 50 y.o. Young against a 50 y.o. Pikes to head up RU after the Eddie debacle, it would be Pikes by a wide margin. If you're asking me who'd be better at coming up with a new play down by 1 with 10 seconds left and explain it with each player's exact role, spacing, speed, contingency and see it come off as planned, that would be Tom.
What Weezer said is correct. Carried him out on a stretcher from a high school game. I had him as my 6th grade teacher and high school coach. Proved he could coach in college at Detroit.
Remember those days pretty well.
Nice to have a fellow ERHS board member here
From that time period
Fred was a micro managing tyrant to work for. I know from personal experience. And I know that Tom and Theresa couldn't stand him
I was rummaging through some garage sales a few weeks back. Stopped at an estate sale in East Rutherford. Found a cheerleaders megaphone and a school pennant from ERHS. Since the school closed in 1971, over 50 years old. Couldn't resist so bought both.
I believe if fred didn’t screw up with the big East young would have had a very good finish to his ru career. His teams played hard and were disciplined. I would lean toward pike but young was very good and probably under appreciated at the time.
he probably wouldnt have won here but had to be double rough to take intense criticism from the fanbase where he reached the final 4 and then not even have any support at home
Vitale was not liked by Gruninger. If you look at the people Mr G turned down as coaches it would be a Hall of Fame list. A young Rick Pitino who was coming from BU was told NO. Dick Vitale who recruited two number one National Players in Les Cason and Phil Sellers was told NO. Finally Jimmy V who wanted to return to his alma mater was told NO. He did hire Foster and Young, two under the radar coaches, but he was warned about Littlepage before he was hired here and paid no attention to what was then inside information that Penn was not going to rehire him. I was invited as a guest to Craig’s first camp and saw first hand why he was going to fail. He did not communicate well with the players and thus they either did not like or did not trust. I thought Craig was a really nice guy but was an administrator not a hands on guy.
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