Fill me in on Schiano's defense

[Blitz8RUCrazy]

Some exaggeration in the here for sure by RichDog, but Schiano's defenses undeniably struggled against the spread. For example, Schiano's 2006 team was loaded with talent on Defense but still gave up 41 points to WVU and in 2004, where we had enough talent to beat Michigan State, Schiano's D got lit up by Chip Kelly's D-1AA UNH for 30+ points in a devastating loss.

umm... first, that 2006 team is WAY overhyped on this board. It was a top 20 team but not a top 10 (we played weak competition for the most part to get there). WVU at the time was legitimately a top 10 team at the time and had better talent. In regulation the score was something like 24-24. That 2006 WVU game went to triple overtime... we lost to the better team.

Your Michigan St and UNH anecdotes were in the 2004-2005 range and those were more due to lack of coaching experience rather than anything else. BTW everyone was getting lit up by Chip Kelley. He was introducing a totally new kind off offense to the CFB world... Once he had time to study those types off offenses he was able to create a good defense for it provided that the correct talent could be recruited for it.

A lot of complaints about GS in this thread are on his handling of the offense or head coaching duties. He is going to be the OSU DC... So you only need to look at his DC skills to answer the OP and those were/are superb.

 

[Scarlet_Scourge]

This should be the best place to ask.

What kind of defense does he run? Does he get after the QB? Does he play zone or man?

We get really,really good redruits so he will have a massive amount of talent do you think he can put them in the right spot to succeed?

Fickell does well coaching LB's and Johnson does great coaching Dline, but before Ash our DB's were poorly coached and frankly Ash was the one calling plays on game day so I expect Schiano to take that over.

Great at stopping the run and great at Blitzing. Really elite at both.

Bad at defining the pass. teams that could pass the ball gave us lots of trouble.

Horrific against the spread. Rutgers got beat badly against spread teams.

 

[Extra Point]

This is complete bullshit. Schiano can look his player in the eye and tell him to run through a wall and he will do it. He can motivate a player unlike many other coaches in the country...

Schiano would sometimes belittle the players based on some of their comments. Our best offensive lineman in history would grumble about Schiano well into his NFL career. Also one of our QB's said something to the affect that when he did well in practice Schiano would say some negative things about it. I guess his idea was to break the players down and then build them back up again. I don't know if the OSU superstars will like that treatment very much.

 

[BiggyRU]

Schiano is a VERY Good but not GREAT DC..

He Stunts waaay to much....

BUT when he finds his rhythm with the defensive play calling his D's are lights out..
The QB has no clue where the rushes are coming from and the Defense will hit the crap out of the other team..

The only problem I see is OSU has such a slim margin of error..
If GS calls one bad game that could ruin the season..

He may have to dial down his aggressiveness at some points and play things a little more safe..

 

[RMSko]

I always loved the Schiano defenses and I'm not a Schiano fan. They were just fun to watch. However, there was some nasty stuff we learned after he left, such as how he treated NFL scouts and RU players (see for example some of the stuff Anthony Davis has come out with). However, this was as a HC and should not impact what he does at OSU since UM will be running the show and will keep him under control. He probably also has learned a lot about his antics since his last coaching stint.

 

[KnightsofChrome]

This is complete bullshit. Schiano can look his player in the eye and tell him to run through a wall and he will do it. He can motivate a player unlike many other coaches in the country...

LOL, ask Tampa Bay that! BTW, did you know that he was voted (by the players in the Big East) the coach they would least like to play for.

If you notice OP, the people that have been coming here defending Schiano's style, are the same ones who licked his boots for over a decade. And, will lick them again if given half a chance. He is a 500 coach at best. Yes, his D is very good, and might shine with the talent that he will have at Ohio State. But, once a dik, always a dik!

 

[rutgers48]

You're getting a guy who once got beat 80-7. And contrary to earlier comments, the spread offense does baffle him.

The upside on Schiano is that he is a workaholic and highly detail-oriented. He is good at developing talent. His major weakness is that he is a very poor game day coach. He gets out-coached all the time.

At OSU, that might not matter given the quality of the athletes you get. But one day, in a Michigan or Michigan State game, you are going to come away saying, "Why the hell did we do that?"

Are you seriously referencing a score from 2001 as an indictment on his defense? Wow. Some of you guys are insane. Schiano is a good to very good DC. With OSU's roster, his defense will be top 20 if not top 10.

 

[vm7118]

LOL, ask Tampa Bay that! BTW, did you know that he was voted (by the players in the Big East) the coach they would least like to play for.

If you notice OP, the people that have been coming here defending Schiano's style, are the same ones who licked his boots for over a decade. And, will lick them again if given half a chance. He is a 500 coach at best. Yes, his D is very good, and might shine with the talent that he will have at Ohio State. But, once a dik, always a dik!

your signature is the most accurate part of your posts. schiano brought RU from a perennial losing team, to a .500 team, to a perennial winning team given big east resources, support, infrastructure, talent. can you imagine what he's going to do at OSU, focusing solely on the defense? it will be ugly for the rest of the league. last time he was "just" a D coordinator, he went 13-1 in conference play and won the sugar bowl.

 

[saran]

Never said he didn't have very good DBacks, just said that he didn't know how to coach them. They became what they currently are, in spite of Schiano! Not, because of him. And, Belichick....well his son played(sat) the bench here, didn't he?

The McCourtys were 2 star DBs with 3 minor offers between them when they came to RU. Devin was actually the weakest recruit and he became first rounder way before Bill Belli got him. With the McCourty's, Courtney Greene and Ron Girault RU was in top 5 for pass defense in nation for a couple years - all with a bunch of no names who lived within 20 minutes of Tappan Zee bridge. RU has had a lot of Schiano DBs start (including KC, Titans etc along with NE), Schiano was DB coach in NFL. The claim GS couldn't coach DBs is just silly.

 

[theRU]

take a look at the Nfl and New England Secondary.... Mccourty, Logan Ryan, Duron Harmon

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/f...impact-new-england-patriots-article-1.2092994

 

[mildone]

take a look at the Nfl and New England Secondary.... Mccourty, Logan Ryan, Duron Harmon

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/f...impact-new-england-patriots-article-1.2092994

OSU can take a look at a whole lot more players in the NFL from OSU than the relative few from RU. Gonna have to work a bit harder to impress, I think.

 

[NorthNJRUFan]

This is complete bullshit. Schiano can look his player in the eye and tell him to run through a wall and he will do it. He can motivate a player unlike many other coaches in the country...

??? Is this sarcastic? Many of his ex players hate him. The entire TB Bucs team turned on him.

 

[mildone]

I think the biggest concern for OSU is that Schiano could be relied upon to have at least 1-2 WTF games when we were in the Big East. Games we should've won easily but somehow we totally screwed the pooch and lost big.

Can't say that was entirely due to defensive things of course. But for a NC contender, a WTF game has to be limited to not beating the spread in a win; loosing in not an option. So if I were an OSU fan, I'd be concerned about that.

 

[rutgersdave]

Good attacking defense. Good blitzes. However you won't get many INT's since he teaches the DB's to not look for the ball.

His defense is currently working on the New England Patriots with Mccourty, Logan, Freeney and Harmon. The other McCourty is starting at Tenn and Cooper is playing somewhere.

 

[ScarletDave]

Are you seriously referencing a score from 2001 as an indictment on his defense? Wow. Some of you guys are insane. Schiano is a good to very good DC. With OSU's roster, his defense will be top 20 if not top 10.

People can't point to 2001 but can point to 1998 at Miami?

 

[rudad02]

So are you being sarcastic or do you mean he realy does actively teach them not to look for the ball?

That is correct. He taught them not to look for the ball. And his guys in the NFL now all look for the ball.

 

[StyleKnight]

He likes to stop the run first. Then blitz on third down. He did not adjust well to the spread. He likes to rotate D-lineman but never subs his linebackers. And yes he does teach his CBs to face guard rather than turn and locate the ball. He was a great defensive coach, he developed a lot of talent on defense. He also thinks half time adjustments are overrated.

 

[RUblackshirt2006]

The images of dlineman rolling under and jumping over eachother pre snap still gives me chills. If he's feeling it, your defense will be more exciting to watch than your offense - which is saying something considering the way Ohio State calls plays.

 

[ChasRC69]

Good attacking defense. Good blitzes. However you won't get many INT's since he teaches the DB's to not look for the ball.[/

So are you being sarcastic or do you mean he realy does actively teach them not to look for the ball?

One thing you should realize when you ask a question on this board is that a lot of posters don't know s**t from shinola. I consider myself to be a member of that group and therefore only post when I know something. Schiano answered that question at several Touchdown Club meetings. He taught his d-backs to turn and look for the ball at the appropriate time. He did not want them to turn around if they were badly beaten by the receiver and we're trying to catch up to him because he thought looking back would slow the d-back and only widen the gap. Anyone who says that our d-backs became good despite Schiano doesn't know what he's talking about - on this particular subject. However, I understand why some people assumed that the players were told to not turn and look, because quite often, our d-backs didn't. My guess is that they didn't for the same reason there are illegal blocks in the back on kick returns in every football game you watch - players screw up.

 

[valkabit]

LOL, ask Tampa Bay that! BTW, did you know that he was voted (by the players in the Big East) the coach they would least like to play for.

If you notice OP, the people that have been coming here defending Schiano's style, are the same ones who licked his boots for over a decade. And, will lick them again if given half a chance. He is a 500 coach at best. Yes, his D is very good, and might shine with the talent that he will have at Ohio State. But, once a dik, always a dik!

So you admit the people who are listing GS' attributes towards the OSU job are probably spot on? So it is safe to assume you're simply attacking Schiano because you don't like him?
In your own words you said he'll probably do a good job with the OSU level of talent.. which means any other comments are simply attacks because you don't like him..

 

[saran]

Greg always said he taught DBs to LOOK for the ball. Then when guys didn't do it (like happens sometimes on most teams) forum fuzzy logic decided Greg must teach DBs not to look for the ball. Is Bill Beli taking RU DBs because they play wrong? No.

On another note, this article explains Gregs defensive inclinations unusually well

"Greg Schiano's Defensive Philosophy Explained"
http://www.bucsnation.com/2012/4/23/2967681/greg-schianos-defensive-philosophy-explained

 

[JoeRU0304]

It is a high-pressure defense with a lot of stunting and blitzing. It will be a good fit for Ohio State because he relies heavily on his corners playing one on one against their receiver.

When it works it's pretty damn fun to watch.

This, with it's main weakness being counters and quick slants.


Joe P.

 

[RU Husky]

He defends the victory formation pretty well.

 

[rutgers48]

People can't point to 2001 but can point to 1998 at Miami?

You can't be serious. Didn't think I had to spell it out but ok....Rutgers 2001 roster was a high school team. We had kids who chose Rutgers over Stony Brook yet someone is trying to say 80-7 that year was indicative of poor defensive coaching? Come on man. I don't get why some of you can't acknowledge that schiano is actually a good DC. Whatever.

 

[krup]

People can't point to 2001 but can point to 1998 at Miami?

Well, yes. The type of athlete Schiano was working with at Miami was WAY more relevant to what he will do at OSU than the roster had in the early years at RU.

 

[needmorecowbell]

It is a high-pressure defense with a lot of stunting and blitzing. It will be a good fit for Ohio State because he relies heavily on his corners playing one on one against their receiver.

When it works it's pretty damn fun to watch.

Very good short recap. Dominating when good but the top coaches will identify the weaknesses and exploit them.

 

[needmorecowbell]

Thanks for the insights, keep them coming.

As for his personality, Urban keeps control of his coaches, I am not worried about him getting out of hand with Urban around. If anything it is a chance for schiano to learn a different philosophy on dealing with players and directing a program.

You are probably right. The one hang up Schiano always had was that he was a control freak. It killed him in the NFL and it was the reason he never won really big at RU. The guy is a big time hard worker and demands 100% from everyone at all times.

 

[James_Bond]

The McCourtys were 2 star DBs with 3 minor offers between them when they came to RU. Devin was actually the weakest recruit and he became first rounder way before Bill Belli got him. With the McCourty's, Courtney Greene and Ron Girault RU was in top 5 for pass defense in nation for a couple years - all with a bunch of no names who lived within 20 minutes of Tappan Zee bridge. RU has had a lot of Schiano DBs start (including KC, Titans etc along with NE), Schiano was DB coach in NFL. The claim GS couldn't coach DBs is just silly.

^ This 100%

 

[RU-Choppin-Ohio]

A big question.....Will Schiano bring the tilted NT to OSU ? Probably not because of Larry Johnson. But, it is designed to force teams to double and allow LB'ers and other Defensive lineman to penetrate the backfield against the run. If they don't double the tilted NT, he is in perfect position to slide and penetrate into the back field. Not sure how many TFL's OSU gets...but, Schiano Defense thrives on them.

 

[Akron Buck]

We had 79 TFL this season

 

[RU-ROCS]

umm... first, that 2006 team is WAY overhyped on this board. It was a top 20 team but not a top 10 (we played weak competition for the most part to get there). WVU at the time was legitimately a top 10 team at the time and had better talent. In regulation the score was something like 24-24. That 2006 WVU game went to triple overtime... we lost to the better team.

Your Michigan St and UNH anecdotes were in the 2004-2005 range and those were more due to lack of coaching experience rather than anything else. BTW everyone was getting lit up by Chip Kelley. He was introducing a totally new kind off offense to the CFB world... Once he had time to study those types off offenses he was able to create a good defense for it provided that the correct talent could be recruited for it.

A lot of complaints about GS in this thread are on his handling of the offense or head coaching duties. He is going to be the OSU DC... So you only need to look at his DC skills to answer the OP and those were/are superb.

Some valid arguments, but you do realize you are starting to sound like Schiano's mom!

 

[RU-ROCS]

Schiano was not offered the Rutgers HC job. But he an Meyers are friends and have mutual respect. This will be stepping stone back to a HC job for Schiano. With the size and speed of the talent on OSU he will do very well there. However I do not think his being there hurts are recruiting at all. If he recruits NJ he will get the same players that any other OSU recruiter would have gotten.

I agree.

 

[VirtualKnight]

Source? I have seen no confirmation that Schiano was offered the job.

He was offered the job very quietly through Greg Brown and he had some serious demands. RU countered and gave him 36 hours to accept which he turned down. Hobbs then moved on.

 

[RU-Choppin-Ohio]

We had 79 TFL this season

Akron Buck.......As a comparison, Rutgers best defense under Schiano ( 2009 ) had 113 TFL's for 426 total yards.

Of course, the competition may not have been as good as what OSU faced. But, I think that is a significant difference.

 

[Akron Buck]

Akron Buck.......As a comparison, Rutgers best defense under Schiano ( 2009 ) had 113 TFL's for 426 total yards.

Of course, the competition may not have been as good as what OSU faced. But, I think that is a significant difference.

113 is very impressive.

 

[LotusAggressor]

This should be the best place to ask.

What kind of defense does he run? Does he get after the QB? Does he play zone or man?

We get really,really good redruits so he will have a massive amount of talent do you think he can put them in the right spot to succeed?

Fickell does well coaching LB's and Johnson does great coaching Dline, but before Ash our DB's were poorly coached and frankly Ash was the one calling plays on game day so I expect Schiano to take that over.

His defenses struggled to defend misdirection and spread offenses. His style of defense works best against pro-style offenses. When his defense works, it's devastating. Lots of forced turnovers, sacks, and tackles for loss. The second half of the Louisville game in 2006 is an example of a Schiano defense at its best.

 

[VirtualKnight]

Schiano runs a basic 4-3 cover 2 shell. You'll see a lot of man under and man free coverages (thus the DB's reading hip to eyes to hands V. looking for the ball). This allows him to get creative with stint/blitz combos that are hard to block and result in many sacks, tfl's and Q leaving the game. His teams tackle well and create turnovers with good eye to hip and helmet placement "bite the ball" technique.

Your defense will be fun to watch and probably won't lose anything from the last 2 years. His players may not all like him (at the time), but they all respect him and play at a high level for him. He demands perfection and isn't affraid to sit a better player if he doesn't buy into the team concept.

 

[rsutton86]

Doesn't he run the Tampa 2 defense. MLB needs to be fast as he will flying 20 yards downfield to cover the TE and Seam routes.

-Disguises blitzes well
-Goes for speed versus size
-Defended the spread well in last season once he got the speed he wanted at the LB position

I never liked his DL slanting consistently with LBs filling the opposite gaps. When he guessed right it was great...when he didn't.....you know the result.

One more...he is never prepared for the backup QB...or is deemed liked we would shit the bed against any team who had a backup QB in.

 

[Akron Buck]

It won;t take long to see how he is adjusting to tOSU since we play the sooners in week 3.

 

[D1ESEL44]

Schiano runs a basic 4-3 cover 2 shell. You'll see a lot of man under and man free coverages (thus the DB's reading hip to eyes to hands V. looking for the ball). This allows him to get creative with stint/blitz combos that are hard to block and result in many sacks, tfl's and Q leaving the game. His teams tackle well and create turnovers with good eye to hip and helmet placement "bite the ball" technique.

Your defense will be fun to watch and probably won't lose anything from the last 2 years. His players may not all like him (at the time), but they all respect him and play at a high level for him. He demands perfection and isn't affraid to sit a better player if he doesn't buy into the team concept.

Good post.

Read VirtualKnight's post - this is an accurate post Akron Buck.

I would also add that Schiano loves to roll coverages to confuse the QB. You will also see a TON of pre-snap. When Schiano was here, I don't think I ever saw a college defense do more pre-snap movement than Rutgers. The idea was to confuse the o-line. He also uses a tilt nose tackle, which don't see a lot of defenses doing anymore. He wants a defensive line, in particular the 3 technique defensive tackle, to penetrate and collapse the pocket.