In our 5 real game against power conference teams Gavin has 2 defensive rebounds. 11 on the season.
We have such more monumental issues going on with this team than whether Ogbole can give us quality minutes as a backup or not. If he can great, but if not I just don't think it makes all that much difference in the whole scheme of things considering the other issues going on.100%
How can anyone watch this team and not think a back up center of his size won’t be helpful come Big10 play!!?
Of course the above assumes he can give the team at least decent defense and rebounding. But I have not heard anything to the contrary about him. So IMHO there is no question he will help.
We have such more monumental issues going on with this team than whether Ogbole can give us quality minutes as a backup or not. If he can great, but if not I just don't think it makes all that much difference in the whole scheme of things considering the other issues going on.
I did not say if we are not going to be elite we will be bad. I said we do not have the defense we have had in the past when we were elite to win those 59-56 rock fights. Caleb is not walking thru the door. We can be serviceable and cause some havoc with our press and Mag and Cliff will do everything they can defensively to make sure we are not abused , but we have to win this year with better offense. You are not putting Gavin and Aundre on the bench and play Mag, Wolf and Cliff upfront and optimize our offensive output. We might need Williams if the guards are being backed down , but getting as much offense out of Noah, JMike and Derek as possible is the better way to wins. If Gavin and Aundre can ever become more consistent from 3 , that is also a better way to wins. You want to see optimal defense and I want to see wins.So why would that make Pike not to put his best D lineups out there. Your logic says if we aren't going to be elite defensively than let's just be bad defensively.
I don't have + / - numbers but I know in almost every game against real competition we go backwards with our offensive lineup and if we make a run it is with our better defensive lineup.
That is a totally different issue that Pike or Knight has to address. He is 6 feet 8 inches. By accident he should get 2-3 rebounds. For him to have 1 rebound or 2 rebounds in multiple games that is totally a lack of desire and understanding of how he can help the team besides knocking down 3’s. Suprised to say the least coming from his background and tape.In our 5 real game against power conference teams Gavin has 2 defensive rebounds. 11 on the season.
I did say our best chance is to win rock fights...doesn't mean that we will win them. When you look at each side of the ball I think more improvement by varying the personnel comes from defense.I did not say if we are not going to be elite we will be bad. I said we do not have the defense we have had in the past when we were elite to win those 59-56 rock fights. Caleb is not walking thru the door. We can be serviceable and cause some havoc with our press and Mag and Cliff will do everything they can defensively to make sure we are not abused , but we have to win this year with better offense. You are not putting Gavin and Aundre on the bench and play Mag, Wolf and Cliff upfront and optimize our offensive output. We might need Williams if the guards are being backed down , but getting as much offense out of Noah, JMike and Derek as possible is the better way to wins. If Gavin and Aundre can ever become more consistent from 3 , that is also a better way to wins. You want to see optimal defense and I want to see wins.
I did say our best chance is to win rock fights...doesn't mean that we will win them. When you look at each side of the ball I think more improvement by varying the personnel comes from defense.
I think we play a lineup with gavin and Hyatt we may improve our scoring a hair but lose mutiples of the offensive gain on D. Whereas as our best defensive lineup gains more on D than they lose on O.
Pike could be wrong, but when you look at how he has substitued in the 5 real games I think he agrees.
no it doesnt, its a shitty location on a shitty day and time
Put the defense and rebounding aside for a second. Griffiths has the lowest offensive rating of any rotation player. The question is not whether him being in helps us win because that answer is obviously no right now. The question is what level of investment do we put in by playing him now and what's the playoff later in the season or next season?
The Answer is yes if the offense is run right. If the point guards can get the ball in to Cliff with good passes or work the pick and roll properly or if they do not pass they drive and kick it on the corner for. Hyatt 3 and you still have Cliff and Mag for offensive rebounds. If the point guards can penetrate either all the way to the hole or jump stop and kick back out for a 3 . Or if we run continuous screens whether it is a pin down or a double screen or a staggered screen to get an open look. Any of those options get you the offense to get over the hump to win over hoping our defense is good enough to hold them off.you throw A will as the 5th i get that the lineup has trouble scoring. Does the addition of Hyatt or Griffith make up for what they could cost you defensively?
Right now it would be Hyatt as he is the only one in this group who has been consistent from 3 and shoots FT well. Down the road I hope it becomes Griffith.Yes. We dont have enough sample size of A Will. Yes Hyatt appears improved with his decision making on offense.
It comes down to you have 8 minutes left in a B1G and you are tied. You have pretty much gone through ykur “rest rotations”.
You have 2 of the PG out there, Mag and Cliff. Who is the 5th guy?
Gavin?
Hyatt?
A Will?
3rd PG?
Oskar?
WOolfolk?
In your scenario what is the incremental boost Hyatt provides in that offensive possession.The Answer is yes if the offense is run right. If the point guards can get the ball in to Cliff with good passes or work the pick and roll properly or if they do not pass they drive and kick it on the corner for. Hyatt 3 and you still have Cliff and Mag for offensive rebounds. If the point guards can penetrate either all the way to the hole or jump stop and kick back out for a 3 . Or if we run continuous screens whether it is a pin down or a double screen or a staggered screen to get an open look. Any of those options get you the offense to get over the hump to win over hoping our defense is good enough to hold them off.
No that can’t even be the debate. We’re not going to have Gavin out there with 2 guards in the situation you describe. Not with his rebounding.you throw A will as the 5th i get that the lineup has trouble scoring. Does the addition of Hyatt or Griffith make up for what they could cost you defensively?
Hyatt is shooting 36% this year.In your scenario what is the incremental boost Hyatt provides in that offensive possession.
Hyatt's career 3 point percentage is 29.7%
AWill career 3 point percentage is 28.8%
If he really is just going to sit in the corner and knock down 3s I'll take A Will on defense and lose the 1% in 3 pt shooting.
I see Hyatt more of an asset as a 4.
Last 2 years by year's end Hyatt played his way out of major minutes in the rotation because of his D. Oskar played over him with our season on the line last year.Right now it would be Hyatt as he is the only one in this group who has been consistent from 3 and shoots FT well. Down the road I hope it becomes Griffith.
In your scenario what is the incremental boost Hyatt provides in that offensive possession.
Hyatt's career 3 point percentage is 29.7%
AWill career 3 point percentage is 28.8%
If he really is just going to sit in the corner and knock down 3s I'll take A Will on defense and lose the 1% in 3 pt shooting.
I see Hyatt more of an asset as a 4.
yes....I'll take the 333 sample size over 53.Hyatt is shooting 36% this year.
It is relevant on defense. A lot does matter with the 3 or 4 perimeter players our opponent has.Position (3 vs 4) is irrelevant on offense. Hyatt guards a 4 when he’s in the game.
Unfortunately I wouldn't think so. Maybe it happens, but I just don't see a switch turning on and him being such an impact offensive player that we have to make it work on the defensive end.No that can’t even be the debate. We’re not going to have Gavin out there with 2 guards in the situation you describe. Not with his rebounding.
It is relevant on defense. A lot does matter with the 3 or 4 perimeter players our opponent has.
Yes. I have not seen enough of A Williams on D to conclude he is a PLUS defender. He may not even be an average defender. We have seen Hyatt enough to know what he is defensively. Maybe in year 6 as a "leader" he gets it. I would think lateral quickness, length and body isn't holding him back
My general premise is Pike will play the lineup that will defend the best. If there is no one more than marginally better than you will see Hyatt out there.I think you may be overvaluing Williams’ D.
My general premise is Pike will play the lineup that will defend the best. If there is no one more than marginally better than you will see Hyatt out there.
That also could mean we are staring down a 6-14ish B1G record
My general premise is Pike will play the lineup that will defend the best. If there is no one more than marginally better than you will see Hyatt out there.
That also could mean we are staring down a 6-14ish B1G record
This comment seems kind of out of place in the context of this discussion. What point are you trying to make? it’s a given Mag would be a part of our best defensive line up. Why compare him to Hyatt?Here's where fans are fascinated with stats.....and ignore obvious other ones to support what they want to believe.
If I told fans that RU is averaging the same amount of PPG as they did last year in the 1st 10 games, would fans believe that is true?? All I keep seeing is that we haven't made up for the losses in the backcourt, but the teams PPG is essentially the same.
If I told fans that pushing the tempo has resulted in RU earning 63 MORE FTs in their first 10 games this year vs last year, would that be a fact or fiction??? It's obviously a fact and while the FT shooting has been a problem for a few players, you cannot ignore that pushing the tempo and the guards driving to the basket, is resulting in points.
I don't know how fans blindly ignore players improving and those items revert back to career numbers........then at the same time, when other players are improving, those players are going to be "important pieces".
Let's just look at 2 players....one seemingly isn't going to ever win over fans.....and one is seemingly irreplaceable and holds the keys to the entire palace. The harsh reality is if you removed either player from the roster, the team doesn't have the depth or an adequate replacement.....but fans can't seem to grasp value, based on what actually happens and impacts the roster, scoreboard or the trickle down effect, of what would happen IF....
What if I told fans that both Mawot Mag and Aundre Hyatt have improved every single year, in almost every single category in the last 3 years??
Should I actually look at career 3 point shooting percentages OR look at the trends that are clearly in front of RU fans.
Do I want to look at someone's 3 point shooting percentages, if they're not a high volume shooter or take one 3 pointer per game??
Hyatt......27.1......to 30.6.....to 35.8 from 3 point range.
Hyatt.....63.4.......to 69.6.....to 75.0 from the FT line
Hyatt....2.8.....to 3.9......to 5.6 rebounds per game year over year.
Assists, very modest....0.7 to 0.8 to 1.7 per game
4.3 PPG ......8.8.......to 11.5....
Mag
23.5......to 30.0......to 40 from 3......
69.6.....to 74 from the FT line last year....
0.4 to 1.1 to 2.0 assists per game
2.9......to 7.8 to 7.0 PPG so far in the 2 games.
Do Hyatt and Mag play a different style of basketball?? Absolutely, they're different players with different strengths and weaknesses. One has a better offensive game, one is better on defense and both are OK on the boards this year.
If the team continues to shoot poorly from the FT line and shoots 20% from 3, they won't win many games.
On the other hand, if the team is averaging pretty close to the same amount of PPG from the 1st 10 games this year vs last year, shouldn't it make sense that the faster tempo and guards ability to attack the defense off the dribble, results in more fouls??? Which means more FT attempts......which means seemingly more chances to set up a token press, which at worse, protects the half court defense for less time??
If we are objective, with modest FT improvement and the expected improvement on the glass with Mag back AND a small or modest increase in shot attempts from 3......wouldn't it make sense that this roster should improve from November through February???
Clearly we’re not.Thru the 1st 10 teams we are 257th in offensive efficiency
Last year thru 10 gmes we were 217th
Last year we had Paul and Caleb hurt a good chunk of the 1st 10 games.
We weren't supposed to be on par with last year. We needed to be better offensively.
You cannot compare the Hyatt and JWill 3 point shooters without watching. Hyatt is a catch and shoot guy or one dribble and launch. JWill looks like he was heaving them and could not catch and shoot without getting blocked with any reasonable defense on him. Hyatt has been about 35% this year and it also looks comfortable and good when it is leaving his hands. What Hyatt has to give you are the defensive rebounds like he did last game and the strong drives all the way to the hoop and actually making his layups like last game. That is the Hyatt that has to show up against Big 10 competition. He is capable if he does the things he does well and avoids the things that he does not do well, dribbling , backing down players , just shooting for the sake of shooting not in rhythm or in the flow of the offense or via a kick out. Hyatt , Mag and Cliff can be as formidable as any front court in the Big 10. Your belaboring his defensive liabilities which are not as bad as you claim are more than offset with the things he can contribute offensively and on the boardsIn your scenario what is the incremental boost Hyatt provides in that offensive possession.
Hyatt's career 3 point percentage is 29.7%
AWill career 3 point percentage is 28.8%
If he really is just going to sit in the corner and knock down 3s I'll take A Will on defense and lose the 1% in 3 pt shooting.
I see Hyatt more of an asset as a 4.
The biggest games of the season last year Aundre Hyatt was on the bench and Oskar Palmquist took his minutes. That isn't me thinking his defense is bad....that is Coach Pike making that determination.Your belaboring his defensive liabilities which are not as bad as you claim are more than offset with the things he can contribute offensively and on the boards
I think we have better offensive days ahead of us. Maybe it is a case of seeing what I want to see......I have seen a noticable difference in passing the 2 games Mag has been back. He makes the extra pass and so far it appears contagious.Clearly we’re not.
Rebounding out of the American East is different than rebounding out of B1G.....having said that A Williams rebounds like a forward and has lifetime DEFENSIVE rebounding numbers better than Hyatt
Its gone.Stop. Let’s put it this way. The leading rebounder on that Hartford team was a 6-3 guard who now plays for St Bonnie’s. He raked in 6.2 boards for Hartford William’s’ last season. He’s currently averaging 2.1 RPG this season. Last year he grabbed 2.6 RPG for St Bonnies.
In other words, Williams success on the glass at Hartford means nothing. Derek Simpson would’ve grabbed 5+ boards there. Someone had to grab rebounds eventually.
The biggest games of the season last year Aundre Hyatt was on the bench and Oskar Palmquist took his minutes. That isn't me thinking his defense is bad....that is Coach Pike making that determination.
Its gone.
You know way too much about the America East conference though.