How far back are we now as a program?

[Vince2310]

we all expected a step up in coaching the fundamentals this year. We all saw Ash's video on rugby tackling and how he turned around Ohio states defense. So while we didn't expect a winning season, we did expect better coaching. What we have is a bunch of inexperienced coaches that know how to talk a big game but can't execute.

So I am curious how far back are we now as a program. To me it feels like a 5 year setback with the hope of getting back to being a 6-6 team.

 

[Scarlet_Scourge]

The same as were were before Ash was hired.

He was hired to rebuild this program from the ground up.

It is going to suck for the 1st few years just like when GS had to do the same thing here.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

The same as were were before Ash was hired.

He was hired to rebuild this program from the ground up.

It is going to suck for the 1st few years just like when GS had to do the same thing here.

This. People really need to relax a little.

 

[Pritz99]

While I'm very disappointed in the area of fundamentals (tackling sticks out), the HC will be given a minimum of three years to show something. And if there's insufficient progress somewhere along the line, the Schiano talk will begin -- and rightly so.

 

[beaced]

we all expected a step up in coaching the fundamentals this year. We all saw Ash's video on rugby tackling and how he turned around Ohio states defense. So while we didn't expect a winning season, we did expect better coaching. What we have is a bunch of inexperienced coaches that know how to talk a big game but can't execute.

So I am curious how far back are we now as a program. To me it feels like a 5 year setback with the hope of getting back to being a 6-6 team.

We are so far back that the only thing behind us IS our behinds.

 

[Saint Puppy]

Unfortunately with a rebuild like this one (where the cupboard is basically bare) we have a long rebuild. Everybody is talking about year 3 of Ash being the breakout year, but in truth that is the best case scenario if Ash works out. Right now Ash's job can be summed up in 3 words recruiting, recruiting, recruiting. If Ash does not work out (which none of us really want to think about) this is going to be a very long road.

 

[Jabanero]

this is soooo painful to watch, I turned it off at 28-zip, we simply can not compete with the upper half of the league, let alone a 2 win team. There are a number of our starters who are not Big 10 caliber players, appreciate their effort but time to graduate and move on !!

 

[RUfromSoCal?]

Ask me after Feb 1, 2017.........

then we'll have a better idea how good a recruiting staff we have......

ask me again Feb 1, 2018 and then we'll know for sure......

 

[Caliknight]

We are 4 solid recruiting classes back.

 

[RUaMoose]

Unfortunately with a rebuild like this one (where the cupboard is basically bare) we have a long rebuild. Everybody is talking about year 3 of Ash being the breakout year, but in truth that is the best case scenario if Ash works out. Right now Ash's job can be summed up in 3 words recruiting, recruiting, recruiting. If Ash does not work out (which none of us really want to think about) this is going to be a very long road.

The question is do we have the right guy running the rebuild. In my opinion we do not. Therefore we'll be wasting years until the rest of you come around

 

[RUbacker]

The question is do we have the right guy running the rebuild. In my opinion we do not. Therefore we'll be wasting years until the rest of you come around

No one can be sure. We took a big swing here so we have a lot riding on ash.

 

[Machiavelli23]

The question is do we have the right guy running the rebuild. In my opinion we do not. Therefore we'll be wasting years until the rest of you come around

I thought Narduzzi could have been a good hire. No way would we have gotten Tom Herman. Another name could have been the golden boy, Al Golden, top rated recruiting classes at Da U got him no where and no way would he have gotten as highly rated classes at RU.

Who in your opinion do you think we should have gotten?

 

[Steve91562]

As bad as this year looks, and it has looked pretty bad at times, we're not as bad as the blowout scores seem to indicate. A few playmakers will make a big difference. Just compare this squad w/ Grant to it w/o him. For whatever reason we're 0-4 in the toss up games, but they were toss up games. Odds tend to work themselves out over time. maybe next year we're 4-0 in the toss up games.

 

[Saint Puppy]

The question is do we have the right guy running the rebuild. In my opinion we do not. Therefore we'll be wasting years until the rest of you come around

Obviously the results of these games are very tough to swallow as a fanbase, and of course it's only natural that you immediately look at the top guy/figurehead of the program which is Ash. I think we need to remember that this is not a Harbaugh situation where he came into ton of talent with Mich. and immediately turned them around. This is a much tougher situation (an almost impossible one to thrive in) where you have inferior talent that is getting blown out and playing for a coach who didn't recruit them. Bottom line Ash has to get a pass for the next couple of years whether we like it or not - his true value at this moment will come in Feb.- and that in and of itself will be no easy task.

 

[BoogieKnight]

The question is do we have the right guy running the rebuild. In my opinion we do not. Therefore we'll be wasting years until the rest of you come around

Right, because he's from Ottumwa, Iowa and not Red Bank.

 

[zappaa]

We are 4 solid recruiting classes back.

Given our history and the history of the top NJ players leaving the state, what makes you think today's 18 year old kids will be any different?
Every team in the B1G has culture and history on their side. There's only one reason a NJ 18 year old with multiple options would stay home...Ash would have to do what every other coach here has tried to do, sell them on NJ pride, if you and the guy next to you stay home we can win, it's no different than the 2016 dream team that fell apart for us.
Given what I see on the field, how will Ash be able to harness NJ pride.
Unlike others on this board who think schemes and sticking to a plan impress great NJ players...I don't see it

 

[bac2therac]

I thought Narduzzi could have been a good hire. No way would we have gotten Tom Herman. Another name could have been the golden boy, Al Golden, top rated recruiting classes at Da U got him no where and no way would he have gotten as highly rated classes at RU.

Who in your opinion do you think we should have gotten?

If we fired Flood in 2013 yes we would have had Hermann...Narduzzi at worst

 

[FELONIOUSMONK]

Scourge I hope you are correct but if this class bolts then we continue to drop further and further into a talent vacuum.You have to earn the trust of the recruits and the fans and that is far from the case now
I am a 50 year fan since grade school in Highland Park, through college in Gainesville ,through stops in Boston to San Diego and back to Jersey.I am just tired of watching and waiting man. I really am. There is way too much talent in this damned state for this .

 

[billhilf]

While I don't think we will necessarily be better next year, it's not impossible. Every year at least one team that won 4 or less games the year before has a winning record the next year.

Colorado won 4 games last year, and 2 the year before. This year they are 8-2. Just saying it's not impossible, in fact these turnarounds are somewhat common.

 

[Pritz99]

zappaa -- kids are not coming here for Jersey pride. NJ is not Alabama, Tennessee, OSU, etc. What will get them to Rutgers is a vision, one which has winning, bowl games, the NFL, being in the Hunt for championships. Ash hast o make kids believe this can happen in their tenure here. Sure, playing early, being in front of family and friends half the games, academics are factors; but being part of a winning culture, raising up trophies, being prepped for the NFL is why kids from NJ go to Michigan, OSU, Florida, Notre Dame, PSU, etc.

Michigan players didn't go to the "Cow School" til they got a top notch coach and started winning. They went to MIChigan (and by and large, still do). Florida kids don't go to USF and UCF until there's no room for them at FSU,m iami, or Florida. And if those kids at USF were recruited by Alabama, Auburn, georgia, OSU, they'd be going there.

Schiano was the only coach RU ever had that convinced recruits oft hat vision. Whether Ash can do it rremains to be seen. I hope so.

 

[rutgersguy1]

If we fired Flood in 2013 yes we would have had Hermann...Narduzzi at worst

Yea I had mentioned Herman multiple times on the board that year as my favorite and I barely got a couple responses because most didn't know much about him even though I posted a ton about him like I did last year about Aranda. He was't the rock star he became lately so he definitely could have been had. Everyone was on Narduzzi who I thought was a solid coach but just lower down my list. He's proving that he is.

To me it's just too early and I've been neutral on Ash right from the start and still am. I'd say if you're leaning negative try to be open for 2.5 years or so (not like you have a choice anyway lol and he's likely to see the 4th) and let it play out. You might be right you might be surprised but it's hard to see much right now IMO until he gets a little bit of his stamp on the roster.

 

[Abro1975]

Penn St and Pitt are good again, and Rutgers is a national laughingstock again. I feel like I'm in a time warp.

 

[BoroKnight]

If we fired Flood in 2013 yes we would have had Hermann...Narduzzi at worst

Why would we fire a coach after two years when the lesser one was 6-7 and the other one was a share of our first conference championship? We're not Texas. Rutgers is not going to fire a 6-7 coach unless all the off-the-field crap happened before that season and not two years later.

The problem is not going into his first year knowing full well he was an interim coach and not letting the results of that season matter one bit. You give him the interim label -- and with his resume there's no way he passes that up -- and then do a coaching search and it's a different story. But the idea of firing him after two seasons is preposterous, and then he goes 8-5 the following year, everyone goes overboard thinking that 3-5 in the Big Ten is so wonderful and then we just pound UNC in the bowl game and people are happy.

It's very hard to justify firing him before we did. Seems crazy, but it is.

 

[Pils86]

We have about 40 kids on the roster ranked 3 star or higher. Say 10 leave this year and hopefully Ash brings in 20 more and we have 50 kids on the roster three star or higher. Then throw in the 2 stars that will be serviceable (Cole and Heeman come to mind). This is not a Terry Shea level talented team and should not look like one on the field. The coaches should be able to put these kids in position to easily win the gimmees, win a couple of the lower level B10 and limit the horrific margin of losses. We should not look like a bought D2 team to the big boys.

 

[Machiavelli23]

Why would we fire a coach after two years when the lesser one was 6-7 and the other one was a share of our first conference championship? We're not Texas. Rutgers is not going to fire a 6-7 coach unless all the off-the-field crap happened before that season and not two years later.

The problem is not going into his first year knowing full well he was an interim coach and not letting the results of that season matter one bit. You give him the interim label -- and with his resume there's no way he passes that up -- and then do a coaching search and it's a different story. But the idea of firing him after two seasons is preposterous, and then he goes 8-5 the following year, everyone goes overboard thinking that 3-5 in the Big Ten is so wonderful and then we just pound UNC in the bowl game and people are happy.

It's very hard to justify firing him before we did. Seems crazy, but it is.

The lack of forward thinking by the RU administration has set us back. We really could/should have taken advantage of our regional competition's woes.... PSU during their years on probation.... Pitt during their coaching carousel... etc. At least Cuse is still trying to build itself up from years of not being relevant.

 

[koleszar]

Yea I had mentioned Herman multiple times on the board that year as my favorite and I barely got a couple responses because most didn't know much about him even though I posted a ton about him like I did last year about Aranda. He was't the rock star he became lately so he definitely could have been had. Everyone was on Narduzzi who I thought was a solid coach but just lower down my list. He's proving that he is.

To me it's just too early and I've been neutral on Ash right from the start and still am. I'd say if you're leaning negative try to be open for 2.5 years or so (not like you have a choice anyway lol and he's likely to see the 4th) and let it play out. You might be right you might be surprised but it's hard to see much right now IMO until he gets a little bit of his stamp on the roster.

My biggest fear is we missed the boat by keeping Coach Incompetent too long. I remember having several discussions with you about Aranda and I really liked his ingenuity on defense. Something I'm not seeing now with our team. Which quite frankly is disturbing.

This is not an attacking defense, it seems it's more read and react. Defense is supposed to be Ash's specialty. Now it may be a by product of our personnel, but the blitzes are not well designed. I fear if Ash isn't the answer and this administration has never been one to open up the check book we might just begin the revolving rolodex of coaching hires every 4 yrs.

 

[RUJMM78]

Its too soon to say regarding Ash but there should be a evaluation of the coaching staff at the end of the season.There is something fundamentally wrong when the team is unprepared to play in the first quarter regardless of the level of competition.

 

[Caliknight]

Given our history and the history of the top NJ players leaving the state, what makes you think today's 18 year old kids will be any different?
Every team in the B1G has culture and history on their side. There's only one reason a NJ 18 year old with multiple options would stay home...Ash would have to do what every other coach here has tried to do, sell them on NJ pride, if you and the guy next to you stay home we can win, it's no different than the 2016 dream team that fell apart for us.
Given what I see on the field, how will Ash be able to harness NJ pride.
Unlike others on this board who think schemes and sticking to a plan impress great NJ players...I don't see it

I'm looking at the current class. If things change, the outlook on Ash will. If not, he is doing what needs to be done.

 

[RUforlife]

We have about 40 kids on the roster ranked 3 star or higher. Say 10 leave this year and hopefully Ash brings in 20 more and we have 50 kids on the roster three star or higher. Then throw in the 2 stars that will be serviceable (Cole and Heeman come to mind). This is not a Terry Shea level talented team and should not look like one on the field. The coaches should be able to put these kids in position to easily win the gimmees, win a couple of the lower level B10 and limit the horrific margin of losses. We should not look like a bought D2 team to the big boys.

Please, don't you know the company line is to blame it all on the kids. Didn't you know we start 11 walk-ons on both sides of the ball. These kids talent wise would have a tough time winning intramural games, let alone intercollegiate games. We lost 49-0 to a team coming in with a 7 game losing streak, and guess what going into this year there were plenty on this board who were telling us we have equal or better talent and put it down as a W or a winnable game. Nah, can't have anything to do with the coaching. Jeez, you just can't make this crap up.

 

[zappaa]

zappaa -- kids are not coming here for Jersey pride. NJ is not Alabama, Tennessee, OSU, etc. What will get them to Rutgers is a vision, one which has winning, bowl games, the NFL, being in the Hunt for championships. Ash hast o make kids believe this can happen in their tenure here. Sure, playing early, being in front of family and friends half the games, academics are factors; but being part of a winning culture, raising up trophies, being prepped for the NFL is why kids from NJ go to Michigan, OSU, Florida, Notre Dame, PSU, etc.

Michigan players didn't go to the "Cow School" til they got a top notch coach and started winning. They went to MIChigan (and by and large, still do). Florida kids don't go to USF and UCF until there's no room for them at FSU,m iami, or Florida. And if those kids at USF were recruited by Alabama, Auburn, georgia, OSU, they'd be going there.

Schiano was the only coach RU ever had that convinced recruits oft hat vision. Whether Ash can do it rremains to be seen. I hope so.

Jersey boy pride and staying home is the only vision CA can sell at this time…IMO
Your vision has way to much chicken or the egg scenario.

 

[zappaa]

I'm looking at the current class. If things change, the outlook on Ash will. If not, he is doing what needs to be done.

I agree, CA is a genius if he can overcome what these kids are seeing and keep our top guys.