We have players that should be able to contend next year. Why bring in someone brand new who they don't know and ruin that?
I for one have been critical of Jordan lately,but
- Thread starter higgins3
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We have players that should be able to contend next year. Why bring in someone brand new who they don't know and ruin that?
I hear you on the eye test. I am taking a lot of players out of HS with a huge grain of salt. Hype about Williams shooting, Goode shooting. The truth is the HS-d1 jump is immense, and not much can be said about how one will perform. You just hope they give effort and contribute in some kind of way.
I don't want to make any predictions. If everyone stays, I think 6-8 big ten games could be won. That is being realistic. I really do think Sanders and Johnson will be a powerful duo. I am unsure how Diallo and Doorson come back. Again, that is Jordans job and should be his main focus right now.
You are the doctor, not I. I don't know how well he will hold up. All I am saying is Jordan has to take full responsibilty and keep on eye on those three players. If he does not, he will not have a job after next season. He is too old for other teams to take him. He will get one more year and he has to show he is worthy of another 2 years. I for one am not sold on Jordan coaching, I do not think he is the right guy for the job, but I think firing him now does more harm than good to a team that is developing and has some pieces.
maybe a guy who can make them better...what exactly are you ruining..they have won 5 games against struggled against Cent Conn St who is ranked 351 and awful Central Arkansas will full lineups
I had a good friend email me this last night.....
"Can a triple OT loss save EJ???"......
It was a simple but extremely detailed question.....I think we need to set aside the Illini game and look at all 30+ games and make the determination on where the program is now, next year or 3 years from now.
If you are in the NBA, then you don't make the change because it's not that big of a deal.....but this is college and recruiting has or will be what determines Eddie's 4th year or beyond.
I think if Ohams lands at RU, you would have safe/decent but not overwhelming talent on the roster lined up, but it is difficult to imagine, Freeman, Johnson, Laurent and Sanders not improving things next year. I'm not even asking any incoming freshman to have an impact on the roster, but some kids could potentially play and help out. We would still be painfully young but there would be some spots of potential.
There usually is a turning point with a program trying to rebuild, where they get to a next level and then stop or slide backwards. The rest of the schedule needs to be reviewed closely before making such a rash statement. It still comes down to Illinois, Penn State and Minnesota 2X or potentially 3X in the B1G tournament. PSU is still horrible, but has a very promising recruiting class arriving, but that's still 2-3 years down the road of any significant impact on their won-loss record.
I think Sanders and Nigel Johnson will be good as a tandem and Mike Williams is revamped into a perfect 3rd guard role. If there is improvement beyond last night, Eddie then earns more time. But 0-18 is still very real and that cannot be a vantage point of earning a 4th year, under any sane person's viewpoint. RU needs at least a couple of wins to see Eddie assured a 4th season, IMO.
"Can a triple OT loss save EJ???"......
It was a simple but extremely detailed question.....I think we need to set aside the Illini game and look at all 30+ games and make the determination on where the program is now, next year or 3 years from now.
If you are in the NBA, then you don't make the change because it's not that big of a deal.....but this is college and recruiting has or will be what determines Eddie's 4th year or beyond.
I think if Ohams lands at RU, you would have safe/decent but not overwhelming talent on the roster lined up, but it is difficult to imagine, Freeman, Johnson, Laurent and Sanders not improving things next year. I'm not even asking any incoming freshman to have an impact on the roster, but some kids could potentially play and help out. We would still be painfully young but there would be some spots of potential.
There usually is a turning point with a program trying to rebuild, where they get to a next level and then stop or slide backwards. The rest of the schedule needs to be reviewed closely before making such a rash statement. It still comes down to Illinois, Penn State and Minnesota 2X or potentially 3X in the B1G tournament. PSU is still horrible, but has a very promising recruiting class arriving, but that's still 2-3 years down the road of any significant impact on their won-loss record.
I think Sanders and Nigel Johnson will be good as a tandem and Mike Williams is revamped into a perfect 3rd guard role. If there is improvement beyond last night, Eddie then earns more time. But 0-18 is still very real and that cannot be a vantage point of earning a 4th year, under any sane person's viewpoint. RU needs at least a couple of wins to see Eddie assured a 4th season, IMO.
I think it is silly to base Eddie staying or going based on wins the rest of the year....if Corey makes 1 free throw we win. A decision has to be more objective. The direction of the program can't be based on a free throw or an open 3 pointer.
To me it comes down to finances, political capital, and what's available. At best Eddie is viewed as a bridge. It is brutally obvious Eddie is not the long term guy. I am not advocating him being fired, but I know 99.9% he is NOT getting it done here.
To me it comes down to finances, political capital, and what's available. At best Eddie is viewed as a bridge. It is brutally obvious Eddie is not the long term guy. I am not advocating him being fired, but I know 99.9% he is NOT getting it done here.
I don't think you are being realistic. RU does not compete in a bubble. Schools don't go from 0 wins to7 or 8 wins in this league. You think just because we have a full roster and competitive last night that we will win all the swing games against the bottom tier teams. Do you know that Minnesota and Penn State are brining great classes next year...PSU has 3 guys from Philly and their class is rated #2 in the Big 10. More talent than RU yet everyone keeps overrating our class for next year..a bunch of unknowns yet RU fans want to project them as a solid class but compared to the rest of the league its toward the bottom. Northwestern has shown progress under Collins yet will struggle to win more than 6 league games this year...Illinois will return a lot and get their injured players back. The top 6 in this league will not miss a beat and simply reload and Wisconsin will be better next year. When the bar is set so low when people will say 1-17 is okay for this year then don't expect much more than 4 or 5 wins next year tops because that's how it works in the league.
Others have stated about best case scenerios. We have no idea how those injured players are coming back but I bet at least one has an injury that dogs him,. it usually happens. Freeman is a solid player. Johnson..lol too many expectations already heaped on him, Ive seen this before. Doorson gives nothing offensively and will have a lot of work to do with conditioning. This team will have a lot of issues next year.
at 0-18 and a negative stain of potentially 34 straight Big 10 losses including tourney games and a 6-26 overall mark with losses in 41 of 47 games would be such a horrible perception nightmare there is no way you can bring him and extend....41 out 47 games....6-41.....5-41 if you take out Newark win. I mean how can anyone justify that. The team JUST HAS to get one win preferably two in these last 8 games with 5 of them potentially winnable
Next year will be better but its going to be better no matter who the coach is. With a full roster or close to a full roster pending defections or more injuries you cant be any worse win loss than this year
One thing I would do whether Eddie stays or goes is significantly dumb down the schedule. RU scheduling strength I think was in the 40s and I think they need to go the Northwestern route who played a cake schedule and got out to a 12-1 start...yes they are just 3-7 in the Big 10 but I think you need to get this RU team in the habit of winning. I would avoid trips out somewhere in a tough tourney with a squad that will still be jelling. No Monmouth and I guess SHU is on the schedule and they could be top 25. Get GW off the schedule, it serves no purpose playing that school. Schedule lots of MEACs and lower levels Northeast conference schools. Load the wins up as many as possible, they will get enough tough games in league play
One thing I would do whether Eddie stays or goes is significantly dumb down the schedule. RU scheduling strength I think was in the 40s and I think they need to go the Northwestern route who played a cake schedule and got out to a 12-1 start...yes they are just 3-7 in the Big 10 but I think you need to get this RU team in the habit of winning. I would avoid trips out somewhere in a tough tourney with a squad that will still be jelling. No Monmouth and I guess SHU is on the schedule and they could be top 25. Get GW off the schedule, it serves no purpose playing that school. Schedule lots of MEACs and lower levels Northeast conference schools. Load the wins up as many as possible, they will get enough tough games in league play
Reasonable.
But what is Eddie bridging.
You could argue that he was brought in to bridge the program from the embarrassment of the Rice affair. But that job has been done.
I expect Rutgers to break ground on the new practice facility this year (and I think they have to in order to make use of the tax credits). Maybe Eddie is retained to bridge the program until the construction is underway or complete. But I could also argue that a new guy could use the start of construction to build excitement and show evidence that Rutgers is now investing in the basketball program.
for the Eddie supporters...what is the end game...what are your expectations ?
year 4
year 5
year 6
year 7
year 4
year 5
year 6
year 7
I totally agree with this too. And as a guy who's time on the banks ran from 77-84 and suffered over and over and over and over again I cannot believe I would say stay the course 1 more year and push success another year or two down the road UNLESS a huge BIG TIME move was a reality for next season. Things like THAT don't happen at Rutgers.
I think Eddie as the bridge needs a year for the cement to dry. Then we can more confidently tread to the other side.
as I said well above. 500 next year or cut bait.
if so then bubble year 5 or cut bait.
(and I am hardly an EJ supporter. Just think we need 1 more year to see thru the fog)
I agree completely with these minimal targets for the next two seasons. Some may say it's harsh to expect so much improvement from Eddie, but that's the hole he dug himself. Just keeping the guy around for Year 4 is in and of itself a generous enough proposition.
Look, none of us are happy with the results. The thing is, I see both improvement and potential in this team.
A month ago I was as ready as anyone to show EJ the door, and resigned to the necessity of doing it. Now I'm not so sure that the path of wisdom doesn't reside in patience rather than hitting the reset button again.
A month ago I was as ready as anyone to show EJ the door, and resigned to the necessity of doing it. Now I'm not so sure that the path of wisdom doesn't reside in patience rather than hitting the reset button again.
[QUOTE="
I'd much rather that Hobbs take a responsible management approach. If he believes that Jordan is the right head coach to get Rutgers to the next level, then extend his contract and keep him here for a few more years. If he believes that Jordan is not the right head coach to get Rutgers to the next level, then find the right head coach and bring him in now."
[/QUOTE]
I haven't read the next 50 or so posts yet, but right here and now this is the best thing to do. It's not up to us; it is up to Pat Hobbs. He's the AD. He's the manager of this mess (that he didn't create) but has been hired to fix the mess and make it a success. Let's leave it to his judgment. Right now the weight of the RU B-ball program rests on his shoulders.
I'd much rather that Hobbs take a responsible management approach. If he believes that Jordan is the right head coach to get Rutgers to the next level, then extend his contract and keep him here for a few more years. If he believes that Jordan is not the right head coach to get Rutgers to the next level, then find the right head coach and bring him in now."
[/QUOTE]
I haven't read the next 50 or so posts yet, but right here and now this is the best thing to do. It's not up to us; it is up to Pat Hobbs. He's the AD. He's the manager of this mess (that he didn't create) but has been hired to fix the mess and make it a success. Let's leave it to his judgment. Right now the weight of the RU B-ball program rests on his shoulders.
How do you know Doorson gives nothing offensively. Most big men improve tremendously after their first year. The reports I heard before he was hurt was he was making great strides .So exactly what do you base his future progress next year or in your case lack of progress?
If he had more guys who could finish you would see more of the 10 assist Sanders. But, with guys like Foreman missing bunnies right and left last night, I think Corey got frustrated and then tried to do it all himself. To me, it's understandable under the circumstances. He is an incredible talent.
I don't know but if I had a dollar for every big man touted at RU Id be rich. Fact is the only one who lived up to anything was Hamaday and it took until his junior year to scratch his talent and his senior. Plus factor in the foot issue. We will see, I just wouldn't count on....just as I wouldn't count on best case scenerios working out like every single recruit producing. Ive heard the talk about transfers before too..just last year people were touting Goode as the best shooter and Kejuan Johnson going to be a good one for us. Who knows what Nigel Johnson will do here. Even a guy like Jonathan Michell didn't come on until his senior year. All 3 recruits are underrecruited guys. Hey one or two may pan out expecting them too is another issue. They are flyers. I am not putting them down but in reality the best recruits go to the better teams. Some flyers have worked out for Jordan, some haven't.
He doesn't know. He has no clue what he is talking about. Why people continue to read his posts is beyond me.
In fairness, if we are judging, can we all agree that this is truly Eddie's first year?
This is the first team of HIS recruits, not inherited players. He brought in Sanders who has potential to be the best PG in the B1G. Laurent who is a legitimate B1G player, and lost his best forward and two centers for the year. We are going out there playing with essentially four fresh/soph guards on the floor at all times against power house teams.
Listen, I'm a lifelong season ticket holder and rarely miss a home game. I'm far from happy with the current state of the program and I am certainly not complacent with losing. But whether you think EJ should be the guy or not moving forward, I think it would be premature to pass that judgement prior to the end of next season.
This is the first team of HIS recruits, not inherited players. He brought in Sanders who has potential to be the best PG in the B1G. Laurent who is a legitimate B1G player, and lost his best forward and two centers for the year. We are going out there playing with essentially four fresh/soph guards on the floor at all times against power house teams.
Listen, I'm a lifelong season ticket holder and rarely miss a home game. I'm far from happy with the current state of the program and I am certainly not complacent with losing. But whether you think EJ should be the guy or not moving forward, I think it would be premature to pass that judgement prior to the end of next season.
No. That's not how it works. HS and AAU coaches aren't considering this Eddie's first year. The talent is going to bleed out of this program. Already Eddie struggled landing too kids this year once TN stole Kwe. Thiam could be good but is still a project. The other two barely have good offers.
What's he going to land next fall after, possibly, going 0-18? Because my guess is there are going to be transfers.
Yes this is year one. Fight it all you want.
Eddie abysmal record with the leftovers Rice left him is an embarrassment but nearly the embarrassment Mike Rice was. A few years losing was guaranteed; a few years losing and out of limelight is what was needed. Now it's time for the surge and eddies recruiting class of sanders, Freeman, Laurent will be s great spring board.
Eddie abysmal record with the leftovers Rice left him is an embarrassment but nearly the embarrassment Mike Rice was. A few years losing was guaranteed; a few years losing and out of limelight is what was needed. Now it's time for the surge and eddies recruiting class of sanders, Freeman, Laurent will be s great spring board.
But you guys make it sound like no new coach has to deal with the previous coach's players and recruits. Any new coach has to have some realistic level of accountability. To throw out a coach's ability to coach players due to not having "his" players on his team is just not a fair way to perceive a coach's ability.
You can argue injuries. You can argue scandal and reputation. You can argue lack of financial and administrative support. But the "not his players" argument just does not hold much weight, when every other new coach in this era of college basketball is being held accountable after 3 years or so.
You can argue injuries. You can argue scandal and reputation. You can argue lack of financial and administrative support. But the "not his players" argument just does not hold much weight, when every other new coach in this era of college basketball is being held accountable after 3 years or so.
You can even argue that Eddie has mostly had his own recruits since day 1-since he was left with only 4 scholarship players. Sure he had to scramble but not ONE from that first year stuck and it's set him back.
Corey and Jonathan and Mike are great, but you have to keep building on that with better and better classes. Eddie isn't and the losing isn't going to help.
It's year 1 to a few fans. That's it.
Also let's not forget, Eddie's best record has been with Rice's recruits. Agree or not, but he benefitted from having Myles and Jack the last two years. Without them it would be and is much worse.
Like 1984 said, .500 next year or Jordan should get let go. Every year teams get worse and teams get better. You can have a solid recruit class but it takes time to develop. It is not what our recruits have, it is what the team has next year, and if people stay. I think they will stay, and if they do, we have the best point guard in the big ten.That means alot. Two players who can get to the paint in Sanders and Johnson.
He still has rices recruits. Next year is the only year none of rices recruits will be on the floor.
I don't agree this is year one. An above average coach could of got more out of our team last year. You don't pay someone a million dollars and say-"don't worry, the next two years are a wash. Just start up in year three. We are completely fine with that.Have fun while you are at it"
Like a lot of us said, .500 next year or better. I think a lot of us agree on that. He has the team to do it.
Any decision to keep Jordan should not be based only results for next year. If it is fire him now because we aren't built for next year. It should be about 3 things.
1. 2016-17 results
2. Demonstrating a path for success and a breakthrough in 2017-18
3. Program with a sound foundation and a future. If roster looks to peak in 2017-18 we have a big problem.
To be honest, every one of those has results to show if they were successful. A path for success-winning.
Program with a sound foundation..winning.
If the team has a losing record, all three are false. Winning is indicative of each one. A successful future in sports is usually shown by a winning/,500 record,
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