Goes back to year 1 when he chose an assistant’s son over Chad Schwenk
Matt Millen saying what every Rutgers fan is thinking
- Thread starter ouchmyknee
- Start date
G.S. stubborn? Also doesn’t like to be second guessed.
The reason Wimsatt didn't see Dremel wasn't because he's 5-9. it's because he hasn't been taught to read defenses.
yeah but a lot of those guys are really losers in real life and athletically, never played past 7th grade pop warner if at all. they have zero objectivity and no baseline from which to judge
those same guys actually think Greg is doing a great job never mind the qb, wr, te, d line situation
What's unacceptable is not giving someone else even one series. Are they afraid GW is too thin skinned to handle it, or are they afraid someone else might look good?
Correct. Ryan Cubit.
GW is a very handsomely paid, semi-pro athlete. There should be zero concern for his skin thickness or psyche.
Perform as you're paid to or get out of the way.
Actually, to get an idea you can look at last year’s Wagner game. Close enough to high school ball. He was 4 of 12 with a pick. You think our staff did that to him? Lol. He came in with accuracy issues. Hasn’t improved on them much to this point. Blame the staff for not developing him if you like but it’s impossible to know if he would’ve had more success elsewhere. I personally doubt it. This one is looking to be like Rettig. Bust at LSU. Similar path at RU. I just don’t think Wimsatt has it.
This - I agree he probably wouldn’t start for a decent FCS team unless they planned to run him a ton.
Taulia is a talent. The only things he doesn’t have are the non-throwing physical attributes like height and heft.
The D line is beat up but they don’t deserve scrutiny. D has been solid all season. It’s hard to know the state of the WR /TE rooms with a passing QB this bad to be honest. I wouldn’t say Greg is doing a “great” job, but most position groups outside of QB have at least shown progressive improvement. QB is a big problem though. If we ride with Gavin again next year and don’t bring in a QB I’d put Greg on the hot seat. And I support him and what he’s done to bring the program back to respectability. But Gavin does not deserve a competition free camp with a clear path to start next season. If we give him that he better deliver.
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That’s not even the point. We lost 6 games this season. Flip QBs on all of them and we probably win at least 2 maybe even 3 more games.
I'm not a hater and I appreciate Matt Millen's non-homer analysis. Do some of our fans like to live in echo chambers and only want to hear praise, and see only sunshine and puppy dogs when our QB throws 38% on 34 passes and a bad pick? Enabling and/or ignoring poor performance will only foster acceptance of mediocrity or worse.
Or nowhere in the same zip code. There were a few today that were really bad.
Try GW at wide receiver. He has the speed if not the quickness. Does he have the hands? I dunno. But we have been patient... and GS and OCs do not do him any favors keeping him at QB with his accuracy issues... and other issues like not seeing teh field. Last week GW fumbled on an exchange when he tried to do an RPO and did not read the DE staring at him standing there waiting for him.
He cannot read THAT.. 6 feet away.. in time to do the right thing.. how is he going to read a field of WRs and DBs?
I'm sorry Gavin and family and fans of Gavin... but, come on now. Its not "us".. it's you. And GS leaving you in games that are out of hand.. why? Why? WHY!? I do not get that. Is Gavin supposed to improve in that situation?
It is unfair to teh offense.. unfair to the WRs.. unfair to the defense.. unfair to the fans... and, ultimate, it is unfair to Gavin Wimsatt. If we threw him back there and spread the field and let him play.. really play.. slinging that rock.. racing outside extending plays... and we gave him 3 downs to find a 1st down without having him hand off into a stacked D. Maybe.,,. maybe then he could learn something about his passing game and maybe we'd learn something too.
But this crap?
Send in the clowns. There ought to be clowns. ...
What? You think the solution is to let Gavin throw more??? He had 34 chances. The play calling did not hold Gavin back. I wish people would stop saying this. I’m not praising the play calling - but it didn’t matter. Kyle was our only offense outside of a few acrobatic catches. Suggestion that calling different pass plays would’ve changed the game somehow is ridiculous. Gavin couldn’t complete anything.
Cal Freshman QB Fernando Mendoza was third string . 2 Star recruit with offers from Cal and 2 Ivies. He is put into action, has 6 starts, 11 TD and 5 INT, and 63% completion percentage. Cal is on par with Rutgers in talent.
Time to move on. Let Ajani have a shot.
It is way too easy to blame Wimsatt, he is what he is. I blame our offensive coaches. Here is why, go back and look at why Wimsatt is not accurate. It is because his mechanics are constantly screwed up.
In this game it was really easy to tell, watch his throws to the left and right. He also struggles with his release point. Even with little practice time, all of this is fixable. Wimsatt needs to practice on his own and the coaches need to give him the knowledge. Notre Dame won a Natty with Tony Rice, who had to work on these issues. Ultimately blame is on the coaching!
In this game it was really easy to tell, watch his throws to the left and right. He also struggles with his release point. Even with little practice time, all of this is fixable. Wimsatt needs to practice on his own and the coaches need to give him the knowledge. Notre Dame won a Natty with Tony Rice, who had to work on these issues. Ultimately blame is on the coaching!
I agree. But we won’t this year. Greg seems to have it in his head that from a recruit’s perspective, it was important that Gavin get this season to work on his game. That is the only explanation. Even Evan completes screen passes competently. That alone more than offsets his lack of running ability. Gavin gave up his senior year of high school - we pushed him into that. so he’s being treated with kid gloves.
Solution to what? Didn't I lay into his game all before that?
Would throwing more help win games like this? no. He's not capable. But, yeah.. I think him throwing more might improve HIM and improve the run game.
AND,, get this,, I think if he threw a lot more with spread offense he could run more... and we'd arrive at a decision that he is NOT a QB a whole hell of a lot sooner.
We tried running more and not letting him throw.. where did that get us?
How's he going to learn to see the field if he is handing off or following teh RB running it himself all the time? Compare that to those pocket passers who seem to rarely handoff and they use the short passing game as their running game.. like so many NFL teams.
The guy throws a long ball... but we don't let him do it enough. Like in 2nd and short.. not that we see that often. We just run it for teh first. But he's like that old joke about the gold bet where a guy shows up with a gorilla for a partner who drives the ball 500 yards onto the green and the opponents settle the bet right here.. only to see the gorilla take the putter and smash teh ball another 500 yards.
He actually completed some screens today. That was amazing considering how we have failed to connect on a screen all season long. He doesn't often throw balls where receivers can make yards after catch... and on that offensive PI call we got... he was supposed to throw the ball BEHIND the LOS to Monagai.. right? That's why Kyle hugged the LOS looking outside and Gavin threw it inside and way over teh LOS... creating the offensive PI call... because.. if that ball was caught behind the LOS.. blocking downfield was fine.
So, in summary.. no.. I don't think Gavin throwing more would win games now. But maybe if he were expected to be a passing QB when he first got a start.. and we called a more balanced game that required a passing QB... we'd have determined that he needs more time on teh bench and have gone with someone else.. like Snyder.. or SImon. While Wimsatt learned.
I have called repeatedly to see Simon out there often. Is that a "solution"? Who knows? Probably not.. right? But he cannot be much worse.. right? Nothing makes any sense about how this has been handled.. not without some kind of explanation from the coaches.
So.. what I was saying was... if we have tio have him back there... spread teh field and left him throw.. let monangai be the every down back that he is.. blitx pickup.. one lanes on QB draws.. which might work if he became a passing threat. Spread the field.. let him read it while it is all spread out. This bunching up in the middle has not worked for us.
But, as I said many times now... make a change at QB. Enough already. And.. if not.. let him throw more.
Maybe - but more likely he’s just not good. Most FBS quarterbacks on scholarship would put up video game like stats on Wagner. Gavin wasn’t able to do this (2 game sample - but his first outing was truly awful last year). That isn’t on the coaches because they shouldn’t have to do anything at all for him to be able to make Wagner look bad.
I don’t think more reps would help him. He didn’t get those reps vs. Wagner. Tells you all you need to know. The staff has tried. They likely see what he’s capable of in practice. He can’t read anything. Can’t adjust on the fly. He can run the ball. That’s what he does well.
Think what that would say about the abilities of the other qbs on the roster.
Or at least the staff's opinion of those abilities.
He has culpability for sure, but the buck stops at the top. Give him the drills, if he doesn't improve, play the next guy, with the knowledge if no one is good enough, someone not on the team currently must start next year. I saw no improvement sadly.
Not well enough ..not with the plays they call. He doesn't bootleg near half enough. He doesn't finish runs well at all.. doesn't keep his legs under him.. tries to lay out to get max yards from nothing plays... instead of trying to evade or break tackles.
I don't think he got enough reps that would help him complete passes. Several times he has looked sharp early in games when run/pass was unpredictable for us. But soon after we go into that lets run the ball because that is who we are crap and then we are looking at 3rd and long when he throws against a D staffed and ready to defend pass.
Anyway, whether or not he could have been better by now is irrelevant. We did not trust him to pass we did not pursue a real passing game.. and we are where we are. The offense is better than last year.. but that bar is so freaking low.. they are still an awful offense. I think Gavin could have been better and still could be better.. but the cost and risk is just too high. I'd rather grab teh dice and roll again... and would haves tarted doing that in the Wisconsin game instead of allowing Wimsatt to come back in after being knocked out.
We’d have finished with more wins with a Vedral type this season. That’s the reality. Perhaps less natural talent, but Vedral made way better decisions and would’ve had more success with a better OL. No doubt. When Vedral had time to throw (putting 2022 aside where he couldn’t feel his hand due to injury), he was very accurate and placed the ball well so that receivers could pick up yardage post catch. Gavin rarely does that. Receivers are tackled Immediately because they have to make acrobatic catches just to compensate for over or under throws (and this shortcoming isn’t even baked into the stat that conclude GW was the worst in FBS).
Vedral was smart but could not throw deep and defenses knew it.
He was Noah Pennington
Defense never stretched and run game was harder for it
The year Cruikshank got hurt (2021) the whole passing game vanished with zero passing TDs for 6 games in a row
Cruickshank and Melton were Harrison Jr and Travis Hunter compared to what RU has now.
Greg knew he needed better WRs last spring.
Greg Schiano says Rutgers football will look to the transfer portal to add a wide receiver (or two)
Rutgers football might be hitting the transfer portal to add a wide receiver.
rutgerswire.usatoday.com
Hahaha.....there is a very good cance that any QB we get through the portal will be an upgrade. Need to find the QB in the portal that is sitting behind a younger stud starter.
Is the assumption that Vedral would have better talent around him? Vedral's lack of arm allowed defenses to load up against the run. Wimsatt's lack of accuracy and timing does the same thing. And both saw few pass plays called because of that.
But, yeah.. at his best.. like in 2021.. maybe you are correct.. the dink and dunk passes over 60% completion rate.. if a lot of those are to our pretty good RBs.... yeah.. maybe we would have done better.
Why we didn't get a good look at Simon this year is incompetent coaching. I cannot imagine what positives were achieved by that decision repeated over and over and over. Maybe the closest comparison might be Gary Nova's coddling.. that delivered a pretty good senior year.. eventually. But sticking with him doing stuff like throwing pick-six backwards.. to DL.. while horizontal... that was painful and why we stuck with him so long.. I could only assume was because he was from Don Bosco who had a lot of talent at the time.
Yes.. I do think Wimsatt may eventually produce a great season. But he needs a LOT OF WORK. That arm you cannot teach. His top-end speed is great. But can he improve the speed of his thought process and improve vision? I do not know.. but I suspect not.
But the time to work on Wimsatt was before he started every game for us and faced such top opposition. Now that he has been the starter for a couple years... how can you bench him and work on him? But if we identified his weaknesses earlier.. and he was never the starter yet... maybe we'd see if he was willing to do the work.. or maybe he'd have bailed and transferred or changed his position by now. We could use another WR.
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Let’s continue—the benching of senior Hart (maybe even burning Hart’s redshirt vs Miami in 02, because Hart would have been QB in 06), not sitting Teel for a spell in 08 (and coming as close as possible to missing a bowl because of it, or maybe winning the BE), Savage/Dodd, etc—others can add to the list.
Carson Wentz came to the NFL with mechanics issues in 2016. He got help off-season and had a perfect coaching setup in 2017 and he got them to the playoffs. Then the key coaches left and he regressed. Gavin needs the right coaching. The question is do we have it or can we get it.
Coaches hate QB controversies.
You get team/fan factions, incitement media, angry parents etc.
Remember all the strife that went down with Savage parents in media.
If a back-up comes in and does well - and its possible since defense wasn't prepped for back-up - all kinds of divisions and toxic sludge opens-up. If a guy gets hurt and back-up does well then that's life. But just to try people out because fans hate that the starter made a couple overthrows in first 5 minutes is not a good way to go for anybody.
Greg gave the RB spot to Rice over Leonard so he's made tough decisions and could make them again if he had to. Truth be told I think Wimsatt starting so early was a pain for everybody. He did need polish and its nice to get it as a back-up until starting at an older age with a couple years of training. Some guys - often large/lanky guys - take longer to "grow into their paws" so to speak. Wimsatt still looks awkward physically - his mesh with RB is kinda half-baked .
ND (Kelly version) and Oregon knew Wimsatt was raw and needed work
"How would you assess Notre Dame’s quarterback prospects in the 2022 class in terms of quality and potential? And how do you think it will end?
Wiltfong: “There’s good quality and potential with the three quarterbacks they’re involved with, to improve what they already have in the quarterback room.
“Drew Allar (6-5, 220; Medina, Ohio), I believe, can play championship football. Gavin Wimsatt (6-3, 200; Owensboro, Ky.) is raw, but the coaching staff likes a lot of his traits. Steve Angeli (6-3, 215; Oradell, N.J.) is a better thrower than some of the quarterbacks they already have at Notre Dame.
“I think this ends with Notre Dame signing Angeli.”
Lemming: “It’s hard to tell who Notre Dame really wants among Steve Angeli, Gavin Wimsatt and Drew Aller. They’re all good, but none of them are great."
Inside Recruiting: Five burning questions answered about Notre Dame football recruiting
Editor’s Note: Inside Recruiting is a new feature that will address key topics involving Notre Dame football recruiting and recruiting in general. We plan to make it a regular staple of our Irish football coverage.
www.southbendtribune.com
No FBS program would ever offer Wimsatt if he entered the Portal; which I don’t he should or will.
He might get some offers from lower tier FCS teams perhaps.
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