One way Ash can lose the fan base quickly.

[Yeah Baby]

Weve played this hand far too long. Longer than anyone else would. The one area Ash should actually look at from last year is are we repeating qb errors.

The main pt is Ash should not burn capital on stuuborness w Laviano. The faithful will withstand losses but not more of the nonsense we had to endure for 3 years. That will erode the support. Either a culture of perform or be replaced or its not.

IIRC you were against Nova too. Later stain

The OP is an asshat. This board has a lot of asshats. Positive or negative is one argument (I like positive and dislike negative). But we have so many people on this board that know nothing at all about Football and love to see us lose so they can blame Laviano or Flood and soon it will be Ash.

This board should be nuked.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

Holy crap people I'm not a Laviano "fan," per say, but give it a rest. It was Game 1, we played a very, very good D, and we have units at OL and WR that simply aren't up to the task. I think he should have gotten pulled, too, but making ANY assumptions based on 1 game, about a brand new HC and staff coaching its 1st game together WITH a roster as such, is freakin' absurd.

 

[vandalen1]

Muller got replaced very quickly after it became clear that he couldn't deal with the speed of the Dline. Don't think Ash is stubborn.

Some of the offenses problems were on Laviano. This is a short passing offense. Quick read and throw, not quick read and wait. If the guy isn't open fast, he has to throw it away. And unfortunately, he needs to throw away lots of passes but it is what it is. Receivers can't get open fast (or at all). I think we'll see more Bailey and Harris as the year goes on.

 

[Dpgru]

The Howard game won't show us much about adjustments but it will be interesting to see if there are any differences in the approach to getting the WRs open against New Mexico. It really doesn't matter who is throwing the ball if no one is open. In any event this year will be a long learning experience for everyone - including the staff.

 

[rubaseball78]

Ash will lose this fan base unless he starts checking this website to see what depth chart moves to make and to pick starters.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

The Howard game won't show us much about adjustments but it will be interesting to see if there are any differences in the approach to getting the WRs open against New Mexico. It really doesn't matter who is throwing the ball if no one is open. In any event this year will be a long learning experience for everyone - including the staff.

BINGO! Remember something my friends:

The VAST MAJORITY of this board absolutely loved Flood and staff in Year 1 DESPITE the 2nd half of the season fiasco that got many of us concerned. Many still loved him/them despite the disaster of 2013, as well, so I think what we're seeing here is A LOT of posters freaking out over things that they really shouldn't be freaking out about until, maybe, the 2nd half of this season. Relax a little and let the guy build his program, and makes changes, as HE sees fit. These things typically DO NOT happen overnight.

 

[rubaseball78]

BINGO! Remember something my friends:

The VAST MAJORITY of this board absolutely loved Flood and staff in Year 1 DESPITE the 2nd half of the season fiasco that got many of us concerned. Many still loved him/them despite the disaster of 2013, as well, so I think what we're seeing here is A LOT of posters freaking out over things that they really shouldn't be freaking out about until, maybe, the 2nd half of this season. Relax a little and let the guy build his program, and makes changes, as HE sees fit. These things typically DO NOT happen overnight.

Plus first year head coach who just coached his first game. There will be a learning curve as to game day coaching.

 

[knightfan7]

I am a big fan of Chris Ash and remain very optimistic about the future, and even the rest of this year.

However, there is one way he can lose the fan base very quickly. That is stubbornness. Of all the complaints about Flood the most important one was how stubborn he was. If Ash shows the same deficiency, the positive energy he has built will dissipate quickly.

Total BS.

"Stubbornness" is what you same people said about Schiano and Flood.

All it means is that the HC won't do what YOU WANT. It has nothing at all with the reality of the situation. I can't imagine the amount of ego it takes to think you rather than the staff know what's best. Go back to Xbox.

 

[zappaa]

I think what most people are upset about, despite the fact we don't have a good OL or WR's.
Is the fact we don't have a QB on this team who looks aware, elusive, sharp, savvy, feels the rush and makes plays out of nothing.
We can't look at each other and say damn that kid is good or, how good would this kid be with weapons.
It is what it is, CL is the best we have, God bless him, he's just not very good, and obviously neither are the other ones.

 

[koleszar]

Yes because there are so many better options.

You know something I always wondered, if Laviano is our best option, just what the hell are the other QB's doing in practice. I mean it's not like he's exactly lighting it up out there. What could they possibly be doing, tripping over the 30 yd. line, throwing the ball into row 5, speaking Japanese while calling an audible? Was every single one of these kids a miss? Is there not a more dynamic runner in the lot, who can complete a 5yd. pass?

 

[knightfan7]

I think what most people are upset about, despite the fact we don't have a good OL or WR's.
Is the fact we don't have a QB on this team who looks aware, elusive, sharp, savvy, feels the rush and makes plays out of nothing.
We can't look at each other and say damn that kid is good or, how good would this kid be with weapons.
It is what it is, CL is the best we have, God bless him, he's just not very good, and obviously neither are the other ones.

No Zap. RU has Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, and Cam Newton waiting in the wings. The staff is just to stubborn to play them.

 

[ru-baby]

Nice calling people asshats. Good logic--what a tool. Good to see you were a Nova should play with 6 int guy. That and the name calling puts your positions into perspective.

 

[coldsprings]

Total BS.

"Stubbornness" is what you same people said about Schiano and Flood.

All it means is that the HC won't do what YOU WANT. It has nothing at all with the reality of the situation. I can't imagine the amount of ego it takes to think you rather than the staff know what's best. Go back to Xbox.

Both of these ideas can be true at the same time: 1. Ash knows more football than you or I will ever know by an incalculably huge margin. 2. Experts, such as Ash, can and do make colossal errors.

If you doubt point 2 (admitting point 2 doesn't mean that Ash is in error here) then read the studies that show wine experts often can't tell a $100 bottle of wine from Two Buck Chuck or the percentage of radiologists who have made errors upon review by other radiologists or the famous book editors who passed on books that became best-sellers etc. etc. Or better yet read Moneyball and learn why Billy Beane cleaned up by just changing the metrics he used to evaluate talent. I have no idea what metrics Ash used to evaluate the QBs. His metrics to evaluate the running backs and place Goodwin 1st were clearly wrong, The odds are that Ash is right in having Rettig 4th on the depth chart, yet I would still love to see what happens if Rettig is allowed to stretch the field with his arm in a game.

 

[Knight Shift]

I think what most people are upset about, despite the fact we don't have a good OL or WR's.
Is the fact we don't have a QB on this team who looks aware, elusive, sharp, savvy, feels the rush and makes plays out of nothing.
We can't look at each other and say damn that kid is good or, how good would this kid be with weapons.
It is what it is, CL is the best we have, God bless him, he's just not very good, and obviously neither are the other ones.

THere were not many instances, but UW's QB looked like crap under pressure. That pick he threw to Cioffi was a wounded duck.

 

[rubaseball78]

Both of these ideas can be true at the same time: 1. Ash knows more football than you or I will ever know by an incalculably huge margin. 2. Experts, such as Ash, can and do make colossal errors.

If you doubt point 2 (admitting point 2 doesn't mean that Ash is in error here) then read the studies that show wine experts often can't tell a $100 bottle of wine from Two Buck Chuck or the percentage of radiologists who have made errors upon review by other radiologists or the famous book editors who passed on books that became best-sellers etc. etc. Or better yet read Moneyball and learn why Billy Beane cleaned up by just changing the metrics he used to evaluate talent. I have no idea what metrics Ash used to evaluate the QBs. His metrics to evaluate the running backs and place Goodwin 1st were clearly wrong, The odds are that Ash is right in having Rettig 4th of the depth chart, yet I would still love to see what happens if Rettig is allowed to stretch the field with his arm in a game.

Just curious how you know Ash is clearly wrong on Goodwin based on 1 game under Ash in the new offensive system?

 

[knightfan7]

Both of these ideas can be true at the same time: 1. Ash knows more football than you or I will ever know by an incalculably huge margin. 2. Experts, such as Ash, can and do make colossal errors.

If you doubt point 2 (admitting point 2 doesn't mean that Ash is in error here) then read the studies that show wine experts often can't tell a $100 bottle of wine from Two Buck Chuck or the percentage of radiologists who have made errors upon review by other radiologists or the famous book editors who passed on books that became best-sellers etc. etc. Or better yet read Moneyball and learn why Billy Beane cleaned up by just changing the metrics he used to evaluate talent. I have no idea what metrics Ash used to evaluate the QBs. His metrics to evaluate the running backs and place Goodwin 1st were clearly wrong, The odds are that Ash is right in having Rettig 4th of the depth chart, yet I would still love to see what happens if Rettig is allowed to stretch the field with his arm in a game.

Wine? I have to laugh but not for the reason you think.

I pour hundreds of glasses a week and have for 20 years. If they just take the glass there is never a complaint. The wines are universally liked. But if they see the label they automatically turn their noses up at it.

 

[zappaa]

Just curious how you know Ash is clearly wrong on Goodwin based on 1 game under Ash in the new offensive system?

You played baseball at a pretty high level, when you watched the game were there certain guys you waned up with the game on the line?
3rd and 1...I want Hicks up.
3rd and 10....I want Goodwin up.

 

[jakeknight]

I don't know why some of the more "knowledgeable" people on this board who can quickly ascertain the issues with the QB and see that one or more of the back ups would be better suited don't go out and find D-1 coaching jobs. They clearly pay very well and you can get most of your line ups and play calling right off the internet it is simply baffling why there are not more board members giving up their mundane 9-5 day jobs for lucrative D-1 coaching opportunities

 

[rubaseball78]

You played baseball at a pretty high level, when you watched the game were there certain guys you waned up with the game on the line?
3rd and 1...I want Hicks up.
3rd and 10....I want Goodwin up

You played baseball at a pretty high level, when you watched the game were there certain guys you waned up with the game on the line?
3rd and 1...I want Hicks up.
3rd and 10....I want Goodwin up

Don't disagree with your 2 scenarios.

previous 2 years, Hicks > Goodwin. In this offense I need to see more than 1 game.

i would also like to see ball thrown to Hicks once in a while. For years we heard Ray Rice couldn't catch a ball. He couldn't catch because we never threw to him; turned out to be a good pass catching RB in pros.

 

[beaced]

I going to go with Ash knows a hell of a lot more about football than anyone here. So what ever decisions he makes on player personnel is okay with me.

Ash will make his decisions whether or not they are popular with the Fans.It is too early to get up tight about those decisions. A couple of games down the line he will be proven correct or not.THEN ,if CHANGES are needed,it will be incumbent upon him to make them. If,at that point he doesn't ,then there will cause for concern.

 

[knightfan7]

Both of these ideas can be true at the same time: 1. Ash knows more football than you or I will ever know by an incalculably huge margin. 2. Experts, such as Ash, can and do make colossal errors.

If you doubt point 2 (admitting point 2 doesn't mean that Ash is in error here) then read the studies that show wine experts often can't tell a $100 bottle of wine from Two Buck Chuck or the percentage of radiologists who have made errors upon review by other radiologists or the famous book editors who passed on books that became best-sellers etc. etc. Or better yet read Moneyball and learn why Billy Beane cleaned up by just changing the metrics he used to evaluate talent. I have no idea what metrics Ash used to evaluate the QBs. His metrics to evaluate the running backs and place Goodwin 1st were clearly wrong, The odds are that Ash is right in having Rettig 4th on the depth chart, yet I would still love to see what happens if Rettig is allowed to stretch the field with his arm in a game.

Sorry but I don't buy it.

In the case of our QB situation a fan can only guess based on absolutely no evidence. A coach makes a decision based on days, weeks, and months of being intimately involved with the situation.

Can they be wrong? Sure but to think someone sitting in the stands, watching on TV, or typing on a message board has anywhere near the ability to make a more correct evaluation is pure unadulterated fantasy. The fact we have so many who are 100% convinced they know better is a never ending source of amusement.

 

[RU5781]

Again with these A-wipes wanting to see with their own eyes how another player performs. What a freakin joke some of you are. It's embarrasing

Heyyyyyy...Mrs. Laviano is back!!

 

[oldtimer67]

IIRC you were against Nova too. Later stain

The OP is an asshat. This board has a lot of asshats. Positive or negative is one argument (I like positive and dislike negative). But we have so many people on this board that know nothing at all about Football and love to see us lose so they can blame Laviano or Flood and soon it will be Ash.

This board should be nuked.

Well, Baby, in the realm of debate, which is disciplined argument, name calling is widely known as the argument of last resort, when there are no other valid arguments to be made. It may also be a character issue.

It is amazing to me how low the reading comprehension of some people on these boards is. I started off by stating my FULL SUPPORT for CA. Next I said COULD and IF. Third, I never mentioned Laviano or the QB position. To me there are several areas that appeared on Saturday that COULD EVENTUALLY need some changes. Could that change? Sure. I do think there MIGHT be an issue with CA and staff giving very high value to people "buying in" and practice effort. That is great in the Spring and Fall CAMPS, but, are these also the best players on game day? If not all of them are, that makes for a tough choice. Stay the course with "your" players even at the cost of on field performance and build the team for the long term, or play the players that give you the best chance to perform on game day. I am all in favor of letting CA make that decision, but if he chooses the first option, the fans will have a lot of suffering to live through.

Finally, the intent of my post was all about the future, not last Saturday or this Saturday. I was just trying to highlight what MIGHT be a POTENTIAL problem with the fan base DOWN THE ROAD. Sheesh.

 

[knightfan7]

Heyyyyyy...Mrs. Laviano is back!!

Now, now. Mom's are off limits.

How ya doing not-as-big guy?

 

[coldsprings]

Sorry but I don't buy it.

In the case of our QB situation a fan can only guess based on absolutely no evidence. A coach makes a decision based on days, weeks, and months of being intimately involved with the situation.

Can they be wrong? Sure but to think someone sitting in the stands, watching on TV, or typing on a message board has anywhere near the ability to make a more correct evaluation is pure unadulterated fantasy. The fact we have so many who are 100% convinced they know better is a never ending source of amusement.

Actually, I agree with you. If I had said what you wrote, I would have been wrong but I didn't write that. The odds that I know better than Ash are close to zero.

I wrote that experts are often wrong not that I as an individual know better. However, studies show that the "crowd" often knows better than the "expert." In his book The Wisdom of Crowds, James Surowiecki wrote based on the literature: "If you can assemble a diverse group of people who possess varying degrees of knowledge and insight, you're better off entrusting it with major decisions rather than leaving them in the hands of one or two people, no matter how smart these people are." Surowiecki's conclusion is counter-intuitive to many but still true.

Translation: I don't know better than Ash but last year the odds that the "crowd" on the board was correct and that Rettig should have received playing time was very high. This year the season is young and the crowd is divided so we can't say much beyond speculation which is what this board is for.