You're not getting this.
During the day, when energy demands are highest, Tesla owners would have the OPTION to sell electricity back to the grid. Most EV owners charge at night anyway. It's a buy low, sell high thing. Pretty simple.
OT: Electric vehicles
- Thread starter BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap
- Start date
During the day, when energy demands are highest, Tesla owners would have the OPTION to sell electricity back to the grid. Most EV owners charge at night anyway. It's a buy low, sell high thing. Pretty simple.
Corruption too. Despite campaigning heavily on climate change, Joe Biden has yet to say the word "Tesla" or "Elon Musk" in public. His corporate overlords forbid it. Same reason he won't even mention the possibility of a carbon tax. Same would be true if a Republican was in office. They're all puppets.
So I guess Tesla owners don't commute, which would mean not being able to drive home if they sold it back.
Your observation on corruption was in full view today with Biden visiting the GM electric car plant and claiming GM is leading the way for electric vehicles. Yikes - what a ridiculous statement. GM will be the first major car company to go bankrupt during this disruption - you can bank on it.
Nope. Can't drive back. Stuck forever. Nothing they can do. Elon himself will have a gun to their head, forcing them to sell energy to the grid. EVs suck.
Don't need to show you anything - If you do a minute of research you will understand - I wont do it for you.
Not this time - it will be a systemic issue with their manufacturing - not an economic cycle issue like the previous two times.
It’s hard for a US president endorsing a company who’s CEO is constantly kissing China’s ass all the time,
The more and more I read about Rivian, Lucid, Ford, etc., the more and more I realize that this notion that Tesla is 5+ years ahead of everyone from a tech and battery perspective is laughable. The gap on Tesla is closing faster than any Teslarati stock pumper can imagine. There are no shortage of articles stating that Lucid batteries have the same, maybe better quality than Teslas and are capable of 4.5 miles per kWh, lasting longer than Tesla's 4 miles per kWh. Regardless, if there is one thing I am sure of it’s that EV stocks are in a massive bubble not seen since the dotcom era.
Lots of money for those who sell at the right time, then buy back at the right time.
Bullshit. You made an outlandish assertion, i.e. that GM will be the first major manufacturer to go bankrupt in an EV world. It's on you to explain why, because there's no evidence to suggests that's true.
Let me simplify - Drive and compare a Tesla Model 3 to a Chevy Bolt. Of course you cant store the bolt in your garage so to be fair keep both cars outside before your drive them.
That meeting between GM and Biden was nothing more than a show of union support - and as usual GM went begging for billions more tax payer dollars to build out a charging network all the while Tesla has paid for and built their own.
Some sales number - 2021 Q3 - GM sales down 33 percent while Tesla sales up 73 percent. Tesla is on schedule to out sell GM in NA by the end of 2023.
That meeting between GM and Biden was nothing more than a show of union support - and as usual GM went begging for billions more tax payer dollars to build out a charging network all the while Tesla has paid for and built their own.
Some sales number - 2021 Q3 - GM sales down 33 percent while Tesla sales up 73 percent. Tesla is on schedule to out sell GM in NA by the end of 2023.
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GM has been consistently profitable for years.
They don't have TSLA's growth, but GM currently makes way more money.
No chance. I fully admit I missed the boat when I almost bought TSLA a few years ago. I respect Musk as a genius but don’t like his antics. I haven’t followed the stock sale situation, but if someone told me he really didn’t have to sell because there were other tax maneuvers in play, but made it sound like he did only because he sees competitive head-winds ahead and knows TSLA is sky-high, that wouldn’t surprise me in the least. The guy is scary smart.
The Bolt was GM going half ass.
And I'm not one to rip on TSLA. They clearly build the best EV in the world, they currently dominate the EV market, especially in the US. Their growth is fantastic.
However, competition is coming. From both the newbies and the legacies. Which is not to say TSLA will not prove to be the best of the bunch 10 years from now, heck I think that's likely. But I think it is also likely that GM will be alive and doing well in the EV space 10 years from now as well.
What's the point of artificially limiting the question of corporate well-being to just EVs?
Never mind. I already know why you want to do that.
Yes, they dominate the EV market. For now.
But, objectively speaking, it's hardly clear that they build the best EV in the world. At least not according to Motortrend's 2021 Car of the Year.
Lucid’s Electric Air Snags Coveted ‘Car Of The Year’ Status From MotorTrend
The magazine said the car sets a “new benchmark” for electric vehicles, also citing its range and efficiency. Some versions can travel as far as 520 miles on a full charge.
www.forbes.com
They've delivered less than 50 vehicles. They cost $170K each, so I would hope they're phenomenal and better come with woolly mammoth pubes in the stitching and unicorn tears in the washer fluid. Lucid is losing money on every one. Companies don't survive on awards.Yes, they dominate the EV market. For now.
But, objectively speaking, it's hardly clear that they build the best EV in the world. At least not according to Motortrend's 2021 Car of the Year.
Lucid’s Electric Air Snags Coveted ‘Car Of The Year’ Status From MotorTrend
The magazine said the car sets a “new benchmark” for electric vehicles, also citing its range and efficiency. Some versions can travel as far as 520 miles on a full charge.
Did Tesla make money on its first delivery on the first gen Model S?
I mean, they've sold 5 cars.Yes, they dominate the EV market. For now.
But, objectively speaking, it's hardly clear that they build the best EV in the world. At least not according to Motortrend's 2021 Car of the Year.
Lucid’s Electric Air Snags Coveted ‘Car Of The Year’ Status From MotorTrend
The magazine said the car sets a “new benchmark” for electric vehicles, also citing its range and efficiency. Some versions can travel as far as 520 miles on a full charge.
I do agree EV's are the future.
Thus I wouldn't look at GM's current EV profitability. Not with the capex they are currently pouring into EV production.
They've been profitable with ICE, why wouldn't they be profitable with EV which has proven to have bigger margins?
But can we use TSLA as an example for all these new EV startups?
TSLA did it, thus LCID, RIVN, FSR, SEV, etc will all do it?
You can't extrapolate it to all of them, but you can't assume that they won't achieve the same success either. Time will tell. Thinking that "only I can do this" is a destructive line of thinking.
And? What does that have to do with what I posted, which accurately points out that the Lucid Air is a better car than any Tesla, at least according to Motor Trend? Also, how do you know they're losing money on every one?
At $170K, they are obviously targeting a more upscale market than the mostly pedestrian Tesla offerings. And with 1700+ reservations already (at $170K each), I they'll probably wind up being okay.
For now, Tesla is enjoying it's head start and is the Toyota Camry of EVs in terms of sales. Which is nothing to scoff at, of course. It's the everyman's EV just as the Camry is the everyman's ICE sedan. Good for business due to lots of sales. So, good for Tesla. Tesla might want to start thinking twice about continually adjusting their prices upwards as their competition heats up, but whatever, it's not my problem.
It remains to be seen how long Tesla can be the Toyota Camry of EVs as the other auto makers start taking EVs more seriously. It will be interesting to see if Toyota, once they feel it's important enough, applies it's winning formula to EV offerings. I suspect they will do quite well because they continue to demonstrate how good they are at selling cars.
I personally have no opinion on it and couldn't care less what happens w/respect to which manufacturers sell the most EVs. Just so long as everybody drops the amazingly moronic yoke thing and everybody catches up to and surpasses Lucid range-wise.
Ya, I expect some of these will succeed to some extent, while others could get bought up, either by the legacies, or a succeeding startup.
LCID making or losing money on a particular car, at this point, likely depends upon how you account for all the expenses they have had to pay out to get this thing going.
Same goes for GM with their EV's, F with theirs, or any other company getting into the space.
But the TSLA guys, who just finally saw TSLA go profitable, after years of not being profitable, now pointing to profitability as a defining metric? I mean geez.
Incorrect. And irrelevant to being the "best car".
If you want name the best selling EV, then Tesla wins (as I said above, it's the Toyota Camry of EVs, for now). But best EV? That's utterly impossible for anybody to define. It's purely a matter of opinion.
The only Tesla I've seen that I would even consider buying is the new Tesla Roadster, which is only a prototype at this point. I don't want any current EVs for various reasons. But if you held a gun to my head and said chose an EV, I'd probably get a Taycan GTS Sport Turismo. So for for me, personally, that'd be the "best EV". Others are free to define it otherwise.
How many cars has LCID sold? I've seen the #5 on multiple occasions.
You want to nit pick "best"? Sure, that is a matter of opinion. But they are the dominant EV company.
Absolutely not. Lost money on the original roadster and model 3 too. What's your point?
I'll jump in here but, wouldn't it be the same as your point regarding the profitability of the first LCID rolling off the line? Or GM's current EV profitablity?
Up until recently, they were the ONLY EV company. But that's changing now as other auto makers get involved.
The advantage for other large and long-lived auto makers who sell ICE cars, besides tons of experience in producing cars, is that they have a non-EV revenue stream that is going strong and will continue to do so for a while. Which should help them make the transition.
Of course Biden is going to support the unions. He will keep distance from Musk who raves about communist China. It is all politics.
Hey, if you poke into the Stocks thread you'll see my EV plays are F and GM.
My take has, and continues to be, TSLA is the clear leader, but competition is coming on strong.
They just had their earnings report, so yeah, I know they're losing money on every vehicle and according to their own guidance, they're going to be hemorrhaging money for the next 2 years. I wish them luck. Do some research.
You and I are polar opposites when it come to the future of GM. I know you're an investor, but I see major red flags. I do not have confidence in their leadership and decision making. They've already partnered with 2 fraudulent companies, Barra has been lying through her teeth lately, loaded with debt, and they're sticking with antiquated, large pouch style cells despite the recent Bolt fiasco.
