OT: The official ACC all things thread

[JayDogSmooth]

I have nothing against Florida State and until recently have been a good and supportive ACC school.

However, FSU will be in for an unpleasant surprise (IMHO) if they think they will maintain the same significance in the B1G as they enjoyed in the ACC. FSU has always had an edge in the ACC because of their recruiting advantage compared to other ACC schools.

That recruiting advantage will evaporate when/if they they are admitted to the NEW B1G (B1G schools including USC, UCLA, Washington and Oregon).

As I stated in a previous post, I was a little bit surprised that in the last 4 years FSU only had 16 players (7 Rounds) drafted into the NFL.

Pitt like many other ACC teams mostly relies on Rival 3-star players to compete with the Top recruiting teams who get the Rival 5/4 Star players (Believe in the new NIL era those same teams will still get those Rival 5/4 star players but will now have to pay for them via NIL).

Pitt in the last 4 years had 17 players (7 rounds) drafted into the NFL (18 if could have counted WR Jorden Addison). The fact that Pitt had more players drafted into the NFL than FSU was surprising.

In the B1G, FSU will also be competing against the OLD Traditional B1G Powers like Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State, Michigan State etc.

Teams like Rutgers are also trying to raise their profile in the B1G but like Pitt recruit mostly Rival 3-star players.

In the New B1G, FSU will be facing other recruiting juggernauts.

Lets look at Penn State for example and how many players they put in the NFL in the last four years.

Penn State players drafted into the NFL (7 Rounds):

2021-6
2022-8
2023-6
2024-8

Penn State put 28 players in the NFL compared to 16 for FSU in the last 4 years.

You can go through the same NFL exercise with Ohio State, Michigan, USC, Washington etc. if you wish.

Don't get me wrong, FSU is a good football program but their fans/alums will have to adjust their expectations for success in the NEW BIG.

FSU fans/alums may have to trade WINS for MONEY (IMHO) in the New B1G.

Any comments from other Rutgers Board Posters on this subject.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

If FSU is fortunate enough to gain admittance to the B1G, they’ll be in the 2nd tier

Tier 1
Buckeye
Michigan
Usc
Notre dame (if they join)

Tier 2
Penn state
FSU
Nebby / Sconnie / Sparty / Iowa
*** This is where I believe Rutgers could, and should, land of we reach our full potential

With a few good years, FSU could overtake usc - but it’s hard to supplant traditional blue bloods, and it doesn’t get any bluer than the top 4

You can thank Jimbo / Willy for the draft nonsense - end of JF and entire WT tenures were a disaster - thankfully, MN has finally righted the ship

As stated previously, 7-5 doesn’t cut it in Tallahassee. The standard doesn’t change, but people will if that starts to be the norm

You will not see a dynasty like FSU had from 87 to 99. Between NIL, the parody that now exists in college football, other schools dipping into Florida for recruiting, and coaching staffs not staying together for extended periods of time, it is virtually impossible to replicate that type of success

Which again, makes what Saban did at Alabama and Dabo did at Clemson so remarkable in this day and age

 

[bigmatt718]

If FSU is fortunate enough to gain admittance to the B1G, they’ll be in the 2nd tier

Tier 1
Buckeye
Michigan
Usc
Notre dame (if they join)

Tier 2
Penn state
FSU
Nebby / Sconnie / Sparty / Iowa
*** This is where I believe Rutgers could, and should, land of we reach our full potential

With a few good years, FSU could overtake usc - but it’s hard to supplant traditional blue bloods, and it doesn’t get any bluer than the top 4

You can thank Jimbo / Willy for the draft nonsense - end of JF and entire WT tenures were a disaster - thankfully, MN has finally righted the ship

As stated previously, 7-5 doesn’t cut it in Tallahassee. The standard doesn’t change, but people will if that starts to be the norm

You will not see a dynasty like FSU had from 87 to 99. Between NIL, the parody that now exists in college football, other schools dipping into Florida for recruiting, and coaching staffs not staying together for extended periods of time, it is virtually impossible to replicate that type of success

Which again, makes what Saban did at Alabama and Dabo did at Clemson so remarkable in this day and age

Oregon and Washington will be in the top 2 tiers as well.

 

[JayDogSmooth]

Oregon and Washington will be in the top 2 tiers as well.

You’re right, I forgot about them
Both would be in tier 2

I guess ucla could be as well if they ever fuguyed things out down in Westwood…

 

[krup]

I’ve been explicitly told that there are assurances of Big Ten entry once the GOR situation is straightened out

Who exactly from B1G and FSU had those conversations is beyond me

Conference expansion and recruiting with the “follow the visits” mantra is the same.

Essentially, if things make financial sense for both parties, deals are swung and teams move conferences.

If it doesn’t make financial sense for both parties, then things will stay status quo

I think the “noise” doesn’t help, because at the end it is still going to take a vote from a sufficient number of schools, and the noise risks turning some of them off unless FSU brings so much revenue to be a no-brainer.

Additionally, I don’t think the “assurances” idea takes into account the fact the B1G has undergone a substantive change. My example would be Colorado jumping to the PAC12, then being against subsequent attempts to expand the PAC12 with other schools like Texas and Oklahoma.

There very well could be a new 4 school voting bloc against expanding to the southeast, because the last thing USC, Oregon, etc. will want is for the western schools to get “lost” in the B1G with a southeast expansion changing the dynamic.

 

[JayDogSmooth]

I think the “noise” doesn’t help, because at the end it is still going to take a vote from a sufficient number of schools, and the noise risks turning some of them off unless FSU brings so much revenue to be a no-brainer.

Additionally, I don’t think the “assurances” idea takes into account the fact the B1G has undergone a substantive change. My example would be Colorado jumping to the PAC12, then being against subsequent attempts to expand the PAC12 with other schools like Texas and Oklahoma.

There very well could be a new 4 school voting bloc against expanding to the southeast, because the last thing USC, Oregon, etc. will want is for the western schools to get “lost” in the B1G with a southeast expansion changing the dynamic.

The noise doesn’t help their B10 cause but needs to be done in order to escape the ACC

If it makes financial sense, as that is all it comes down to, I wouldn’t be worried about the western schools forming a voting block to essentially block any additional schools from entering

Especially if their pocketbooks see a substantial increase due to the new schools and thereby, the associated increased cable contract money per year, per school

 

[krup]

The noise doesn’t help their B10 cause but needs to be done in order to escape the ACC

If it makes financial sense, as that is all it comes down to, I wouldn’t be worried about the western schools forming a voting block to essentially block any additional schools from entering

Especially if their pocketbooks see a substantial increase due to the new schools and thereby, the associated increased cable contract money per year, per school

With 18 schools and the current TV contracts, it takes bringing a ton of revenue to both pay for yourself and make the other schools enough extra to be worth it. ND obviously does that, I am not sure that FSU does.

You certainly don’t want to negatively influence the schools who might be on the fence when it comes to that.

 

[JayDogSmooth]

With 18 schools and the current TV contracts, it takes bringing a ton of revenue to both pay for yourself and make the other schools enough extra to be worth it. ND obviously does that, I am not sure that FSU does.

You certainly don’t want to negatively influence the schools who might be on the fence when it comes to that.

I don’t think if I see FSU alone does that, you’d have to bring in other schools

ND is the big fish - no doubt about that

 

[krup]

I don’t think if I see FSU alone does that, you’d have to bring in other schools

ND is the big fish - no doubt about that

But then those other schools have to also pay for themselves plus offer a sweetener, and the math gets worse and worse.

I can see a UNC combined with FSU possibly offering enough to make the math work, I have trouble figuring out any other group of 2 schools that doesn’t include ND which can do that.

The financial bar that needs to be hit for any new adds is higher than USC and UCLA had to get over, let alone the ancient times back when RU/MD were added.

 

[JayDogSmooth]

But then those other schools have to also pay for themselves plus offer a sweetener, and the math gets worse and worse.

I can see a UNC combined with FSU possibly offering enough to make the math work, I have trouble figuring out any other group of 2 schools that doesn’t include ND which can do that.

The financial bar that needs to be hit for any new adds is higher than USC and UCLA had to get over, let alone the ancient times back when RU/MD were added.

Yeah, it would have to be at least one other school, I would think Carolina would do the trick

Obviously, Notre Dame would also fit the bill if they were so inclined to join

 

[kupuna133]

But then those other schools have to also pay for themselves plus offer a sweetener, and the math gets worse and worse.

I can see a UNC combined with FSU possibly offering enough to make the math work, I have trouble figuring out any other group of 2 schools that doesn’t include ND which can do that.

The financial bar that needs to be hit for any new adds is higher than USC and UCLA had to get over, let alone the ancient times back when RU/MD were added.

Interesting that 2 schools that had the least perceived value by those not in the know, Rutgers and Maryland, added the most to the bottom line of any conference expansion. And changed the game for conference expansion going forward.

Conferences now can't just grab the "marquee" name without justifying a return.

 

[krup]

Interesting that 2 schools that had the least perceived value by those not in the know, Rutgers and Maryland, added the most to the bottom line of any conference expansion. And changed the game for conference expansion going forward.

Conferences now can't just grab the "marquee" name without justifying a return.

RU/MD were definitely smart adds, but the bar they had to meet at the time was to be worth $50 million+, while a school needs to be worth double that now to make sense as an addition.

 

[kupuna133]

RU/MD were definitely smart adds, but the bar they had to meet at the time was to be worth $50 million+, while a school needs to be worth double that now to make sense as an addition.

The bar was raised because RU/UMD were brought in to change the dynamic of how conferences and media rights were valued. B1G members prior to the RU/UMD additions were not getting anywhere near 50m.
Edit
Big members were getting just over 25 m prior to RU/UMD https://btn.com/2013/05/06/report-big-ten-payouts-to-hit-25-7-million/

 

[MADHAT1]

I have nothing against Florida State and until recently have been a good and supportive ACC school.

However, FSU will be in for an unpleasant surprise (IMHO) if they think they will maintain the same significance in the B1G as they enjoyed in the ACC. FSU has always had an edge in the ACC because of their recruiting advantage compared to other ACC schools.

That recruiting advantage will evaporate when/if they they are admitted to the NEW B1G (B1G schools including USC, UCLA, Washington and Oregon).

As I stated in a previous post, I was a little bit surprised that in the last 4 years FSU only had 16 players (7 Rounds) drafted into the NFL.

Pitt like many other ACC teams mostly relies on Rival 3-star players to compete with the Top recruiting teams who get the Rival 5/4 Star players (Believe in the new NIL era those same teams will still get those Rival 5/4 star players but will now have to pay for them via NIL).

Pitt in the last 4 years had 17 players (7 rounds) drafted into the NFL (18 if could have counted WR Jorden Addison). The fact that Pitt had more players drafted into the NFL than FSU was surprising.

In the B1G, FSU will also be competing against the OLD Traditional B1G Powers like Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State, Michigan State etc.

Teams like Rutgers are also trying to raise their profile in the B1G but like Pitt recruit mostly Rival 3-star players.

In the New B1G, FSU will be facing other recruiting juggernauts.

Lets look at Penn State for example and how many players they put in the NFL in the last four years.

Penn State players drafted into the NFL (7 Rounds):

2021-6
2022-8
2023-6
2024-8

Penn State put 28 players in the NFL compared to 16 for FSU in the last 4 years.

You can go through the same NFL exercise with Ohio State, Michigan, USC, Washington etc. if you wish.

Don't get me wrong, FSU is a good football program but their fans/alums will have to adjust their expectations for success in the NEW BIG.

FSU fans/alums may have to trade WINS for MONEY (IMHO) in the New B1G.

Any comments from other Rutgers Board Posters on this subject.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

growl
USC and Washington just joined the B1G so all the players that were drafted from those two programs along with UCLA & Oregon can't be attributed to being in the B1G .
FSU might wind up having a good draft haul for its players once if it becomes a B1G member
As for becoming a lesser program in the B1G that can also be claimed by the ed PAC programs that entered B1G territory.

Claims like that must be proven , just like one can claim Texas and OK will not fare as well in the SEC as they did in the B1G 12. but longhorn and Sooner history points out that could be wrong .
Oklahoma kept being a top program a
after the B-8 became the B-12 and Texas didn't lose a beat when the SWC folded and it joined the B-12.
Nebraska did fall from grace when it left the B-12 for the B1G so you can say FSU will do the same and have a program to point out to prove your point.
But the Cornhuskers weren't that bad when they first started in the B1G, once they dumped Bo Pelini (37-16 as a B1G team compared to 29-12 as B-12 member) poor coaching hires seemed to be what killed that programs ability to compete in the B1G just like when they dumped Farank Solich for Bill Callahan, tehir B-12 preformance wasn't something to write home to mother about, unless it was a complaint.
Once Bo was hired the Cornhuskers became a top B-12 program again .
Rhule wasm't much of a NFL HC, but his college HC resume is pretty good.
So the jury should be coming back and taking a second look to see if Nebraska can be a good B1G member.

FSU's ACC history suggests it might just be more competitive in the B1G tham people might think, but dominating the B1G shouldn't be expected.
Making it harder for OSU and Michigan tostand out from the crowd might be what they bring and with/if
FSU and the ex PAC in the B1G now, maybe the top B1G programs will be taken down a notch and not considered the undisputed leaders

About recruits, Florida is a paradise and the Seminoles might use B1G status to get the ones that looked down on the ACC and thought SEC was more enticing.
Now they might feel playing at home for FSU in the B1G is just as good. Heck FSU being a member might open up Florida a little better for all B1G programs