Pacheco

[RUich]

I was just thinking about his journey. No offensive line to speak of when he was at RU and still had decent numbers. Put him in the afterthoughts of the NFL and finally picked by KC in the seventh round. Then had to show up at their camp, with the clock ticking, to make some kind of splash before getting cut like so many late round picks.
Ends up their feature back and has a great season and a Super Bowl ring in his rookie season! On to the present, where he is poised to do it again. Have to wonder how many other pro teams were looking over the list of candidates during the late rounds who looked right past him and wonder what happened to the guys they did pick?

 

[ashokan]

Guys get fired after enough bad draft pics.
If Pacheco didn't have that fast 40 dash he wouldn''t have been drafted
Even Schiano thought he would be a FA and a special teams player
If Pacheco bombed the staff could justify the pic with the dash number.

KC was the perfect team.
Mahomes and Kelce keep the defense stretched.
Reid knows offenses and situational football
KC OL is very good
Put Pacheco on the Jets and Breece Hall on KC and Hall is a star as well.
Of course people love the spicy run style

"Why that man mad at the ground!" posted one YT fan

 

[LeapinLou]

Even Schiano thought he would be a FA and a special teams player

I'm not sure where you received that bit of information but I find it hard to believe.

I went to a closed practice in the bubble when Pacheco was a Sophomore/Junior. He was head and shoulders the best player on the team. It was stark to watch him practice relative to anyone else at any position. He was clearly an NFL caliber player.

As you pointed out, he needed the right supporting cast to become a star. KC is a perfect fit.

 

[Yeah Baby]

I'm not sure where you received that bit of information but I find it hard to believe.

I went to a closed practice in the bubble when Pacheco was a Sophomore/Junior. He was head and shoulders the best player on the team. It was stark to watch him practice relative to anyone else at any position. He was clearly an NFL caliber player.

As you pointed out, he needed the right supporting cast to become a star. KC is a perfect fit.

He made it up just like most of the crap we see on message boards. People will believe that crap.

Schiano called him a pro early on and Millen also said he was a pro. Those are guys I will listen to and believe.

 

[Kbee3]

Anyone who watched Pacheco at Rutgers could see that he was special. I think he still holds the record for "Most times running into a hole that's not there and still gaining yardage." And when he got some blocking, he was great.
I thought he could play in the League. I just wondered if he'd get a chance. Luckily he stayed healthy and Kansas City gave him one.

 

[ashokan]

I'm not sure where you received that bit of information but I find it hard to believe.

I went to a closed practice in the bubble when Pacheco was a Sophomore/Junior. He was head and shoulders the best player on the team. It was stark to watch him practice relative to anyone else at any position. He was clearly an NFL caliber player.

As you pointed out, he needed the right supporting cast to become a star. KC is a perfect fit.

Pop was mediocre as a senior with 647 yds and 3.9 average.
You realize how many P5 RBs were much better than that?

Greg emphasized special teams when talking about Pacheco - who he did not equate with a top RB

“I think that Pop is going to be a really good NFL player,” Schiano said. “I think that he can do all the things that they want you to do in the NFL. He can run the football, he can protect and I think he will be a very good special teams player. Unless you are the guy who is rushing for 1,000 yards then you better be a really good special teams player as a running back because that main guy is getting the most carries and the rest of you are there as backups, unless maybe you’re a third down situational back.”

TheKnightReport - Isiah Pacheco shines at Pro Day, talks upcoming private workout and more

Rutgers Football RB Isiah Pacheco shines once again at Pro Day, excited about possibly playing in the league.

rutgers.rivals.com

 

[ashokan]

He made it up just like most of the crap we see on message boards. People will believe that crap.

Schiano called him a pro early on and Millen also said he was a pro. Those are guys I will listen to and believe.

Lots of UFAs on special teams are "pros"

 

[RUbacker]

He made it up just like most of the crap we see on message boards. People will believe that crap.

Schiano called him a pro early on and Millen also said he was a pro. Those are guys I will listen to and believe.

I can confirm 100% that Greg said he was going to the league early on after he saw pacheco. He also never said as FA or special teams not sure where he got that from.

 

[jtung230]

Don’t forget that there was a group that said he didn’t know how to run.

 

[yesrutgers01]

Pop was mediocre as a senior with 647 yds and 3.9 average.
You realize how many P5 RBs were much better than that?

Greg emphasized special teams when talking about Pacheco - who he did not equate with a top RB

“I think that Pop is going to be a really good NFL player,” Schiano said. “I think that he can do all the things that they want you to do in the NFL. He can run the football, he can protect and I think he will be a very good special teams player. Unless you are the guy who is rushing for 1,000 yards then you better be a really good special teams player as a running back because that main guy is getting the most carries and the rest of you are there as backups, unless maybe you’re a third down situational back.”

TheKnightReport - Isiah Pacheco shines at Pro Day, talks upcoming private workout and more

Rutgers Football RB Isiah Pacheco shines once again at Pro Day, excited about possibly playing in the league.

rutgers.rivals.com

So- coach speak when you are trying to put your player in a great position for the draft. First- he had already said he was going to be a really good player- he can run the ball and protect the ball. But when Greg started talking about ST's- it was his way to let teams know that IP could be special there even though he didn't plat ST's in college. IP was always going to be a late round UDFA- bringing up ST's was not a way to say he wasn't a special RB but to try to get some props to the kid who may have to start his career proving it on ST's.
And Pops has done even better than anyone could have thought.

 

[ashokan]

I can confirm 100% that Greg said he was going to the league early on after he saw pacheco. He also never said as FA or special teams not sure where he got that from.

Statistically there was nothing wildly optimistic about Pacheco's stats.
Around 45 1000+ yd rushers this year in P5.
I read a lot of Pacecho stuff back then and Greg was praising Pacheco's drive and skills while softening draft expectations with all the 'special teams" talk.

Facts are that Pacheco was drafted 251 - in the last 12 players.
Only 12 players away from PFA land
No doubt that 40 time got him drafted at all.
Before the combine nobody was talking about Pacheco as a starter no less a great starter
KC took a gamble and won

cfbstats.com - 2023 National Player Leaders

 

[LeapinLou]

Pop was mediocre as a senior with 647 yds and 3.9 average.
You realize how many P5 RBs were much better than that?

Greg emphasized special teams when talking about Pacheco - who he did not equate with a top RB

“I think that Pop is going to be a really good NFL player,” Schiano said. “I think that he can do all the things that they want you to do in the NFL. He can run the football, he can protect and I think he will be a very good special teams player. Unless you are the guy who is rushing for 1,000 yards then you better be a really good special teams player as a running back because that main guy is getting the most carries and the rest of you are there as backups, unless maybe you’re a third down situational back.”

TheKnightReport - Isiah Pacheco shines at Pro Day, talks upcoming private workout and more

Rutgers Football RB Isiah Pacheco shines once again at Pro Day, excited about possibly playing in the league.

rutgers.rivals.com

I give you credit for supplying your source. Some of your comments are fair based on this. It seems Schiano flat out said he wouldn't be the "1000 yards guy" and that's exactly who Pacheco became. But I also think these comments were made with the understanding that he wasn't going to be a top pick and he was trying to spin it a certain way.

As far as you sighting Pacheco's college stats, that was a function of his offensive line, not him. If Pacheco had played for Wisconsin, he would have eclipsed 4,000 career yards.

 

[Roy_Faulker]

The 40 time was special.

Speaking of amazing 40 times - glad Bo got picked up too and had a strong finish to the year scoring tds in the playoffs. .

 

[ashokan]

I give you credit for supplying your source. Some of your comments are fair based on this. It seems Schiano flat out said he wouldn't be the "1000 yards guy" and that's exactly who Pacheco became. But I also think these comments were made with the understanding that he wasn't going to be a top pick and he was trying to spin it a certain way.

As far as you sighting Pacheco's college stats, that was a function of his offensive line, not him. If Pacheco had played for Wisconsin, he would have eclipsed 4,000 career yards.

Yes I know the OL was a big problem for Pop - he didn't even make top 100 rushers.
Against Ohio St he had 8 yds on 6 carries - 1.33 avg
Against PSU he had 6 yds on 7 carries - 1.17 avg
Against Northwestern he had 15 yds on 13 carries - 1.15 avg

He had a good game vs Michigan but - looking at the stats of a player you might not know well - who would roll the dice on such senior yr stats?

Breece Hal had 1500 yds and 20 TDs

cfbstats.com - Isaih Pacheco 2021 Player Statistics - Rutgers Scarlet Knights

 

[LeapinLou]

This thread prompted me to look this up.

RU career rushing yard leaders:

• Ray Rice (2005-07) 4,926.
• Terrell Willis (1993-95) 3,114.
• “JJ” Jennings (1971-73) 2,935.
• Bruce Presley (1992-95) 2,792.
• Brian Leonard (2003-06) 2,775.
• Glen Kehler (1975-78) 2,567.
• Isaih Pacheco (2018-21) 2,442.

Rice in first place by over 1800 yards, lol. Of course, if Willis would have come back for his senior year, it would be much closer.

 

[ashokan]

This thread prompted me to look this up.

RU career rushing yard leaders:

• Ray Rice (2005-07) 4,926.
• Terrell Willis (1993-95) 3,114.
• “JJ” Jennings (1971-73) 2,935.
• Bruce Presley (1992-95) 2,792.
• Brian Leonard (2003-06) 2,775.
• Glen Kehler (1975-78) 2,567.
• Isaih Pacheco (2018-21) 2,442.

Rice in first place by over 1800 yards, lol. Of course, if Willis would have come back for his senior year, it would be much closer.

Rice's yearly average was about 1600 yds a season (and with teams knowing he was main weapon to stop.) If Rice came back for his senior year and got 1600 yds he would be all time D1 rusher with over 6500 yds. Even Rice was only 2nd round

 

[gmay8]

Yesterday i put $10 on Pacheco to win Super Bowl MVP at +4000 (40/1). Obviously Mahomes or Purdy are the heavy favorites... but you never know if the Chiefs commit to running the ball and Pop goes for 150 yards and 2 TDs he's got a good shot. Fun money for a rooting interest.

 

[jtung230]

Yesterday i put $10 on Pacheco to win Super Bowl MVP at +4000 (40/1). Obviously Mahomes or Purdy are the heavy favorites... but you never know if the Chiefs commit to running the ball and Pop goes for 150 yards and 2 TDs he's got a good shot. Fun money for a rooting interest.

Isn’t 40/1 +400?

 

[RUTGERS95]

So- coach speak when you are trying to put your player in a great position for the draft. First- he had already said he was going to be a really good player- he can run the ball and protect the ball. But when Greg started talking about ST's- it was his way to let teams know that IP could be special there even though he didn't plat ST's in college. IP was always going to be a late round UDFA- bringing up ST's was not a way to say he wasn't a special RB but to try to get some props to the kid who may have to start his career proving it on ST's.
And Pops has done even better than anyone could have thought.

I think you are doing a revisionist thing. many of us wanted Pacheco to get the ball a lot more and didn't. I think Greg liked him but Greg didn't really think he was as good as he's shown to be. There were lots of head scratchers with Greg's use of Papecho

 

[Rutgers Chris]

Isn’t 40/1 +400?

1=100, so it’s +4000. I like it, going to bet it too so I have something to root for.

 

[yesrutgers01]

I think you are doing a revisionist thing. many of us wanted Pacheco to get the ball a lot more and didn't. I think Greg liked him but Greg didn't really think he was as good as he's shown to be. There were lots of head scratchers with Greg's use of Papecho

Interesting enough, IP's last 3 years Ash/GS/GS
Pops carried the ball 452 times and the 2nd highest RB each each combined for 145 and the combo of QB/Langan carried 449 times.

I think it was more play calling then any knock on a specific player

 

[RUTGERS95]

Interesting enough, IP's last 3 years Ash/GS/GS
Pops carried the ball 452 times and the 2nd highest RB each each combined for 145 and the combo of QB/Langan carried 449 times.

I think it was more play calling then any knock on a specific player

I'm just glad he's succeeding as he's the type of kid you root for. I think they are all way overpaid altruistically but I hope he gets a billion dollar contract:)

 

[knightfan7]

Pop was mediocre as a senior with 647 yds and 3.9 average.
You realize how many P5 RBs were much better than that?

Greg emphasized special teams when talking about Pacheco - who he did not equate with a top RB

“I think that Pop is going to be a really good NFL player,” Schiano said. “I think that he can do all the things that they want you to do in the NFL. He can run the football, he can protect and I think he will be a very good special teams player. Unless you are the guy who is rushing for 1,000 yards then you better be a really good special teams player as a running back because that main guy is getting the most carries and the rest of you are there as backups, unless maybe you’re a third down situational back.”

TheKnightReport - Isiah Pacheco shines at Pro Day, talks upcoming private workout and more

Rutgers Football RB Isiah Pacheco shines once again at Pro Day, excited about possibly playing in the league.

rutgers.rivals.com

And a KC scout studied his senior year tape and charted how much he gained after first being hit. He knew RU's OL was bad (which has been brought up by media and folks here) and felt he was better than his YPC. He then killed it at the combine. The only reason they waited untill the 7th was they already had 3 NFL quality RB's including a 1st Rounder.

 

[RUHEADHUNTER]

1=100, so it’s +4000. I like it, going to bet it too so I have something to root for.

what website do yo use?

 

[ashokan]

And a KC scout studied his senior year tape and charted how much he gained after first being hit. He knew RU's OL was bad (which has been brought up by media and folks here) and felt he was better than his YPC. He then killed it at the combine. The only reason they waited untill the 7th was they already had 3 NFL quality RB's including a 1st Rounder.

I would expect something like that from KC.
Some teams just know what to do

 

[mildone]

I'm just glad he's succeeding as he's the type of kid you root for. I think they are all way overpaid altruistically but I hope he gets a billion dollar contract:)

They'd probably think you were overpaid, too. 😉

It's funny how people think they should have an opinion on how much money other people make. I long for a time when people minded their own business. I think everybody should make as much as they can and how much that is ain't none of my business, so I don't ever need to know.

 

[ashokan]

They'd probably think you were overpaid, too. 😉

It's funny how people think they should have an opinion on how much money other people make. I long for a time when people minded their own business. I think everybody should make as much as they can and how much that is ain't none of my business, so I don't ever need to know.

Fans have to pay those salaries
They are hardly rationally affordable which is why NFL working to get young dudes addicted to gambling

 

[knightfan7]

I would expect something like that from KC.
Some teams just know what to do

Exactly. That scout obviously saw something and took the time to look deeper. I'd say he earned his paycheck.

I guess that's why they're more successful than the rest.

 

[Rutgers Chris]

what website do yo use?

Fanduel or DraftKings if I was in NJ.

 

[mildone]

Fans have to pay those salaries
They are hardly rationally affordable which is why NFL working to get young dudes addicted to gambling

Someone somewhere is paying for every salary everywhere, be it investors, customers, taxpayers, fans, etc. It's no excuse for one person to judge another person's income worthiness. People should mind their own damn business.

Who are any of us to judge what a football player's worth is? That's between the football player and the team management. None of our business. If we don't want to pay for it, then we don't have to do so. Easy.

 

[nutfromSEC117]

 

[nutfromSEC117]

 

[ashokan]

Someone somewhere is paying for every salary everywhere, be it investors, customers, taxpayers, fans, etc. It's no excuse for one person to judge another person's income worthiness. People should mind their own damn business.

Who are any of us to judge what a football player's worth is? That's between the football player and the team management. None of our business. If we don't want to pay for it, then we don't have to do so. Easy.

This ^^ is a silly argument.
Sports salaries are public and fans want to know what the teams they spend on are investing in.
You make it sound like hackers are uploading their tax returns.
When Giants pay millions to the oft injured D Jones, they might not want to pay for those season tickets.
What's the product being offered and how sustainable?
We know once a few 1st round players start getting big deals the rest of the team suffers.
Now Saquon is on the block to save money despite being popular.
Is Jones worth 30 million more a season?
RU coaching deals are mostly public - are they being violated?
Of course not.

 

[mildone]

This ^^ is a silly argument.
Sports salaries are public and fans want to know what the teams they spend on are investing in.
You make it sound like hackers are uploading their tax returns.
When Giants pay millions to the oft injured D Jones, they might not want to pay for those season tickets.
What's the product being offered and how sustainable?
We know once a few 1st round players start getting big deals the rest of the team suffers.
Now Saquon is on the block to save money despite being popular.
Is Jones worth 30 million more a season?
RU coaching deals are mostly public - are they being violated?
Of course not.

You can rationalize judging players all you want. Bottom line is, if fans don't want to pay for player salaries, they don't have to do so. It's a choice fans make to spend money on the team and is incredibly easy to opt out.

 

[ashokan]

You can rationalize judging players all you want. Bottom line is, if fans don't want to pay for player salaries, they don't have to do so. It's a choice fans make to spend money on the team and is incredibly easy to opt out.

Its not "judging players" its surveying team expenses/investments.
Fans cant make choices if things are secrets

Your Right to Discuss Wages​

Under the National Labor Relations Act (NLRA or the Act), employees have the right to communicate with their coworkers about their wages, as well as with labor organizations, worker centers, the media, and the public. Wages are a vital term and condition of employment, and discussions of wages are often preliminary to organizing or other actions for mutual aid or protection.

Your Right to Discuss Wages | National Labor Relations Board

Under the National Labor Relations Act (NLRA or the Act), employees have the right to communicate with their coworkers about their wages, as well as with labor organizations, worker centers, the media, and the public. Wages are a vital term and condition of employment, and discussions of wages...

www.nlrb.gov

 

[mildone]

Its not "judging players" its surveying team expenses/investments.
Fans cant make choices if things are secrets

Your Right to Discuss Wages​

Under the National Labor Relations Act (NLRA or the Act), employees have the right to communicate with their coworkers about their wages, as well as with labor organizations, worker centers, the media, and the public. Wages are a vital term and condition of employment, and discussions of wages are often preliminary to organizing or other actions for mutual aid or protection.

Your Right to Discuss Wages | National Labor Relations Board

Under the National Labor Relations Act (NLRA or the Act), employees have the right to communicate with their coworkers about their wages, as well as with labor organizations, worker centers, the media, and the public. Wages are a vital term and condition of employment, and discussions of wages...

www.nlrb.gov

We have the right to do all sorts of stuff. Doesn't mean we have to do it.

Fans know how much they spend on a team. They have no real need whatsoever to know how that money is spent.

People think they deserve to know everything about everybody these days. IMO, they don't. We've become a rumor mongering, privacy eschewing, busybody society. Rudeness is overtaking politeness and classiness in our culture. Sucks.

 

[RUTGERS95]

Someone somewhere is paying for every salary everywhere, be it investors, customers, taxpayers, fans, etc. It's no excuse for one person to judge another person's income worthiness. People should mind their own damn business.

Who are any of us to judge what a football player's worth is? That's between the football player and the team management. None of our business. If we don't want to pay for it, then we don't have to do so. Easy.

your problem is try to be the wittiest guy in the room and often just derail an otherwise good thread

If you would read what I wrote, like an adult without trying to be cute, you'd realize exactly the intimation and no need to derail this

 

[shields]

Also had a game versus Penn State with over 100 yards and Penn State kid said pacheco runs hard.

 

[mildone]

your problem is try to be the wittiest guy in the room and often just derail an otherwise good thread

If you would read what I wrote, like an adult without trying to be cute, you'd realize exactly the intimation and no need to derail this

So that’s my problem, eh? I‘ll be honest, I was wandering around all day, sensing I had a problem but not knowing what it was. Before you posted, I thought sure it was gas.

But now? These poor eyes hath been opened, hallelujah! And the gassy feeling? It passed.

Oops, there I go again, hopelessly stuck trying to be cute.

BTW, what does altruistically overpaid even mean?

 

[miketd1]

Andy Reid — like the Rutgers football program — has a knack for picking RBs.

He drafted arguably two of the top 5 RBs in Eagles franchise history in Brian Westbrook and LeSean McCoy.