Rettig's mobility not good enough

[mildone]

Because having watched Laviano play we have come to the conclusion that he is not that good.

And I am not calling for Rettig, last year he should have gotten more of a chance, but this year, if Laviano continues to struggle, I am fine with Gio or Allen(I'm preferring the former at the moment).

Note I am not not calling to bench Laviano yet, and I do think Ash will make a change if things do not.

I don't think Laviano is good enough to win games without a decent supporting cast. So in that sense, I agree that he's not that good.

However, the coaches on two separate staffs have seen far, far more of all the QBs on our roster than any of us fans have seen. And those coaches are all considerably more educated about football than the fan-base.

So if the coaches have concluded that Laviano should still be the starting QB, then I'm willing to trust their decision. Doesn't mean Laviano is all that great. It just means that he's apparently the person they all thought, and for the moment still think, is the best option we have, for better or worse.

If Laviano fails to protect the ball in subsequent games, then I think it's likely he'll get benched. If he's getting even half-decent protection and receivers are getting open quickly, and he's either not seeing them or missing on his throws, then I think it's likely he'll get benched.

If he doesn't get benched, then it would make more sense for the fan-base to complain about the quality of the backups then to moan about Laviano. Because if he is screwing up when the team is playing well around him and the coaches still refuse to put in a backup, then the backups must be a lot worse than the fan-base realizes.

Because if there's one thing we can rely on, it's that the coaches want to win games even more than the fans want to win games. For us, it's momentary happiness at stake. For Ash, it's his career on the line.

 

[mildone]

untill given a chance they could not do worse

Just because we fans don't get to see how the backups perform very often, it doesn't mean the coaching staff doesn't get to see them perform constantly. The backups had their chance in training camp.

If the team improves around Laviano but Laviano does not improve with them, then as long as at least one of the backups had demonstrated the ability to operate the offense, I think the coaching staff will make a change.

But that's only if the team improves and Laviano does not. I don't think we'll see the coaching staff throw Laviano under a bus if the entire team struggles in a game. It takes all eleven players to do their jobs for the team to have success. Not just one.

 

[mildone]

Yeah and fans that have opinions shouldn't post at all and everyone here should just write I support the coaches' decision because they're right all the time.

A forum is here for people's opinions! Stop being so ridiculously extremist!

He's not being extremist. He's being gently sarcastic. He's making fun of fans that think, after one game, that they are in a better position than the coaching staff to determine who the starting QB should be.

That's his opinion and, as you say, a forum is here for people's opinions.

 

[mildone]

Why is Goodwin still ahead of Hicks on the depth chart?

I've watched for 2 years and one game where Hicks is clearly the better RB.

But Coach likes certain things about Goodwin, maybe he's more mature, I'll say he is definitely the better pass catcher and blocker. And maybe the same is at play with Laviano. . They like certain aspects about Laviano, Flood clearly thought Laviano's leadership was important, and I've heard some similar quotes from Ash, despite perhaps not being as good at other aspects, like throwing the ball.

I don't discount Laviano being the better practice QB. Where as another guy may be a better game QB.

I think Hicks is really good. There were a couple runs, Saturday, where I thought Hicks would have done better than Goodwin. Having said that, to my way of thinking, Hicks needs to figure out what the coaches want to see and show them that, whatever it is. My guess is Hicks has been made aware of what he needs to do and he's working on it.

In other words, I don't fault the coaches for Hicks not starting. I lay the responsibility squarely on Hicks shoulders.

 

[RUinPAC10land]

He's not being extremist. He's being gently sarcastic. He's making fun of fans that think, after one game, that they are in a better position than the coaching staff to determine who the starting QB should be.

That's his opinion and, as you say, a forum is here for people's opinions.

All right, that one is fair. I was a little offended by his sarcasm and I did get a little defensive. I for one know that I could be absolutely wrong about Rettig but I am dying to find out what a stronger armed 4 star qb can do with this offense. I saw what Schiano did with Savage and I don't want the same mistake to be made. I would love it if this staff gave Rettig a chance and allow him to have the same chances as Laviano.

 

[chase07470]

Incorrect - apparently he is now 5th string QB.

In one of Seargents columns a week or so ago after Laviano was named the starter. He replied to one of the comments after the article. . He mentioned that during the practices they had observed recently, Gio and Allen were taking the reps with the second team... and Dare was now taking the reps with the third team Offense. Mentioned that Rettig did not take any 11 vs 11 reps at all and only participated in QB drills. --- 5th string

There is no place for a slow footed guy in this new world. But with the limited time he's played, it does seem like Rettig has a knack for dropping the ball over the wr's shoulder. He did it in almost every game he's played, including the spring game to agudosi.

Obviously QB's have to do a lot more, on and off the field but it's frustrating to watch our offense and think about that arm and the throws against NSU and late against OSU and Wisconsin. It almost seems like getting that on the field is worth whatever negatives come with it because it's just so hard to score if you can't do that. Right now, not only can we not do that, we're not even trying.

How are we going to score four plus TD's required to win a game with only a steady diet of sinks and dunks? We're not.

 

[mildone]

All right, that one is fair. I was a little offended by his sarcasm and I did get a little defensive. I for one know that I could be absolutely wrong about Rettig but I am dying to find out what a stronger armed 4 star qb can do with this offense. I saw what Schiano did with Savage and I don't want the same mistake to be made. I would love it if this staff gave Rettig a chance and allow him to have the same chances as Laviano.

As much as I'm trying to calm people and appeal for patience, trust (in the coaching staff) and logic, I admit that in the heat of the game on Saturday, I was hoping that Ash would put in Allen during the second half to see what he might be able to do with his feet. So believe me, I understand where everybody is coming from.

But when things calm down, I see the logic behind what the coaching staff is doing. It's just going to take time and we're going to suffer some in the meantime; particularly over the first half of this season.

 

[brucelaw8]

As

All right, that one is fair. I was a little offended by his sarcasm and I did get a little defensive. I for one know that I could be absolutely wrong about Rettig but I am dying to find out what a stronger armed 4 star qb can do with this offense. I saw what Schiano did with Savage and I don't want the same mistake to be made. I would love it if this staff gave Rettig a chance and allow him to have the same chances as Laviano.

As is well known,I am solidly in your camp.Without a lights out runner(a la Houston) we will not win without a QB that can stretch the defense.Stout BIG defenses will never respect us unless there is a deep threat.I am smart enough to see that it is probably not in the cards for Rettig at RU.He will likely never see meaningful minutes here,barring unforeseen circumstances.

 

[jellyman]

Three staffs, same result.

Bingo.

Rettig sounds like a great kid, but this year is now the 3rd consecutive staff that has not put Rettig in as a 1st strong QB ... and if another poster above is correct, that Dare is getting 3rd Team reps, and Rettig is basically the 5th stringer now ... then ... well I do not even know what to say about some people who post on this board about them knowing more than the coaches (though it is true I sometimes do so, I do not do so in an endless litany of complaints).

Repeat after me: The biggest problem in the Washington game was NOT Laviano. It is true Lkaviano was not great. It is also likely true Laviano may never be able to carry a team. But the biggest problem for RU's offense against Washington was its offensive line performance, followed by the lack of WR skills.

 

[ru-baby]

Repeat after me: The biggest problem in the Washington game was NOT Laviano//////

Ha. How many times have we heard the not the biggest problem argument. Its ok its alwaus a problem - just that there are other problems too each week. The apologist culture continues.

 

[BoogieKnight]

Repeat after me: The biggest problem in the Washington game was NOT Laviano//////

Ha. How many times have we heard the not the biggest problem argument. Its ok its alwaus a problem - just that there are other problems too each week. The apologist culture continues.

Can't do much if the DL is living in your backfield. I am no Laviano apologist and in fact think we need to go all in with the read option and play Allen or Gio who are legit threats to break contain with their feet. But their interior DL were blowing us up and pushing us into the backfield all day. Other than UM and MSU that will be the best D line we face all year. Even better than OSU's IMO.

 

[RUinPAC10land]

Bingo.

Rettig sounds like a great kid, but this year is now the 3rd consecutive staff that has not put Rettig in as a 1st strong QB ... and if another poster above is correct, that Dare is getting 3rd Team reps, and Rettig is basically the 5th stringer now ... then ... well I do not even know what to say about some people who post on this board about them knowing more than the coaches (though it is true I sometimes do so, I do not do so in an endless litany of complaints).

Repeat after me: The biggest problem in the Washington game was NOT Laviano. It is true Lkaviano was not great. It is also likely true Laviano may never be able to carry a team. But the biggest problem for RU's offense against Washington was its offensive line performance, followed by the lack of WR skills.

How the heck did you become moderator? The possible thought of going premium has become a little less likely. The other problems argument is pretty weak, dude. Smh

 

[slyker]

Bingo.

Rettig sounds like a great kid, but this year is now the 3rd consecutive staff that has not put Rettig in as a 1st strong QB ... and if another poster above is correct, that Dare is getting 3rd Team reps, and Rettig is basically the 5th stringer now ... then ... well I do not even know what to say about some people who post on this board about them knowing more than the coaches (though it is true I sometimes do so, I do not do so in an endless litany of complaints).

Repeat after me: The biggest problem in the Washington game was NOT Laviano. It is true Lkaviano was not great. It is also likely true Laviano may never be able to carry a team. But the biggest problem for RU's offense against Washington was its offensive line performance, followed by the lack of WR skills.

Good post. Nice to read rational & logical thoughts on RU's offense once in a while.

 

[imbazza2]

[

Why does anyone think anybody behind Laviano on the depth chart is better?

OH 4 stars by rivals is soooo much better then live evaluation and being from LSU or TCU makes them superior to anything Rutgers could have.
LSU, TCU or Flood's staff or Ash's staff do not know how to evaluate QB???
Either these posters are ledger liars just stirring the pot or some of the most dumb/stubborn MFs on the planet

 

[Yeah Baby]

to run the 2-3 yard carries- and throw screens and slants?

Seems like a lot of overthinking in whats needed. Perhaps a threat to throw more than 10 yards- and not have d stack the box- might help

You are such a loser. Luckily there are 20 others just like you on this board. Have fun girls.

 

[DJ Spanky]

Dear Lord!!!

I completely agree Laviano is not the answer. But Redding?

Since when is Otis playing football? I thought he was sitting on the dock of the bay.

Makes me think of Chase Dodd over Tom Savage all over again.

Which was perfectly warranted, given Savage's attitude and demeanor. This has been rehashed time and again: Savage brought that on himself, and even admitted it after he graduated.

 

[mildone]

Since when is Otis playing football? I thought he was sitting on the dock of the bay.

Watching the tide roll away, ooh. Great f-ing song, that.

 

[D1ESEL44]

Yes

Bingo.

Rettig sounds like a great kid, but this year is now the 3rd consecutive staff that has not put Rettig in as a 1st strong QB ... and if another poster above is correct, that Dare is getting 3rd Team reps, and Rettig is basically the 5th stringer now ... then ... well I do not even know what to say about some people who post on this board about them knowing more than the coaches (though it is true I sometimes do so, I do not do so in an endless litany of complaints).

Repeat after me: The biggest problem in the Washington game was NOT Laviano. It is true Lkaviano was not great. It is also likely true Laviano may never be able to carry a team. But the biggest problem for RU's offense against Washington was its offensive line performance, followed by the lack of WR skills.

Regarding the OL and WRs - I agree. The OL has to be able to hold off the rush and give Laviano time to work through his progressions.

Our WRs can't generate separation, which means you need a QB who can really spin it, but do so with accuracy. Due to the lack of separation being generated by the WRs, the QB must demonstrate the ability to fit the ball into tighter windows. To other posters' points, if you have a QB who lacks the arm strength to zip the ball into tighter windows/throwing lanes, then you have to put in a QB who does.

 

[miketd1]

Laviano's lack of pop is part of the problem.

On bubble screens, it honestly feels like the defender is out running the ball on the way to the receiver -- it takes an eternity to get there, even boundary side.

 

[D1ESEL44]

Can't do much if the DL is living in your backfield. I am no Laviano apologist and in fact think we need to go all in with the read option and play Allen or Gio who are legit threats to break contain with their feet. But their interior DL were blowing us up and pushing us into the backfield all day. Other than UM and MSU that will be the best D line we face all year. Even better than OSU's IMO.

I don't know if this offense will ever really start "humming" with Laviano operating out of the gun. If our WRs can't generate separation, then we will need a dynamic ground game to open up the passing attack via play action. Laviano is not a runner. He looked awkward carrying the ball on Saturday. Allen and Gio played in Gun and Run offenses in high school and probably much more familiar than Lav with the read/option.

 

[RU Cheese]

Bingo.

Rettig sounds like a great kid, but this year is now the 3rd consecutive staff that has not put Rettig in as a 1st strong QB ... and if another poster above is correct, that Dare is getting 3rd Team reps, and Rettig is basically the 5th stringer now ... then ... well I do not even know what to say about some people who post on this board about them knowing more than the coaches (though it is true I sometimes do so, I do not do so in an endless litany of complaints).

Repeat after me: The biggest problem in the Washington game was NOT Laviano. It is true Lkaviano was not great. It is also likely true Laviano may never be able to carry a team. But the biggest problem for RU's offense against Washington was its offensive line performance, followed by the lack of WR skills.

so if the line and WRs are the biggest problem, wouldn't it make sense to start the RB who is strongest in pass protection and the better receiver?

 

[seels2662]

Bingo.

Rettig sounds like a great kid, but this year is now the 3rd consecutive staff that has not put Rettig in as a 1st strong QB ... and if another poster above is correct, that Dare is getting 3rd Team reps, and Rettig is basically the 5th stringer now ... then ... well I do not even know what to say about some people who post on this board about them knowing more than the coaches (though it is true I sometimes do so, I do not do so in an endless litany of complaints).

Repeat after me: The biggest problem in the Washington game was NOT Laviano. It is true Lkaviano was not great. It is also likely true Laviano may never be able to carry a team. But the biggest problem for RU's offense against Washington was its offensive line performance, followed by the lack of WR skills.

Jelly, keeping Laviano in IS the problem, for the exact reasons you said. Having a qb that can run for first downs when things gets bad hides the other issues with the offense. By having Laviano in there that cannot carry the team you have to rely on these weaknesses to succeed.

 

[RUsojo]

I think I will trust the judgment of 3 coaching staffs before I trust a poster who has made a series of idiotic and derogatory comments since the game ended.

The problem is there are no playmakers on offense besides Grant.

 

[RUinPAC10land]

You are such a loser. Luckily there are 20 others just like you on this board. Have fun girls.

You're a winner with all this eloquent name calling! Wow, I used to use these words in middle school too!

 

[Knight Ed]

There is no place for a slow footed guy in this new world. But with the limited time he's played, it does seem like Rettig has a knack for dropping the ball over the wr's shoulder. He did it in almost every game he's played, including the spring game to agudosi.

Obviously QB's have to do a lot more, on and off the field but it's frustrating to watch our offense and think about that arm and the throws against NSU and late against OSU and Wisconsin. It almost seems like getting that on the field is worth whatever negatives come with it because it's just so hard to score if you can't do that. Right now, not only can we not do that, we're not even trying.

How are we going to score four plus TD's required to win a game with only a steady diet of sinks and dunks? We're not.

Re-watch the Spring game if you recorded it. Retting was 2 for 8 on deep balls this year. Just to be blunt he looked like crap in both Spring games he played and for some reason a few people here were really impressed when he threw for 100 yards while the offense was struggling against Norfolk State. Accuracy and touch are weak points for him as well as his feet. That's why 3 coaching staffs in his career have him on the bench and he is currently a fourth string QB here. Rettig simply is not a good QB.
I believe a few years from now there will be a pick up game at the Rettig family Thanksgiving get together. Retting will be still riding the bench in his own back yard and there will be a couple of posters on this board sitting in the grass and complaining how he never got a fair shot.

 

[jellyman]

Jelly, keeping Laviano in IS the problem, for the exact reasons you said. Having a qb that can run for first downs when things gets bad hides the other issues with the offense. By having Laviano in there that cannot carry the team you have to rely on these weaknesses to succeed.

I do not have an answer to that premise (i.e. maybe you are correct, maybe not) ... But I was only referring to Rettig - who is running 4th, or even 5th, string right now. Rettig is not a runner, so is not the answer in my mind.

Maybe Rescigno or Allen provide something different, and important. For the time being, I will trust the coaching staff, who I believe know a lot more about what can make this offense work than you or I.

 

[cicero grimes]

In my opinion the problem comes from transitioning from the pro set to the spread. We don't have the OL or a RB of Ray Rices caliber to really play a pro set. We don't possess the speed or talent to play street ball (spread). Yes, this is a real problem. A really good coaching staff would assess the talent on the team and figure out the best possible offense for them to play. Instead, today's modern coaches create an offensive scheme and then try to mold and recruit players to fit that offense. Three issues, that takes years to implement, a need to recruit elite talent and finally earn your paycheck by coaching up these kids !!!!!

This exactly. BTW If we are committed to the spread should we not be playing the QB of the future, Odin who has spread experience. I think the argument should be if CL continues to struggle do we just burn Odin's redshirt and get him prepared for next season.

 

[chase07470]

Re-watch the Spring game if you recorded it. Retting was 2 for 8 on deep balls this year. Just to be blunt he looked like crap in both Spring games he played and for some reason a few people here were really impressed when he threw for 100 yards while the offense was struggling against Norfolk State. Accuracy and touch are weak points for him as well as his feet. That's why 3 coaching staffs in his career have him on the bench and he is currently a fourth string QB here. Rettig simply is not a good QB.
I believe a few years from now there will be a pick up game at the Rettig family Thanksgiving get together. Retting will be still riding the bench in his own back yard and there will be a couple of posters on this board sitting in the grass and complaining how he never got a fair shot.

I'd take 2-8 with the chance, in some games it might be 4-8. Sure beats zero. Maybe Gio can throw it downfield. Hard to be competitive without some success throwing down field. As I stated, Rettig is too slow for this offense. Should have played last year.

 

[seels2662]

I do not have an answer to that premise (i.e. maybe you are correct, maybe not) ... But I was only referring to Rettig - who is running 4th, or even 5th, string right now. Rettig is not a runner, so is not the answer in my mind.

Maybe Rescigno or Allen provide something different, and important. For the time being, I will trust the coaching staff, who I believe know a lot more about what can make this offense work than you or I.

Yes I agree that Rettig is not the answer. But in my opinion neither is Laviano.

 

[DJ Spanky]

Watching the tide roll away, ooh. Great f-ing song, that.

Dude, when did you leave Georgia?

 

[miketd1]

A legit running threat at QB changes the defensive assignments. The offense gets an extra blocker and forces defenses to at least account for the threat of a triple-option on every play. That in and of itself simplifies defenses, especially when you add tempo.

You're essentially requiring them to play a safety in the box to account for the threat of a QB run. Now you've got one-on-one along the outside -- exactly what you want.

...unless their defenders can handle your receivers 1v1, their DTs get instant pressure up the middle, and/or your QB has problems hitting guys beyond 10 yards.

Now you just have a recipe for a 50-burger...

 

[mildone]

Dude, when did you leave Georgia?

Does anybody ever really leave Georgia?

 

[ru-baby]

New You are such a loser. Luckily there are 20 others just like you on this board. Have fun girls

First, your name calling is juvenile and embarrassing. Second, you know not who you name call and their level of success in any endeavor. Your emotional acting out says quite a bit about you. Lastly, since you don't agree with the position and have no apparent skill set, means or civility to refute, you drop to name calling--"Girls"--really?

Jelly--you are a moderator who posted in this thread--this is (losers-girls) what should pass for debate? Should we note Yeah Baby emotional outbursts that some would attribute to a feminine bent? Is that really what we want here?

 

[cicero grimes]

You are such a loser. Luckily there are 20 others just like you on this board. Have fun girls.

The above is why I post on this board. A high level of discourse and learned and well reasoned debates.

 

[FanuSanu52]

How the heck did you become moderator? The possible thought of going premium has become a little less likely. The other problems argument is pretty weak, dude. Smh

Jellyman is known for one major thing on this forum: in-depth football analysis that shows higher football IQ and more balance than most here. I assume that had something to do with him becoming moderator.

You, too, are now known for one thing on this forum: poor football analysis that shows lower football IQ and more reactionary hysterics than most here.

Jellyman, ftw.

 

[160louis]

I said it last year and I'll say it again " I don't believe Laviano is good enough to get Rutgers to a bowl game". If he doesn't light it up against New Mexico I hope the staff looks at Gio or Allen.

 

[DJ Spanky]

Does anybody ever really leave Georgia?

Well not if you have it on your mind.

 

[knightfan7]

URBAN LEGEND ALERT: (Modern day Justise Hairston as a chronic fumbler)

"What boggles my mind is every coach who has ever coached Rettig has thought he shouldn't get snaps. We're talking about more than three completely different staffs at multiple schools."

What boggles the minds of those who are not trying to defend a position is that this yarn gets perpetuated as proof of a lack of qb skill by the kid. If you actually look at the history it's pretty silly to perpetuate, but it of course is the knee jerk to support a position.

First, he wasn't going to play as a freshman at LSU. Don't believe it was ever in the plans. To say that the staff thought he would never get snaps there is just incorrect. By accounts, the type of O changed and the kid looked for a situation likely where he could get a shot to be the starter (w RU ) and took the opportunity. Last year it was said that he was in a tight competition and he threw td passes in actual games. If you want to use Flood's judgment of playing or not playing him more as a measure of proof well that speaks to the merits of the position. Lastly, we are now trying a spread (although the game v Wash really could have fooled many) and the staff may feel his skill set is not a fit. All of that doesn't mean 3 staffs thought he shouldn't get snaps. There was a move, some very poor judgment and now an O that may be a poor fit.

Considering Laviano's well known skill set and abilities under pressure do I think Rettig could do as well or better with this offense-absolutely. Just the threat of an actual 10+ yard pass would loosen the D.

Would Gio or Allen do better--have no idea but I would like to see the result. This staff clearly wanted to start with experience at qb and ease into the new system.

While that's understandable to a degree, all the talk about competition and all positions being open is feeling like it's perhaps hollow. Muller-a senior got pulled! We had no threat of an O on Saturday FROM THE QB POSITION. Why not pull Laviano and see if one of the others could light a spark if competition truly rules the day? Ash's commnets had led the faityhful to believe that any player -qb included-would be pulled if not performing. THAT IS ONE OF THE REASONS WHY HE HAS HAD SO MUCH SUPPORT AND THE OFF SEASON WENT SO WELL. There was no negativity as the belief was that if Laviano played it was fine-if he did well he would play and that would be great--if he put up 0 td's and lost by more than 30-he would certainly be pulled. That was at leas the understanding I had from all of Ash's comments.

Ash yesterday said that the green jersey work is different from real games-somewhat of an acknowledgement. Could always go back to Laviano for the Howard game and extoll all of his great non pressure passes we will see v inferior competition if another qb got time v Wash. It appears a decision was made to give Laviano until Iowa at least to prove himself. Howard and NM will allow for the statements of a 2-1 qb to be made and yadda yadda about a tough opening day but he has grown etc. That's their choice but don't expect many who have been on board with the true competition mantra not to see this as a disappointment and incongruous with what has been put out.

He left LSU because by the end of the Spring Practice he had dropped behind 2 other underclassman QB's. He was only put in for couple plays at the end during the SG and saw the handwriting on the wall.

 

[knightfan7]

Well not if you have it on your mind.

or if the lights go out.

 

[FanuSanu52]

I said it last year and I'll say it again " I don't believe Laviano is good enough to get Rutgers to a bowl game". If he doesn't light it up against New Mexico I hope the staff looks at Gio or Allen.

You realize Rutgers isn't good enough to get Rutgers to a bowl game, right?