4Real, Would be interesting to know how many folks on your list are RU grads. Maybe add a column? Have to believe alumni would be more likely to stay the course v non-alum. ???
Season Ticket Renewals, Redux
- Thread starter RU4Real
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...with that last paragraph that’s why I just might send in a donation instead...still supporting the program, just not the current direction.
Joe P.
I never made the assumption that the people on this board are "the most loyal". To the contrary, my belief is that the vast majority of the high-dollar donors (and most loyal fans) do not participate on this board.
You'd think...but wouldn't surprise me to learn otherwise with the Rutgers fanbase.
Was not in the original poll but will likely renew 3 of 3 and keep parking. Some of the overall group attrition occurred in prior years after a high of 8 (and 2 pkg passes) in 2014 entering the B1G. Was down to 5 in 2017 and down again to 3 this past year.
I’m renewing all 5 and 2 Yellow passes. I qualify for Scarlet but love Yellow. The rest of my friends/tailgate crew in 124 (another 7) are renewing as well. I plan to call my rep to see if we can get moved all together closer to the 50. Would be tough to move since we have had these seats since ‘94. If we move, I thank all the people not renewing here.
Had to edit the first sentence to "Nobody is NOT a real fan." We are all real fans.
Hope that Hobbs and the rest of athletics are aware of the UConn situation. Many people scoff at UConn, but we were in similar places before the invite to the B1G.
https://www.courant.com/sports/uconn-football/hc-sp-uconn-football-attendance-20180828-story.html
UConn's season Ticket sales (which includes comps)
2005: 32,500
2010: 27,500 (Fiesta Bowl Season)
2011: 26,000
2017: 16,000
2018: 13,000 (-15% from 2017, -53% from 2010).
Asked recently about declining attendance, UConn athletic director David Benedict said the problem begins with the team’s recent win-loss record.
“The easy answer is winning or the lack thereof,” Benedict said. “It’s been since 2011 that we’ve had a winning season in football, so I think that wears on a fanbase.”
UConn W-L records:
2011: 5-7
2012: 5-7
2013: 3-9
2014: 2-10
2015: 6-7
2016: 3-9
2017: 3-9
2018: 1-11
RU W-L, (season tickets):
2014: 8-5
2015: 4-8 (31,168)
2016: 2-10 (28,478)
2017: 4-8 (23,812)
2018:1-11 (22,337)
2019: -Can definitely see a decline of another 5,000 (or more) similar to the 2016 to 2017 decline, unless the fans left have a greater endurance for pain because they have already hung on?
https://www.nj.com/rutgersfootball/...ook_at_rutgers_sagging_ticket_sales_as_s.html
On top of the losing, the article linked above shows even though on the rebound, Kentucky saw a 10% decline in season tickets in 2018 to 29,000. Florida saw a 9,000 seat decline going into 2018 after a 4-7 season.
This board has discussed the cost of lost season tickets--assuming each season ticket is worth an average $350 (not including parking and money spent at stadium), it tickets decline another 5,000 tickets, Rutgers athletics will have a decline of at least 10,000 tickets while Ash has been head coach, equal to $3,500,000/season in lost ticket sales.
This is the mentality that will never allow us to get to a higher level and a mentality I just cannot understand. Fans are not owed a BIG ten winning program. Fans need to sacrifice to get us there ( yeah yeah yeah... youve sacrificed for 30 years blaah blaah blaaah) So have I. It sucks not winning. I know more than most here. But the only way to get there and to stay there is to build a financial pipeline that continues to grow. You would think the most passionate fans would understand this and want to help support that goal if they were financially able to do it. But I guess living in a blue state with a large majority of people expecting the Govt and the University to pay for the things we feel we are owed , maybe that is just the mentality of the people around here. In my mind it is you get what you pay for and if your hands are staying in your pockets we aint never gonna get there.
Wow- excellent, excellent post, and what anybody looking to ‘shame’ anyone else for their decision needs to keep in mind before they open their mouths. Attendance and recruiting IMO are usually lagging indicators that take a season or two to catch up to actual performance. It’s why many struggling franchises sometimes don’t see the forest through the trees. Advanced ticket sales for the average live sporting event is typically sold on ‘old results’/ the results at the time of sale- not the status at the time the event rolls around, which is why our 4-8 2010 season outdrew our 9-4 bowl-winning season in 2011, and one of the reasons why our 4-8 2015 season probably had higher season ticket sales than previous bowl seasons (with of course the B1G invite playing a huge reason as well).
...one thing seems abundantly clear looking at our numbers: regardless of conference, the fan base has little interest in watching ‘name’ programs kick the crap out of us. We already played that game from 1996-2002; we’re not interested in any potential sequel.
Joe P.
Fans are not ‘owed’ a winning program..and programs are not ‘owed’ fans. You seem to refuse to recognize it’s a two-way street and want to take the easy way out by playing the blame game. Not buying season tickets doesn’t mean people don’t support Rutgers in other ways. I’d rather just send in a donation to Rutgers Football than buy tickets at this point.
Joe P.
Not to be snarky, but would you really send a check to the Rutgers Football program if you didn't buy season tickets? The answer is no for most people. And that is why Slyker is correct. We just don't have loyal fans/alumni like the other B1G programs.
...has Rutgers Football produced the same results as other B1G (now peer) programs? ...chicken/egg, chicken/egg, chicken/egg...again, seem to be content on blaming the fans for everything. Give us even a Citrus Bowl season and your point would hold more water...but it doesn’t explain how Temple basically spends the same amount of $$$ on their HC’s that we do. I guess all those TU fans just fork over cash by the handful along with that super-lucrative AAC contract and sweet on-campus stadium they have.
..when someone can explain that last point to me, I’ll listen. Until then, you’re not going to convince me Rutgers does it’s job in supporting Rutgers Football or meeting their fans halfway.
Joe P.
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You are a complete idiot. Who are you to bash Rutgers fans for making personal decisions about how the want to spend their free time and money? Than to top it off you bring politics into it an accuse all these people, you don't even know, that they looking for handouts. You are deranged.
Whether the School is doing its part or not is not the point. If you are a fan and you stopped financial support, you are a large part of the problem - and not doing anything to help achieve what we all want. Sitting by the side complaining about what the admin did not do isn't helping anything ... it is probably actually making matters worse, by creating a more negative atmosphere among potential donation sources (future fans) who might read these boards full of bitching and moaning.
...are you for real with this??? That’s literately half the equation. That’s like saying ‘that other person who lives in your house who is smashing things with a hammer and clogging all the toilets is not the point; why did you stop your home improvement efforts??’
Joe P.
In short. You will only buy tickets/support the program if we win. Got it.
Good post. For me this was a personal decision on how to spend my money and my time. While I love my tailgate crew and rarely see them outside of RU sporting events, there have been too many times where it felt like a chore to wake up early on a Saturday morning and cart the kids (who became increasingly resistant to going) to a game for which you knew we were going to lose, the only question was by how much. The tailgate has been the highlight of the show for most of the Flood/Ash era. Throw in conflicting kids sporting obligations, a demanding job and a desire to travel more with the family and the decision became clear to me. I'll still pick a game or two to attend and I'll roll the dice that at least for the foreseeable future, secondary market prices will be much lower than what I was previously paying. While my primary motivation for dropping tickets was not to send a message, the fact remains I wouldn't have arrived at this decision if the product on the field was any good.
Very poor assumption on your part, especially since we’ve had 4 straight losing seasons, 2 with double-digit losses...gotta love broad-sweeping generalizations...what is it with yours and slyker’s almost-maniacal efforts to avoid admitting Rutgers as an institution has responsibility here?
Instead of trying to denigrate me, why don’t you try answering the Temple question...how does TU spend the same and/or more on a HC than we do?
Joe P.
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I was out then and I am out now. From a peak of 17 Tix to 6 to 0
How do you figure that. Certainly you can be loyal without donating, and you can donate without being loyal, but I would assume there is a high correlation between donating and loyalty. I would think that loyal fans are more likely to donate than those who are not loyal.
Purdue is probably a good case study too. Hard to find data. But here is a link for the optimists. Assuming Ash does not turn it around and is fired, perhaps we can get new fans on board quickly.
The season after Brohm was hired, they saw 4,000 new season ticket sales with just one week before season ticket sales closed. But even so, Purdue is way below RU in season ticket sales:
Last year, Purdue sold just over 14,000 season tickets (not counting the students), which was 2,000 more than they sold in 2016. Soak that in:
Purdue Season Tickets Sold (57,236 Capacity):
2016: 12,000
2017: 14,000
2018: 19,000 (as of July 10, 2018)
https://www.hammerandrails.com/football/2018/4/23/17272460/purdue-football-ticket-sales-rising
So what’s driving the surge in ticket sales? It’s two factors: renewed excitement in Purdue football and a good home schedule. Unless you’ve been under a rock since September 1st, you know that there’s a renewed energy surrounding the football team after a bowl win and returning The Bucket back to its proper home in West Lafayette. This has without a doubt driven a majority of the new ticket sales.
Graphic not showing up, here is a link:
https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/rsO...horus_asset/file/10705403/attendance_2017.png
Purdue W-L (attendance estimated from graph above)
Note there is a one year lag in attendance decline vs. W-L record.
2006: 8-6 (55,000)
2007: 8-5 (58,000)
2008: 4-8 (56,000)
2009: 5-7 (51,000) new coach Hope
2010: 4-8 (48,000)
2011: 7-6 (46,000)
2012: 6-6 (44,000)
2013: 1-11 (48,000) new coach Hazell
2014: 3-9 (36,000)
2015: 2-10 (37,000)
2016: 3-9 (35,000)
2017: 7-6 (48,000) new coach Brohm
2018: 6-7 (51,120)
https://www.purdueexponent.org/sports/article_f58ee572-0929-5d56-97d7-360a97aa3b0d.html
According to the data, Purdue has already seen over 5,300 new season tickets as well as a 91 percent renewal rate from 2017 holders.
During the 2017 season, Purdue’s overall football attendance increased by more than 13,000 fans per game and its revenue increased by $2.5 million compared to 2016, according to reporting from the Indianapolis Star.
Purdue’s attendance increase was an outlier for college football last year with nationwide college football attendance down 1,409 fans per game. However, with the new direction Purdue football has taken in the past year under new head coach Jeff Brohm, the team looks to continue its new trend in attendance.
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@RU4Real should send the links above, the graph and bolded part above to someone in athletics. And send them again if Ash falters at the beginning of the season. Purdue's $2.5 million has the cost per additional fan at $192, or for 7 games, $27/game. That probably includes comps and student tickets.
If our attendance (season and total ticket) falters like Purdue, RU athletics is losing a minimum of $2.5 million. By firing Ash, that could be potentially easily recovered by hiring a new coach who generates some excitement like Brohm did. You have to spend money to make money.
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The idea that you would “blah, blah, blah” people being fans for decades undermines your whole argument.
I don’t think Rutgers owes me a winning program, but I also don’t think what will put the program over the top is my giving them another couple of thousand dollars after the roughly $40-50,000 I have spent on Rutgers football over the years didn’t.
I have heard it say that you really know a relationship is over not when there is fighting, but when there is apathy. The decision to keep Ash has made me more apathetic, and I have other things to spend my money on that I care more about.
I respectfully disagree. And I think you are being condescending to the fans who have had enough of the bullshit coaching job by Ash and his predecessor. What's the mentality of the people in West Lafayette? Seems a lot like ours, and last time I checked they are not a blue state, as if that has anything to do with anything here.
So I’m an outlier, I guess. My plan was to drop my seats on the 40 yd line and buy one ticket in non-priority section to keep my points. After thinking about it more I decided to just go ahead and drop altogether. However, my seat mate opted to “buy” my tickets for the year in the hopes that I’ll come back on board in 2020. As for 2019, he plans to use my seats for his family and friends, and I assume I’ll get the tickets for a couple games.
Depends on if the team makes any appearances.
18 sports for one.
And not having to take care of an on campus facility for two.
That’s just off the top of my head.
I'm curious what was said by the rep in response to your 150th comment. Was it just that you get a replica statue for renewing or did the rep preview at all about any planned events/activities?
Basically that he wasn't aware there may be an issue with not having a game. I prefaced my comments to him that I realized he had nothing to do with it. I asked if they ever pass on comments. Didn't sound like they do anything but note it in the account so I let it go.
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