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Time for the B1G to make a play for Notre Dame

Ash_Hole

Ash_Hole

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Sep 8, 2019
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SEC shook the entire football landscape when they went to 16 with Texas & Oklahoma. Both programs are listed in the top 5 of most valuable college sports entities.

BIG’s counter? A lame scheduling alliance that puts us on the same footing as two lesser conferences.

At the same time, Notre Dame received a wake-up call yesterday. Brian Kelly saw the writing on the wall, and went for the boatloads of money in the SEC. Better matchups, better NIL, better TV deals, better recruiting. All while, ND’s viewership has cratered 48% in a year in which they are a top 10 team.

We all know Notre Dame’s smugness about being independent, but sometimes, it’s about recognizing what is best for both parties.

SEC isn’t stopping at 16, they want to be the NFL of college football. They want to run the NIL game. And the B1G conference is the only legitimate bulwark to that happening.

Do we really think Nebraska wouldn’t entertain jumping at the opportunity to rejoin Texas, Oklahoma, Texas A&M, and Missouri?

If it takes B1G expanding out west (ie USC, Stanford, UCLA, Oregon, etc) then so be it. Pods work and can maintain our division — the math works.

Create the ultimate academic league steeped with traditions & history in direct competition to the jock league.

But at this moment, when ND seems to have take a step back on the national stage, Kevin Warren should at least be having conversations…
 
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From all indications over many years and several invites by the Big Ten, the Big Ten is one of the last conferences that they will join.
 
WhiteBus said:
From all indications over many years and several invites by the Big Ten, the Big Ten is one of the last conferences that they will join.
Click to expand...

My question is, does their sanctimoniousness leave them with enough depth to get through either a B1G or SEC schedule? With "recovery" games with the lesser teams on their independent schedule they never face the week in/week out grind of facing a trio of teams like OSU, UM and MSU in 3 consecutive weeks.
 
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mdk01 said:
My question is, does their sanctimoniousness leave them with enough depth to get through either a B1G or SEC schedule? With "recovery" games with the lesser teams on their independent schedule they never face the week in/week out grind of facing a trio of teams like OSU, UM and MSU in 3 consecutive weeks.
Click to expand...
Simple answer is no. See this year's Cincinnati game. At home!
 
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According to the ACC, the hybrid deal ND signed with the ACC specifies that if they join a conference before the deal runs out in 2036, it has to be the ACC.

Contracts can be broken, but I am sure any damages would be significant. Then you have to consider that the B1G has a leader who prefers to not expand when it is advantageous for the B1G and instead give the SEC time to absorb OU and Texas before they start working on their next raid.
 
mdk01 said:
My question is, does their sanctimoniousness leave them with enough depth to get through either a B1G or SEC schedule? With "recovery" games with the lesser teams on their independent schedule they never face the week in/week out grind of facing a trio of teams like OSU, UM and MSU in 3 consecutive weeks.
Click to expand...

They only have the record they do (as well as the wins of the last few years) because they have been playing half their games against the very weak ACC. Against OSU. Michigan, MSU, Iowa, or PSU, year in and out? They will be 7-5 every year, if that.
 
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Re: ACC Grant of Rights.
1) A GOR didn’t stop Texas or Oklahoma
2) Notre Dame’s GOR with ACC must have a thousand different backout clauses because ND added more to ACC at time of deal
3) Not a hard legal argument when they’re not even in a member of the league
4) Estimated to be $50-$100m for any ACC team to leave GOR in legal fees. Hefty, for sure, but not necessarily impossible when B1G’s paying teams a lot more per year

Not saying it’s likely, but just making the case that it’s possible — which refutes some
opinions above saying it’s absolutely impossible.

Notre Dame is only big whale left on the table (besides Pac-12) so I just hope B1G at all times is thinking ahead. And everrrrything is about timing. Few thought Texas and Oklahoma
would ever leave, but NIL deals and college football playoff negotiations freaked them out at the exact right time.

ND losing their star coach to the SEC, while having abysmal viewership numbers, may be the exact right time.

As others have mentioned though, Kevin Warren should just stop being Mr. Nice Guy, and grab 2-6 Pac-12 teams.
1) That will only help Notre Dame to want to join in future
2) Add new timezone markets for television
3) Recruit coast to coast
4) Big TV markets for NIL deals

I just share the opinion as many others here that we’re slow to react and could get left out in the cold. As an example, if Michigan loses this week, it’ll be another year that the B1G is not represented in the playoff. Adding more teams statistically gives you a better chance that it’ll never happen (another reason SEC did it), gives you more times for an expanded playoffs, and you hope gives you better quality teams at the top.
 
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Ash_Hole said:
SEC shook the entire football landscape when they went to 16 with Texas & Oklahoma. Both programs are listed in the top 5 of most valuable college sports entities.

BIG’s counter? A lame scheduling alliance that puts us on the same footing as two lesser conferences.

At the same time, Notre Dame received a wake-up call yesterday. Brian Kelly saw the writing on the wall, and went for the boatloads of money in the SEC. Better matchups, better NIL, better TV deals, better recruiting. All while, ND’s viewership has cratered 48% in a year in which they are a top 10 team.

We all know Notre Dame’s smugness about being independent, but sometimes, it’s about recognizing what is best for both parties.

SEC isn’t stopping at 16, they want to be the NFL of college football. They want to run the NIL game. And the B1G conference is the only legitimate bulwark to that happening.

Do we really think Nebraska wouldn’t entertain jumping at the opportunity to rejoin Texas, Oklahoma, Texas A&M, and Missouri?

If it takes B1G expanding out west (ie USC, Stanford, UCLA, Oregon, etc) then so be it. Pods work and can maintain our division — the math works.

Create the ultimate academic league steeped with traditions & history in direct competition to the jock league.

But at this moment, when ND seems to have take a step back on the national stage, Kevin Warren should at least be having conversations…
Click to expand...
You keep saying the Big Ten should keep adding teams like ND and multiple PAC12 teams. You are wrong that the math works. Each new school needs to generate well over $55 million in media on their own to make the addition financially sound. Otherwise the current schools would have to take a pay cut to support the new ones. Notre Dame is losing fans in an alarming way. Their exclusive home TV contract provides $15 million and NBC is taking a bath on it this year.
 
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WhiteBus said:
You keep saying the Big Ten should keep adding teams like ND and multiple PAC12 teams. You are wrong that the math works. Each new school needs to generate well over $55 million in media on their own to make the addition financially sound. Otherwise the current schools would have to take a pay cut to support the new ones. Notre Dame is losing fans in an alarming way. Their exclusive home TV contract provides $15 million and NBC is taking a bath on it this year.
Click to expand...
Posted this in the TV ratings thread.
Also ND got 22 million in tv money in 2019. I posted an article on that too in one of these threads.



Looks like ND tv ratings taking a hit this year. Article is paywall but you the gist from this teaser blurb.

Notre Dame football lost nearly half its TV audience from last season. Viewership for the Fighting Irish’s games on NBC is down 48% from '20, averaging 2.5 million viewers. Last season, Notre Dame games on NBC averaged 4.8 million viewers. No Irish game this season drew more than 4 million....

NBC sees significant drop in Notre Dame football TV audience​

 
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rutgersguy1 said:
Posted this in the TV ratings thread.
Also ND got 22 million in tv money in 2019. I posted an article on that too in one of these threads.



Looks like ND tv ratings taking a hit this year. Article is paywall but you the gist from this teaser blurb.

Notre Dame football lost nearly half its TV audience from last season. Viewership for the Fighting Irish’s games on NBC is down 48% from '20, averaging 2.5 million viewers. Last season, Notre Dame games on NBC averaged 4.8 million viewers. No Irish game this season drew more than 4 million....

NBC sees significant drop in Notre Dame football TV audience​

Click to expand...
Cuz they played these cupcake teams…
 
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There won’t be any movement with ND at least until ACC GOR is near expiration. Anyone can say it doesn’t matter but I see no examples proving that. Texas/OU are still in the B12 and as of now no news on just how early they may leave despite what people assume. And when they do it’s going to cost them a ton. Plus they announced their departure with about 4 years left on the GOR (which is about two years earlier than I might have expected) but the ACC GOR still has 15 years on it out til 2036. Nothing will likely happen until at earliest a few years before that.

I’m not even saying something will happen but if it does that’s the earliest it can.
 
Last edited:
rutgersguy1 said:
Posted this in the TV ratings thread.
Also ND got 22 million in tv money in 2019. I posted an article on that too in one of these threads.



Looks like ND tv ratings taking a hit this year. Article is paywall but you the gist from this teaser blurb.

Notre Dame football lost nearly half its TV audience from last season. Viewership for the Fighting Irish’s games on NBC is down 48% from '20, averaging 2.5 million viewers. Last season, Notre Dame games on NBC averaged 4.8 million viewers. No Irish game this season drew more than 4 million....

NBC sees significant drop in Notre Dame football TV audience​

Click to expand...
I think the only thing that would move the needle on Notre Dame's leadership going all in for any conference would be NBC pulling the plug on the weekly over the air broadcasts.

Perhaps Football leadership saying the only route to the National Championship is through a conference. That is what the ACC flirtation is about, providing a landing strip if that comes to pass.

Do we want them in B1G? Maybe, but if they are so undesirable as a TV property that NBC drops 'em - what are they going to deliver to BTN/Fox?

I'm ok if they go all in with the ACC. I think we (B1G & RU) will be ok.
 
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srru86 said:
I think the only thing that would move the needle on Notre Dame's leadership going all in for any conference would be NBC pulling the plug on the weekly over the air broadcasts.

Perhaps Football leadership saying the only route to the National Championship is through a conference. That is what the ACC flirtation is about, providing a landing strip if that comes to pass.

Do we want them in B1G? Maybe, but if they are so undesirable as a TV property that NBC drops 'em - what are they going to deliver to BTN/Fox?

I'm ok if they go all in with the ACC. I think we (B1G & RU) will be ok.
Click to expand...
Their playoff route is fine especially when they expand. CFP meetings going on today for that.

The only thing that would make them join a conference (ACC/B10) is if they don't have a stable home for their sports. ACC GOR expiration is when that possibly could happen if the B10 wanted to poach some schools but who knows what the plan is with that. But as long as they have a stable home for their sports I don't think they join any conference.

They've got plenty of money, they don't need any really to bend over backwards for it. As per an article I posted in one of these threads, the B10 made like 43M in tv money in 2019 and ND 22M...it doesn't make any difference to them. I think they're fine.

As to do we want them in the B10, hypothetically speaking. Heck yes. They are arguably the best brand out there and still can draw plenty of eyeballs (despite this last season), especially pitted against teams like Michigan, OSU, PSU, MSU, Nebraska, Wisconsin and even old rival Purdue. The B10 tv deals would balloon even more than they already will.
 
rutgersguy1 said:
the B10 made like 43M in tv money in 2019 and ND 22M...it doesn't make any difference to them. I think they're fine.
Click to expand...
If NBC says "We're out, Saturday afternoons we'll be broadcasting eSports competitions" you think ND is Ok with $22 million dollar hit? That's a bunch of extra passes of the old collection plate.

I know it's unlikely, just that some strange and unexpected stuff has gone down.
 
Notre Dame and Missouri.. get it done.. finger to the SEC.. or how about this.. take the ENTIRE ACC.. none of them would have to pay GOR stuff because the conference would dissolve while the movers and shakers would come over to the Big Ten offices in some capacity.. and those offices relocated someplace more central (though with everyone at that level flying.. Chicago is as convenient as anywhere else.. just that it is becoming a hellhole so perfect excuse to move..)
 
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srru86 said:
If NBC says "We're out, Saturday afternoons we'll be broadcasting eSports competitions" you think ND is Ok with $22 million dollar hit? That's a bunch of extra passes of the old collection plate.

I know it's unlikely, just that some strange and unexpected stuff has gone down.
Click to expand...
CBS can snatch them up then, they just lost the SEC lol. There will always be a home somewhere for their games.
 
ND is structured to join the ACC if need be, but with playoffs expansion moving to at least 8, the benefits of needing a conference championship for ND to get into a four team playoff limits the impetus.

From a college profile and cultural fit, the BiG makes sense. From all other aspects, this discussion is moot.
 
srru86 said:
If NBC says "We're out, Saturday afternoons we'll be broadcasting eSports competitions" you think ND is Ok with $22 million dollar hit? That's a bunch of extra passes of the old collection plate.

I know it's unlikely, just that some strange and unexpected stuff has gone down.
Click to expand...
For the geographic footprint alone I wanted Mizzou instead of Nebraska.

And I’ll settle for ND while we’re at it.😉
 
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srru86 said:
Now that is a road trip I could endorse.
Click to expand...
Right? That would be the favorite away game for everybody in the Big Ten (well, every fanbase, at least - not sure the schools admins would like it so much).
 
Ash_Hole said:
Re: ACC Grant of Rights.
1) A GOR didn’t stop Texas or Oklahoma
2) Notre Dame’s GOR with ACC must have a thousand different backout clauses because ND added more to ACC at time of deal
3) Not a hard legal argument when they’re not even in a member of the league
4) Estimated to be $50-$100m for any ACC team to leave GOR in legal fees. Hefty, for sure, but not necessarily impossible when B1G’s paying teams a lot more per year

Not saying it’s likely, but just making the case that it’s possible — which refutes some
opinions above saying it’s absolutely impossible.

Notre Dame is only big whale left on the table (besides Pac-12) so I just hope B1G at all times is thinking ahead. And everrrrything is about timing. Few thought Texas and Oklahoma
would ever leave, but NIL deals and college football playoff negotiations freaked them out at the exact right time.

ND losing their star coach to the SEC, while having abysmal viewership numbers, may be the exact right time.

As others have mentioned though, Kevin Warren should just stop being Mr. Nice Guy, and grab 2-6 Pac-12 teams.
1) That will only help Notre Dame to want to join in future
2) Add new timezone markets for television
3) Recruit coast to coast
4) Big TV markets for NIL deals

I just share the opinion as many others here that we’re slow to react and could get left out in the cold. As an example, if Michigan loses this week, it’ll be another year that the B1G is not represented in the playoff. Adding more teams statistically gives you a better chance that it’ll never happen (another reason SEC did it), gives you more times for an expanded playoffs, and you hope gives you better quality teams at the top.
Click to expand...
Your very first statement is false. The GOR DID stop Texas and Oklahoma from leaving the Big 12 prior to the expiration of the GOR. The GOR expires in 2025. TX and OK enter the SEC in 2025-26. That is not mere coincidence.

In fact, the TX and OK announcement was that they would not be extending the GOR beyond its 2025 expiration. That very wording is evidence that both schools are honoring the GOR currently in place.
 
rutgersguy1 said:
Posted this in the TV ratings thread.
Also ND got 22 million in tv money in 2019. I posted an article on that too in one of these threads.



Looks like ND tv ratings taking a hit this year. Article is paywall but you the gist from this teaser blurb.

Notre Dame football lost nearly half its TV audience from last season. Viewership for the Fighting Irish’s games on NBC is down 48% from '20, averaging 2.5 million viewers. Last season, Notre Dame games on NBC averaged 4.8 million viewers. No Irish game this season drew more than 4 million....

NBC sees significant drop in Notre Dame football TV audience​

Click to expand...

ND is finding out the downside of watering down their schedule for Kelly. Sure, more wins but the downside is they end up with a bunch of crappy games on NBC. Throw in USC sucking (although they should be better going forward) and ND had a truly awful home slate this year. Cincy was a good game and team but Cincy isn't pulling in eyeballs. It's no surprise that ND's ratings pale in comparison to your typical Saturday CBS game where they get to choose the best game in the SEC, for example, and ND is stuck playing Toledo on national TV. Even as a ND fan, I sometimes struggle to stay engaged in some of the home broadcasts given the quality of opponent.
 
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Ty Webb said:
ND is finding out the downside of watering down their schedule for Kelly. Sure, more wins but the downside is they end up with a bunch of crappy games on NBC. Throw in USC sucking (although they should be better going forward) and ND had a truly awful home slate this year. Cincy was a good game and team but Cincy isn't pulling in eyeballs. It's no surprise that ND's ratings pale in comparison to your typical Saturday CBS game where they get to choose the best game in the SEC, for example, and ND is stuck playing Toledo on national TV. Even as a ND fan, I sometimes struggle to stay engaged in some of the home broadcasts given the quality of opponent.
Click to expand...

Those watered down schedules got them into 2 playoffs, where they discovered reality.
 
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If the BIG should do anything vis a vis ND it is to simply make an agreement with the PAC 12 not to schedule any game with ND. Then sit back and watch ND die on the vine while proudly holding on to their Indy status.
 
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