Ace and Dylan Top 3? Sorry. Don’t see it…

[rufeelinit]

Earlier in the year I was very impressed with how effortlessly DH seemed to be able to play high level basketball. More recently, I am not sure the same level of effort is there. Maybe he is still dealing with injuries, but he like many others doesn't seem to be busting it to get up off the floor after an unsuccessful drive to the hoop to get back on defense.

And BTW why are we always on the floor after driving to the hoops? I don't think this just an RU issue but this trolling for fouls should be discouraged.

Ace always struck me as a less finished product who needed good coaching to further develop his basketball fundamentals and decision making. I thought he would get better and more consistent as the year progressed. He is still wildly inconsistent and makes poor decisions but just keeps smiling because he knows there are no consequences.

Pike has catered to these guys all year. JWill is another who seems to be way too nonchalant and ready to flash a smile regardless whether he made a crazy shot or turned it over once again. We will know how bad the state of the program is if he back again next year.

 

[Mr Magoo]

Earlier in the year I was very impressed with how effortlessly DH seemed to be able to play high level basketball. More recently, I am not sure the same level of effort is there. Maybe he is still dealing with injuries, but he like many others doesn't seem to be busting it to get up off the floor after an unsuccessful drive to the hoop to get back on defense.

And BTW why are we always on the floor after driving to the hoops? I don't think this just an RU issue but this trolling for fouls should be discouraged.

Ace always struck me as a less finished product who needed good coaching to further develop his basketball fundamentals and decision making. I thought he would get better and more consistent as the year progressed. He is still wildly inconsistent and makes poor decisions but just keeps smiling because he knows there are no consequences.

Pike has catered to these guys all year. JWill is another who seems to be way too nonchalant and ready to flash a smile regardless whether he made a crazy shot or turned it over once again. We will know how bad the state of the program is if he back again next year.

I believe JWill is out of eligibility…and that’s a good thing.

 

[rufeelinit]

I believe JWill is out of eligibility…and that’s a good thing.

I hope you are right and would have thought the same, but I thought I read in one of these threads that he has one more year.

 

[RUbacker]

Wait until the “Rutgers staff didn’t know what to do with them” comments come out around draft time.

huge hit against our program coming

 

[RUJMM78]

Harper and Bailey stated they came to Rutgers to win a national championship.Once the non conference games were over it was readily apparent that goal wasn't happening.Even in games Rutgers won the team performance wasn't impressive.B1G Ten opponents quickly realized Rutgers was a flawed team on defense and totally dependent on Bailey and Harper for high double digit scoring.While Rutgers scored over 70 points a game they still had scoring droughts and the defense allowed far too many uncontested layups and wide open 3 point shots.Health issues to Bailey and Harper put added pressure on the rest of the team to overachieve,In some games players did have outstanding performances but there was no consistency game to game.As the season nears completion team motivation is gone and so is the fan dreams of watching Rutgers successfully compete in the NCAA Tournament.

 

[biazza38]

It’s fun watching our fan base constantly turn on the two best players on the team and not the people built who the roster. Our team is laughably bad

 

[zappaa]

Exposure to the best coaches, trainers and competition in the world will change that over time. Their level of athletic and basketball-skills potential is unlimited. They are unfinished canvasses waiting to become masterpieces.

Ace has a poor handle and it’s even worse at speed, I don’t know if you can teach that.

 

[AshCatchEm]

Pike keep poisoning aces skills enough that he's gonna drop in the draft

 

[Pils86]

Best truthful post ever. But will they be Top 3???

I say no, even if Coop stays at Duke.

 

[biazza38]

our fanbase is so ignorant

 

[Pils86]

Ace has a poor handle and it’s even worse at speed, I don’t know if you can teach that.

Hate to agree but he does seem to lose control a lot when driving with his right hand, not even sure if he can drive while dribbling with left.

 

[zappaa]

It’s fun watching our fan base constantly turn on the two best players on the team and not the people built who the roster. Our team is laughably bad

If you criticize the people who built the roster, you hear Pike isn’t missing the open shots and you’re not allowed to whine because you don’t contribute to NIL (Incredibly people on this board somehow know if you contribute)

 

[Mholinko]

Anyone saying they aren’t top 3 picks don’t really understand the draft and don’t know what the nba is looking for

If you’re using your eyes and saying okay these aren’t the 2nd and 3rd best PLAYERS in college then you’re correct

Those are guys like Johnni Broome, Mark Sears, Ryan Kalkbrenner, Zakai Ziegler etc

Upperclassmen who will be happy to be drafted anytime in round 1 if at all

The draft is more on potential and cieling and traits than any other professional draft and in that regard they are both easily top 5-6 prospects if not top 3 … it doesn’t always translate to wins

Zach Edey was barely a lottery pick and was a dominant college player

 

[seansherm]

This OP comes up on a night that Casey Jacobson (before I turned game off with 10 left) was constantly saying that Ace is the one guy that can unseat Flagg for #1 and yet RU fans are all he's not top pick, blah, blah, blah. Ace is probably a higher pick than Dylan. His ceiling has always been much higher, just like Dylan was always more ready for college. Dylan is finding that the lane isn't so open against talented teams, and he isn't a great outside shooter.

 

[Mholinko]

This OP comes up on a night that Casey Jacobson (before I turned game off with 10 left) was constantly saying that Ace is the one guy that can unseat Flagg for #1 and yet RU fans are all he's not top pick, blah, blah, blah. Ace is probably a higher pick than Dylan. His ceiling has always been much higher, just like Dylan was always more ready for college. Dylan is finding that the lane isn't so open against talented teams, and he isn't a great outside shooter.

He’s been scouted and now everyone knows he needs to work on his jumper to take the step to elite

 

[seansherm]

He’s been scouted and now everyone knows he needs to work on his jumper to take the step to elite

Yeah. It's funny too, his jumper has actually been a little better than I was expecting.

 

[Erial_Lion]

I believe JWill is out of eligibility…and that’s a good thing.

He’s got one more year.

2021 - COVID year
2022 - year 1
2023 - redshirt
2024 - year 2
2025 - year 3

 

[NY AGENTMAN]

He’s been scouted and now everyone knows he needs to work on his jumper to take the step to elite

It must be a weak draft if Harper and Ace are 2-3. Ace had the ability if u play in a league with no D (NBA) and Harper is good going to the hoop but needs to work on his shot and handle! These guys would be mid 1st rounders in a decent draft

 

[zappaa]

This OP comes up on a night that Casey Jacobson (before I turned game off with 10 left) was constantly saying that Ace is the one guy that can unseat Flagg for #1 and yet RU fans are all he's not top pick, blah, blah, blah. Ace is probably a higher pick than Dylan. His ceiling has always been much higher, just like Dylan was always more ready for college. Dylan is finding that the lane isn't so open against talented teams, and he isn't a great outside shooter.

The fanbase would like to go 500 and qualify for the conference tournament with two top 5 lottery picks.
The hype from experts warranted those expectations.
When you have to defend your best players with talk of high ceilings and potential you know you’re having an awful season

 

[seansherm]

The fanbase would like to go 500 and qualify for the conference tournament with two top 5 lottery picks.
The hype from experts warranted those expectations.
When you have to defend your best players with talk of high ceilings and potential you know you’re having an awful season

I mean, you of most here, should known what was coming on a team expected to be led by freshman. No veteran leadership - I was killed all offseason saying JWill showed me no leadership qualities last year. No emphasis on the defensive end of the court in team building.

The expectations are fan induced. I expected a bubble team, but really aren't surprised by any of this. Pike abandoned his defense first culture. I actually thought he abandoned it last year, but he got that team to be decent defensively.

 

[rufeelinit]

It’s fun watching our fan base constantly turn on the two best players on the team and not the people built who the roster. Our team is laughably bad

Sounds like you are doing some very selective reading or just don’t like this thread which is focused on DH and AB. This board is flooded with other threads critical of the roster in general or specific supporting players who have not either met expectations or were not good enough to begin with.

To be clear the real problem starts at the top of the program not any individual player.

 

[hinson32]

Ace couldn’t be more inconsistent. Very poor handle… very.
Dylan seemingly peaked and is not the player he was…. Injury lingered?

There’s many more players, even 2 freshman, better AT THIS STAGE.

I can’t see a franchise taking a chance on the “potential” of Ace with that high in the draft in all honesty.

Prove me wrong.

Well your drafting record is pretty impressive. Most scouts say you have a good eye for talent.

 

[Miggins]

They can develop their shot in the NBA. Hakeem Olajuwon couldn’t shoot and was not a great free throw shooter when he left college and improved his shot, developed that sweet Hakeem shake jumper and an MVP level offensive game. Magic Johnson couldn’t shoot a jumper when he entered the league, he worked at it and developed a good outside shot. LeBron was not the greatest outside shooter when he entered the league, first year in the league he shot 29% from 3, last year he shot 41%, this year 40%. These guys work and work and work at developing their shot. If Dylan is going to be as good as they say in the league, he will need to do the same and work at developing his outside shot. He is more than capable, but do agree with you that he needs to improve his outside shot. The greats work at it and develop, time will tell if Dylan can do the same and be one of the greats.

Agree he CAN develop just would be worried if I am a GM picking that high. The other guys you mention were all dominant physical players who even without a good outside shot would be very good NBA players, very high floors. Dylan without an outside shot? Is he going be be able to penetrate and score in the NBA especially if the defender does not have to respect his outside shot?

I think it is quite possible he can be a good NBA player.

Also possible he he a low floor as well

 

[BIGRUBIGDBIGredmachine]

I'm not sure Dylan is going to be a top PG in the NBA, I can see him developing into a really good 2G. I expect Ace will be a heckuva shooter in an NBA offense that gets him the ball in better position to catch and shoot. He'll get stronger too and help his drives in traffic.

 

[SBP]

Well your drafting record is pretty impressive. Most scouts say you have a good eye for talent.

Will see I guess

 

[B0ski]

Pike caught lightning in a bottle with these two but has shite the bed coaching them. What highly ranked recruits will entertain coming here in the future after watching this disaster.

Yes money talks but after this year unless Rutgers offers way more than other teams I can’t see any other lottery pick caliber players ever setting foot in Piscataway- unless a new coaching regime is in place.

 

[Mholinko]

It must be a weak draft if Harper and Ace are 2-3. Ace had the ability if u play in a league with no D (NBA) and Harper is good going to the hoop but needs to work on his shot and handle! These guys would be mid 1st rounders in a decent draft

Funny you say that it’s actually considered one of the stronger drafts in quite a while by just about every talking head and scout

Just furthers my point that good college player and good nba player aren’t the same and none of us really know what the nba is looking for

It’s been that way for 2 decades we just never paid attention because Rutgers has never had anyone worth drafting that high

 

[biazza38]

Sounds like you are doing some very selective reading or just don’t like this thread which is focused on DH and AB. This board is flooded with other threads critical of the roster in general or specific supporting players who have not either met expectations or were not good enough to begin with.

To be clear the real problem starts at the top of the program not any individual player.

Selective reading? There’s a new thread every game now

And 100% agree, the problem starts at the top

 

[RU848789]

Ace couldn’t be more inconsistent. Very poor handle… very.
Dylan seemingly peaked and is not the player he was…. Injury lingered?

There’s many more players, even 2 freshman, better AT THIS STAGE.

I can’t see a franchise taking a chance on the “potential” of Ace with that high in the draft in all honesty.

Prove me wrong.

I agree on Ace and still wonder if Dylan is 100%, but certainly based on performance they're not lottery picks. However, the NBA drafts based on potential and we've had NBA scouts sitting next to us for 3 different home games this year and all 3 thought both were top 10 picks if not top 3-4.

 

[BIGRUBIGDBIGredmachine]

Dylan has not looked as fast and nimble as he was before his ankle injury. He's not the quickest pg I've seen in college hoops, but early in the year once he got downhill he had the combo of power, agility and enough speed to get to the hoop with more ease. To be fair it's also obvious to see teams have been hedging and quickly collapsing on him once he gets in the lane. I don't know why we haven't figured out a way to have him swing the ball out quicker to whoever is open when they start collapsing on his drives. Oregon ate us alive with the drive and swing pass out for their open 3's.

 

[RUisB1Gtime]

Have to remember. They are 18 years old. Both have scored close to 40 in games multiple times as Freshman. In 5 years they are only 23 which is still extremely young. They are both 100% nba talents. How good they will be will depend on work ethic, coaching etc......

 

[Scangg]

I believe JWill is out of eligibility…and that’s a good thing.

He is not

 

[Scangg]

Ace has a poor handle and it’s even worse at speed, I don’t know if you can teach that.

Ace has good handle for a 6'10 18 year old. He will be fine. Most people his size can't dribble half as well

 

[Shelby65]

I'm not sure Dylan is going to be a top PG in the NBA, I can see him developing into a really good 2G. I expect Ace will be a heckuva shooter in an NBA offense that gets him the ball in better position to catch and shoot. He'll get stronger too and help his drives in traffic.

Dylan is ball dominant to the extreme. He will not waste energy running around to get passed to. He’s a 1, not a 2.

 

[zappaa]

Ace has good handle for a 6'10 18 year old. He will be fine. Most people his size can't dribble half as well

After 18 years you either have a handle or you don’t.

 

[FIJI'83]

New two-round NBA mock draft: Scouting reports and fit intel for every pick

With the NBA trade deadline behind us, Jonathan Givony and Jeremy Woo project landing spots for NBA prospects in Rounds 1 and 2.

www.espn.com

I've posted this before but here is ESPN's latest mock draft posted 5 days ago by Jonathan Givony who is the most respected NBA draft analyst. Dyaln and Ace are locked in as picks 2/3. The only question is if Ace can pass Dylan to be pick 2.

Dyaln: "The 18-year-old's combination of size, shot-creation prowess, passing creativity, finishing skill and scoring instincts have drawn comparisons in NBA circles to a young James Harden."

Ace: "Bailey, who turns 19 in mid-August, is also making notable strides as a passer and defender, as the game appears to be slowing down as he gains experience against high-level competition. There's no ceiling on Bailey's long-term upside considering the development trajectory he is on, and a positive final month of the season could help him challenge Harper for the No. 2 pick. Every team in the NBA is searching for a big, explosive shooter and scorer with a competitive streak in Bailey's mold."

It is very clear that majority of the people who have posted here know absolutley nothing about the NBA and it's draft process. ESPN has Egor Demin, a freshman guard from BYU, who is averaging only 11 ppg on 28% from 3 as the eighth pick for context on why college stats don't matter for these prospects. Drake Powell, a freshman guard on a bad UNC team, is mocked at pick 22 despite averaging only 7 ppg on 24 mins per game.

 

[The RUT]

After 18 years you either have a handle or you don’t.

So you don’t think his handle can/will improve? Interesting.

What makes Ace such a strong prospect is not his handle, it’s his ability to sink a contested shot anywhere on the floor.

The consistency of his turnaround fadeaway jumper alone screams NBA. There’s so much spacing in the NBA, once he’s confident at that level, Ace is going to be a killer.

I don’t enjoy the NBA game much, but Ace has the most superstar potential in the draft and it’s not close to me.

 

[Knight Owl]

Numerous examples of talented freshman getting drafted at top of lottery from losing or average college teams
1- Ben Simmons LSU
2- Markelle Fultz Washington
3- Isiah Stewart Washington
4- Jaylen Brown Cal
5- Trae Young Oklahoma

NBA is a different beast. They draft on potential. Harper and ACE are still top 5 picks

If you combine the skill sets of Ben Simmons and Ace you get a very complete player.
Shooting-Ace
Defense-Ben
Handle-Ben
Rebounding-Ben
Passing-Ben
Finishing around the rim-Ace

 

[jerseybird]

Ace has a poor handle and it’s even worse at speed, I don’t know if you can teach that.

Coaches can break down the movements and correct thru execution of proper repetitions. Just takes time & effort.

 

[Knight Owl]

After 18 years you either have a handle or you don’t.

Ace’s tall and leggy build hurts his handle for sure.