Anderson, Shea and now Ash
- Thread starter CuredbywinningRU
- Start date
Yeah, maybe he would have read that ... if it wasn't published a month and a half after he made his post. Seriously, let it go. OP embarrassed himself with a quick trigger finger back on DECEMBER 5. You're embarrassing yourself now. You could have made a very good, positive conversation by just dropping that link into its own thread, but instead you went with this petty bullshit.
I think you missed the point lol....okay: maybe the OP never should have typed words that made zero sense, especially the parts he stated as if they were fact, before learning more about Coach Ash, hence, AFTER he spent a month or so reading articles about this man's experience, qualities, and preparedness for a head coaching position as such.
Sorry but when a poster types his/her opinion, as if they are fact - as the OP did in this thread - I feel they deserve to get ALL the proper information they can to make a more informative statement. I've been trying my best to help the OP out with this since the day he started the thread, btw, not just now. :smiley:
Ash is the same guy today as when the OP started the thread. Not sure how the circumstances are different.
Once we get past the name calling -- and please note that those who have no clear rebuttal often resort to shouting and insults -- can I put my two cents in?
Let's try to look at it from the recruits standpoint: Does a Jersey kid want to go Rutgers because it's his state school? In my view a resounding NO. I think the ability to have his family and friends see him play has its appeal, but why would going to the state school be to his advantage?
He wants the best for himself: To win, to get better so to potentially get to the NFL, get a good education to assist him in his post-college life, great teammates to enjoy his 4 years, play as much as he can (rather than sit on the bench), have friends and family watch him play.
Granted, some kids may have a low priority of the educational aspect, but the coach who can show him that Rutgers is where these things can happen. Appealing to state pride seems to me pretty low on the totem pole. Does a head coach knowing HS coaches make any difference? Other than familiarity in the early years I don't think it matters. How the HC impresses HS coaches is far more valuable. And not as valuable as the recruits opinion of what the position/assistant and HC demonstrate.
So...while I may have preferred another pick, I don't know nearly as much about Asn and the other candidates as the people that made the decision. Did they make the best choice? I dunno. I do think it was a good choice, and I'll support him and hope for the best. And discussions about his performance and potential are fair game for discussion. Let's just not fire him or promote him to sainthood yet.
Let's try to look at it from the recruits standpoint: Does a Jersey kid want to go Rutgers because it's his state school? In my view a resounding NO. I think the ability to have his family and friends see him play has its appeal, but why would going to the state school be to his advantage?
He wants the best for himself: To win, to get better so to potentially get to the NFL, get a good education to assist him in his post-college life, great teammates to enjoy his 4 years, play as much as he can (rather than sit on the bench), have friends and family watch him play.
Granted, some kids may have a low priority of the educational aspect, but the coach who can show him that Rutgers is where these things can happen. Appealing to state pride seems to me pretty low on the totem pole. Does a head coach knowing HS coaches make any difference? Other than familiarity in the early years I don't think it matters. How the HC impresses HS coaches is far more valuable. And not as valuable as the recruits opinion of what the position/assistant and HC demonstrate.
So...while I may have preferred another pick, I don't know nearly as much about Asn and the other candidates as the people that made the decision. Did they make the best choice? I dunno. I do think it was a good choice, and I'll support him and hope for the best. And discussions about his performance and potential are fair game for discussion. Let's just not fire him or promote him to sainthood yet.
You say a Jersey kid doesn't want to go to Rutgers just because it's his in-state school. And the next sentence talks about family and friends being able to see him play. That's a fairly big draw, certainly not a resounding NO. Take a look at other state schools and their recruitment lists; mostly in-state recruits. Not so at Rutgers because of the Fludd fiasco. before then there was a majority of Jersey recruits. Also, Coach Ash has already stated that he wants to farm the Jersey gardens. Yes, I don't care if 7or 8 recruits are from out of state, but that's a red flag if the balance is the other way.
you cant argue this Ash hire wasnt done from a point of strength,meaning RU didnt have a full B10 share of income money to hire a name coach so the question will be is ASH an up and comming head coach rising star like Tom Hermann panned out to be,or just a place holder till RU gets full share B10 money and can hire a proven 'name' head coach?
Actually I consider this the upside of having forum/thread history retained. It helps show posters who are agenda driven....for instance, the OP was still bashing Ash as of yesterday in one of the Rene threads.....
the love of meyer is so blind, google urban meyer leaving gators, he bailed when the future was going to get tough, sorry he decided to flight rather than fight, and his teams had less oversight than most in recent history
it will be his first report card, it may be a short semester, but he will get a grade
I am concerned with the lack of NJ connections as well. I don't see any path to long term success without retaining our fair share of NJ players (not necessarily top 10 guys). But Ash seems to recognize the need for NJ kids. And I think Ash has better credentials than any of our prior hires, other than Schiano. Just have to hope he can get it done.
I don't judge the OP as a person.
But as a Rutgers Football fan he's a complete embarrassment.
But as a Rutgers Football fan he's a complete embarrassment.
"Lack of NJ connections", I can't help but throw up in my mouth over the complete fallacy and myth some of our fans cling to.
You want a staff that can create excitement and coach up players or do you want a staff with NJ connections?
We're in a hole now because flood and a coaching staff full of nj connected guys did so poorly. Destroyed an entire program in 4 years.
Well, if he does good or real good, we still can't compare him, to Burns, Anderson,
or any one else from decades ago. Ash might have more going for himself,
but he also, his support has to be at least 10 times greater.
Actually IMO he has BETTER credentials than Greg had.Schiano had a number of years at Penn St. learning from Paterno.T hen 2 years as DC at Miami with Butch.Coach Ash has had 20 years of learning experiences from any number of fine FB minds including Urban.Other than having played the game,Greg never planned to be a FB Coach. He was strongly considering Law School,whereas Coach Ash had planned to be and prepared to be a FB Coach for all of his life. We have a WINNER calling the shots for our team.RU:football:ROCKS.
I find it funny that people are jumping off the edge because recruits are decommitting. Remember when Flood was hired just to save the recruiting class? Well, we all saw how that turned out. Rutgers sacrificed long term goals for a short term win and now Rutgers is paying for it by firing Flood and his staff. Rutgers is on the hook financially and its image has been damaged. Remember when Rutgers was a bowling every year and winning, even ESPiN gave the school respect (a little:stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:). Now we're back to articles making claims the football program is a cluster F and Rutgers is nothing more than a basement dweller in the B1G....BULL! We all may not agree with Ash's approach so far, but his game plan has long term success written all over it when compared to Flood.
No NJ Connections? How about this guy?
Rick Mantz, past president of the New Jersey Football Coaches Association and one of the state's most respected mentors.
"Having a high school coach liaison to the coaching community is critical for a big-time program, and Mantz is a great hire with his having been a part of the executive committee of the NJFCA for (20) years." said MyCentralJersey.com football analyst Marcus Borden, also an NJFCA Hall of Fame member.
Brian Dohn, national recruiting analyst for Scout.com: "Rick has a strong reputation in the state. He was one of the really good high school coaches in New Jersey, so he has credibility from that standpoint. And he's a guy that's been around a lot and knows a lot of the coaches (statewide). This is Rutgers hiring one of New Jersey's own, and it comes from the high school ranks. It makes complete sense because Rutgers has been undermanned in the recruiting office for so long that they are finally doing something to help those relationships, and there's a point man now that the coaches can identify with and reach out to."
So when Rick Mantz calls a high school coach, who he knows well and makes the pitch, which would you rather hear? "Chris Ash is the new head coach here. He was the defensive coordinator at Ohio State last year when they won the national championship, and he worked in the SEC under Bret Bielema and at Wisconsin under Barry Alavarez. In addition, eight of our new coaches have ties to Ohio State." OR
"Hi, we have a bunch of coaches here with Jersey ties. Oh, what happened last year? That was nothing. So, how about giving some jersey guys a break . . . . "
You do know Ash is much more like a Schiano hire then a Anderson/Shea hire. But you just want to stir the pot and 3 pages later. you have done that
BWT your "coach pushing hard to get him that job" that is an another false statement UM wanted Ash to stay as Ash said in an interview. But that would mean you would of had to read about Ash. You also make a statement that is not true but well crafted to make an impact but stating Shea and implying that ASH is a NON-RECUITER. This is the direct opposite as all of his former coaches speak highly of his recruiting abilities. all this leads to a well constructed hate piece by a professional writer> Hi steve
And this is a quote from one who's view is valued
"He's a very intelligent person," Bielema said. "There's a lot of good football coaches, I don't know how smart they are -- you know what I mean?"
BTW Schiano, Golden and even Weis have NJ ties, and that is the rub. 50% of the NJ HS coaches dislike theses guys for one reason or another, Ash on the other hand comes in with a clean slate so there is no baggage or dislike by the NJ HS coaches So this is another advantage
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RUTGERS__R00LZ,
What I'm saying is that a lot, if not most, kids don't have the state pride that they have in, say, Alabama or Michigan or Texas, etc. Yes, having friends and family able to see you play IS a big draw. But it's not Rutgers, it's proximity. I don't know they exact numbers, but I suspect Temple has quite a few NJ recruits -- due to proximity.
It's also easier and less expensive to recruit in your backyard. Seeing the same recruiter at your HS games would naturally have a positive effect. Being easy to see games in person more often helps, as well. So it's no surprise that the vast majority of players are in-state. But you have to be aware of quality. I'm sure the quality of Schiano's NJ recruits was greater than those of Flood, Shea, or Graber, while the absolute numbers are probably close. In fact, I'm amazed...truly amazed that the majority of flood recruits are from out of state. (I'm taking you at your word).
My point is the HC having NJ ties is relatively unimportant. Much more significant is the assistant coaches and coordinators have solid relationships throughout the state -- whether they presently exist or must be developed. And, of course, that the HC be able to close the deal. That'll depend less upon the HC saying he's a Jersey Boy, then him convincing the kid (and his parents) of his vision for Rutgers and the recruit himself. And how his bonifides can get them both there.
What I'm saying is that a lot, if not most, kids don't have the state pride that they have in, say, Alabama or Michigan or Texas, etc. Yes, having friends and family able to see you play IS a big draw. But it's not Rutgers, it's proximity. I don't know they exact numbers, but I suspect Temple has quite a few NJ recruits -- due to proximity.
It's also easier and less expensive to recruit in your backyard. Seeing the same recruiter at your HS games would naturally have a positive effect. Being easy to see games in person more often helps, as well. So it's no surprise that the vast majority of players are in-state. But you have to be aware of quality. I'm sure the quality of Schiano's NJ recruits was greater than those of Flood, Shea, or Graber, while the absolute numbers are probably close. In fact, I'm amazed...truly amazed that the majority of flood recruits are from out of state. (I'm taking you at your word).
My point is the HC having NJ ties is relatively unimportant. Much more significant is the assistant coaches and coordinators have solid relationships throughout the state -- whether they presently exist or must be developed. And, of course, that the HC be able to close the deal. That'll depend less upon the HC saying he's a Jersey Boy, then him convincing the kid (and his parents) of his vision for Rutgers and the recruit himself. And how his bonifides can get them both there.
While Ash was not my first choice, I've been impressed by almost everything he has done so far. Sure, the proof is in the pudding, but right now it's way premature to have a negative slant. Signing day would be the first time to debate whether more success could have been had, but right now Ash appears to be working hard...and smart.
Hiring Ash guaranteed that this years and next years recruiting classes would be weak. This year because no one knows who he is. And next year because our wins/loss record will be terrible. The chances of Ash succeeding here are slim. We went cheap again when we really needed to hire a name coach to fix the mess Flood left
Where on Schiano's resume did it state that he was the DC of a NC team? While you're looking for that, find the place on Schiano's resume where he was the DC for a program that went to a major BCS bowl 3 times during his tenure. I'm all about having a wait and see attitude, but the comment about Ash's resume is utterly ridiculous and ignorant.
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Next year's class will blow away any of Flood's 3 classes (2013-15). No doubt in my mind. Also expect a nice finish to this one but it was ranked in the 50's before Flood was canned.
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If Ash is half as good as some think, then stop this BS about Rutgers having a cappy record. I wouldn't be surprised to see a record around 500. The team is not as bad as some think. It's not championship caliber, but better than advertised. The problem with this team is coaching. The Xs and Os was poor and the team lacked discipline. Had the team had half of this, then Rutgers is at least 6-6 or 7-5 this past season. It's a fine line between good or bad teams.
Love what I think this staff is capable of but we have an I credibly difficult schedule and still lack quality depth at a lot of position groups so I'm not expecting anything but visible improvement in all facets of the game.
We have at least a 4 wins next year. How well we turn around our D and how quickly we can install and run a "power spread" will be on display game 1 at Washington. If we can hang with them and get a break and a win that will get us closer to 6 wins
Note Washington will have no tape on our O and expect some wrinkles in the D as well.
First game I expect an intelligent game plan that Washington can't scout
Pritz, don't get me wrong. I believe the coaches/recruiters can be from anywhere to get good Jersey players. It just seems weird that the in-state haul is so out of balance. The 2016 list shows 3 Jerseyites and 9 from out of state. Ash has said he'll make New Jersey a priority and I'd like to see it.
