Remember when mentioning on this board 5 months ago that we might not be able to make the ncaas without a portal center and with low major transfers? It got you figuratively crucified and called all kinds of stupid. “Pike will coach them up”. “Trust Pike and the staff”. “Pike will easily teach them defense”. “Don’t worry about the transfers low three point percentages at any prior schools because now they’ll have opportunities while opposing teams worry about Ace and Dylan”. On and on and on. Maybe those with rose colored glasses might want to pay attention to those that are cautiously pessimistic?
Five months ago
- Thread starter darkcheck
- Start date
I don't understand the persecution complex of so many posters here. Especially the more negative posters. Like 90% of the board wants to fire Pike yesterday and a lot of people still post things like "saying mean things about Pike will get you attacked blah blah blah".
Yeah, that wasn't a popular opinion 5 months ago though you did certainly have a couple allies (@Greene Rice FIG comes to mind). It also wasn't popular among non-Rutgers fans given we were ranked preseason. I dunno, congrats on getting it right I guess, but this is a place where there is not a lot of consensus on anything so people are often going to disagree.
Yeah, that wasn't a popular opinion 5 months ago though you did certainly have a couple allies (@Greene Rice FIG comes to mind). It also wasn't popular among non-Rutgers fans given we were ranked preseason. I dunno, congrats on getting it right I guess, but this is a place where there is not a lot of consensus on anything so people are often going to disagree.
There’s disagreeing respectfully and there’s irrationally ripping some folks for a differing opinion. Rutgers has a history of overconfidence, on the field, on the court, mid game and on these boards. A smidge of success and then Rutgers is gold and can do no wrong. It should be ok to have an educated differing opinion or one of a little caution. It’s not negativity, it’s analytical. To me all opinions are welcome. I try to learn from the ones I disagree with. I’m respectful and if my opinion differs from those that said “sweet 16s a lock” I usually preface it by saying “I hope you’re right”. I truly do want Rutgers to succeed, especially in basketball. It’s been a love of my family for over 40 years. I can be that and still be critical of things I don’t like. And I know my opinion doesn’t matter one bit to anyone who’s a decision maker at RU. I just wish this board was more fair and analytical, and less insulting and name calling. Maybe then the pessimists can be more hopeful and the optimists can not hype things up and set expectations way to high. Then we can all enjoy the ride more as a fanbase. Of course it’s ok to have a little fun along the way. Fluoxetine you and I had some knock down drag outs last year. This year we’ve agreed more and more. I’d like that to continue as I respect your opinions.
Blue Ribbon was onto something before the season started. I guess everyone including myself drank too much Kool Aid. But in my preview for this team, I did mention all the weaknesses that could be major problems for this team. Those weaknesses I mentioned were exposed the entire season. Also, want to mention Pikiell's incompetence with the rotations has been maddening and have not solved any of the issues.
The last two games have been embarrassing in the second half.
All of Pikes flaws over the years of him coaching here are all being exposed in full this year. Sad to witness.
Convenient to blame Pikiell. Were we lucky to be an elite defensive team? Blame Pike the GM not the coach.
“It got you figuratively crucified and called all kinds of stupid. “Pike will coach them up”. “Trust Pike and the staff”. “Pike will easily teach them defense”. “Don’t worry about the transfers low three point percentages at any prior schools because now they’ll have opportunities while opposing teams worry about Ace and Dylan”.”
Idk if these were real quotes you chose to put in but none of these seem to rise to the level of being figuratively crucified or called stupid, kinda just looks like people offering differing opinions.
No not actual quotes, just a sugar coated version of the general themes on why we were called foolish. The insults and viciousness occurred in the threads. You’re right those which just be innocent debate points on their own.
Last edited:
This one time, 5 months ago, I was right about shorting RU MBB, and I don't think the world has sufficiently kissed my ass enough about being right.
You cannot make it, long term, as a Rutgers fan unless you can find optimism that tantalizes logic. It no big trick to be Eeyore.
You cannot make it, long term, as a Rutgers fan unless you can find optimism that tantalizes logic. It no big trick to be Eeyore.
Please the smell from the garbage that is coming from your mouth. One it wasn’t just me. There are many in here who got beat down. Two it wasn’t one time. We’ve Been sounding the alarm regarding poor recruiting, development, rotations, offensive schemes and accountability for a few years. Those burying their heads in the sand have ignored them. Fundamentally it wasn’t rocket science to see the signs. In no way I was bragging I was wiser than anyone. Just looking for more harmony so some can relax in setting crazy expectations and some can try to be more optimistic.
Also, perhaps the most foolish thing I’ve read on here. Cant be a long term fan unless you have illogical optimism. Wow! Tell me you enjoy losing and love mediocrity without actually telling me. I enjoyed the early 80s, 89, 91, 2019-22. There’s nothing wrong with wanting that to be sustained and calling out the analytical reasons you observe why we’re deviating from that path.
Players and coaches are bashed mercilessly every game by the cheapest fanbase in America. Everyone knows full well how teams are constructed in 2024 2025. We got Ace and Harper for free because they came from outside NIL. The rest of you diehards LMFAO gave nothing absolutely nothing but worthless opinions. It’s why we have a roster of players that do not belong here.
Sorry darkcheck...you have it wrong. You want to pin the failure on the coaching staff. The same coaching staff that succeeded without a lot of talent and lifted the program to a level that landed Ace and Dylan.
So you want to claim being right because you told everyone how bad Pike is.
So you want to claim being right because you told everyone how bad Pike is.
What a fool you are. You don’t know what people donated (cause it certainly wasn’t an investment). I threw money in the fireplace along with many others.
Hahahahaha yes the same staff that was successful 4,5,6+ years ago and then got complacent and got away from all their trademark characteristics used to rebuild the program. Prove me wrong.
And was landing Ace and Dylan really worth it? What did it get us? We got away from everything that made us relevant again.
No one can prove you wrong, but there is little evidence they were complacent and they didn't get away from the trademark characteristics until this season.
In hindsight? No it wasn't worth it, we got nothing out of this season and now our two best players are gone. But I don't know how you really turn down an opportunity for two top 5 players. The big error IMO was abandoning the principles in a misguided attempt to build offense around them.
But it's over. This season is a bump in the road, it doesn't stop you from going back to what worked. The real question is the portal and whether Pike can navigate it. We have yet to really see him attempt a "normal" portal year; 2023 we replaced two key pieces at the last minute, 2024 we did the Ace/Dylan experiment.
You do realize what my opinion was when we landed them, and if memory serves me correct I didn't have anyone (including you) agreeing with me.
because a competant coach that could recruit would be able to assemble a solid core around them
the issue with Pike has been CONSISTENT POOR OVERALL RECRUITING...I have been banging this drum for years....big misses with his highest rated recruits which makes me wonder his evaluation skills...(Jones/Griffiths), non factor transfers (J Will/Hyatt), woeful injuired old slow portal players (Hayes, Fernandes, Martini, Acuff, A Will), bad maac level players (mensah, wolf, reiber, oskar, EO), role players forced into minutes way too soon (J Mike, Derek, Lathan, Grant). I am almost sure I am leaving players out.
also i believe Pike lacks the eye of tiger...how many years did it take him to get to the NCAA from Stony Brook? 10....he won regular season titles a few more times and then couldnt seal the deal by winning the conference tourney.
He got lucky with an incredible group of players and then got extra time from them with that stupid extra covid year
RU has yet to have a proper return entrence to the ncaa tourney with fans
that game vs Notre Dame in Dayton was infuriating and played just like that horrific loss to Hofstra in the NIT and how much of the early season went this year.
Isn't there real evidence in a thread on here somewhere that our NIL war chest is among the smallest in the B10
I am not making fun or insulting anyone but it is a FACT no matter how much you think you donated or feel that you contributed to the program we are a A team playing in the MLB when it comes to finances
It isn't anyones fault specifically it is a collective fault for the school and for our fanbase to want to "compete" with the biggest and best the country has to offer and then when the needle moves a little bit as to what is required we point fingers and don't accept any responsibility
We absolutely DO NOT belong in the B10 for the forseeable future based on our financial status and that is what the fanbase can do to change the narrative
It is a tired argument because everyone here will say "I am not donating SH*T to this program unless they make changes" but we will just go in a circle about it and nothing will happen
Could some better coaches have done a better job with this roster ... YES. Could some better coaches have constructed a better roster with what we DID have available... YES.
BUT... don't make the mistake of thinking that either of those YES's mean that we were anywhere in position to be ACTUALLY competitive at the top of the B10 or to make a real run in March. Even with a great staff this was a roster that was going to be hard pressed to make it out of the first weekend as its ceiling.
You guys can bicker and yell at each other all you want... but the fact of the matter is UNLESS things change with both staff, culture AND finances we saw our ceiling 4 years ago winning an NCAA game and making the play-in. If you as fans are okay with that then there is no need to discuss NIL, finances or coaching changes any further.
Ace and Dylan are more of a problem than you or other fans believe.
Supporting cast not good, but they are good enough if 40% of the team were very good college basketball players
NIT game means jack sh!t...please don't even bring it up.
HERE IS WHAT PIKE GOT WRONG IN THE PAST..........
He did not stock a roster with enough players, probably out of loyalty and not wanting to cause competition. The Notre Dame game we were fried by the end of the year. Too many guys playing too many minutes and not having a bench. Mulcahy's last 2 years here was running on fumes at the end of each year. Crying, whining to officials, tripping opponents, etc. Winning with defense takes a lot out of teams and teams that play like this need depth.
The only positive of us losing is that you have nothing to write about. Your silly recaps with no inside information that you think are relevant to impress 70 year olds. No one bashes the players as much as you do. You have never donated squat to the program and have been a fan all of your life and probably sit in the 300 level. Let the 70 year old have his weather thread and stop trolling it with stolen material. You’re not a weatherman or a journalist lol. What’s next 100 man hours of bracketology that you make ZERO money from. You’re not a friend to this basketball program. You’re a basher of the basketball program.
This thought is something that i think about.
I have considered that more and more
And the thing of it is... that INCREDIBLE group of players made 2 NCAA tournaments (don't say COVID year) and won 1 game
And we bow at the feet of Pike for doing that
I respect and appreciate what the guy did digging us out of the complete graveyard of college basketball and bringing stability and respectability to the program... but like other professional sports there are coaches who are "organizers" and can raise the floor of a program to a certain level and then there are WINNING coaches that know how to get the job done when the chips are in the middle
Pike is not a high leverage coach in any respect
It is well known that we have one of the smallest NIL in the BIG TEN.
Very fair point about the deviation from trademarks being only this year. Probably the two years prior we’re just because of poor recruiting as Bac says.
Agree you don’t turn down two five stars but the poster made it sound like Pike earned them. Dylan’s mom loved Pike and wasn’t it that Aces Godfather was in with Knight. Now it seems they may have come here because they could do whatever they wanted to while here.
I sure hope Pike can navigate the portal as you say because the cupboard is pretty bare. We’re about to lose 60% or our points and it’s hard to win with 35 ppg. Although many on here say we can’t compete in the portal and that’s not Pikes fault, apparently it’s people like me who donate but not enough.
So 70 yr olds have no relevance? Probably fans their whole life. What difference does it make where anyone sits.
Is it fair to complain about Zach Martini in the same thread and then have the same posters actually try and tell you in other threads throughout the season that "They have the best plus-minus on the team or that "they're in position on defense".....LMAO
We have the absolute fanbase that doesn't deal in reality.....they make grand statements about a team being NCAA caliber but one injury details a season for Mag, but there's no such leeway provided when a much more talented player missed 5 games and isn't 100% since he returned??
We have Ace Bailey unable to csrry non B1G players for 4 months and some posters saying the player isn't a Top 3 draft pick because "he doesn't play with maximum effort???"......if you ask these posters who does play with maximum effort, you get no legitimate answer....
The fact remains the same.....I live in a factual world and use basketball and logic on knowing what minimal money and NIL means....yet we have dumb fans crying about Cliff, or Spencer, as if there's unlimited money for everyone??
There are tough decisions that are NIL related....the staff does not want limited players, but that's what RU and we ultimately provide the staff. Then the same fans blame the coaching for lack of offense, shooting defense etc.
I'm not asking fans to agree, but sometimes the reason RU isn't competitive against the best in a Top 2 league, is because we don't win in football and that generates the highest level of donors needed to spread to other sports.
We have one of the lowest revenue bases, in comparison to everyone else in the B1G. I would imagine we generate the least amount of ticket revenue and donations in the entire conference.
The sport is changing folks and other leagues and fanbases are going to have to make difficult decisions sooner than later. Is this really THAT important to you?? If it is, find some of the wealthy people and convince them to bail RU out, because it's not getting better in either sport for RU, the gap is getting wider by the year......good luck blaming that on Pike, literally the only relevant coach in our B1G existence......
We have the absolute fanbase that doesn't deal in reality.....they make grand statements about a team being NCAA caliber but one injury details a season for Mag, but there's no such leeway provided when a much more talented player missed 5 games and isn't 100% since he returned??
We have Ace Bailey unable to csrry non B1G players for 4 months and some posters saying the player isn't a Top 3 draft pick because "he doesn't play with maximum effort???"......if you ask these posters who does play with maximum effort, you get no legitimate answer....
The fact remains the same.....I live in a factual world and use basketball and logic on knowing what minimal money and NIL means....yet we have dumb fans crying about Cliff, or Spencer, as if there's unlimited money for everyone??
There are tough decisions that are NIL related....the staff does not want limited players, but that's what RU and we ultimately provide the staff. Then the same fans blame the coaching for lack of offense, shooting defense etc.
I'm not asking fans to agree, but sometimes the reason RU isn't competitive against the best in a Top 2 league, is because we don't win in football and that generates the highest level of donors needed to spread to other sports.
We have one of the lowest revenue bases, in comparison to everyone else in the B1G. I would imagine we generate the least amount of ticket revenue and donations in the entire conference.
The sport is changing folks and other leagues and fanbases are going to have to make difficult decisions sooner than later. Is this really THAT important to you?? If it is, find some of the wealthy people and convince them to bail RU out, because it's not getting better in either sport for RU, the gap is getting wider by the year......good luck blaming that on Pike, literally the only relevant coach in our B1G existence......
I don’t recall your exact position about landing two five stars. I do know that mine was that having two five stars guaranteed nothing. People were all over the board saying best team ever, sweet 16 and final four and that I was crazy because every team with two lottery picks always has ncaa tourney success. I said because those team are blue bloods, for us it assures nothing. If that sounds familiar I did agree with you. If it doesn’t then please enlighten me because I do want to understand your position.
oh i definitely am with you somewhat on Ace/Dylan moreso than majority here
threading the needle with 7 man rosters before mag went down is not the way to go...fools gold...
his recruiting and retention distraous no two ways about it
Very good point about the lack of football success not generating excitement and donors necessary for money for other sports.
There were people who didn't want a portal 5? Seemed like nearly the entire board was in agreement on that but that's what you chose to lead with? Odd
I'm still not giving you two years prior. The 22-23 team was 39th in kenpom. Sure I would like to be better but that is good enough to make the tournament most times. (On the other hand the opposite is true about 21-22).
Look, Pike hasn't had rousing success but until the last couple years (and I guess the first few on an absolute scale but not relative to what he inherited) he hasn't had clear failure either.
It is fair to bring up when fans don't understand why he is playing and blasting the coach for playing him and we have data that shows we have been best on defense when he is on the floor. I think it is worthy of a mention and deserves an exploration.
Different scenario. We had a huge drop off of talent after our 1st 5 or 6 players. Ace and Dylan are NBA talents.....we are playing B1G basketball. I couldn't give a flying fvck what they do on the Indiana Pacers and Minnesota Timberwolves...different game.
This is an issue....I got JaMike for you....wish i had more. We have a culture problem right now. Sorry, but I am inclined to blame Ace and Dylan. Maybe I am wrong here.....i am definitely not 100% rational less than 24 hours after the loss.
I hear you
agree
valid point
our athletic department is a fiscal mess and we are a state university and about have a gubernatorial race where the primary winner will be the person who shows they can cut the most and lower your taxes. Schiano in helicopters not going to be viewed in a positive way
Agree 1000% here
I just see three non ncaa years in a row. And in the whole tenure one ncaa win
You say no clear failure other than the first three years and the last two? That’s five of his nine. I won’t at all fault him at all for the first three, but of the last six he’s had clear failure the last third of his time here?
What do you mean that’s what I chose to lead with? I literally said “no portal center” as a negative in my OP. I certainly thought we needed one and couldn’t believe we wouldnt negotiate with Ewin
