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GAME 19 PENN STATE: Shattered Dreams

bac2therac

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Jul 30, 2001
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Belle Mead NJ
And now you've given me, given me
Nothing but shattered dreams, shattered dreams
Feel like I could run away, run away
From this empty heart
You said you'd die for me
Woke up to reality
And found the future not so bright
I dreamt the impossible
That maybe things could work out right
I thought it was you
Who would do me no wrong



This team did 1-0 pretty good for two games in a row. Giving some of us a glimmer of hope. Rutgers has 2 fantastic NBA talents and when they are clicking and the supporting cast are providing just enough like they did in the last 2, Rutgers can have a success. With 2 star players who likely are the best players at any time on the court, Rutgers remains a threat to be able to jump up and beat anyone at anytime. Some players stepped were stepping up and the defense was looking tuned in. Dare I say we were seeing growth and team ball rise to the surface. Alas tonight was a reminder this team isnt all that different from what we have seen all year. Rutgers will be in every game and will do somethings really good such as rebounding the ball tonight. Unfortunately team ball has been an issue that has dogged us from game 1. Tonight it was turnovers that put RU at a disadvantage in the first half. In the 2nd half it was once again a familiar scoring drought where the supporting cast came up empty again. The 11-0 PSU run when Pike subbed in after RU had the ball up 3 spoke volumes and effectively that was the game. I can go over what each player did and did not do but its just revisiting familiar territory. It is what it is. One step forward and one step back.

Getting in a dust up in the game thread about Ace Bailey....no shit sherlocks, RU would not have been in the game without Ace Bailey going off for 30 points on 13-15 fg shooting. That Rutgers lost despite that effort in a very winnable game vs a solid not likely NIT Penn State team in a non hostile environment is the problem itself. The surrounding cast isnt good enough we know that. Add in Dylan having one of his worst games as a Scarlet Knight (and yes he was a non factor before his injury) and its not pretty. That Pike chose the path of riding 2 freshmen phenoms looms as the biggest issue. Ace had dunks, incredible shots, and he will be on sportscenter tonight. The game film tonight will be salivated over by NBA scouts. Its quite the highlight film for the NBA. See the thing is, me and many some others here (I could be mistaken) are not here the NBA. Ace's two bonehead plays, the first after the monster dunk jawing and then the 2nd that the other Ace baited him into really showed the immaturity of a freshman perhaps more interested in his highlights than helping the team. I get it Ace loves hoops and he loves Rutgers. What I question is whether making the NCAA tourney in a one year stop is the real goal here. Again it looks like Pike has to rely on Ace/Dylan just going off for RU to win games and like tonight to even make it a game. To me that is not teamball.

It is shattered dreams for me. I have spoke my peace all year long about the futility of this season. The promise was a NCAA season and dreaming the possibilties and embracing the attention. It did not take long til the signs were there the promise was going horribly wrong. They had to keep going 1-0 and they did not tonight. Mathematically yes they are alive but look at the record...10-9. They are what they are. Tonight just bringing back to reality that this team just isnt good enough to get and build leads on a consistent basis. They will win some close games and lose some close games. They will jump and surprise and then remind you exactly why you are not enjoying the rollercoaster. Fix one thing and another crops up. Rebounding our best all year yet still our opponents shooting nearly 50%. Small individual improvements from EO and Grant get highlighted because the bar had been set so low. Every team is getting better at this point in the year. Its a little late to try and figure things out 19 games in and RU still seems to have a glaring lack of leadership and poise. To me that was the difference in the game. Ace Baldwin provided that in spades for the Nittany Lions. To me a more impactful 22 points on 6-16 shooting with 5 steals and 8 assists than Ace's ridiculous 13-15fg, 30 point game. If you cannot understand what I am talking about then I guess you do not care about who won the game. Penn State does not have the better players. Their sum is greater than the parts thats for sure. Solid team ball and incredible ball movement. Tonight was the perfect example of team ball and poise of individuals whether that was Ace's offensive prowess or Dylan's futility

People will say Dylan was hurt tonight and the flu the other games and that is why they lost. Yeah part of the reason but deserving teams find ways to win when players are hurting or they have the depth to pull it out. PSU had a 10ppg starter out plus their senior leader trying to come back from back issues. No one feels sorry for you in this league. The 2024-2025 Rutgers basketball team is all out of excuses at least for me and I know there will be others that differ in that opinion. Monster game at MSG lost a ton of luster. Like I said RU can jump and beat better teams and a win at MSG would not surprise me at all but what exactly does that mean. Is going 1-0 even good enough at this point given 11-10 and 1-7 in Quad 1 is as ugly as its going to get for a power 5 school. I woke up to reality and found that the future not so bright.....
 
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It’s just so frustrating as a fan of Rutgers. We were so close to being in the discussion. Every time, every single time. I just hate being irrelevant.
 
Depressing but spot on. The real shame is just how exciting the MSG game could have been with a win tonight there for the taking.
yup and it still has the potential to be exciting, if Dylan ankle is fine, I do believe this team shows up when the lights are on and Sparty is top 10 so I think once everybody gets in there and the ball rolls out the chance for a special day is still there
 
Your post is great and I think welcomes a lot great discussion. 1 and dones are a different beast. You asked does Ace care more about making the NCAA tournament in his one year stop at RU or making highlights. I think it’s an extremely interesting conversation from a non scientific psychology perspective.

I have no doubt Ace and Dylan want to make the NCAA tournament. And want to desperately win. I think they want that more than making highlights.

But, the reality is that in a broader sense of how they view their basketball career, where they are now in the journey, the NBA draft and getting their first mega contract is what’s most important to these guys in this moment.

So long way of saying I think where you were going is Ace getting technicals in a close game to hype a great play, is an example of him not LOCKED IN on Rutgers basketballs best interests of winning games. In that sense, not committing a technical was not in his head, only celebrating a SC Top 10 play was, bc his goal is to be an NBA star doing just that.

This is only a topic for us bc we feel we know that the old guard, whether it RHJr Myles Cliff Geo Young McConnell, even Paul, would be so focused on the tiny details of the end game that they would almost never risk committing fouls like those.
 
Your post is great and I think welcomes a lot great discussion. 1 and dones are a different beast. You asked does Ace care more about making the NCAA tournament in his one year stop at RU or making highlights. I think it’s an extremely interesting conversation from a non scientist psychology perspective.

I have no doubt Ace and Dylan want to make the NCAA tournament. And want to desperately win. I think they want that more than making highlights.

But, the reality is that in a broader sense of how they view their basketball career, where they are now in the journey, the NBA draft and getting their first mega contract is what’s most important to these guys in this moment.

So long way of saying I think where you were going is Ace getting technicals in a close game to hype a great play, is an example of him not LOCKED IN on Rutgers basketballs best interests of winning games. In that sense, not committing a technical was not in his head, only celebrating a SC Top 10 play was, bc his goal is to be an NBA star doing just that.

This is only a topic for us bc we feel we know that the old guard, whether it RHJr Myles Cliff Geo Young McConnell, even Paul, would be so focused on the tiny details of the end game that they would almost neve risk committing a foul those.
Or maybe he’s just immature?
 
1 and dones are a different beast. You asked does Ace care more about making the NCAA tournament in his one year stop at RU or making highlights. I think it’s a extremely interesting conversation from a non scientist psychology perspective.

I have no doubt Ace and Dylan want to make the NCAA tournament. And want to desperately win. I think they want that more than making highlights.

But, the reality is that in a broader sense of how they view their basketball career, where they are now in the journey, the NBA draft and getting their first mega contract is what’s most important to these guys in this moment.

So long way of saying I think where you were going is Ace getting technicals in a close game to hype a great play, is an example of him not LOCKED IN on Rutgers basketballs best interests of winning games. In that sense, not committing a technical was not in his head, only celebrating a SC Top 10 play was, bc his goal is to be an NBA star doing just that.

This is only a topic for us bc we feel we know that the old guard, whether it RHJr Myles Cliff Geo Young McConnell, even Paul, would be so focused on the tiny details of the end game that they would almost neve risk committing a foul those.
this, explains it well...yes they do care but do they care in the way they NEED to especially at this point in the season...like a Paul, Geo, Ron, Caleb, Myles, JY.....you put it well
 
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Ace had a great game but just tired of this season being about him and Dylan and not Rutgers. He's playing well but the immature fouls hurt.

Bigger disappointment is our transfer bench going back to their normal antics of just not being cut out for this level. Acuff was terrible, Jordan meh, Zach meh, J Will (dude terrible game).

We are playing better these last 3 games but PSU took us out of our game with that zone and we just never recovered. Our defense has gotten better though, I have noticed that.
 
yup and it still has the potential to be exciting, if Dylan ankle is fine, I do believe this team shows up when the lights are on and Sparty is top 10 so I think once everybody gets in there and the ball rolls out the chance for a special day is still there
Reality says hello
 
Reality says hello
disagree, they are capable of beating top team on their best day especially in a jacked environment. What an 11-10 edit 10-9 team isnt capable of is suddenly doing a 180 and going 9-3 the rest of the way since they are 5-10 vs any team with a pulse in Q123
 
I don’t think it’s that deep with Ace as far as his motivations, he’s like hardly 18 years old and got super excited after doing superhuman things.

All the people writing off our horrendous defense against Nebraska should be way less surprised than they are. Since the New Year we’ve had two defensive performances under 1 PPP, one came from a fairly solid defensive 2H against Wisconsin, the other was Purdue missing like 15 open 3s. We never turned a corner on that end and it’s cost us the season.
 
We are 10-9, not 11-10.

Regardless, IMHO, we have to finish 6-0 at home and find a way to win three road games. That's the most logical path to ensure a bid to the big dance.

Any slip up along the way and a B1G tourney title is the only other way to dance. Hence, Saturday's game is just as important as it was before tonight's game. Now we still need to find three road wins instead of two.
 
disagree, they are capable of beating top team on their best day especially in a jacked environment. What an 11-10 team isnt capable of is suddenly doing a 180 and going 9-3 the rest of the way since they are 5-10 vs any team with a pulse in Q123
Sure. And what exactly have you seen so far that makes you think that is likely?
 
Or maybe he’s just immature?
I don’t think it’s immaturity. To Bacs original thoughts, it’s a bigger thematic conversation than that.

What he did is what the game is today. Basketball culture is different. That’s been true and been moving in the direction it has been for a long time. And I’m not just talking at the NBA level, not just AAU, all over. It’s in your 5th grade township recreational leagues too. Kids have fun, they celebrate big plays, the welcome and embellish the highlight plays that’s are now social media moments.


@PhillyRU
 
We are 10-9, not 11-10.

Regardless, IMHO, we have to finish 6-0 at home and find a way to win three road games. That's the most logical path to ensure a bid to the big dance.

Any slip up along the way and a B1G tourney title is the only other way to dance. Hence, Saturday's game is just as important as it was before tonight's game. Now we still need to find three road wins instead of two.
good catch...im getting away from myself...but i think we would take 11-10 right now
 
We are 10-9, not 11-10.

Regardless, IMHO, we have to finish 6-0 at home and find a way to win three road games. That's the most logical path to ensure a bid to the big dance.

Any slip up along the way and a B1G tourney title is the only other way to dance. Hence, Saturday's game is just as important as it was before tonight's game. Now we still need to find three road wins instead of two.
There’s just no chance we beat Ill and Mich at home B2B imo, put a fork in it
 
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Sure. And what exactly have you seen so far that makes you think that is likely?
i didnt say it was likely at all...i said i wouldnt be surprised if they beat MSU. Harper and Ace both show at the same time which they really havent much this year and yes they can win. If its not MSU they will beat a Mich or Ill at home but more than 1...likely no...Unfortunately they cant string games together
 
Taking out Ace at 9 minute mark was atrocious and game immediately turned with PSU going on 11-0 run.

MSG game vs Sparty would have been epic with a win tonight.

Now it’s a game for survival !
To your point, RU outscored PSU by 12 points in the 30 minutes that Ace Bailey was on the floor.

PSU outscored RU by 20 in the ten minutes that Ace was on the bench
 
To your point, RU outscored PSU by 12 points in the 30 minutes that Ace Bailey was on the floor.

PSU outscored RU by 20 in the ten minutes that Ace was on the bench
It’s kind of moot though as he didn’t make it through the game due to fouls.
 
So when you watched that game, you thought to yourself that ace is playing selfishly? What makes you say he doesn't care about reaching the tournament? How do you come to that conclusion? Guard play is why they lost tonight. 17 turnovers not because of aces fouls. Unless you just want to blame the loss on him because of his status. That's when you pick out his two mistakes out of everything he did and blame him for the loss. Team is getting better man find some joy and relax.
 
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So when you watched that game, you thought to yourself that ace is playing selfishly? What makes you say he doesn't care about reaching the tournament? How do you come to that conclusion? Guard play is why they lost tonight. 17 turnovers not because of aces fouls. Unless you just want to blame the loss on him because of his status. That's when you pick out his two mistakes out of everything he did and blame him for the loss. Team is getting better man find some joy and relax.
I’m sure BAC will reply but I think all the other stuff you mentioned is assumed, as the product on the floor is what this team has shown us most of the year. And now Bac is moving into the larger theoretical questions as to why we’re at where we are now, and how does it influence where we go from here.

Ace was obviously incredible. And for me, the rules of the game are little to tight around the collar when it comes to the technical. Let the guys show emotion in a very emotional endeavor.
 
So when you watched that game, you thought to yourself that ace is playing selfishly? What makes you say he doesn't care about reaching the tournament? How do you come to that conclusion? Guard play is why they lost tonight. 17 turnovers not because of aces fouls. Unless you just want to blame the loss on him because of his status. That's when you pick out his two mistakes out of everything he did and blame him for the loss. Team is getting better man find some joy and relax.
where did I blame him for the loss
 
I’m sure BAC will reply but I think all the other stuff you mentioned is assumed, as the product on the floor is what this team has shown us most of the year. And now Bac is moving into the larger theoretical questions as to why we’re at where we are now, and how does it influence where we go from here.

Ace was obviously incredible. And for me, the rules of the game are little to tight around the collar when it comes to the technical. Let the guys show emotion in a very emotional endeavor.
you are translating it better to them than i can
 
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