I'm not sure we will ever be successful in Big Ten football

[Yeah Baby]

I don’t care if it was starters or scrubs. Once up 24-3, Iowa was playing deliberate prevent defense against us and executed near perfectly. That’s why you cannot take the second half yards Evan racked up to mean a whole lot. On 3 out of 4 of those possessions, once we moved into Iowa territory, their defense turned it up a notch and stopped us. They stopped us twice on downs and once Evan threw the pick. If you’ve read my posts you know I’m not overly negative, but forgive me for not being overly excited that we managed to finally convert on 1 out of 4 of those drives. From the presser, it was fairly obvious to me that GS is hoping he won’t be counting on Simon to be the starter for the remainder of the year.

I’m not saying he is a savior for the 300 yards. I just stated the facts. One other fact is they knew we were passing and he took a lot of hits. He earned every one of this yards. He was at 60 in the first quarter and over a hundred in the first half and that includes Iowa playing kill the clock pretty much all game. If we don’t turn it over and he only throws for 200 and the score is closer does that mean he played better? Not to anyone who knows the game. The only way he could have played better is no picks and a W for us.

The fact that this board has negative posters who complain no matter what does not mean you are one of them. I stand by that comment and those who are negative know who they are. If you feel the need to defend your comments that’s on you. I don’t apologize for being positive.

 

[NorthernKnight]

By "successful" I mean:
1. Four bowls every seven years - doesn't matter which ones
2. Ranked two of those years
3. Being in playoff conversation ONE of those six years. I'm not even saying MAKING THE PLAYOFFS. Just in the conversation.

I can't look at the team and the direction it's going and say that.

Never is a long time.

 

[Extra Point]

Of course we will be successful. As a RU fan you are conditioned to be unsure from years of watching and being unsure.

 

[NotInRHouse]

OK- so, we beat BC at their home and the Iowa game was really decided by turnovers. Turnovers do happen and could have just as easily been their offense that had the turnovers and then it would be a different story.

I know you can't say- IF we didnt turn them over- but for the point of context of your OP- IF the TO's didn't go against us- our defense held their own with Iowa and our offense was just as good or better than Iowa...And they had a multi year starter at QB and we had our 3rd string.

Yeah but our 3rd string QB should be throwing all over against Temple and not throwing against Iowa but overall scoring minimum 5 TDs against everyone because it's Greg's third year and we all know every P5 program in America has a 3rd string that is essentially Tom Brady lite!!!

 

[batts]

By "successful" I mean:
1. Four bowls every seven years - doesn't matter which ones
2. Ranked two of those years
3. Being in playoff conversation ONE of those six years. I'm not even saying MAKING THE PLAYOFFS. Just in the conversation.

I can't look at the team and the direction it's going and say that.

Unfortunately, we now also have the NIL to contend with. We are not going to be able to compete with the NIL deals that are going to be offered by the likes of Michigan, PSU, Ohio State, Maryland, Wisconsin, USC, UCLA, etc. The NIL is going to divide the Big 10 into the "Haves and Have Nots. Hopefully, Congress or the NCAA starts regulating player compensation.

 

[RUforlife]

All’s he did in his time here was turn what was arguably the worst program in the country into a winner.
When he went to Tampa he left Kyle Flood with a top 5 defense nationally and one of his best recruiting classes.
He took us to # 7 in the country.
He was the National COY.
He had 26 players drafted and countless walk ons.(top ten in the country at the time).
All while keeping one of the best APR’s in the country.
He is a better coach now than he was then.
To the OP’s original post: are we ever going to be successful in the Big Ten Conference?
Yes we are. Just look at basketball. That was a bigger dumpster fire than football before Pike took over.
We finally have everything in place here to compete:
Solid recruiting base.
Great conference affiliation with all the resources and excellent exposure.
An administration ( from the president on down) that understands the importance of a strong athletics program and supports it. Even the Governor is on board.
Schiano is going to get the job done.
In a few years people are still going to be complaining: I can here it now, “Schiano he’s a good coach, he just can’t win the big one”.

Again, very emotional, just not fact driven, and I appreciate the emotion, that emotion is what makes a loyal fan over the years. His record just doesn't support that type of optimism in my view, also it discounts the fact we now play in a conference with schools that have bigger endowments, better facilities, larger fan bases, are the flagship universities for their states and have the support of their citizens and politicians, what makes a Rutgers fan think that they are just going to sit back and allow us to pass them by? Yes, Greg may improve the product, but so will our conference competitors. Also, at some point there is going to be pressure on Greg to improve the OOC schedule. Will Greg get us back to Pinstripe Bowl or its equivalent in the next 3-5 years based on our w/l record, I think he will, more than that, not based on the record.

 

[Joey Bacala]

#1 & #2 are defintely doable. #3 is not within my realm of possibility at this time.

 

[rutgersguy1]

#1 & #2 are defintely doable. #3 is not within my realm of possibility at this time.

Just read an article on Kansas with some stats on AP ranking for P5 schools. the longest drought was Kansas' last ranking in Oct 2009. Illinois was 2nd longest and Rutgers was 3rd longest, November 2012.

Kansas also has the 2nd longest drought of beating an AP ranked team at the time of the game. Rutgers was the longest.

There are opportunities annually for these things in the B10. I think all are possible but will it be with this staff or another, well we'll see in time.

 

[50 yd line RR]

Again, very emotional, just not fact driven, and I appreciate the emotion, that emotion is what makes a loyal fan over the years. His record just doesn't support that type of optimism in my view, also it discounts the fact we now play in a conference with schools that have bigger endowments, better facilities, larger fan bases, are the flagship universities for their states and have the support of their citizens and politicians, what makes a Rutgers fan think that they are just going to sit back and allow us to pass them by? Yes, Greg may improve the product, but so will our conference competitors. Also, at some point there is going to be pressure on Greg to improve the OOC schedule. Will Greg get us back to Pinstripe Bowl or its equivalent in the next 3-5 years based on our w/l record, I think he will, more than that, not based on the record.

What did I say that was emotionally driven? Shiano coach of the year? Players in the NFL? 100mill from the Big on the way? Hollaway Hobbs all in? Great academics? Fertile recruiting?
#7 national ranking?
All facts.
If what you imply were true no program could ever turn their program around. It happens every year.Miami, Kansas State, Kentucky. Perennial doormats that became strong programs.
That can’t happen here why?I call BULL SH##
Schiano is not the guy? The Big Ten is to tough?
Every program cycles around. Rutgers is now in the cycle.
I say time will tell.
no emotions necessary.

 

[newell138]

As much as I've been trying to avoid the CE board, sometimes the topics on here make me want to go over there for some positive content.

 

[tomatocan]

The people who post these types of threads

Who's going to remove the cloud?

 

[yesrutgers01]

Again, very emotional, just not fact driven, and I appreciate the emotion, that emotion is what makes a loyal fan over the years. His record just doesn't support that type of optimism in my view, also it discounts the fact we now play in a conference with schools that have bigger endowments, better facilities, larger fan bases, are the flagship universities for their states and have the support of their citizens and politicians, what makes a Rutgers fan think that they are just going to sit back and allow us to pass them by? Yes, Greg may improve the product, but so will our conference competitors. Also, at some point there is going to be pressure on Greg to improve the OOC schedule. Will Greg get us back to Pinstripe Bowl or its equivalent in the next 3-5 years based on our w/l record, I think he will, more than that, not based on the record.

There is no reason to improve the OOC unless we go back to only 8 conference games- We go undefeated or only 1 loss and win the CCG- we are in playoffs with our current OOC.
The other bowls- usually tied in with how you did in conference.

Currently- we usually play 9 B1G games, 1 P5 game 1 G5 and 1 "other" - are we supposed to also schedule Bama?

I never understand this point of view- right now- we need to win all 3 OOC no matter who they are.

Why does everyone want to make it harder?

 

[-RUFAN4LIFE-]

There is no reason to improve the OOC unless we go back to only 8 conference games- We go undefeated or only 1 loss and win the CCG- we are in playoffs with our current OOC.
The other bowls- usually tied in with how you did in conference.

Currently- we usually play 9 B1G games, 1 P5 game 1 G5 and 1 "other" - are we supposed to also schedule Bama?

I never understand this point of view- right now- we need to win all 3 OOC no matter who they are.

Why does everyone want to make it harder?

So they can complain when the team loses one against Texas or Clemson.

 

[mildone]

Never is a long time.

Yup. People really ought to beware absolutes.

 

[Knightmoves]

Actually- his post made me think of something...Iowa beat us because everything that could go wrong for us, did and everything that had to go right for them, did...

It actually proves a point that Iowa needed that to happen to win as they did.

The comparison is just stupid.

With 10 mins left in 3rd Quarter, Iowa was winning 24-3. Wasn’t the game pretty much over at that point?

 

[yesrutgers01]

With 10 mins left in 3rd Quarter, Iowa was winning 24-3. Wasn’t the game pretty much over at that point?

In just a 5 minute difference, they obtained that 24-3 lead...so, in fact, it wasn't really over. You score a TD and let's say it is now 24-10 with 5 minutes left in 3rd- that is a 2 possession game...

 

[MADHAT1]

You play your schedule.

yep, and back in the day: that schedule was mainly filled with D-1AA opponents.
Rutgers welcomed hard times when they committed fully to a D-1A schedule but refused to support the program like a D-1Aprogram should be if you want a successful program

 

[NorthernKnight]

Again, very emotional, just not fact driven, and I appreciate the emotion, that emotion is what makes a loyal fan over the years. His record just doesn't support that type of optimism in my view, also it discounts the fact we now play in a conference with schools that have bigger endowments, better facilities, larger fan bases, are the flagship universities for their states and have the support of their citizens and politicians, what makes a Rutgers fan think that they are just going to sit back and allow us to pass them by? Yes, Greg may improve the product, but so will our conference competitors. Also, at some point there is going to be pressure on Greg to improve the OOC schedule. Will Greg get us back to Pinstripe Bowl or its equivalent in the next 3-5 years based on our w/l record, I think he will, more than that, not based on the record.

News flash. We won’t be improving the out of conference schedule for the next 7-10 years.

there’s ZERO reason to improve it. The B1G schedule is plenty tough enough.

 

[NorthernKnight]

In just a 5 minute difference, they obtained that 24-3 lead...so, in fact, it wasn't really over. You score a TD and let's say it is now 24-10 with 5 minutes left in 3rd- that is a 2 possession game...

The game wasn’t over until Iowa ping ponged the 51 yard field goal in.

Three scores was insurmountable.

 

[mildone]

The game wasn’t over until Iowa ping ponged the 51 yard field goal in.

Three scores was insurmountable.

Agreed. I never felt like there was no chance until that point because our O had been moving the ball reasonably well, at times including the first drive, against Iowa's excellent D.

 

[Purple-Ed]

There are turnovers and there are game changers. We had game changers, not turnovers.

If the ball was intercepted and the WRs had the sense to tackle DeJean, then it is a turnover.

Rutgers committed not one, but two game changers.

This is what has really shocked RU fans.

This means we have a massive catastrophic failure with this program. The last time we saw a catastrophic failure like this was when the shuttle blew up.

Do you practice being a jerk-off?

 

[goru7]

So many twists and turns in these threads. Let ‘s speak the facts ! What Schiano did in the 2004-2008 period was rather amazing. Shea had us as the worst that our program ever was. We had some talented teams under Graber and of course Frank Burns but the worst teams of all time under Shea ( until Ash). Now getting 26 guys that were either 2 stars, some 3 stars and a few 4 stars , or walk ons, to become NFL players is as good as any coach that recruited that type of talent . News Flash: the Big East in 2004-2008 had better teams than the Big 10 even at the top. The Big 10 got their asses handed to them in bowl game after bowl game. Louisville with Petrino and West Virginia with Rich Rod and Pat White and Slayton was as good as any team in the country. We beat one of them and but for no review of an early fumble , a dropped Td , and a crushing triple OT loss we are playing in a New Year’s game. Our loss to Cincinnati in 2006 after the Louisville game also had Mark D’Antonio coaching Michigan State , no slouch and he built that Cincinnati team into the solid real good program it is today. Rutgers , Louisville , West Virginia ,Cincinnati and South Florida between 2004 - 2008 were as good as any 5 teams from the Big 10 and probably would have kicked ass.
Plus Schiano made prime time Thursday night special. A happening , an event. So let’s not forget what he did.
He also underachieved in not winning more Big East Championships as 2006 and 2008 should have been championships but 2006 came down to triple OT and 2008 the team and Teel started slow before becoming a juggernaut. There was always that 1 WTF game that also had you talking to yourself and had you cursing your attempt to go to sleep that night.

Now to the present Big 10 or the Big 10 East or when Urban Meyer came to Ohio State. He forced the whole Big 10 to get faster , recruit better athletes and changed a lot of their game plans. Almost every team in the Big 10 is better across the board now. Clearly the entire Big 10 East is and despite Iowa and Wisconsin’s early stumbles , Wisconsin , Iowa have been tremendous for many years in a row. But other West teams are better too, as a program , Minnesota and Purdue and Northwestern.
So now Greg takes over the incredible dumpster fire that Ash left us and has to climb up all the way from the bottom as the worst Power 5 and likely Group of 5 team , but now has to do it in a stronger BIG 10 as well as stronger teams nationally with the spread offense . Much tougher hill to climb. Not sure any coach , Saban , or insert any coach you want here , could do it without getting all 4 and 5 star recruits. Not ever taking anything away from Saban but if his roster was not almost completely 4 and 5 star talent , he wouldn’t be winning like he is. ( He gets all the credit because he is recruiting that talent , just as Kirby Smart is now doing at Georgia and the NFL over the last 4-8 years is filled with players from those schools ). Greg has not broken through with recruiting yet and really unknown if he will be able to fully break through but he will make us competitive again , good enough to knock off ranked teams , but the job is even harder today than the first go around . He has brought back some hope which was totally extinguished under Ash. Ash almost killed the program. The rise will be harder but definitely possible bordering on probable .

The Simon discussion deserves a separate response.

 

[Knightmoves]

In just a 5 minute difference, they obtained that 24-3 lead...so, in fact, it wasn't really over. You score a TD and let's say it is now 24-10 with 5 minutes left in 3rd- that is a 2 possession game...

When Iowa went up 24-3 the game was basically over for RU. You are one of the few who didn’t see it.

 

[yesrutgers01]

When Iowa went up 24-3 the game was basically over for RU. You are one of the few who didn’t see it.

My point was against a post that had Iowa in full prevent and playing their backups as Simon was passing for his yards. Iowa was not going to go soft with that lead with over a qtr to go

 

[Rutgers Chris]

Three posts into his posting career and the author of the OP is dropping pessimism like a seasoned pro. Well done

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

I’m not saying he is a savior for the 300 yards. I just stated the facts. One other fact is they knew we were passing and he took a lot of hits. He earned every one of this yards. He was at 60 in the first quarter and over a hundred in the first half and that includes Iowa playing kill the clock pretty much all game. If we don’t turn it over and he only throws for 200 and the score is closer does that mean he played better? Not to anyone who knows the game. The only way he could have played better is no picks and a W for us.

The fact that this board has negative posters who complain no matter what does not mean you are one of them. I stand by that comment and those who are negative know who they are. If you feel the need to defend your comments that’s on you. I don’t apologize for being positive.

I’m not negative. I’m actually quite positive on the outlook for us once we get past next week if Vedral returns healthy. I just don’t think you can look at what Evan did down 24-3 to Iowa or when Maryland was killing us last season and conclude he deserves to continue to start. If he threw lights out against Temple, I might see it differently.

 

[RUforlife]

What did I say that was emotionally driven? Shiano coach of the year? Players in the NFL? 100mill from the Big on the way? Hollaway Hobbs all in? Great academics? Fertile recruiting?
#7 national ranking?
All facts.
If what you imply were true no program could ever turn their program around. It happens every year.Miami, Kansas State, Kentucky. Perennial doormats that became strong programs.
That can’t happen here why?I call BULL SH##
Schiano is not the guy? The Big Ten is to tough?
Every program cycles around. Rutgers is now in the cycle.
I say time will tell.
no emotions necessary.

I am pretty sure that 1) all B1G programs are getting the same amount of $s, 2) the other coaches in the conference have players in the NFL, 3) all the ADs in the conference are "all in," 4) almost all of the universities in the conference have great academics, some actually better than Rutgers, 5) many programs are sitting in very fertile recruiting grounds. As for the #7 ranking, how long did we hold that ranking and how many times in his 13+ years of coaching Rutgers has Schiano delivered 1) a conference title, 2) a new year's day bowl appearance, 3) finished in the top 15? Now, like I said there is no disputing that Schiano is a good coach, but this idea that he will deliver anything more than 6-8 win seasons at his top end is just wishful thinking based on a 13+ year record.

Oh, and your point about other coaches turning perennial doormat programs around into top 10 teams is well taken, unfortunately Shiano has not been one of those coaches in 13+ years of trying.

 

[Mufasa94]

News Flash: the Big East in 2004-2008 had better teams than the Big 10 even at the top.

This is one of the most ridiculous statements I've seen presented.
'04: 4-loss Pitt from the Big East says enough
'05: PSU and tOSU both were better than WVU (I wouldn't be the only one who says that)
'06: tOSU was better than Louisville (and Michigan was better than RU and/or WVU)
'07: tOSU was better than WVU (sorry, losing to the MNC is less embarrassing than Pitt)
'08: 3-loss Cincinnati from Big East losing to 4-loss VT in Orange Bowl says enough

The Big 10 got their asses handed to them in bowl game after bowl game.

tOSU losing a couple MNC games doesn't mean other teams beating teams like Wake Forest were better.

If you want to bring up 2nd place teams like '06 Michigan, while I didn't buy into the overhype of those two for a potential rematch, a 2nd place Big 10 team drawing eventual #4 USC Pac-10 winner in the Rose Bowl is a whole lot tougher than Big East runner-up WVU drawing 4-loss (soon to be 5 loss) GT in the Gator Bowl. I'd rather avoid mentioning who the 3rd place Big East team had to face off against in their bowl.

Rutgers , Louisville , West Virginia ,Cincinnati and South Florida between 2004 - 2008 were as good as any 5 teams from the Big 10 and probably would have kicked ass.

More ignorance. I'm not going to bother detailing as above. I'll request you provide evidence to support your claim.

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

My point was against a post that had Iowa in full prevent and playing their backups as Simon was passing for his yards. Iowa was not going to go soft with that lead with over a qtr to go

I never said they were playing back ups. Their starters were playing prevent defense to avoid giving up big plays which allowed Simon to move the ball into Iowa territory raking in 8-12 yard completions while the clock ran. Iowa’s defense tightened up once there was a shorter field after we crossed mid court. They stopped us twice on downs and once picked off Evan. We made it into the end zone 1 in 4 times. This isn’t debatable - it’s a factual account of what happened in the game.

 

[50 yd line RR]

I am pretty sure that 1) all B1G programs are getting the same amount of $s, 2) the other coaches in the conference have players in the NFL, 3) all the ADs in the conference are "all in," 4) almost all of the universities in the conference have great academics, some actually better than Rutgers, 5) many programs are sitting in very fertile recruiting grounds. As for the #7 ranking, how long did we hold that ranking and how many times in his 13+ years of coaching Rutgers has Schiano delivered 1) a conference title, 2) a new year's day bowl appearance, 3) finished in the top 15? Now, like I said there is no disputing that Schiano is a good coach, but this idea that he will deliver anything more than 6-8 win seasons at his top end is just wishful thinking based on a 13+ year record.

Oh, and your point about other coaches turning perennial doormat programs around into top 10 teams is well taken, unfortunately Shiano has not been one of those coaches in 13+ years of trying

Yes the big ten teams have enjoyed all those things for a long time we’re just getting started. We never had the commitment top to bottom, the resources or the exposure.
You spout 6-8 wins like that’s a fact it’s just your opinion.You really dont know what Schiano can or can’t do because again. he has never had the commitment top to bottom, resources or exposure! No one knows. So don’t speak like it’s fact.
I believe Schiano can get it done, but only time will tell.Just my opinion.

 

[mdk01]

I am pretty sure that 1) all B1G programs are getting the same amount of $s,

I'm very sure you're wrong

 

[Miramar-RU]

I definitely believe we can be at a point where we’re challenging for the playoff every 6 years. Under the 12-team structure we would have been in it in 2006, and we had a strong shot in 2012 even after the loss or Louisville. Teddy Bridgewater was the hottest QB in America at that point, missed the 1st quarter and still had 263 passing yards, beating us that year by 3 points. We beat Louisville and we would have been in the BCS against Florida, who Louisville beat by 10 in that Sugar Bowl. Both of these were in the Big East.


Will we get there? That’s another thing. But we definitely can and should get there.

 

[KnightLife1994]

In the end, not getting into the end zone on that first drive really hurt us. If that’s a TD, Simon is probably outright instructed to take a sack and not throw the ball if pressured on the next possession. Change that one thing and the whole game flow could’ve changed considerably.

Anything positive Simon did in the second half of the game really has to be taken with a grain of salt. We’re down 24-3 with 10 minutes to go on the clock in the 3rd. Iowa just wanted to get out with a win and as few injuries as possible. So long as they had a 3 score lead they were willing to give us those medium pass openings. The pass blocking couldn’t have been better on the second pick - so that one was entirely on Evan.

I disagree with this sentiment. We were down 24-10 with 11 minutes left and we were moving the ball extremely well at this point. We had them at 3rd and 7 with like 9:45 left and had we gotten that stop we could have scored to make it a one possession game. We also were 6 inches away from a doink off the upright and the ball at our own 37 with about 7:30 left. We were very much in the game at points in the 4Q.

 

[colbert17]

There are opportunities annually for these things in the B10

Agreed but beating a #3 ranked 2022 Ohio St. is a universe beyond beating a #2 ranked 2007 South Florida

 

[King of S]

I definitely believe we can be at a point where we’re challenging for the playoff every 6 years. Under the 12-team structure we would have been in it in 2006, and we had a strong shot in 2012 even after the loss or Louisville. Teddy Bridgewater was the hottest QB in America at that point, missed the 1st quarter and still had 263 passing yards, beating us that year by 3 points. We beat Louisville and we would have been in the BCS against Florida, who Louisville beat by 10 in that Sugar Bowl. Both of these were in the Big East.


Will we get there? That’s another thing. But we definitely can and should get there.

Play-offs? Do you say play-offs?

 

[e5fdny]

Seen Pat Fitzgerald and Kansas mentioned in the thread.

I’ll take either of their results for 2.0 and be satisfied: Pat Fitzgerald and his multiple NYD bowl appearances or the Mangino led Jayhawks with their Orange Bowl nod.

Do I think that’s going to happen? We’ll see.🤷‍♂️

As for getting guys in the NFL, I still contend it’s much more important for the program to have our folks to collectively have better Saturdays than what might happen individually on Sunday.

 

[rutgersguy1]

Seen Pat Fitzgerald and Kansas mentioned in the thread.

I’ll take either of their results for 2.0 and be satisfied: Pat Fitzgerald and his multiple NYD bowl appearances or the Mangino led Jayhawks with their Orange Bowl nod.

Do I think that’s going to happen? We’ll see.🤷‍♂️

As for getting guys in the NFL, I still contend it’s much more important for the program to have our folks to collectively have better Saturdays than what might happen individually on Sunday.

I’ve posted a few times here the teams of our status that would’ve made or contended for a 12 team playoff since 2014.

KSU, GT, NW, WF, IU, WSU, Miss St, TCU, Colorado, ISU, Utah, Pitt are some of the names. I don’t think it’s out of the question at all, whether it’s this staff or not remains to be seen.

 

[e5fdny]

I’ve posted a few times here the teams of our status that would’ve made or contended for a 12 team playoff since 2014.

KSU, GT, NW, WF, IU, WSU, Miss St, TCU, Colorado, ISU, Utah, Pitt are some of the names. I don’t think it’s out of the question at all, whether it’s this staff or not remains to be seen.

That would be nice but as I have said all along since the time 2.0 was announced a NYD appearance would qualify his tenure as a successful return IMO.

The next guy can do that, the Playoff thing.

 

[rutgersguy1]

That would be nice but as I have said all along since the time 2.0 was announced a NYD appearance would qualify his tenure as a successful return IMO.

The next guy can do that, the Playoff thing.

Many of the NYD bowls will be wrapped into the 12 team playoff.

I’m not sure how many playoff games will actually fall on NYD. Some of the playoff games will likely be on weekdays too in order to avoid the NFL and give each game an exclusive window.

 

[colbert17]

Play-offs? Do you say play-offs?

Could have been GS post game Saturday night.