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OT: Another nice game by Simpson

G- RUnit said:
You keep saying that without any support. That’s not fair. Who exactly?
Teammates who hate effort, hustle and defense?

And even sillier, it’s basically a whole new team this year. One player back from last year, JMike. JWill was only here for two months and Ogbole was hurt.

And Seems to me Mags giving up on the season and pouting Gavin were the problem children. They both fled rather than forced out. I have shown some support for my conclusion. Where’s yours?

Team chemistry comment grossly unfair and nothing to support it against Simpson.
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This isn't something that can be verified by statistics....you will just have to trust me here.
 
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G- RUnit said:
Debate has many facets.
Some of it is who is better.
Some is a local NJ player.
Some is who would you have wanted next year when Dylan and Ace are gone.
Some is treatment by fans. JMike is treated like a defensive God, Simpson was driven outta town. Can make a strong argument Simpson brings more to the table.
Some is wondering if we could have taken advantage of excellent free throw shooting. Among best in B1G. JMike misses at end of SHU could have cost us the game.
Fair and reasonable topics for an RU basketball board?
Purposely placed it OT for those who don’t care to read it
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NO ONE is treating Davis like a defensive god. A few posters said he played well in the last two games, nothing more.

I think the real reason people might have been hoping Davis stuck around this year was tied to his friendship with Ace. They didn't want anything to potentially screw up Ace coming to the banks. They were trying to eliminate all risk, whether it was real or imagined.
 
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winfield102 said:
NO ONE is treating Davis like a defensive god. A few posters said he played well in the last two games, nothing more.

I think the real reason people might have been hoping Davis stuck around this year was tied to his friendship with Ace. They didn't want anything to potentially screw up Ace coming to the banks. They were trying to eliminate all risk, whether it was real or imagined.
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I think it's even simpler than this.

Davis was a 3-star freshman kid who no one had any expectations for, he came in and played some nice defense, people were like "hey maybe this kid has some potential, he's only a freshman, sure his shooting sucks but maybe it'll get better when we have a better offense around him, this is kind of a plesant surprise."

Simpson was a sophomore who, fairly or not, was basically the focal point of our "offense" such as it was. He had the highest usage rate on the team except for players who played almost no minutes (Chol, Ogbole) or came back late in the year (J. Williams). On this highest usage he had the 7th worst EFG% in division I among players playing 16+ minutes per game (the worst in power conferences, and the 3rd worst among non-freshman).

No one thinks Davis would've succeed in the role Simpson was being asked to play. No one thinks Davis was a better basketball player than Simpson last year.

People just (rightly) thought Davis was much better relative to (a) preexisting expectations (Davis had none) and (b) the role they were being asked to play (Davis basically a defensive stopper, Simpson the focal point of a power conference offense).
 
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Arizona Knight said:
If your case for Simpson is that he is better than JMike, then I guess you win? Is that really the benchmark for deciding whether someone is a value add on a B1G roster? Maybe the debate is about something else and I’m missing it.
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If he's better than the guy who stayed (which I think he is), then yes, that's value added.
 
fluoxetine said:
I think it's even simpler than this.

Davis was a 3-star freshman kid who no one had any expectations for, he came in and played some nice defense, people were like "hey maybe this kid has some potential, he's only a freshman, sure his shooting sucks but maybe it'll get better when we have a better offense around him, this is kind of a plesant surprise."

Simpson was a sophomore who, fairly or not, was basically the focal point of our "offense" such as it was. He had the highest usage rate on the team except for players who played almost no minutes (Chol, Ogbole) or came back late in the year (J. Williams). On this highest usage he had the 7th worst EFG% in division I among players playing 16+ minutes per game (the worst in power conferences, and the 3rd worst among non-freshman).

No one thinks Davis would've succeed in the role Simpson was being asked to play. No one thinks Davis was a better basketball player than Simpson last year.

People just (rightly) thought Davis was much better relative to (a) preexisting expectations (Davis had none) and (b) the role they were being asked to play (Davis basically a defensive stopper, Simpson the focal point of a power conference offense).
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And then in the preseason, after many workouts, practices, and scrimmages among the guys, those who attended, including some members of the press, were saying JMike took a huge leap forward toward rounding out his game. So I was hopeful based on that, that he would contribute more than he has, so far.
 
G- RUnit said:
Except not starting at St.Joes either until last game. Accepted lesser role there? Makes one wonder what was actually said.
St. Joes still pretty good D1 basketball. A10 not bad. Not like his replacements had great numbers vrs Monmouth, Merrimack, Wagner, St. Pete’s and Kennesaw.

Everything including scholarships is conjecture and didn’t we not use one schollie?
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Everything that happened after 3/18/24 is irrelevant to his decision, because it was unknown at the time. He had no idea what sort of role he'd be playing elsewhere or on what team - the only comparison he'd have is his prior time at Rutgers, and what his role might be in 2024-25 at Rutgers.

He knew that Harper and Bailey were going to come in, and they were going to be the focal point of the offense and take the lion's share of the shot attempts. He knew Williams was coming back and would also eat up a lot of shots attempts. He knew Davis wasn't going to transfer with his HS friend Bailey coming in. At the time, Griffiths also hadn't entered the portal, either.

Simpson played in 31 games with 25 starts, averaging 26.0 minutes and 13.7 FGA/40 min. The available minutes at the three guard spots were going to be more limited, and the shot attempts would likely be going primarily to Harper/Bailey. He'd have been looking at closer to 15-20 min/game and 7-8 FGA/40 min had he returned.

And that's entirely outside of any conversations he may or may not have had with staff - just based on the roster construction, it was going to be tougher sledding for him to get shots/minutes in 2024-25 than it had been in 2023-24 with our late guard departures.

He opted to try his hand somewhere else - and I wish him the best.

As far as scholarships - Pike hasn't used 13 to start a season, and he's said it's hard to have that many guys and keep them happy. If Simpson had returned, it's likely we wouldn't have had one of our 4 inbound transfers - my guess there would have been Acuff from a role perspective, but it could have been Derkack or Hayes.
 
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G- RUnit said:
I don’t think he was encouraged to stay.

Gotta believe if coming off the bench at St. Joes would have been comfortable coming off bench at RU.

If JMike now starting at RU, why not Simpson?

However you want to spin it.

If Simpson had JMikes performance this year he’d be killed.
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Simpson isn’t a good fit here. It’s that simple. Stop making him out to be something he is not. Davis is a defender first second and third. That is his job. Plus his ties to Ace. Simpson’s best asset was scoring and he wasn’t very good at it last year.
 
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Glad he left. addition by subtraction, was tired of him throwing up horrible shots & then pouting. His Daddy G-RUnit needs to spend more time on his sons board @ St. Joes.
 
RUChoppin said:
I was one who was disappointed Simpson left, mainly because of his defense and because I wanted more culture carry-over from year to year, and I thought he could help bring the younger guys along.

That said, his role would have pretty significantly changed, and I don't think he saw himself as a 7-8th man complementary piece playing 12-15 min/game with a dramatic reduction in shot attempts. It was pretty clear by the time he made his decision, that our starting guards would be Harper/Williams and that Davis would be staying to play with Bailey.

At the time he entered the portal on 3/18, Mag and Griffiths were also still on the team (they didn't enter the portal until 3/20 and 3/28). Woolfolk entered the portal the same day, and the only guy who jumped faster was Chol on 3/15. It was pretty clear Simpson wasn't looking to take a reduced role as a rising junior and was looking to transfer down somewhere he could have higher usage.

I'm glad he found a spot. On a "per 40 min" basis, he's contributing about the same to St. Joe's as he did for Rutgers last year, but more efficiently (though it's been against a far easier schedule). No ill will toward Simpson from my end. Would have loved to have him as a 10-15 min guy for his defense and FT shooting (and some opportunistic buckets on limited shots), but I doubt he'd have been happy in that role.

Had he stayed, though, it would have most likely been with Acuff's schollie not Davis'.
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Love Simpson. He needs the ball in his hands. He wasn’t going to get it with Dylan’s arrival. Was hoping he could take a greatly reduced role here for a bounce back year next year. Happy to see him do well. Great culture guy and leader, has had nothing but positive things to say about RU.
 
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G- RUnit said:
And 4th year starting senior next year.
Love Pike but really bad unfortunate move.
More upside over some others he kept.
Foul shooting in B1G was enough to keep him around. Will never understand and never really fully explained.
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With you on this. Was a little out of control, but he was young last year. Would have been the rare player to stick around now through senior year and be better and contributing every year. He lost spot to JMike because JMike is Bailey's bud. That's the long and short of it.
 
TRU2RU said:
Glad he left. addition by subtraction, was tired of him throwing up horrible shots & then pouting. His Daddy G-RUnit needs to spend more time on his sons board @ St. Joes.
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Ehhh reason he threw up half of terrible shots because he was the only one on the floor that could create his shot and with shot clock going down… he was forced to take those shots. If he was on a better team he would have had a better shooting %.
 
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TRU2RU said:
Glad he left. addition by subtraction, was tired of him throwing up horrible shots & then pouting. His Daddy G-RUnit needs to spend more time on his sons board @ St. Joes.
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Ouch. Not related. Just an extremely long time hoops and RU fan.
 
needmorecowbell said:
Simpson isn’t a good fit here. It’s that simple. Stop making him out to be something he is not. Davis is a defender first second and third. That is his job. Plus his ties to Ace. Simpson’s best asset was scoring and he wasn’t very good at it last year.
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Best asset was his defense, foul shooting, ball handling and hustle. Scoring was way down on the list.
 
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shields said:
Used to be Bishop Daniels and now simpson.
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Also. Used to be Corey Sanders and Jacob Young…. Also one of first to criticize Mags sitting it out. So many loved him too. Oopsy. Crickets your smugness. Cherry pick much? Or ignore when convenient.

Or only arguments you don’t like?

Likewise Mike Williams and Marquise Webb were great defensive players who weren’t great shooters and are beloved heros.

But alas Simpson reminds me of Montez too. Great defense and yet fans never warmed up to him because of offense shortcomings. But still revered other players.

No rhyme or reason for RU favorites,
Shields will stick head in sand of Know nothings and just make snide commentary.

Simpson played the same D and ripped unbelievably. If you don’t see the double standards and your own hypocrisy, might want to look harder in the mirror.
 
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RutgersClassof2004 said:
With you on this. Was a little out of control, but he was young last year. Would have been the rare player to stick around now through senior year and be better and contributing every year. He lost spot to JMike because JMike is Bailey's bud. That's the long and short of it.
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I don’t think Derek was pushed out - and I believe we still have an open scholarship. If he was, he probably wouldn’t have positive things to say about RU. JMike is content going all out on D and shooting 1-3 times a game and getting 10-15 minutes. That’s not Derek’s game, definitely not as an upperclassmen and I can’t blame him for not wanting to go from ~30 mins a game to 10.
 
BillyC80 said:
And then in the preseason, after many workouts, practices, and scrimmages among the guys, those who attended, including some members of the press, were saying JMike took a huge leap forward toward rounding out his game. So I was hopeful based on that, that he would contribute more than he has, so far.
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You won’t find higher piles of BS on this earth than the piles you find in pre-season college basketball reporting.
 
SirPerceval said:
You won’t find higher piles of BS on this earth than the piles you find in pre-season college basketball reporting.
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Sure, I get that. But why single out JMike at all? They were seeing something new and better in him that just hasn’t come to fruition in real games, at least not yet.

I feel like there must be a breakout game coming, from him and guys like Martini and Acuff.
 
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BillyC80 said:
Sure, I get that. But why single out JMike at all? They were seeing something new and better in him that just hasn’t come to fruition in real games, at least not yet.

I feel like there must be a breakout game coming, from him and guys like Martini and Acuff.
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I don't see much coming from JMike, Martini, or Acuff than what you see now. They are all somewhat borderline players for this level of competition.
 
Hes really the missing piece in the back court on this team IF he bought in to playing a role. That role being

1) defensive stopper of the oppositions best guard. He was a good defender
2) slasher, no dribbling around
 
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RutgersChow said:
I forgot how good JMike was shooting threes and finishing around the basket.
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Simpson was a disaster on offense - an absolute liability with his rarely-made midrange jumpers and frequently-stuffed layups.
fluoxetine said:
I think it's even simpler than this.

Davis was a 3-star freshman kid who no one had any expectations for, he came in and played some nice defense, people were like "hey maybe this kid has some potential, he's only a freshman, sure his shooting sucks but maybe it'll get better when we have a better offense around him, this is kind of a plesant surprise."

Simpson was a sophomore who, fairly or not, was basically the focal point of our "offense" such as it was. He had the highest usage rate on the team except for players who played almost no minutes (Chol, Ogbole) or came back late in the year (J. Williams). On this highest usage he had the 7th worst EFG% in division I among players playing 16+ minutes per game (the worst in power conferences, and the 3rd worst among non-freshman).

No one thinks Davis would've succeed in the role Simpson was being asked to play. No one thinks Davis was a better basketball player than Simpson last year.

People just (rightly) thought Davis was much better relative to (a) preexisting expectations (Davis had none) and (b) the role they were being asked to play (Davis basically a defensive stopper, Simpson the focal point of a power conference offense).
Click to expand...
I actually thought Davis was a better player than Simson last year. So there's at least 1. Lol
 
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Westcoast said:
Simpson was a disaster on offense - an absolute liability with his rarely-made midrange jumpers and frequently-stuffed layups.

I actually thought Davis was a better player than Simson last year. So there's at least 1. Lol
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Their production was very similar, but I'd give Derek the edge. Take away his awful mid range game, which much of the time he had to take because no one else on the team could create their own shot, he was a better distributor, probably rebounded just as well, was a little longer, and I give him the edge in D. This coming from someone who spent the off season before last year trying to tell everyone Derek wasn't as good as everyone thought he was.
 
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fluoxetine said:
I think it's even simpler than this.

Davis was a 3-star freshman kid who no one had any expectations for, he came in and played some nice defense, people were like "hey maybe this kid has some potential, he's only a freshman, sure his shooting sucks but maybe it'll get better when we have a better offense around him, this is kind of a plesant surprise."

Simpson was a sophomore who, fairly or not, was basically the focal point of our "offense" such as it was. He had the highest usage rate on the team except for players who played almost no minutes (Chol, Ogbole) or came back late in the year (J. Williams). On this highest usage he had the 7th worst EFG% in division I among players playing 16+ minutes per game (the worst in power conferences, and the 3rd worst among non-freshman).

No one thinks Davis would've succeed in the role Simpson was being asked to play. No one thinks Davis was a better basketball player than Simpson last year.

People just (rightly) thought Davis was much better relative to (a) preexisting expectations (Davis had none) and (b) the role they were being asked to play (Davis basically a defensive stopper, Simpson the focal point of a power conference offense).
Click to expand...

seansherm said:
Their production was very similar, but I'd give Derek the edge. Take away his awful mid range game, which much of the time he had to take because no one else on the team could create their own shot, he was a better distributor, probably rebounded just as well, was a little longer, and I give him the edge in D. This coming from someone who spent the off season before last year trying to tell everyone Derek wasn't as good as everyone thought he was.
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All of our guard play woes last year ties back to we had 3 guards in Simpson Davis Fernandes who did not fit together. We couldn’t play two at a time but much of the time Pike chose to or was forced to (but again, his roster construction).

I think Simpson was the better player albeit in the situations they were both in it was marginal then, but I also agree the general vibe on Davis has been much kinder.
 
If I am not mistaken last year wasn't he the 2nd most inefficient player in major d1 basketball last year? We all miss him because hes performing well in a lesser conference but he was not a good offensive player for us last year
 
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