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OT: Electric vehicles

This is his full time job. Paid troll. Unlikely he's in the US or a US citizen. Such a fulfilling existence .
She has been out for a few days. She is back in now. Will find out the deal specifics I do know her previous Tesla was less than three years old and the range started declining that she could not make it from Bethlehem PA to Red Bank NJ and back on a single charge. Will find out the monetary loss she experienced from having to release a new Tesla.
 
I agree re: "Moore's law". I do not believe the "technological leap" will be in battery capacity, but rather the ability to charge EV batteries quickly and often. Varying the amperage and charging time is not constrained by Moore's law (I don't believe, I'm not a scientist to be fair). If an EV can go +/- 300 miles and "fast charging" becomes available (relatively) everywhere (parking lots, roadsides, outside coffee houses and snack shops, etc.) that to me is what will produce significant adoption over the next 5-7 years. Not necessarily increased range due to increased battery capacity.
I think storage and charging tech will improve very rapidly, although yes, storage tech probably has a lower ceiling so more gains might be found in rapid charging.

I very much agree that having more and more public charging availability will speed EV adoption. And it'll make the lives of EV owners in apartments or condos or other places people cannot charge at home much easier.

But insofar as EV pricing goes, I think it's going to remain pretty high for a while yet, with maybe an exception here and there in addition to the less expensive options available today. Just too many people competing for too few presently-available resources at the moment.
 
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She has been out for a few days. She is back in now. Will find out the deal specifics I do know her previous Tesla was less than three years old and the range started declining that she could not make it from Bethlehem PA to Red Bank NJ and back on a single charge. Will find out the monetary loss she experienced from having to release a new Tesla.
This "debate" is getting too dumb to ignore.

Why focus on one person, imaginary or otherwise? Just do this:


And start reading.
 
I tell this story frequently. In 1992 my first company was an early adopter of computer technology in the printing industry. We saw Adobe's beta version of its Photoshop software product in San Francisco that year. Our first Macintosh computer we purchased had a 200 megabyte hard drive with 20 megs of RAM. Cost $4200. Seems silly today. Costs will come down. (Relatively) Quickly. Of that I am certain.

I agree on the costs coming down. There is massive competition in the EV space.
 
Hey, just want to thank you for that in-depth follow-up you promised and came through on vis-a-vis your BS coworker story.

Very informative ... in one way or another.

And a Zerohedge post? Keep that solid informational foundation rolling! Why not post the original Electrek story where ZH pulled the actual info from? (Rhetorical, of course)
So I got the details from my co worker. The car was just over (1 month) over three years old. She had 73000 miles on it when she sold it to a private car buying company. Even though it was out of warranty and Tesla did offer her an "allowance" in the purchase of a new Tesla, she opted to sell it privately and according to her got substantially more selling it privately. She rolled that money into a new tesla.
she paid roughly 30000 after sale of car to use it for three years. She said she notice her range slowly dropping about a year ago and then in the last six months it got substantially worse to the point she had to charge both at home and work and it became untenable for her.
 
So I got the details from my co worker. The car was just over (1 month) over three years old. She had 73000 miles on it when she sold it to a private car buying company. Even though it was out of warranty and Tesla did offer her an "allowance" in the purchase of a new Tesla, she opted to sell it privately and according to her got substantially more selling it privately. She rolled that money into a new tesla.
she paid roughly 30000 after sale of car to use it for three years. She said she notice her range slowly dropping about a year ago and then in the last six months it got substantially worse to the point she had to charge both at home and work and it became untenable for her.
This is very odd. She is so disappointed and dissatisfied with her Tesla that she bought another one? This doesn't add up....
 
So I got the details from my co worker. The car was just over (1 month) over three years old. She had 73000 miles on it when she sold it to a private car buying company. Even though it was out of warranty and Tesla did offer her an "allowance" in the purchase of a new Tesla, she opted to sell it privately and according to her got substantially more selling it privately. She rolled that money into a new tesla.
she paid roughly 30000 after sale of car to use it for three years. She said she notice her range slowly dropping about a year ago and then in the last six months it got substantially worse to the point she had to charge both at home and work and it became untenable for her.
Tesla's battery warranty is good for 8 years and 100k, 120k, or 150k miles depending on model
 
This is very odd. She is so disappointed and dissatisfied with her Tesla that she bought another one? This doesn't add up....
Where did you get that she was "so upset"? I never said she was upset and in fact she said she loves her new Tesla. She took a big hit on the initial price $62k for a car that was three years old in my opinion but she was not upset.
I would be upset, but since I am not inclined to buy a Tesla or any EV at any price I don't have to worry about it. I like to get my ICE cars to 300k miles and anything over is gravy.
I think EV cars are not more environmentally friendly than ICE cars, EV's front load their carbon release and make it up over years from not releasing exhaust. The carbon released from the manufacture of EV's is as much if not more than ICE cars. That is not even including the environmental damage that the strip mining for the raw materials for the batteries comes into play.
Someday in the distant future maybe EV's will be environmentally and economically feasible but that time is several decades into the future. Until then I will keep my lower cost and more environmentally friendly ICE cars running till my daddy takes the T-bird away!
 
Chevy has a hard time building reliable ICE cars and they have been building them for decades. I can only imagine what their EV reliability will be. I see a lot of recalls with both chevy and ford EV's
I had a GMC Suburban, which is basically a Chevy Suburban, for 20 years with nothing but very minor issues, none which affected driving. It got totally abused the entire time by me and then by 3 kids who learned how to drive in it and then used it all the time.

The wife drove it too, but didn't abuse it. She saved the abuse up for me (woo hoo! 😛).
 
I had a GMC Suburban, which is basically a Chevy Suburban, for 20 years with nothing but very minor issues, none which affected driving. It got totally abused the entire time by me and then by 3 kids who learned how to drive in it and then used it all the time.

The wife drove it too, but didn't abuse it. She saved the abuse up for me (woo hoo! 😛).
For two decades I drove nothing but American cars. My first two American cars were gems. Then I bought two jeep cherokees limiteds and it was nothing but problems. After my second jeep literally died in my driveway with 43k miles on the odometer I said never again. My last two cars have been Japanese makes. First a Toyota which lasted me for 330k miles and now a 2017 Mazda which has 140k miles with no issues so far.
 
It's not $90K for a battery.
My post said a conventional ICE Platinum F150 runs $74,000. I redid the configuration, and it actually costs $80,000, plus sales tax. To purchase the ICE F150 Platinum, you would pay $85,000.

The price of the F150 Lightning Platinum is $90,000, and minus the tax credit, it is $82,500, and no sales tax.

So, the Lightning version of the F150 is $2,500 less expensive in 2022.

The car fire numbers are BS, per Car and Driver. Score more fake news from the prime source of fake news, the New York Times. Yes, the same newspaper that reported Poland invaded Nazi Germany when the opposite happened. Don't believe everything you see on the interwebs.

Want to LOL now?

If anything is bs , Is those ridiculous numbers you just put up , again my question is the safety in these tin cans being built for those mark up prices , I paid 32k for my 2012 f150 Lariat fully equipped .
 
For two decades I drove nothing but American cars. My first two American cars were gems. Then I bought two jeep cherokees limiteds and it was nothing but problems. After my second jeep literally died in my driveway with 43k miles on the odometer I said never again. My last two cars have been Japanese makes. First a Toyota which lasted me for 330k miles and now a 2017 Mazda which has 140k miles with no issues so far.

This demonstrates nothing other than you buy cars because you need to get from Point A to Point B and care nothing about the driving experience.

Toyotas are the automotive equivalent of a vacuum cleaner.
 
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This demonstrates nothing other than you buy cars because you need to get from Point A to Point B and care nothing about the driving experience.

Toyotas are the automotive equivalent of a vacuum cleaner.
My driving experience is fine. I turn on the car and it gets me from point A to point B more efficiently than an electric car. When I am
Low on fuel, I pull into a gas station and fill it up with clean gasoline in about five minutes.
when I get hot I either open the sunroof and the windows or turn on the air conditioner. When it’s cold out I turn on the heat and heated seats.
since o drive a stick shift I feel very engaged in the “driving experience”.
now Mr. car and driver, tell us how much better your experience is.
 

PG&E's Tesla battery facility catches fire in California​


Reuters) -A fire outbreak at PG&E Corp's energy storage facility on Tuesday that uses battery packs made by Tesla Inc has shut down part of Highway 1 in California.

This came about a year after another fire broke out in a Tesla's "Megapack" battery unit in Australia during testing of one of the world's biggest energy storage projects.

Power producer PG&E said it was working with firefighters to stop the fire from spreading at the California facility, which is one of the biggest utility-owned, lithium-ion battery energy storage systems in the world. The incident has caused no electrical outage for customers, it added.
klexczlVDtCczZy6.jpeg

Glad those Tesla batteries are so clean they are spewing white smoke toxic chemicals into the atmosphere. Science has proven “white smoke” toxic chemicals from electric battery packs are much better for the environment than black smoke fossil fuel smoke. LOL!
 
My driving experience is fine. I turn on the car and it gets me from point A to point B more efficiently than an electric car. When I am
Low on fuel, I pull into a gas station and fill it up with clean gasoline in about five minutes.
when I get hot I either open the sunroof and the windows or turn on the air conditioner. When it’s cold out I turn on the heat and heated seats.
since o drive a stick shift I feel very engaged in the “driving experience”.
now Mr. car and driver, tell us how much better your experience is.

If you're driving a Toyota, there's no describing my driving experience that would even remotely resonate with you.

But here's a small bit - 2 years ago I drove from Ford City, PA to Manalapan, NJ in 3 hours flat.

Go do some math.
 
I don’t think the analogy of PCs and certain other digital devices to cars works. There is no Moore’s law for cars. Cars have only ever gotten more expensive with time.

When supply chain problems ease, and when enough time has passed for manufacturers to produce enough cars to exceed demand, then all cars, including EVs, will get less expensive.

More EV manufacturers will eventually be able to produce EVs less expensively and still make a profit, so that will mean new and less expensive models. But it won’t be like computers where the performance is improving exponentially while costs keep going down.

Inflation might drive the cost of cars down eventually. But low supply is driving costs way up. I think it might be several years, at least, before things normalize.
The average EV weighs 1000 pounds more than its comparable combustion engine, therefore they will be more expensive to build. Lower fuel and maintenance cost should equate or lower total cost over time. But because they require more materials, ones that are diminishing in supply, costs to build will never be lower than gas cars. At least in any time Frame that I can see.
 
If you're driving a Toyota, there's no describing my driving experience that would even remotely resonate with you.

But here's a small bit - 2 years ago I drove from Ford City, PA to Manalapan, NJ in 3 hours flat.

Go do some math.
So what are you driving mr car and driver, a yugo?
 

PG&E's Tesla battery facility catches fire in California​


Reuters) -A fire outbreak at PG&E Corp's energy storage facility on Tuesday that uses battery packs made by Tesla Inc has shut down part of Highway 1 in California.

This came about a year after another fire broke out in a Tesla's "Megapack" battery unit in Australia during testing of one of the world's biggest energy storage projects.

Power producer PG&E said it was working with firefighters to stop the fire from spreading at the California facility, which is one of the biggest utility-owned, lithium-ion battery energy storage systems in the world. The incident has caused no electrical outage for customers, it added.
klexczlVDtCczZy6.jpeg

Glad those Tesla batteries are so clean they are spewing white smoke toxic chemicals into the atmosphere. Science has proven “white smoke” toxic chemicals from electric battery packs are much better for the environment than black smoke fossil fuel smoke. LOL!
This is one of the more moronic things I’ve ever read.
 
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Hahaha! Oh your “mom” car Volvo is soooo much better than my Toyota. I just bet you wear tortoise shell glasses. LOL!

You'd be funny if you were 9 years old.

You really don't know a damn thing about cars. That's not good for a "man". I have 2 daughters who know more about cars than you.
 
Men don’t drive “soccer mom” cars and brag about them. At least straight men don’t! LOL

Says the guy who delights in his Toyota.

You're through here, Joanne. Run along, now. Maybe some of your pussy little friends will want to play with you.

It's funny, this board always seems to have at least one little dickweed like you. No ties to RU, don't ever go to any games, but wants to hang out on the message boards being a whiny little priss, talkin' shit about stuff you know nothing about. What's wrong, sweetie - Twitch not entertaining enough for ya? Are all the other little kids wise to your failed candy van routine? Been banned from the tooth fairy fetish subReddit?

Yeah, we know your type. Too old to hang around the playground, but not bold enough to have been put on a watch list.

Small. Time.
 
This demonstrates nothing other than you buy cars because you need to get from Point A to Point B and care nothing about the driving experience.

Toyotas are the automotive equivalent of a vacuum cleaner.

Not the sportiest brand, sure. But the best got'damn off-road vehicles on the planet ... all of it.
 
Not the sportiest brand, sure. But the best got'damn off-road vehicles on the planet ... all of it.

Shhhh... Brandi will read this and immediately set about trying to put a lift kit on his Camry.
 
Says the guy who delights in his Toyota.

You're through here, Joanne. Run along, now. Maybe some of your pussy little friends will want to play with you.

It's funny, this board always seems to have at least one little dickweed like you. No ties to RU, don't ever go to any games, but wants to hang out on the message boards being a whiny little priss, talkin' shit about stuff you know nothing about. What's wrong, sweetie - Twitch not entertaining enough for ya? Are all the other little kids wise to your failed candy van routine? Been banned from the tooth fairy fetish subReddit?

Yeah, we know your type. Too old to hang around the playground, but not bold enough to have been put on a watch list.

Small. Time.
Hahaha! Hang around at playgrounds, Is that what you do? Police APB:”be on the lookout for a guy who drives a sweeeet Volvo S60 soccer mom car and wearing horn rimmed glasses. He likes to hang out on playgrounds. LOL
 
Shhhh... Brandi will read this and immediately set about trying to put a lift kit on his Camry.

Lol. Winch, too, I hope.

I hadn't noticed quite how intense that argument was before posting. Back to the front row.
 
There's an old episode of top gear where they tried to kill an old Toyota hilux pickup and couldn't. One of my favorite episodes actually.
My Toyota lasted for 330k before the water pump went. That was the only major
Repair I had in the 13 years I owned it. I could have kept it longer but honestly just needed to change vehicles. My current Mazda is stick, fun to drive and so far with 140k on it only has needed regular maintenance. So far,
So good.
 
There's an old episode of top gear where they tried to kill an old Toyota hilux pickup and couldn't. One of my favorite episodes actually.

Great episode.

And, of course, every 3rd world "technical" operated by terror orgs everywhere is based on a HiLux.
 
Hahaha! Hang around at playgrounds, Is that what you do? Police APB:”be on the lookout for a guy who drives a sweeeet Volvo S60 soccer mom car and wearing horn rimmed glasses. He likes to hang out on playgrounds. LOL

Write your own material, Brenda.
 
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