OT: Electric vehicles

[BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap]

Vote to expand Tesla's Berlin gigafactory delayed indefinitely | TechCrunch

Grünheide municipal council delays vote to expand Tesla gigafactory Berlin due to a need for more clarification.

techcrunch.com

From the WSJ article:
"Among those incentives is a $35 per kilowatt-hour credit for U.S.-made battery cells. The law also affords $10 per kilowatt-hour for domestically produced modules, or collections of cells, and additional assistance for companies making raw and intermediate battery materials in the U.S."

This is a no-brainer decision for Tesla.

 

[mildone]

I'm now lusting after the Volvo XC60 Recharge.

Combined output from its supercharged / turbocharged ICE and 2 electric motors: 455 hp. 487 lb/ft torque. 0-60 in 4.4 seconds, per Car & Driver. 30ish miles of electric range.

Also the better part of $65,000.00. Not sure what rebates apply, as there's basically zero information on Volvo's web site.

@mildone - absent a Macan PHEV, this may be the next best thing.

I built one at their website, worked out to a hair under $80K with options (including the Ohlin's suspension, aka "Polestar Engineered" which $17K). Looks nice. 63 combined MPGe.

I would like wider wheels to go with the Ohlin's, but that might be achievable in the aftermarket depending on the wheel wheels and brakes and so forth. So might make sense to skip the Polestar upgrade and just go aftermarket for both a suspension and wheels.

Anyway, I've added it to my list. Before I settle on something, I'll go check them out in person, give it a test drive.

One small rant, not at all specific to Volvo, is that manufacturers are packaging their stuff such that it's hard to get options I do want (in this case, the upgraded sound system) without also having to pay for options I don't want or need (driving aids most of which I'd never use or disable).

I get that lots of people want that stuff (and for many, it might one day save their lives). But I don't need it and don't want to pay for it. End of rant.

 

[RU4Real]

I built one at their website, worked out to a hair under $80K with options (including the Ohlin's suspension, aka "Polestar Engineered" which $17K). Looks nice. 63 combined MPGe.

I would like wider wheels to go with the Ohlin's, but that might be achievable in the aftermarket depending on the wheel wheels and brakes and so forth. So might make sense to skip the Polestar upgrade and just go aftermarket for both a suspension and wheels.

Anyway, I've added it to my list. Before I settle on something, I'll go check them out in person, give it a test drive.

One small rant, not at all specific to Volvo, is that manufacturers are packaging their stuff such that it's hard to get options I do want (in this case, the upgraded sound system) without also having to pay for options I don't want or need (driving aids most of which I'd never use or disable).

I get that lots of people want that stuff (and for many, it might one day save their lives). But I don't need it and don't want to pay for it. End of rant.

I would skip the Ohlin dampers. Turns out they're only adjustable at the valve body - so, under the hood for the front ones, but the rears have to be adjusted by reaching up under the wheel wells with the car jacked up. Doesn't seem very user friendly.

I would in no way expect the XC60 to have the reflexes of a Macan. But Volvo builds a sweet ride and that's a LOT of sleeper performance.

My build priced out at $69,400.

 

[mildone]

I would skip the Ohlin dampers. Turns out they're only adjustable at the valve body - so, under the hood for the front ones, but the rears have to be adjusted by reaching up under the wheel wells with the car jacked up. Doesn't seem very user friendly.

I would in no way expect the XC60 to have the reflexes of a Macan. But Volvo builds a sweet ride and that's a LOT of sleeper performance.

My build priced out at $69,400.

The Ohlin's get rave reviews, and in an SUV, I wouldn't care much about adjustability. Just great handling and comfort. But yeah, it'd be better to not pay for that or the wheels and look aftermarket instead, if necessary - be less expensive to achieve the same or better results.

TBH, I don't even much care about the performance much. I still have a couple of the giant SUVs on my list for consideration and they mostly have crappy acceleration and are far from nimble. So why would a Macan even be on my list? Because it's great fun to drive. But that's more of a nice to have than a high priority for a new SUV for me.

I like the MPGe numbers of the Volvo. It works for my road-trip sensibilities, range-wise. A full 18 gallon tank and full charge might produce over 750 miles of range in "normal" driving (1134 by EPA estimates, but, you know).

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

Texas grid avoids summer blackouts with $1 billion in extra spending

Texas' electric grid operator has powered through record demand this summer by paying more to keep higher reserves and rewarding industrial consumers to cut usage, a combination that has added more than $1 billion to power fees.

www.reuters.com

Good on Texas - they were rightfully lambasted for royally screwing up. Looks like they are learning some lessons. A pair of related key elements are needed there - and everywhere - construction of the "smart grid" transmission lines connecting where renewables are produced to where the energy is used, and vast increases in energy storage solutions.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

I mostly just ignore them out here in the FB forum. They're either just trolling or just vomiting up stuff they've been told to think.

We have some pro-EV extremists and some anti-EV extremists here. Like everything else, reality lies somewhere in the middle of those extremes. IMO, reasonable dialog between reasonable people with non-extremist viewpoints get negatively affected when we confuse each other with the extremists and/or trolls.

This is wrong, and another example of both sides-ism.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

as opposed to the nonsense and ridiculous unrealistic claims by the the frequent posters who support your view? asking for a friend

This is easy. Who brings actual, real data to the discussion?

 

[RUevolution36]

This is wrong, and another example of both sides-ism.

you don't get it. there are no sides. it's not black or white. there's a whole spectrum of possibilities.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

From the WSJ article:
"Among those incentives is a $35 per kilowatt-hour credit for U.S.-made battery cells. The law also affords $10 per kilowatt-hour for domestically produced modules, or collections of cells, and additional assistance for companies making raw and intermediate battery materials in the U.S."

This is a no-brainer decision for Tesla.

I'm encouraged that a piece of major US legislation is having the intended effect of incentivizing companies to do more work here than abroad.

 

[RUevolution36]

This is easy. Who brings actual, real data to the discussion?

data that you can trace to a verifiable source? and not just a twitter repost?

 

[mildone]

This is wrong, and another example of both sides-ism.

I didn’t say extremists on either side are right. I said the answers lie so where in the middle. So how is that both sides-ism? What is wrong exactly?

 

[fsg2]

This is wrong, and another example of both sides-ism.

Nah, he's right.

It skews closer toward the pro-EV side, imo, but definitely not as far as some of you think.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

data that you can trace to a verifiable source? and not just a twitter repost?

Yes, Multiple times. Verifiable information that is easily checked.

 

[RU4Real]

Yes, Multiple times. Verifiable information that is easily checked.

Not totally sure what this little spat is about, but I will say that for things like EV range numbers, just go to Car & Driver. Their tests utilize a consistent and documented methodology and can be considered both accurate and representative of what you'd expect in "real world" situations.

 

[mildone]

Not totally sure what this little spat is about, but I will say that for things like EV range numbers, just go to Car & Driver. Their tests utilize a consistent and documented methodology and can be considered both accurate and representative of what you'd expect in "real world" situations.

I don’t know what it’s about either. I write stuff that is mostly neutral and far from anti-EV and a couple guys here flip out about it like I’ve committed sacrilege. It’s weird.

But whatever, it’s still entertaining and if it helps them get through their days, so be it.

 

[mildone]

Nah, he's right.

It skews closer toward the pro-EV side, imo, but definitely not as far as some of you think.

I agree that it skews closer to the pro-Ev side. But still nowhere near either extreme.

 

[sdwcpa]

I'm now lusting after the Volvo XC60 Recharge.

Combined output from its supercharged / turbocharged ICE and 2 electric motors: 455 hp. 487 lb/ft torque. 0-60 in 4.4 seconds, per Car & Driver. 30ish miles of electric range.

Also the better part of $65,000.00. Not sure what rebates apply, as there's basically zero information on Volvo's web site.

@mildone - absent a Macan PHEV, this may be the next best thing.

I was very fortunate to get a XC60 recharge extended range for about 61k. My timing was also good as I got it before the law changed and will get the 7500 Fed tax credit.

I don't want to jinx anything but so the car has been great. I have been getting a consistent 38-43 miles of range on a full charge and with the 455HP and the 523LB of torque the car is a rocket ship when it has to be.

 

[RU4Real]

I was very fortunate to get a XC60 recharge extended range for about 61k. My timing was also good as I got it before the law changed and will get the 7500 Fed tax credit.

I don't want to jinx anything but so the car has been great. I have been getting a consistent 38-43 miles of range on a full charge and with the 455HP and the 523LB of torque the car is a rocket ship when it has to be.

Stop, I'm begging you. Seriously, my wife is gonna be sooo f*ckin' pissed. I haven't even had my S60 for a year. 😂

 

[Knight Shift]

Stop, I'm begging you. Seriously, my wife is gonna be sooo f*ckin' pissed. I haven't even had my S60 for a year. 😂

Here's a compromise- you can buy my S60 Recharge, and I'll let you sit in the XC60 during tailgates.

I don't think we discussed it- but we love everything about our S60 Recharge, and like @sdwcpa 's experience, our S60 Recharge is exceeding the 41 mile electric range.

 

[RU4Real]

Here's a compromise- you can buy my S60 Recharge, and I'll let you sit in the XC60 during tailgates.

I don't think we discussed it- but we love everything about our S60 Recharge, and like @sdwcpa 's experience, our S60 Recharge is exceeding the 41 mile electric range.

I hate you all.

 

[mildone]

I hate you all.

You don't have to hate me. I don't even have a Volvo or a hybrid of any kind. Yet. 🙂

 

[RUevolution36]

Ford sets rules for dealers selling electric cars: Fixed no-haggle pricing - Autoblog

Ford is one of few automakers taking action against predatory dealers and insane markups, and its dealers have to get on board or get cut out.

www.autoblog.com

 

[mildone]

One week of severance for employees who’ve been there for how long?

Tesla ordered to tell laid off workers about lawsuit | TechCrunch

The lawsuit claims the company violated Section 1400 of the California Labor Code, as well as the federal Worker Adjustment and Retraining Notification Act.

techcrunch.com

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

 

[jtung230]

View embedded media

It has to be a hybrid right?

 

[fsg2]

Electric aircraft, particularly EVTOLs, are one of the most intriguing parts of electric mobility.

We're getting those damn flying cars one way or another!

 

[BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap]

It has to be a hybrid right?

No. Electric planes exist. Just very limited production or prototypes

 

[fsg2]

Detroit auto show, admittedly a shell of its former self, has a whole section dedicated to EVTOL, transport drones and the like.

 

[jtung230]

No. Electric planes exist. Just very limited production or prototypes

If the range is 200km, what’s the range limit for a flight, 100km? You have to build in some buffer for emergencies

 

[mildone]

If the range is 200km, what’s the range limit for a flight, 100km? You have to build in some buffer for emergencies

They just do a mid-air recharging. A Home Depot plane with a long extension cord or something.

 

[RU4Real]

Detroit auto show, admittedly a shell of its former self, has a whole section dedicated to EVTOL, transport drones and the like.

Hear me out.

Personal transport vehicle, basically set up like a quadcopter. Batteries, but with a turbine range extender

This is an important concept because it's efficient and *safe*. The turbine essentially acts as a redundant power source, but isn't driving the rotor blades directly.

 

[fsg2]

Hear me out.

Personal transport vehicle, basically set up like a quadcopter. Batteries, but with a turbine range extender

This is an important concept because it's efficient and *safe*. The turbine essentially acts as a redundant power source, but isn't driving the rotor blades directly.

Sounds well-suited to an electric aircraft for power-to-weight.

Thought we'd have more significant automotive examples by now after so many concepts and plans. Brits and Chinese, in particular, seem quite interested.

 

[BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap]

Hear me out.

Personal transport vehicle, basically set up like a quadcopter. Batteries, but with a turbine range extender

This is an important concept because it's efficient and *safe*. The turbine essentially acts as a redundant power source, but isn't driving the rotor blades directly.

Your neighbors will hate you.
Noise+wind and plenty of dipshits flying into power lines

 

[BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap]

It's all about battery energy density for evtol.
https://www.flightglobal.com/busine...t-makes-electric-flight-viable/140050.article

 

[pmvon]

Here's a compromise- you can buy my S60 Recharge, and I'll let you sit in the XC60 during tailgates.

I don't think we discussed it- but we love everything about our S60 Recharge, and like @sdwcpa 's experience, our S60 Recharge is exceeding the 41 mile electric range.

Curious how often you are having to use gas on a daily basis?

 

[Knight Shift]

Curious how often you are having to use gas on a daily basis?

We have not been driving much. To the office (37 miles) once or twice per week. On office days, 1 gallon. Around town for going to store, me going to fire calls, etc., nothing. Obviously, longer trips will require gas. In the normal course, we are filling up once every 3 weeks or so. For daily driving not including the 37 mile commute, we are not using gas.

 

[RU4Real]

Your neighbors will hate you.
Noise+wind and plenty of dipshits flying into power lines

Ya know they have mapping software for that stuff, right?

Hell, any power line worth its hum is already mapped on sectional charts. Memorizing that stuff is how I used to entertain my friends by flying the Delaware from Trenton to the Water Gap at 25' AGL.

 

[pmvon]

I’ve been looking at the Model 3 again and surprised to find used car prices the same or in some cases above new. Supply and demand I guess given delays.

Given this thread is 153 pages this has probably been mentioned before.

 

[OntheBanks]

Curious how often you are having to use gas on a daily basis?

Right now for my Ford Escape SEL PHEV I have gone approx. 1000 miles with 100 on gas. When I picked up the car on June 29th the dealer did not charge it and I drove 23 miles home on gas. My daily driving is below the estimated 37 miles on a full charge. The reason that I have 100 miles on gas is because I have the ability to set my drive mode to gas only and I want to reduce my estimated miles left on gas to 50 miles. When I get to 50 miles left I will put in $5 of gas to keep the gas fresh in the 11 gallon tank.
One other thing, I set my charge level to only be up to 80% charged. I'm told this allows the battery to last longer.

 

[Rutgers Chris]

I’ve been looking at the Model 3 again and surprised to find used car prices the same or in some cases above new. Supply and demand I guess given delays.

Given this thread is 153 pages this has probably been mentioned before.

I was just looking at this last week. Pretty sure I could get $5k or more than I paid for my model 3 a year ago