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OT: Electric vehicles

BROTHERSKINNY said:
Agreed. But whose choice should it be to decide what people drive, the individual or the governments?
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I'm pretty anti-government, with reasonable limits. I freely chose a plug-in hybrid for vehicle 1 in our house and a full EV F150 Lightning for vehicle 2. The government had no role, however, $15,000 in tax credits was a small inducement. Same for considering buying solar panels for our home. In my view, that's the government at it's best- giving people reasons and/or incentives to adopt new/newer technologies that in some respect are beneficial to mankind. Excuse me, but I have to go hug a tree.
 
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WhichReligionIsRight said:
A problem many people have it being able to look outside their own personal experiences to see the larger world. OK, you live out in the country with RVs and lots of pickups used for everyday life. I'm here to tell you that is a comparatively rare experience. EVs may not become popular in rural areas for a while (or maybe not - the F150 Lightning and Rivian models seem to me to be well-suited to rural lifestyles). That's OK. There are plenty of folks can use and are willing to buy EVs now and in the future. Check back in two years when EVs account for >10% of new car sales. Many of your neighbors will be wanting EVs for themselves and their families.
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Lol, ironic post of the year?

I live in a metro area that looks more like NJ than the "country," fwiw.

Having driven multiple times through the heart of the US, I know that most of it looks more like I'm describing in terms of trucks and usage than it does downtown San Francisco. Tell me people up and down California don't tow boats to lakes and ocean, campers and snowmobiles into the mountains, UTVs and dune buggies into the desert. Every weekend. Just try. Then tell me the giant construction industry doesn't need to carry and tow GVWR-pushing loads of tools and materials to make that state into the massive sprawl it's become.

But good thing I have you to inform me how rare that all is. I'll be sure to spread the word. It might take a while to reach that 99 (soon to be 90!!) percent of the driving population that doesn't have an EV, though, so don't anticipate immediate results.
 
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fsg2 said:
Lol, ironic post of the year?

I live in a metro area that looks more like NJ than the "country," fwiw.

Having driven multiple times through the heart of the US, I know that most of it looks more like I'm describing in terms of trucks and usage than it does downtown San Francisco. Tell me people up and down California don't tow boats to lakes and ocean, campers and snowmobiles into the mountains, UTVs and dune buggies into the desert. Every weekend. Just try. Then tell me the giant construction industry doesn't need to carry and tow GVWR-pushing loads of tools and materials to make that state into the massive sprawl it's become.

But good thing I have you to inform me how rare that all is. I'll be sure to spread the word. It might take a while to reach that 99 (soon to be 90!!) percent of the driving population that doesn't have an EV, though, so don't anticipate immediate results.
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Are you always this sensitive? Just get over the idea that relatively few people tow stuff and that even for people who do tow stuff, most only tow once or twice a year.
 
WhichReligionIsRight said:
Are you always this sensitive? Just get over the idea that relatively few people tow stuff and that even for people who do tow stuff, most only tow once or twice a year.
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Sensitive? Hardly.

The few e-zealots on here make arguments that are silly and laughable.

Towing was but a tangent to a greater point I don't even need to make. That 1 percent figure does it for me.

It's not even worth breaking a whopping 1 percent down any further, but I am curious how many EV drivers belong to a household with an ICE-inclusive vehicle, which is both the arrangement for which I advocated for myself and an effective ...wait for it ...Plug In Hybrid set -up! If you're a single-driver household, having two vehicles (EV and ICE) would most likely flip the entire EV financial benefit argument on its head, and your best bet would be ....a Plug In Hybrid!!

Welcome back to yesterday; sorry you wasted your time. Let's proceed as originally scheduled.
 
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I continue to get the vibe from several here (who don't own an EV but only read about them from suspect sources) that the range reported by our cars is a lie, that it's always an overestimate which is why the purported savings from EV ownership is a scam of sorts.
So I got annoyed by this enough to make this video 30 minutes ago...
 
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WhichReligionIsRight said:
A problem many people have it being able to look outside their own personal experiences to see the larger world. OK, you live out in the country with RVs and lots of pickups used for everyday life. I'm here to tell you that is a comparatively rare experience. EVs may not become popular in rural areas for a while (or maybe not - the F150 Lightning and Rivian models seem to me to be well-suited to rural lifestyles). That's OK. There are plenty of folks can use and are willing to buy EVs now and in the future. Check back in two years when EVs account for >10% of new car sales. Many of your neighbors will be wanting EVs for themselves and their families.
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By the same token, tons of people live in cities in apartments or high rise condos and don’t have access to charging at home. Those folks are going to have a very different outlook on range than folks who own a home where they can charge every night.
 
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WhichReligionIsRight said:
Here we go again. Shitting on data with absolutely no counter-factuals. Just feelings.

Hint: There's a source cited at the bottom of the chart. Second hint: The numbers are legit. The bean counters know how to count car sales.
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Shitting? No. I asked a simple question that you should be asking before accepting some chart from the internet as fully accurate. I didn’t see any source cited and I still don’t. Perhaps one must view It on Twitter?

And no, I am not basing anything here on feelings at all. You’re projecting your way of looking at this stuff, if you think my feelings are involved in any way. Only time I’m expressing feelings is when discussing stuff like why I don’t want an EV sports car and will likely never own one.

Not trusting data cited in the internet without validation is logical and in the interests of being well-informed, versus just being informed.
 
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mildone said:
Shitting? No. I asked a simple question that you should be asking before accepting some chart from the internet as fully accurate. I didn’t see any source cited and I still don’t. Perhaps one must view It on Twitter?

And no, I am not basing anything here on feelings at all. You’re projecting your way of looking at this stuff, if you think my feelings are involved in any way. Only time I’m expressing feelings is when discussing stuff like why I don’t want an EV sports car and will likely never own one.

Not trusting data cited in the internet without validation is logical and in the interests of being well-informed, versus just being informed.
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You are making the same tired old arguments. You could have taken 30 seconds out of your life to vet the group that provided the data - and maybe five more minutes to verify the data is accurate. Or not. Instead, you choose to continue emoting (in your case distrust).

The data from the chart shown is accurate.
 
mildone said:
By the same token, tons of people live in cities in apartments or high rise condos and don’t have access to charging at home. Those folks are going to have a very different outlook on range than folks who own a home where they can charge every night.
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This is all fine and right. I'll post is again - EVs are not for everyone. Yet.
 
jtung230 said:
I use Electrified America and no issues. Not sure where you are getting the “close to half” number.
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I have been fortunate enough to handle my charging needs from my own garage for my PHEV. There are multiple blogs out there with posts from people that have pulled into an Electrify America or Charge Point charging station and finding half or sometimes more than half of the charging lines broken.
 
WhichReligionIsRight said:
Your two premises are wrong. Try again.
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You're not normally an asshole in this forum or even this thread. But you've definitely been trending that way over the past few days.

You're making unprovoked attacks on multiple people, misstating what they wrote, repeatedly misjudging their intentions even when they clarify it for you, and casting stuff people write that isn't in full agreement with your viewpoint in a bad light. In my case, you're responding to innocent posts as if you're being attacked when that's not at all what I've been doing; you're definitely misreading me.

Is everything okay with you?
 
LBusDoor90 said:
I continue to get the vibe from several here (who don't own an EV but only read about them from suspect sources) that the range reported by our cars is a lie, that it's always an overestimate which is why the purported savings from EV ownership is a scam of sorts.
So I got annoyed by this enough to make this video 30 minutes ago...
View embedded media
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Several automotive magazines/websites that do vehicle testing test range on EVs using their own "normal driving" metrics. And a lot of EVs aren't reaching their EPA listed ranges when driven normally. These magazine/websites have been around forever and there is nothing suspect about their reporting at all - they're certainly more objective than manufacturers are when it comes to verifying claimed specs.

That's not calling EV manufacturers liars or claiming EPA range numbers are a scam. It's just using real world testing versus much more constrained testing or using manufacturer numbers which should always be verified by objective parties.

If anything is a suspect source, it's lots of stuff reposted from social media which is often filled with misinformation/disinformation about all kinds of stuff.

And, other than a couple people who are clearly just trolling, none of the regulars in this thread are anti-EV at all, nor have any of us claimed that EV ownership is a scam.
 
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WhichReligionIsRight said:
Sorry, but towing something is "fringe". How many people tow, and of those who do, what percent of their trips are towing something. Maybe 5% of people actually tow something and they tow maybe 1% of the time. So, we're talking about fringe travel behaviors. Once again, EVs are not for everyone. Yet.
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Exactly; only a small percentage of drivers fit that example.
 
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sdwcpa said:
I have been fortunate enough to handle my charging needs from my own garage for my PHEV. There are multiple blogs out there with posts from people that have pulled into an Electrify America or Charge Point charging station and finding half or sometimes more than half of the charging lines broken.
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Again, just sharing my experience. No issues with Electrified America so far. Have 3 years of 30 min fast charging for free through VW.
 
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mildone said:
Several automotive magazines/websites that do vehicle testing test range on EVs using their own "normal driving" metrics. And a lot of EVs aren't reaching their EPA listed ranges when driven normally. These magazine/websites have been around forever and there is nothing suspect about their reporting at all - they're certainly more objective than manufacturers are when it comes to verifying claimed specs.

That's not calling EV manufacturers liars or claiming EPA range numbers are a scam. It's just using real world testing versus much more constrained testing or using manufacturer numbers which should always be verified by objective parties.

If anything is a suspect source, it's lots of stuff reposted from social media which is often filled with misinformation/disinformation about all kinds of stuff.

And, other than a couple people who are clearly just trolling, none of the regulars in this thread are anti-EV at all, nor have any of us claimed that EV ownership is a scam.
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Fair enough. To clarify, I’m referring to the “hit and run” crowd that pops in very occasionally, often just to share “wisdom” in line with what they have contributed on the CE board or other threads rife with political posturing.
 
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LBusDoor90 said:
Fair enough. To clarify, I’m referring to the “hit and run” crowd that pops in very occasionally, often just to share “wisdom” in line with what they have contributed on the CE board or other threads rife with political posturing.
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as opposed to the nonsense and ridiculous unrealistic claims by the the frequent posters who support your view? asking for a friend
 
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WhichReligionIsRight said:
A problem many people have it being able to look outside their own personal experiences to see the larger world. OK, you live out in the country with RVs and lots of pickups used for everyday life. I'm here to tell you that is a comparatively rare experience. EVs may not become popular in rural areas for a while (or maybe not - the F150 Lightning and Rivian models seem to me to be well-suited to rural lifestyles). That's OK. There are plenty of folks can use and are willing to buy EVs now and in the future. Check back in two years when EVs account for >10% of new car sales. Many of your neighbors will be wanting EVs for themselves and their families.
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Define rare...
 
LBusDoor90 said:
Fair enough. To clarify, I’m referring to the “hit and run” crowd that pops in very occasionally, often just to share “wisdom” in line with what they have contributed on the CE board or other threads rife with political posturing.
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I mostly just ignore them out here in the FB forum. They're either just trolling or just vomiting up stuff they've been told to think.

We have some pro-EV extremists and some anti-EV extremists here. Like everything else, reality lies somewhere in the middle of those extremes. IMO, reasonable dialog between reasonable people with non-extremist viewpoints get negatively affected when we confuse each other with the extremists and/or trolls.
 
I'm now lusting after the Volvo XC60 Recharge.

Combined output from its supercharged / turbocharged ICE and 2 electric motors: 455 hp. 487 lb/ft torque. 0-60 in 4.4 seconds, per Car & Driver. 30ish miles of electric range.

Also the better part of $65,000.00. Not sure what rebates apply, as there's basically zero information on Volvo's web site.

@mildone - absent a Macan PHEV, this may be the next best thing.
 
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