Certain cars, yes. The used car market is obscene right now. Ppl are paying more for used than new for certain models because the new ones are on several month back order. My BIL wanted a minivan for his growing family, so he waited 6 months for a new Toyota Sienna. He could have had a used one sooner, but it would have been the same price, plus 20k+ miles, as the brand new, redesigned model.
OT: Electric vehicles
- Thread starter BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap
- Start date
Congrats, I've had my Model 3 long range for 3 weeks now and am loving it. Once I was able to get the outlet installed in my garage last week, I've had no issues with charging.
The used car market is insane. Astounding offers for both electric and ICE.
Traded in a 2.5 year old Altima SV earlier this month with 56k miles on it. Checked in to see what they were doing with it. They listed it for $22k. I drove by 3 days later and it was gone.
I'd buy a Tesla or a Ford or almost any other brand despite such stories. All cars from all manufacturers suffer somewhat serious issues from time to time. My approach isn't to avoid specific manufacturers so much as to avoid being an early adopter of any model. Let others be the guinea pigs.
It's happening with a number of different cars these days. It's pretty nuts and I'm glad I'm in a position to put any purchases until it normalizes again.
Some manufacturers are actually prohibiting owners of leased cars from selling the lease to anybody but their own dealerships. Because other dealers are purchasing leases for more than they are worth because they know they can turn around and sell the car for even more. Strange times.
Well said. I hope you enjoy yours as much as I have mine for 3+ years so far.
There was never a point in audio history when Sony and the Japanese didn't know exactly what they were doing either. Until Steve Jobs. Full disclosure I am a Tesla owner and I love the car, but there is a reason the capital markets view Tesla as a more valuable company than the next five automakers combined. And it isn't because the capital markets are "fan boys".
Just my $0.02.
I don't think that's really a compelling argument. The factors that drive buying behavior in the markets aren't always the same as those that drive product purchases. TSLA is overvalued on many levels. Not saying that makes it a bad product - just that, as markets are not economic indicators, so are market prices not reflective of consumer behavior.
Fit and finish problems are drastically overblown. Inspect your vehicle, and if you're not satisfied, don't accept delivery until problems are corrected.
Ordering a car on your phone is awful? I guess you miss the pleasure of dealing with car dealerships.
Tesla is the pioneer of the charging infrastructure. They are the standard.
Love to hear your thoughts why Elon is a jerk, but based on your previous comments, it seems like you fall victim to a lot of clickbait headlines.
Enjoy your car!
It's probably pointless to get in an argument over this and I have my preferences, but we should be objective...
I didn't say fit and finish. I said build quality. The car clearly is designed and built to a price point. Of course there is a bunch of money tied up in batteries so it's not going to be like a $40k or $50k car, but it's objectively below say... the Volkswagen GLI (MSRP ~30k) I test drove.
I live in a state where Tesla can't sell cars direct so I guess that's on the state legislature, but the experience at our local showroom or whatever it's called is less than stellar. The smugness of the sales people is hard to take. When I made an appointment to pick the car up in the next state, I told I couldn't pickup the car on a Saturday and the delivery dates and times were take it or leave it. I did end up pushing enough to get an appointment for Saturday, but is there another car dealer in America that wouldn't be happy to let you pick up a car on a Saturday?
As far as I am concerned J1772 is the standard for AC charging (yes I know there is an adapter) and CCS is the standard for DC charging. It's what every other automaker is using.
Elon Musk is a jerk. The "SEC middle word is Elon's" tweet is just one example. Adults don't make public statements like that.
I like the car, I really do. I'm spending over $50k on one. It's the best option for me right now. In no way is it perfect, there's a lot of room for improvement. The cult of personality around Elon Musk and the whole company is absurd, and probably doing more harm than good toward the adoption of EVs.
Thanks for sharing your experience and I'm glad you like you new ride.
In 2+ years of ownership, I've only been to a service center once and that was to pick up my car. I was in and out in less than an hour and my sales rep was a gentleman through the whole process leading up to my delivery date. I hope your experience was an anomaly. I also had mobile service come to my house once. Also, a positive experience.
As far as Elon, cookie cutter CEOs don't change the world. He's definitely different. Tesla's mission statement is to "accelerate the transition to sustainable energy". Key word: accelerate. Do you really think EV adoption and awareness would be where it is today without Tesla? You may disagree with his methods, but it's hard to argue the results.
Definitely a good sign. Hope we see more domestic battery recycling and manufacturing.
Ford announces partnership with Tesla cofounder JB Straubel’s Redwood on batteries
Ford announces partnership with Tesla cofounder JB Straubel’s Redwood on batteries
Thought someone said that other company CEO's don't care? 🙂
Also, this is a quote is being presented without any context. To what is the CEO responding? It's impossible to judge the quote on it's own merits without knowing the context for it.
Tesla Drivers Using Autopilot Watch the Road Less, MIT Study Shows
It may seem self-evident, but the fact it was confirmed by an MIT study is what's interesting.
Tesla rolls out FSD Beta with safety scores. (Note: I still can't access my safety score yet)
cleantechnica.com
Tesla Rolls Out "FSD Beta Button" & "Safety Score" To Countless Tesla Owners - CleanTechnica
Sign up for daily news updates from CleanTechnica on email. Or follow us on Google News! After a long — often impatient — wait, Tesla owners across the United States have nearly gotten access to the company’s “FSD Beta” driver-assist software for city streets. As one of those owners, I’m ...
cleantechnica.com
Not a good look:
www.cnbc.com
Elon Musk praises China, says Tesla will continue to expand investments there
It's the second time this month Musk was highly complimentary of the nation that's imperative to his electric vehicle company, saying it's a "global leader in digitalization."
Not a good look:
Elon Musk praises China, says Tesla will continue to expand investments there
It's the second time this month Musk was highly complimentary of the nation that's imperative to his electric vehicle company, saying it's a "global leader in digitalization."
Especially as he's made some statements about non-Chinese subjects that would have gotten him Jack Ma'ed if they were, and he has a tendency to speak first and then consider the implications later.
$TSLA is 1000% pumped up by fan boys, there is no one that can say otherwise with a straight face. It is more of a religion than a car company but it doesn't take much for a facade to crumble.
Haven't we done this already? 2007 quotes about iPhone:
""There’s no chance that the iPhone is going to get any significant market share. No chance. It’s a $500 subsidized item. They may make a lot of money. But if you actually take a look at the 1.3 billion phones that get sold, I’d prefer to have our software in 60% or 70% or 80% of them, than I would to have 2% or 3%, which is what Apple might get."
-Steve Ballmer
"That virtual keyboard will be about as useful for tapping out emails and text messages as a rotary phone. Don’t be surprised if a sizable contingent of iPhone buyers express some remorse at ditching their BlackBerry when they spend an extra hour each day pumping out emails on the road."
- TechCrunch
"I have three specific reasons why the iPhone’s design will cause it to crash in flames the way Apple’s late and unlamented Newton did, only much more loudly and publicly because of all the hype it’s gotten. First, the iPhone ignores the main reasons that the iPod succeeded: simplicity and ease of use. Second, the iPhone crams too many functions into a single box. Putting everything in the same package so you only have to carry one box sounds like a good idea, until you want to listen to music while surfing the web or reading your email or playing a game. Third, users will detest the touch screen interface due to its lack of tactile feedback. Using a thumb keyboard, as on the very popular Treo phone, allows the user to feel the keys and know subconsciously that he’s about to press this one and not the one next to it. A touch screen doesn’t allow that, so the user will have to be looking at the keyboard at all times while using it."
-Tech author David Platt
"The Apple phone will be exclusive to one of the major networks in each territory and some customers will switch networks just to get it, but not as many as had been hoped. As customers start to realise that the competition offers better functionality at a lower price, by negotiating a better subsidy, sales will stagnate. After a year a new version will be launched, but it will lack the innovation of the first and quickly vanish.mThe only question remaining is if, when the iPod phone fails, it will take the iPod with it."
-Tech journalist Bill Ray
"Apparently none of you guys realize how bad of an idea a touch-screen is on a phone. I foresee some pretty obvious and pretty major problems here. I'll be keeping my Samsung A707, thanks. It's smaller, it's got a protected screen, and it's got proper buttons. And it's got all the same features otherwise."
"Apparently none of you guys realize how bad of an idea a touch-screen is on a phone. I foresee some pretty obvious and pretty major problems here. I'll be keeping my Samsung A707, thanks. It's smaller, it's got a protected screen, and it's got proper buttons. And it's got all the same features otherwise."
"Touch screen buttons? BAD idea. This thing will never work."
-Tech User forum
Paradigm shifts are only noticeable years later. Apple's market cap was $100B in 2007. There were a TON of people who would have told you Apple was overvalued in 2007. Apple's market cap is $2.4T today. Maybe Tesla isn't to auto industry what Apple was to tech industry. Maybe it is. I didn't bet against Steve Jobs and I am not betting against Elon Musk. Time will tell.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/bensin...hought-the-iphone-would-fail/?sh=63aeef18544e
i don't think it's as much fanboys pumping up the stock as it is people hoping to cash in on a lottery ticket.
You're clueless.
Stocks don't run because of retail investors like you and I.
There must be a lot of "fan boys" in those billion dollar investment firms.
Stop buying into the disinformation campaign and take a look at the disruption Tesla is causing across a wide swath of multibillion dollar financial sectors. There's a reason Tesla is constantly under attack. They represent disruption. Change. Just like Apple did.
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And the "atheists" will admit it's a car company but the fan boys won't admit it's a religion.
You must be clueless or have been under a rock the last year if you think retail investors don't have clout
You are trying to compare a sub $1000 cell phone which even poor people have and a company that has a near monopoly (duopoly) on the device to a "luxury" car company, who sells overpriced cars with promises they can't keep, and who also admits they will never be as large as the biggest players?
If you are going to put your money in a religious stock like this, at least put it in one that is going to be a monopoly or at least a big player. Tesla is neither.
It's neither. Stop hating because you think you missed the boat and are bitter. Still time to jump in. By 2030, today's stock price will look like a typo.
Can you please at least read if you are going to reply to me? Read again then maybe come back with something remotely making sense.
Another guy who doesn't understand exponential growth.
Obviously you dont and you dont listen to Elon when he makes his wild promises he won't keep. There are some truths in there like Tesla will never be a large car manufacturer like GM or Toyota.
This isn't Amazon spending all their money on growing to become a monopoly.
And like I said it is a religion and you are a drone zealot so enjoy your day and hope you cash in on the waves because those foundations are built on top of sand.
I owned a printing company back in the early 90's. Sold it in '99. We were one of the early adopters of Apple technology in that space which is now dominated by Apple product. I kept and still have an early MacWorld magazine which featured the first computer we bought on its cover. The machine had 160mB hard drive and 4 mB of RAM. Sold for about $3,000. Ten years later (2002) the same price bought this tech: 512 MB RAM, 80 GB hard drive.
(imo) Over the next ten years Tesla will lead in battery tech and charging tech. Think about my example above and then think what tech Tesla will have in its cars/batteries and charging stations in ten years. We simply disagree if you think the map below isn't completely filled in with red with tech at 5x-10x speed and capacity in 5-10 years.
Current Tesla supercharging stations:
That would be nice if Telsa owned and operated the battery production, but they don't. Compare your nice little map to gas stations and then you can start talking there.I owned a printing company back in the early 90's. Sold it in '99. We were one of the early adopters of Apple technology in that space which is now dominated by Apple product. I kept and still have an early MacWorld magazine which featured the first computer we bought on its cover. The machine had 160mB hard drive and 4 mB of RAM. Sold for about $3,000. Ten years later (2002) the same price bought this tech: 512 MB RAM, 80 GB hard drive.
(imo) Over the next ten years Tesla will lead in battery tech and charging tech. Think about my example above and then think what tech Tesla will have in its cars/batteries and charging stations in ten years. We simply disagree if you think the map below isn't completely filled in with red with tech at 5x-10x speed and capacity in 5-10 years.
Current Tesla supercharging stations:
Ranked: The Top 10 EV Battery Manufacturers
With an increasing interest in electric vehicles (EVs), the battery market is now a $27 billion per year business.
elements.visualcapitalist.com
Guess you haven't seen the giant factories being built in Berlin and Texas. Another factory announcement probably next year. Demand soaring. $25K Tesla in 2023. Don't forget all the other "wild promises" like autonomy, AI, front & rear vehicle castings, batteries, charging infrastructure, robotics, neural network training, supercomputers, solar, energy storage, insurance. Ya know, all the same stuff that GM and Toyota are doing.
What is Tesla spending its money on? Educate me please.
One of us will be on the right side of history.
You're assuming Moore's Law applies to batteries.I owned a printing company back in the early 90's. Sold it in '99. We were one of the early adopters of Apple technology in that space which is now dominated by Apple product. I kept and still have an early MacWorld magazine which featured the first computer we bought on its cover. The machine had 160mB hard drive and 4 mB of RAM. Sold for about $3,000. Ten years later (2002) the same price bought this tech: 512 MB RAM, 80 GB hard drive.
(imo) Over the next ten years Tesla will lead in battery tech and charging tech. Think about my example above and then think what tech Tesla will have in its cars/batteries and charging stations in ten years. We simply disagree if you think the map below isn't completely filled in with red with tech at 5x-10x speed and capacity in 5-10 years.
Current Tesla supercharging stations:
Not bitter at all. I guess your religion has it's "Oh ye of little faith" commentaries of it's own.
I am (sort of).
Biotech/Genome sequencing (for example) clearly out paces Moore's law. BUT battery tech is reliant on chemical reactions so it could be on the complete other side of the spectrum and far underperform Moore's law.
Again time will tell. But (imo) Musk is the best when it comes to auto tech in 2021 and I tend to respect and bet on those I think have the ability to generate huge paradigm shifts (Jobs, Bezos, Watson/Crick, etc.).
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