That's great, except when it comes to auto accidents, it's not the weak or stupid that always die.
https://www.news-journalonline.com/...k-while-roller-skating-ormond-sea/6780416002/
OT: Electric vehicles
- Thread starter BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap
- Start date
https://www.news-journalonline.com/...k-while-roller-skating-ormond-sea/6780416002/
GM advising some Bolt EV owners to park 50 feet away from other cars in case of fire
The warning follows GM recalling more than 140,000 of the EVs due to the risk of batteries spontaneously catching fire.
How long until GM is forced to buy back all of these?
Vitriol? Really? 😀
I can only speak for myself of course, but if I’m being vitriolic, then I must be among the happiest and most light-hearted of vitriolic persons in history. Most of us are having great fun here. Hopefully including you.
If you are perceiving vitriol from anybody, then I’d suggest it’s you that is either misinterpreting the tone or intent behind what’s written or else perhaps is projecting.
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Yeah, that’s nuts. The problem now, for me, is that I habitually park as far from everyone as possible. Bolt owners are gonna start parking closer to me. 😮GM advising some Bolt EV owners to park 50 feet away from other cars in case of fire
The warning follows GM recalling more than 140,000 of the EVs due to the risk of batteries spontaneously catching fire.www.cnbc.com
How long until GM is forced to buy back all of these?
Collateral damage. And statistically speaking, it’s almost always the weak and stupid who die, even as collateral damage. I mean, 100 is the average IQ and it sure ain’t smart, right?
There is already a full recall of every Bolt ever made.GM advising some Bolt EV owners to park 50 feet away from other cars in case of fire
The warning follows GM recalling more than 140,000 of the EVs due to the risk of batteries spontaneously catching fire.
How long until GM is forced to buy back all of these?
I guess it just takes time.
The recall is for GM to repair. But there is a growing sentiment that consumers wish that they would just do a buy back.
Nor does he bother to address the various nuances relative to number of fatalities in underdeveloped nations, how those fatalities are predominantly related to poor (or non-existent) infrastructure and how Elon's Electronomic Conveyances would be of little impact in those environments.
This guy would make a great 9/11 Truther.
This is the big EV news today, but not so much in a "beat Tesla" way, although that's notable.
520 miles ...EPA rated. That's legit, the kind of figure that should help vanquish limited range arguments.
SK Innovation shareholders approve plan to split off battery business
SK Innovation Co Ltd (096770.KS) said on Thursday its shareholders had approved the company's proposal to separate its battery business into a new company.
www.reuters.com
also battery news in the EV space...
New Lightning plant—
www.google.com
Ford started churning out electric F-150s for customers — see inside the cutting-edge factory where the Lightning is built
We got a firsthand look inside the new plant where Ford is building the electric version of its massively popular F-150 truck.
www.google.com
Ford hiring 450 more Lightning employees—
www.google.com
Ford boosts spending to increase production capacity of its F-150 Lightning electric truck | TechCrunch
Ford said Thursday it will invest another $250 million and add 450 jobs to increase production capacity of its upcoming F-150 Lightning to 80,000
www.google.com
Agreed. I've been saying that I suspect range concerns will be addressed in the not too distant future. At the pace it's taking me to choose and buy an SUV, I might wind up with an EV SUV sooner rather than later.
Lucid looks amazing, but the first car out of the box will be $169,000. In any case, competition is great for consumers.
GM might have sealed their fate in the design studio. Large pouch style cells are more prone to thermal runaway. Combine that with defects from the manufacturing process and you get the current mess GM and LG Chem have on their hands.
Different Battery Form Factors and Fire Risk
Yep, Lucid is thinking to play in the higher end market. Will be interesting to see how they do.
But I really like seeing the increases in range. Everybody will push each other on that and on making the cars lighter and the result will be even more awesome EVs in 5-10 years, I think. Hopefully across all price ranges.
:
The lowest trim Air is under $80K before gov credits and has 406 miles (not EPA rated yer). Undercuts the Model S Long Range by around $15K.
But that's OK, Musk says there's no need for more than 400 miles 😂
The lowest trim Air is under $80K before gov credits and has 406 miles (not EPA rated yer). Undercuts the Model S Long Range by around $15K.
But that's OK, Musk says there's no need for more than 400 miles 😂
Does he really say that? If so, that would be incredibly self-absorbed. Not that he's trying to market what he has now so much as that he thinks his opinion about what people want or need is somehow more valid that what people actually want or need. And that he thinks we're too weak-minded to decide for ourselves.
Yeah, they announced a Plaid+ spec back in January with supposed 520 miles of range (not a reaction to Lucid at all ; ), then canceled it earlier in the summer because regular Plaid is "too good." Then he expanded by saying they found people don't really need any more than 400 miles ...pure bs, especially with charging times as they are.
Sounds like maybe he considers wishful thinking to be the same thing as engineering.
Lowest trim Air will not be available until 2023 if all goes well. Get off of your knees for Lucid for a second and realize they're just at the base of the mountain. Prototypes are easy (relatively speaking). Scaling production, especially of new technology, is the hard part. Several orders of magnitude more difficult. Manufacturing is often overlooked and underappreciated. I wish Lucid luck. The more EVs on the road, the better.
BTW...what's the pack size of the Lucid Dream? I can't find it. Not sure if released. 520 miles of range is very impressive, but efficiency is measured in kWh/mile.
We’ll, if we’re gonna get all competitive about everything…
Lucid is kicking Tesla’s butt already and they’ve barely gotten started. Wait till Lucid starts cranking ‘em out.
Ford will crush the repeatedly delayed Tesla truck. And Ford’s been doing this difficult manufacturing thing since long before Elon was even a gleam is his momma’s eye.
Finally, both Porsche and Audi build better looking EVs that, despite having lower specs, sell for more money than the Tesla offerings. Which, in the orders of magnitude more difficult world of automotive manufacturing, is a profit-margin beat-down of Tesla.
It’s good that Tesla got a head start so they hopefully can remain at least a little competitive for awhile longer. Because, as you say, the more EVs on the road the better.
😉
I know you're poking, but there is a misconception about the ground that legacy auto has to make up and the hurdles on the horizon.
Audi e-Tron: 700 kg pack weight
95 kWh pack capacity
218 mi range
Those are embarrassing specs from an established brand. Most likely negative margins on every one produced, especially given the volume is so low. In summary, ICE ain't EV.
And, let's not forget about Chinese EVs. China tends excel at replication rather than innovation, but they do have access to localized supply chains and a cheaper labor force. I think we're going to see the Chinese brands do exactly what the Japanese did in the 90s.
Most of the major manufacturers are using the Li-ion battery packs as a stop gap before solid state. Which I don't know if I've heard that Tesla is working on. Solid state is just about ready...just need to get the production lines down. That should address the weight and range problems.
Lmao ..off my knees? Only one who's fluffing for a team is you. Lucid has done one thing quite well, no idea if the rest of the car is any good.
Pack is 113 kwh, iirc.
The lower price Lucids are not on the market, and probably won't be for at least a year.
Solid state batteries have been around for decades.
"just need to get the production lines down"
I LOL'ed at that.
Unimaginably difficult. Imagine trying to design a production line that glues together thousands of the most fragile/brittle potato chips. Perfectly arranged without any chips breaking. That's kinda like what you're dealing with with solid state. It remains a daunting engineering task.
I wouldn't count on solid state any time soon.
Sodium ion batteries (replacing lithium) is the new "latest and greatest". I don't know much other than they're supposedly safer and cheaper, but currently less energy dense than cells that use lithium.
Since you need some sort of refresher:
What are solid-state batteries and how will they make electric cars better? - Autoblog
How are they different? What are the advantages? Why are they difficult to mass-produce? Who's trying to make them?
www.autoblog.com
"Japan's Toyota Motor Corp is one of the front runners to mass produce solid-state batteries. It has said it is struggling with their short service life but still intends to start making them by mid 2020s.
In addition to Toyota's in-house research, it has teamed up with Japan's Panasonic Corp to develop these powerpacks with their Prime Planet Energy & Solutions Inc venture.
Close on their heels, Germany's Volkswagen has invested in Bill Gates-backed U.S. battery firm QuantumScape Corp, which aims to introduce its battery in 2024 for VW's EVs and eventually for other carmakers.
VW says the battery will offer about 30% more range than a liquid one and charge to 80% capacity in 12 minutes, which is less than half the time of the fastest charging li-ion cells now available.
Stellantis, formed in January by the merger of Italian-American automaker Fiat Chrysler and France's PSA, has a venture called Automotive Cells Co with TotalEnergies and a partnership with China's Contemporary Amperex Technology Co Ltd (CATL). Stellantis intends to introduce solid-state batteries by 2026.
Ford Motor Co and BMW AG have invested in startup Solid Power, which says its solid-state technology can deliver 50% more energy density than current lithium-ion batteries. Ford expects to cut battery costs by 40% by mid-decade.
South Korea's Hyundai Motor, which has invested in startup SolidEnergy Systems, plans to mass produce solid-state batteries in 2030.
Samsung SDI Co Ltd, an affiliate of Samsung Electronics Co Ltd, is working on developing solid-state batteries.
EV market leader Tesla Inc has so far not said it wants to develop or use solid-state cells in its cars."
Toyota’s Big Bet On Solid State Batteries Could Boost The Entire Sector
The world's largest automaker has just raised the stakes in the solid-state battery sector after announcing its intention to invest over $13.5 billion by 2030
I'm well aware. I was responding to his point that Lucid is only playing in the high priced market. They're merely launching the higher priced models first.
Since you need some sort of refresher:
What are solid-state batteries and how will they make electric cars better? - Autoblog
How are they different? What are the advantages? Why are they difficult to mass-produce? Who's trying to make them?
"Japan's Toyota Motor Corp is one of the front runners to mass produce solid-state batteries. It has said it is struggling with their short service life but still intends to start making them by mid 2020s.
In addition to Toyota's in-house research, it has teamed up with Japan's Panasonic Corp to develop these powerpacks with their Prime Planet Energy & Solutions Inc venture.
Close on their heels, Germany's Volkswagen has invested in Bill Gates-backed U.S. battery firm QuantumScape Corp, which aims to introduce its battery in 2024 for VW's EVs and eventually for other carmakers.
VW says the battery will offer about 30% more range than a liquid one and charge to 80% capacity in 12 minutes, which is less than half the time of the fastest charging li-ion cells now available.
Stellantis, formed in January by the merger of Italian-American automaker Fiat Chrysler and France's PSA, has a venture called Automotive Cells Co with TotalEnergies and a partnership with China's Contemporary Amperex Technology Co Ltd (CATL). Stellantis intends to introduce solid-state batteries by 2026.
Ford Motor Co and BMW AG have invested in startup Solid Power, which says its solid-state technology can deliver 50% more energy density than current lithium-ion batteries. Ford expects to cut battery costs by 40% by mid-decade.
South Korea's Hyundai Motor, which has invested in startup SolidEnergy Systems, plans to mass produce solid-state batteries in 2030.
Samsung SDI Co Ltd, an affiliate of Samsung Electronics Co Ltd, is working on developing solid-state batteries.
EV market leader Tesla Inc has so far not said it wants to develop or use solid-state cells in its cars."
But DogCrap wouldn't count on it anytime soon ...which bodes pretty well for solid state!
I'm aware of the various plans to develop solid state.Since you need some sort of refresher:
What are solid-state batteries and how will they make electric cars better? - Autoblog
How are they different? What are the advantages? Why are they difficult to mass-produce? Who's trying to make them?
"Japan's Toyota Motor Corp is one of the front runners to mass produce solid-state batteries. It has said it is struggling with their short service life but still intends to start making them by mid 2020s.
In addition to Toyota's in-house research, it has teamed up with Japan's Panasonic Corp to develop these powerpacks with their Prime Planet Energy & Solutions Inc venture.
Close on their heels, Germany's Volkswagen has invested in Bill Gates-backed U.S. battery firm QuantumScape Corp, which aims to introduce its battery in 2024 for VW's EVs and eventually for other carmakers.
VW says the battery will offer about 30% more range than a liquid one and charge to 80% capacity in 12 minutes, which is less than half the time of the fastest charging li-ion cells now available.
Stellantis, formed in January by the merger of Italian-American automaker Fiat Chrysler and France's PSA, has a venture called Automotive Cells Co with TotalEnergies and a partnership with China's Contemporary Amperex Technology Co Ltd (CATL). Stellantis intends to introduce solid-state batteries by 2026.
Ford Motor Co and BMW AG have invested in startup Solid Power, which says its solid-state technology can deliver 50% more energy density than current lithium-ion batteries. Ford expects to cut battery costs by 40% by mid-decade.
South Korea's Hyundai Motor, which has invested in startup SolidEnergy Systems, plans to mass produce solid-state batteries in 2030.
Samsung SDI Co Ltd, an affiliate of Samsung Electronics Co Ltd, is working on developing solid-state batteries.
EV market leader Tesla Inc has so far not said it wants to develop or use solid-state cells in its cars."
Those plans do not change the fact that scaling production remains a daunting task. The secret sauce is the machine that builds the machine.
Once again, I think many here undervalue and underestimate manufacturing. It's painfully difficult, especially to do so profitably.
Didn't you tell me that it would just get done and pooh-pooh'ed my point and said that I was being too cautionary when I mentioned that getting the infrastructure built to support a huge growth in EV's was going to be painfully difficult? You mentioned Moore's Law and all that to try to make your point. You overestimate and overvalue your ability to put together a cohesive, logical point of view.
I feel like I have been hearing for ten years how Lucid will take on Tesla. They have been all talk, and when they finally come out will have full competition with mainstream auto makers. I don't see them as anything special and not sure if they make it long haul.
Tesla's New Steering Yoke Shows Little Benefit and Potential Safety Pitfalls - Consumer Reports
Consumer Reports tries out Tesla's new steering yoke
lol. the stupid f'ing yoke.
