He is a registered republican who lives in FL. Guess you are right to think something shady is going on.
OT: NJ Gov't to shut down #1 Disc Golf course in NJ
- Thread starter yessir321
- Start date
Ok, different guy I met at a tailgate a few years back. I thought he said his screen name was close to yours, I misinterpreted
If you are ever in the yellow lot and you see a silver F150 Lighting with the electric grill going, say hello.
Yes. And the same DEP inspected the property 3 times prior in 2014, 2017, and 2020 and found no issue. Neighbor buys a winery next door and wants to use the neighboring land for horse riding trails for tours, makes a sizable donation and here we are… with the DEP now having issue with the activity that for 11 years in that park they had no issue with.
Voorhees township has made it clear that they are against removing the course but it’s not up to them
How did you get that? NJ was fine looking the other way for the common interest. But someone complain and they have to follow the law as written. What $$$$ are you referring to. It’s funny because so many on here will tell you NJ is all about screwing people with $$$$.
They have asked folks to email the local representatives of district 6. The response has been overwhelming. Voorhees township received thousands of calls this weekend. Now over 15k people have signed the petition.
And on a side note, ‘Saddlehill Winery’ is now down to 1.3 stars on google
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NJ was not looking the other way, disc golf is defined as ‘grey area’ and is open to interpretation by the DEP. for 11 years the DEP approved disc golf in that park, no issues.
All the sudden a carpet bagger from Florida buys the adjacent farm next door which he brags about how cheap he bought it, starts dumping in the course and driving deer into his fence, makes a call and donation to the DEP (which if you don’t think money was spent to get the DEP back out you are just living in denial because someone else called the owner a republican and for some reason you have a heightened sensitivity to anyone talking negatively on your political side)
Just use your head here, it’s not hard to figure out what happened behind the scenes
Carpetbagger? Bill Green is from Marlton. Raised
his family in Camden county. Developed multiple businesses in NJ. Splits his time between his houses in Longport and Boca.
He’s absolutely a carpet bagger. He’s also about to lose his ass on this winery after this stunt he pulled. It’s not just the disc golfers, he’s upset his entire community as a result of this
That’s fine if he in fact did all that is claimed. And he should get what comes to him But I guess your definition of carpetbagger is different from mine.
Do you live in this area? You play there often? Spoke with a friend from Marlton and he had no idea there was this type of facility in town. And was surprised to hear so much turmoil. This has many in town divided.
proof that we have too much government. The state and country would run significantly better without the administrative state we have,
dont be so naive.
you a life long resident or just move here?
its pretty plain to see here, the laws in NJ are rarely written to be absolute cuz if ya leave a gray area left up to interpretation, that law can be used how you want it used.
case in point, this thread.
there is no law, agreement, contract that is not open to interpretation, Lawyers get paid BIG money to find holes in laws and contracts. Even so called "Ironclad" agreements have been turned over by the courts.
#: If you saw my letter to the editor of the Targum September 21, 1977, the object course was designed in 1976 by Flash Eberle, the coach of the Rutgers Ultimate team.
This puts things in a different light.
www.70and73.com
“They think I want to take control of the land," Green said in an interview on Monday morning with 70and73.com. "I just want a neighbor that doesn't vandalize my property and threaten my business."
"It was not my decision to get rid of the disc golf course," Green added.
Green said he filed a Voorhees police complaint in January when a disc golfer cut a hole in the vineyard's deer fence to retrieve a lost golf disc. Buchanan-Jacobs disputes the assertion it was a disc golfer, noting that the fence can easily be climbed to claim a disc.”
“Stephen J. Steglik, the Voorhees township administrator, on Monday confirmed there was nothing in writing.
"No, there was never a written agreement at the time of the construction of the course, only a verbal agreement and working relationship between the township and disc golf group," he said in an email response to 70and73.com's questions. "Unfortunately, even if there were an agreement the DEP's decision would have made the agreement null and void."
Age should disqualify anyone from having opinions on this matter, but Buchanan-Jacobs is just 23 years old. He’s not old enough to speak to whatever was verbally agreed upon in 2012. His tactics in all of this don’t endear me to him and his cause.
Controversial Decision: Popular Voorhees disc golf course on Township property to be closed by state.
A controversy over the future of a professional disc golf course on preserved open space in a Voorhees Township park has erupted, with a professional disc golfer circulating a petition
“They think I want to take control of the land," Green said in an interview on Monday morning with 70and73.com. "I just want a neighbor that doesn't vandalize my property and threaten my business."
"It was not my decision to get rid of the disc golf course," Green added.
Green said he filed a Voorhees police complaint in January when a disc golfer cut a hole in the vineyard's deer fence to retrieve a lost golf disc. Buchanan-Jacobs disputes the assertion it was a disc golfer, noting that the fence can easily be climbed to claim a disc.”
“Stephen J. Steglik, the Voorhees township administrator, on Monday confirmed there was nothing in writing.
"No, there was never a written agreement at the time of the construction of the course, only a verbal agreement and working relationship between the township and disc golf group," he said in an email response to 70and73.com's questions. "Unfortunately, even if there were an agreement the DEP's decision would have made the agreement null and void."
Age should disqualify anyone from having opinions on this matter, but Buchanan-Jacobs is just 23 years old. He’s not old enough to speak to whatever was verbally agreed upon in 2012. His tactics in all of this don’t endear me to him and his cause.
You're off base on this one. I've actually spoken to Adam Harris the course designer and the guy who put the course in with the approval of the town and while there is no written agreement on that, that's essentially the town's fault not his, plus the fact that there were 3 DEP inspections of the property since the course was installed without any findings related to the course says everything to me. This guy complained about the course, without any proof it was a disc golfer that put a hole in the fence. Also, as Harris has noted, he and the volunteers cleaned up an immense amount of waste and debris that the former farm owner had piled onto the course area over the years. Buchanan Jacobs may not have "been there" but he's getting his info from Harris and other sources who have. I do agree that this is much more of an issue with the DEP than the winery owner, though.This puts things in a different light.
Controversial Decision: Popular Voorhees disc golf course on Township property to be closed by state.
A controversy over the future of a professional disc golf course on preserved open space in a Voorhees Township park has erupted, with a professional disc golfer circulating a petition
“They think I want to take control of the land," Green said in an interview on Monday morning with 70and73.com. "I just want a neighbor that doesn't vandalize my property and threaten my business."
"It was not my decision to get rid of the disc golf course," Green added.
Green said he filed a Voorhees police complaint in January when a disc golfer cut a hole in the vineyard's deer fence to retrieve a lost golf disc. Buchanan-Jacobs disputes the assertion it was a disc golfer, noting that the fence can easily be climbed to claim a disc.”
“Stephen J. Steglik, the Voorhees township administrator, on Monday confirmed there was nothing in writing.
"No, there was never a written agreement at the time of the construction of the course, only a verbal agreement and working relationship between the township and disc golf group," he said in an email response to 70and73.com's questions. "Unfortunately, even if there were an agreement the DEP's decision would have made the agreement null and void."
Age should disqualify anyone from having opinions on this matter, but Buchanan-Jacobs is just 23 years old. He’s not old enough to speak to whatever was verbally agreed upon in 2012. His tactics in all of this don’t endear me to him and his cause.
If something is off base, it is the article. But then you go on to agree with the points made in the quotes I excerpted. Somebody cut a hole, who did it is in dispute, that prompted DEP to get involved, and Voorhees doesn’t have the required documentation to keep the course open.
I only added that Finlay isn’t old enough to have been there in 2012 for the agreements and his tactics don’t endear me.
This response sums up what I heard from my buddy who lives in town. Green purchased this location in an auction. Invested multiple millions of dollars in improvement. And wanted to protect his investment from damages.This puts things in a different light.
Controversial Decision: Popular Voorhees disc golf course on Township property to be closed by state.
A controversy over the future of a professional disc golf course on preserved open space in a Voorhees Township park has erupted, with a professional disc golfer circulating a petition
“They think I want to take control of the land," Green said in an interview on Monday morning with 70and73.com. "I just want a neighbor that doesn't vandalize my property and threaten my business."
"It was not my decision to get rid of the disc golf course," Green added.
Green said he filed a Voorhees police complaint in January when a disc golfer cut a hole in the vineyard's deer fence to retrieve a lost golf disc. Buchanan-Jacobs disputes the assertion it was a disc golfer, noting that the fence can easily be climbed to claim a disc.”
“Stephen J. Steglik, the Voorhees township administrator, on Monday confirmed there was nothing in writing.
"No, there was never a written agreement at the time of the construction of the course, only a verbal agreement and working relationship between the township and disc golf group," he said in an email response to 70and73.com's questions. "Unfortunately, even if there were an agreement the DEP's decision would have made the agreement null and void."
Age should disqualify anyone from having opinions on this matter, but Buchanan-Jacobs is just 23 years old. He’s not old enough to speak to whatever was verbally agreed upon in 2012. His tactics in all of this don’t endear me to him and his cause.
This disc golf course should have never been built in the first place. It was never approved by DEP-town etc... How it was able to survive this long is a mystery. The fact that the DEP allowed this improper usage while performing site visits is the issue. Not that the course is being closed down.
I have no horse in the race. But speaking with my friend he has been there for 20+ years and he and his neighbors knew nothing about this facility until it ended up in the news. I am sure there are residents of Marlton that use this course but most are from outside the area.
Upon some research looks like Morrison invented the first ‘flying saucer’ toy which he called the ‘Pluto Platter’. Headrick re-evaluated the toy, redesigned it and patented the new style which is the modern style ‘frisbee’ still used today.
Going on a deep dive here, I have all the respect for Headrick in particular with basket design which was key, but as far as ‘frisbee’ design and the modern game, the absolute king is Dave Dunipace
I’m going to quote my 3rd grade teacher here,
‘Just because you can, doesn’t mean you should’. The moment Green found out he could take action to have the course removed he took it. And now he has to live with the consequences. It’s such a shame because what this looks like it’s leading to is no disc golf course and a new business that has already ostracized itself from its community. What a shame. At the end of this, there’s no winners
You say ostracized from the community. Do you live in town? From speaking with my buddy the most ardent supporters on the disc golf side are not local residents.
And your quote goes both ways. The course could have been built but doesn't mean it should have.
I am all for less development. If I used that course I would not want it disturbed either. I just don't see how the course can stay without a reversal from the DEP.
Can not the same be said about the organized mob tactics to ruin a man’s business?
This is what is upsetting my buddy that lives in town. The community was very excited about the opening of this new business and attraction to town. Now there is a dark cloud and it is all being orchestrated by a vocal group of outsiders.
I grew up in Monmouth County in the 60s. It was a time when lots of farmland and open space was being developed for housing. We were one of the early arrivers and there was still a lot of open space around us. We kids spent most of our days playing in the fields and woods, building “illegal” forts and ballfields. With time new housing would be built nearer and nearer to our forts and fields. Occasionally one of the new owners would lodge a complaint about us being a disturbance or nuisances near their home and the town would come and tear down our fort. Of course, we’d be pissed off ten year olds and vow revenge. But also, and of course, the adults - our parents - would explain to us that we had we were wrong. We had no “rights” to build on the open land and we should be thankful for the time we had, but it was time to accept and move on.
I grew up in SNJ about 10-15 minutes from there and my dad lived in Cherry Hill about a mile from Stafford Woods during my teen years, so I was there a lot and I have friends who still live near there. Let's put it this way: most think Green is an arrogant _____ and they all signed the petition when I asked people to think about it - most local businesses also support the DG course, as they know they get business from the 100,000 rounds per year. Even with that, the NJDEP is the one being incredibly short-sighted here, especially given how they gave 3 previous passing inspections!
This is the issue. The DEP never gave approval for the creation of the course. But allowing the course to exist while conducting site visits is the issue.
There’s nothing organized to ruin Bill’s business.
Actions have consequences, it’s that simple. Just because Bill COULD get the DEP involved does not mean he SHOULD have. The reaction of the community is simply the result of his actions.
A far more extreme/somber example of this type of scenario is Meip Geis. She could have done the legally right thing to do and turned in the Frank Family, but was the right thing to do?
I don't think I would use that in a discussion of banning disc golf.
