OT: Poor Talia Jane

[NorthernKnight]

She doesn't have to be the next tech mogul, but she also doesn't have to be the typical underpaid corporate cog. And if what someone said about her getting a gig is true; she now doesn't have to be. Like it or not, she just trolled the entire Internet and won.

The work thing is a load of nonsense. Hard work is not universally a have or have not quality. For some people maybe, but others need to be challenged, motivated and compensated to work hard. Which is why one size fits all advice based on one person's own story isn't all that helpful.

And that's why some folks, very generally speaking, are pompous, opinionated ##@$s who can't even properly formulate full thoughts, let alone give actionable advice. Hopefully some of them have been lucky enough to marry up in order to cover up their inherent and numerous shortcomings.

Fanu,

I think we collectIvely are talking past each other on this thread.

I don't think the sentiment is "shut up and pay your dues" in a cranky old man get off my lawn way. I think there have been a few posts that have tilted that way, but I think the rest of the posts are much more realistic than that.

I think you're absolutely correct in your assertion that our model for success has changed dramatically and that sine exceptional young entrepreneurs reflect that. I think that's the exceptional, but there's also a clear pattern of major gains and career boosts by smart job hopping with 15-20 gains (or more) each time raising the curve the individual is working from each time. Sometimes millennials (and gen x's...and even done baby boomers) overplay and oversell this, but it is a legitimate path to success that is the complete contra to cradle to grave and shut up and pay your dues.

I think you lose it some when you become the champion of the millennial questioning the system...IRS nit that they shouldn't question the system...they can question away. But do it smartly and do it with your feet rather than as a victim. Talent acquisition is a key concern for vibrant companies and talent fleeing sends a message...supply and demand does work in HR.

With that said, you just picked a crappy example to defend on this one. This young lady is a fraud and whiner and is the worst poster child for this discussion. You can just start out with how many dumb things she did...from an economics standpoint and just the fact that she failed to understand that you cannot move jobs for 1 year under established company policy (which isn't uncommon...).

She really is the worst of the stereotype, while there are so many Millennials doing so many good things and working smartly ad diligently building their power bases and careers.

 

[NorthernKnight]

Wrong. And I still don't drive a Prius. What's your favorite feature on that go cart? Mine is the wimpy horn I hear when I cut them off all the time. It makes me laugh.

I laughed out loud at Levaos (known for: It is because it is, because it is type posts) lecturing Cali on depth of understanding and posts.

 

[NorthernKnight]

Not that parents should pay, but those prices must be for a hovel assuming you're still in Hoboken lol. I have a friend whose rent is going up to $2700 for a 1BR. Now that I own it's a good thing for me, but I hope the kids being pushed into far out JC and Newark and BK are safe. I had a friend when we first graduated was paying $700 or so for a share in DTJC. There was Lucky 7s and LITM. Now every other spot is a $15 cocktail.

See, that's the point. Don't live in Hoboken, or if they do, live 5 to an apartment.

 

[NorthernKnight]

Yes, the one with kids who actively participate in their lives do. Unfortunately, a lot of people don't give a hoot.

Agreed. But isn't lack of effective parenting at the core of most of our social ills?

 

[Upstream]

Not that parents should pay, but those prices must be for a hovel assuming you're still in Hoboken lol. I have a friend whose rent is going up to $2700 for a 1BR. Now that I own it's a good thing for me, but I hope the kids being pushed into far out JC and Newark and BK are safe. I had a friend when we first graduated was paying $700 or so for a share in DTJC. There was Lucky 7s and LITM. Now every other spot is a $15 cocktail.

NIRH, some time ago you decried past generations for living in suburbs rather than urban hubs. Now you complain that the current youth generation has it tougher than past generations because they can't afford to live in urban hubs. Well if you can't afford to live in a desirable urban hub, you have exactly the same choices as previous generations: get roommates to split the rent, move to less desirable urban areas where the rent is cheaper, move further out to the suburbs where rent is cheaper.

 

[RU4Real]

So I've been doing some consulting work for NYPD of late. Every morning, in front of the Starbucks at Broadway and Barclay, I see a "homeless girl" sitting on the sidewalk holding a paper cup and looking for spare bills.

Funny thing... she's about 25, well-dressed (albeit with a dingy ski parka over the top of everything else) and has lots of jewelry - gold rings, a bracelet, a couple of gold chains.

Somebody should really explain to her that the act would play a lot better if she wasn't actually wearing 2 months' rent.

 

[RU4Real]

NIRH, some time ago you decried past generations for living in suburbs rather than urban hubs. Now you complain that the current youth generation has it tougher than past generations because they can't afford to live in urban hubs. Well if you can't afford to live in a desirable urban hub, you have exactly the same choices as previous generations: get roommates to split the rent, move to less desirable urban areas where the rent is cheaper, move further out to the suburbs where rent is cheaper.

Oh, is he complaining on this thread?

I don't see it, since I put him on 'Ignore' - right after I forwarded his last "Fat donut-eating overpaid slob cop" rant to some friends at Marlboro Twp PD.

 

[NorthernKnight]

Oh, is he complaining on this thread?

I don't see it, since I put him on 'Ignore' - right after I forwarded his last "Fat donut-eating overpaid slob cop" rant to some friends at Marlboro Twp PD.

You probably want to take him off ignore and read this thread....provides some insights on him...

 

[RU4Real]

You probably want to take him off ignore and read this thread....provides some insights on him...

Oh, I think we've had a lifetime worth of insights from him.

Tom Petty said it best: "A rebel without a clue".

 

[Upstream]

You probably want to take him off ignore and read this thread....provides some insights on him...

And excellent entertainment value

 

[vkj91]

There is no alternative. If you don't go, every study shows you will make less money.

Maybe there are places you can raise families on a welder's salary. They are few and far in between, and not sure what kind of growth there is for welders.

And the complaint isn't that everyone has a degree, because the reality is, everyone accepts it these days, the issue is now really you need a graduate degree for many jobs and both of those are very expensive.

Most millenials are pretty unconcerned with the competition, so to speak, but just the drowning in debt in a way that no other generation had to, and that literally not one politician until Bernie Sanders or Elizabeth Warren came along had boo to say about it. The government makes money off this with absurd interest. My student loans are government backed, and my mortgage is private, and yet, my student loans have the higher interest rate...it is an outrage that the feds profit off of this.

well there definitely are alternatives and while it's true statistically you will make more with a degree I wonder what the net is after paying off loans and interest vs actually making money. Does the 4 year Art major at Monmouth taking full loans make more money than the electrician with no loans over the course of his career? Regardless, my comment was a simple observation based on statements made in this very thread. Somebody(maybe you) said it's harder to get a job because everyone has a college degree. Later, BRG stated the cost of college is a big detractor in people going to college. I simply said it's one or the other and can't be both. That being said, lets use this girl and her journey as an example. First, the tuition at Cal State Long Branch is only 6,452 a year and With room and board it totals 22,932. Lets assume she got zero help from home and took 100% loans. She's looking at about 90,000 in debt which I would consider far from insurmountable and less than someone who graduated from a private college as far as 20 years ago. Of course, she could have kept those costs way down by commuting, living off campus, or god forbid working while she was in school. Lets be honest, she was an English major so she wasn't exactly studying around the clock. The cost of tuition is too high in this country at many schools(hers not being one of them) and Federal Government shouldn't be in the business of controlling student loans but the idea that your generation doesn't have options is ludicrous. You can go to a community college for two years before transferring to a state school, you can commute, and you sure as hell don't have to live in hoboken or Jersey City after graduation.

 

[Caliknight]

Oh, is he complaining on this thread?

I don't see it, since I put him on 'Ignore' - right after I forwarded his last "Fat donut-eating overpaid slob cop" rant to some friends at Marlboro Twp PD.

Where was this rant from? These millenials are always so angry and bitter. Ironic given the never had to work for anything.

 

[RU4Real]

Where was this rant from? These millenials are always so angry and bitter. Ironic given the never had to work for anything.

It was in the context of one of the discussions on cops getting shot. Basically he said that suburban cops are vastly overpaid, they're never in any danger and spend all their time shoveling donuts into their mouths while they sit on their fat, overpaid asses.

It was pretty ignorant.

 

[Caliknight]

Not surprising.

 

[FanuSanu52]

Fanu,

I think we collectIvely are talking past each other on this thread.

I don't think the sentiment is "shut up and pay your dues" in a cranky old man get off my lawn way. I think there have been a few posts that have tilted that way, but I think the rest of the posts are much more realistic than that.

I think you're absolutely correct in your assertion that our model for success has changed dramatically and that sine exceptional young entrepreneurs reflect that. I think that's the exceptional, but there's also a clear pattern of major gains and career boosts by smart job hopping with 15-20 gains (or more) each time raising the curve the individual is working from each time. Sometimes millennials (and gen x's...and even done baby boomers) overplay and oversell this, but it is a legitimate path to success that is the complete contra to cradle to grave and shut up and pay your dues.

I think you lose it some when you become the champion of the millennial questioning the system...IRS nit that they shouldn't question the system...they can question away. But do it smartly and do it with your feet rather than as a victim. Talent acquisition is a key concern for vibrant companies and talent fleeing sends a message...supply and demand does work in HR.

With that said, you just picked a crappy example to defend on this one. This young lady is a fraud and whiner and is the worst poster child for this discussion. You can just start out with how many dumb things she did...from an economics standpoint and just the fact that she failed to understand that you cannot move jobs for 1 year under established company policy (which isn't uncommon...).

She really is the worst of the stereotype, while there are so many Millennials doing so many good things and working smartly ad diligently building their power bases and careers.

I was not trying to defend her actions, but maybe it came across that way since she was inextricably linked to each and every post in the thread. I think the idea of putting your CEO on notice via social media is absolutely moronic way to go about things .. unless maybe her goal was to draw a bunch of attention to herself and possibly get a better job through notoriety alone, in which case, it's proving kinda brilliant.

Beyond that, I can't disagree with anything you wrote. Good summary.

 

[RUaMoose]

My first job out of college in '92 paid 20k/year and I had to commute from Cliffwood to Mahwah every day. Never complained just got some experience and took a job closer a year and a half later. "Social media" and whiny entitlement is one bad witches brew

 

[brgossRU90]

Growing up in an era of social media has proven to be bad news for a lot of people. They don't seem to know when to draw a boundary. I see this with "bernie bros," who are obnoxious and I saw this with a tenant of mine who was incredibly obnoxious and rude to me via text. He had a great newly renovated apartment a good $200 below market rate. He's now living elsewhere.

 

[NotInRHouse]

Haha. I own a condo in Jersey City, that actually is worth a solid 100k at least more than what I paid after I rented a small walk up because I worked for it. That doesn't mean I don't realize that the rent is high. I worked for everything I have, and I am not complaining about my own circumstances. But unlike some, I don't say well I am doing fine so so must everyone else and anyone who isn't is lazy or whatever generalization. I know plenty of people my age who are rich because their dads are, and I know lots of people who work way harder than the rich people and drown in debt. That aspect is no different from any other.

And no one has to live anywhere. You could rent in a far out suburb, it's still expensive a higher share of income versus today when incomes have only really started rising again recently.

 

[RUbacker]

Where was this rant from? These millenials are always so angry and bitter. Ironic given the never had to work for anything.

These little idiots re surprised by their student loan debt, why? Did they not know how much it would cost? Can they be that stupid? I hear it all the time how they are shocked when they find out how much they owe, really ? Ugh they are clueless.

 

[Caliknight]

These little idiots re surprised by their student loan debt, why? Did they not know how much it would cost? Can they be that stupid? I hear it all the time how they are shocked when they find out how much they owe, really ? Ugh they are clueless.

Logic has no place with these babies.

 

[NotInRHouse]

well there definitely are alternatives and while it's true statistically you will make more with a degree I wonder what the net is after paying off loans and interest vs actually making money. Does the 4 year Art major at Monmouth taking full loans make more money than the electrician with no loans over the course of his career? Regardless, my comment was a simple observation based on statements made in this very thread. Somebody(maybe you) said it's harder to get a job because everyone has a college degree. Later, BRG stated the cost of college is a big detractor in people going to college. I simply said it's one or the other and can't be both. That being said, lets use this girl and her journey as an example. First, the tuition at Cal State Long Branch is only 6,452 a year and With room and board it totals 22,932. Lets assume she got zero help from home and took 100% loans. She's looking at about 90,000 in debt which I would consider far from insurmountable and less than someone who graduated from a private college as far as 20 years ago. Of course, she could have kept those costs way down by commuting, living off campus, or god forbid working while she was in school. Lets be honest, she was an English major so she wasn't exactly studying around the clock. The cost of tuition is too high in this country at many schools(hers not being one of them) and Federal Government shouldn't be in the business of controlling student loans but the idea that your generation doesn't have options is ludicrous. You can go to a community college for two years before transferring to a state school, you can commute, and you sure as hell don't have to live in hoboken or Jersey City after graduation.

I am not defending this chick. Like I said, she is wrong. But as just as wrong is that until 1982 no in California at state schools paid no tuition, and those people and others similarly situated say, oh millenials are lazy or in over their heads or what not.

She should have gotten a roommate, even still SF is a very expensive city, and in fact that is also an issue in that most of the "cheap" cities have fewer jobs and there are very few jobs in the suburbs or rural areas in most of the US.

I think all anyone in our generation wants is recognition that the cost of education is too high, and for someone to take on the fact that federal government is profiting as a result of that. You can go to CC or commute, but in NJ CC is still not very cheap, you need a car for most commutes, etc...and not only that but today you need an advanced degree in many fields which is the same process over again.

Holding up this one girl as emblematic would be like a millenial using Mark Zuckerburg or any other tech genius to say we're smarter, more successful, more inventive, etc...this girl existed in your generation but instead of whining online about debt she whined to her mom or friends about MRS degree being the reason she couldn't afford things...

 

[NotInRHouse]

These little idiots re surprised by their student loan debt, why? Did they not know how much it would cost? Can they be that stupid? I hear it all the time how they are shocked when they find out how much they owe, really ? Ugh they are clueless.

Where did it say anyone was surprised?

I think we were surprised with all the debt your generation caused. Let's liquidate SS and medicare so we can pay off Iraq.

You boomers can ward off disease since you told your veteran parents and your millenial children how terrible we are. Broken hips will self heal, I'm sure...

 

[NotInRHouse]

Agreed. But isn't lack of effective parenting at the core of most of our social ills?

Some of them, but then whose fault is that...lol...

 

[RUbacker]

I'm not gonna stick up for her, but don't know why people project onto an entire generation. Actually I don't know why we have "generations" at all, save for giving older folks a more formal way of requesting that their greens be left alone.

I thought your post was one of the best ones - youths have been entitled and whiny for ages; it's just that they have more powerful tools today. Even just 15 years ago, maybe you wrote that rant on your personal blog and nobody but your three followers read it. Now the entire world is reading it, and somehow it's a big enough incident to make the news cycle.

These grubsters come home at age 30 and hand their parents a speeding ticket to pay or want their ca

Where did it say anyone was surprised?

I think we were surprised with all the debt your generation caused. Let's liquidate SS and medicare so we can pay off Iraq.

You boomers can ward off disease since you told your veteran parents and your millenial children how terrible we are. Broken hips will self heal, I'm sure...

wow you are a very clueless grubster with little knowledge of the real world.

 

[FanuSanu52]

These grubsters come home at age 30 and hand their parents a speeding ticket to pay or want their ca

wow you are a very clueless grubster with little knowledge of the real world.

Man, you're beyond "get off my lawn" ... more like "get off my lawn before I light it on fire and start shooting anyone that looks under the age of 40."

 

[BigRnj]

I just read about poor Talia Jane's plight. I wonder how many "Everyone's a Winner" trophies she has?

 

[DJ Spanky]

Man, you're beyond "get off my lawn" ... more like "get off my lawn before I light it on fire and start shooting anyone that looks under the age of 40."

And the problem with this is.........?

 

[DJ Spanky]

I just read about poor Talia Jane's plight. I wonder how many "Everyone's a Winner" trophies she has?

Well that just calls for:

 

[RUbacker]

Man, you're beyond "get off my lawn" ... more like "get off my lawn before I light it on fire and start shooting anyone that looks under the age of 40."

Yep if you are going to grub my money and not work for yours yes get off my lawn !!!

 

[mdk01]

Man, you're beyond "get off my lawn" ... more like "get off my lawn before I light it on fire and start shooting anyone that looks under the age of 40."

Sounds like a plan.

 

[rutgersdave]

Let it go! A girl is complaining no more than many on this board.

 

[miketd1]

Let it go! A girl is complaining no more than many on this board.

It's different.

She is complaining about a situation that she has a lot of control over.

Outside of donating a couple million bucks, our fandom is pretty much at the mercy of the Rutgers football program.

 

[RUsSKii]

Let it go! A girl is complaining no more than many on this board.

The girl in question also created a GoFundMe account in order to raise money after being fired. That doesn't exactly bode well for her critics "letting it go".

 

[Nosoj]

Where was this rant from? These millenials are always so angry and bitter. Ironic given the never had to work for anything.

These little idiots re surprised by their student loan debt, why? Did they not know how much it would cost? Can they be that stupid? I hear it all the time how they are shocked when they find out how much they owe, really ? Ugh they are clueless.

Logic has no place with these babies.

These grubsters come home at age 30 and hand their parents a speeding ticket to pay or want their ca

wow you are a very clueless grubster with little knowledge of the real world.

You guys realize that if the Millennials are not prepared for the real world, that falls squarely on the Boomers and Gen Xers who are raising them, right?

 

[Extra Point]

My first job out of college in '92 paid 20k/year and I had to commute from Cliffwood to Mahwah every day. Never complained just got some experience and took a job closer a year and a half later. "Social media" and whiny entitlement is one bad witches brew

20K out of college in 1992 was pretty good. That would be about 34K today. Her problem is she took a high schooler's job at about 11K a year and I think she wanted to get attention to spring board into journalism. She writes better than most SL editors do. Who cares about losing an 11K a year job.

 

[Upstream]

You guys realize that if the Millennials are not prepared for the real world, that falls squarely on the Boomers and Gen Xers who are raising them, right?

Yep. There were a lot of parents who failed at preparing their kids for adulthood. There were also a lot of parents who did not fail, and raised young adults who are poised for successful lives.

I think the perception of millennial entitlement is amplified by social media which did not exist in previous generations. 25 years ago, Talia wouldn't have have had a national audience to listen to her whining.

Today, lots of people see Talia's writings, and assume her whining represents the norm for millennials. But even Talia notes that, "Every single one of my coworkers is struggling. They’re taking side jobs, they’re living at home." I assume that the bulk of Talia's co-workers are millennials; that is who'd I'd expect to take an entry-level job at Yelp making slightly more than minimum wage.

Because of social media, the focus is on Talia and her sense of entitlement. Ignored are her millennial coworkers who have second jobs, roommates, or live with their parents. Ignored are her millennial coworkers who are willing to struggle to gain experience and move on to their next job.

Maybe there is a greater sense of entitlement among millennials than previous generations. Maybe it just seems that way because social medial makes it easy for their voices to be heard. But certainly there are plenty of millennials, like Talia's coworkers, who don't expect success to be handed to them on a silver platter.

 

[Nosoj]

Yep. There were a lot of parents who failed at preparing their kids for adulthood. There were also a lot of parents who did not fail, and raised young adults who are poised for successful lives.

I think the perception of millennial entitlement is amplified by social media which did not exist in previous generations. 25 years ago, Talia wouldn't have have had a national audience to listen to her whining.

Today, lots of people see Talia's writings, and assume her whining represents the norm for millennials. But even Talia notes that, "Every single one of my coworkers is struggling. They’re taking side jobs, they’re living at home." I assume that the bulk of Talia's co-workers are millennials; that is who'd I'd expect to take an entry-level job at Yelp making slightly more than minimum wage.

Because of social media, the focus is on Talia and her sense of entitlement. Ignored are her millennial coworkers who have second jobs, roommates, or live with their parents. Ignored are her millennial coworkers who are willing to struggle to gain experience and move on to their next job.

Maybe there is a greater sense of entitlement among millennials than previous generations. Maybe it just seems that way because social medial makes it easy for their voices to be heard. But certainly there are plenty of millennials, like Talia's coworkers, who don't expect success to be handed to them on a silver platter.

I agree. I didn't mean to imply that ALL Millennials were not prepared for the real world. As I mentioned, I normally fall under the Millennial category...my wife certainly does and most of my team at work does. I know I work hard and my wife and my team work their asses off to earn what they've accomplished.

I think part of it is social media, Millennials are hardly the first generation accused of being self-centered: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Me_generation Replace "1970s" with "2000s" or "2010s" and some of this could practically have been written BY the Boomers, not about them:

By the mid-1970s, Tom Wolfe and Christopher Lasch were speaking out critically against the culture of narcissism.[1] These criticisms were widely repeated throughout American popular media.

The development of a youth culture focusing so heavily on self-fulfillment was also perhaps a reaction against the traits that characterized the older generation, which had grown up during the Great Depression. That generation had learned values associated with self-sacrifice.

The term "Me generation" has persisted over the decades, becoming synonymous with the baby boomers to many Americans. Not all young adults were enamored with the lifestyle choices being offered to them in mainstream culture, however. The 1970s were also an era of rising unemployment among the young, continuing erosion of faith in conventional social institutions, and political and ideological aimlessness for many.

If you add social media onto that...how does that look?

 

[j10oreo]

Damn, I realized I'm a Millennial.... instant loss of street cred. :cry:

 

[finester39]

While I agree many millenials feel a false sense of entitlement, this chart clearly illustrates how much harder it is to get by without help from mommy and daddy compared to previous generations

 

[Caliknight]

You guys realize that if the Millennials are not prepared for the real world, that falls squarely on the Boomers and Gen Xers who are raising them, right?

Yes and no, but generally I agree. This girls parents are far likely to be bigger idiots than she is. Prevailing wisdom is that Gen Z will be much different than their millenial parents, as has always been the case with each generation that follows the next. They are likely to look at the incompetence, entitlement and lack of work ethic of their parents as not cool. This is good for everyone.