Our last 8 games...

[BillyC80]

Since Eugene came back from his injury, we’re 4-4, going 2-2 at home and 2-2 on the road. Our 4 losses include an overtime loss on the road to the hottest team in the B1G, and two home losses to Top 20 teams, including today’s crazy ass buzzer beater.

If we guard the three the way way did tonight, we’re gonna be a tough out the rest of the way.

I wouldn’t count us out against anybody, home or away, and definitely not in the BTT.

 

[BillyC80]

Bumping this with an extra thought. If you didn’t know the record of these two teams coming in, you might assume they were pretty close.

While I agree that you are what your record says you are, we are NOT currently playing like a 12-13 team (just as IL is not currently playing like a 10-15 team). We played Iowa even for all 40 minutes and yet they’re record is 20-5.

And while you can’t say woulda shoulda coulda in sports, it is fair to say we were one shot away from beating both IL and IA and going 6-2 in our last 8 since Eugene came back.

That’s the team we’re taking into MSU. And that’s the team that might actually be peaking in the B1G tourney. I’m excited to see how this plays out.

 

[Proud NJ Sports Fan]

Have to win the home games

 

[BillyC80]

Have to win the home games

Agreed. If we play the way we did against Iowa we will win our last two at home. And maybe we steal one on the road.

The key that separates us from good teams like Iowa is consistency. This year we’ve played at a high level intermittently, from one game to the next, while teams in the top half of our conference have been consistently good in almost every game.

What we’ve been seeing in our last 8 games (and especially the last 3 games), with the emergence of our freshmen and with Gene coming back, is that we’ve been more consistently good from game to game.

 

[bac2therac]

you have to play at a high level to win every night in the Big 10, RU is just getting to that point now where it realizes that.

 

[BillyC80]

you have to play at a high level to win every night in the Big 10, RU is just getting to that point now where it realizes that.

This is what gives me the most hope for the rest of this year and for all of next year.

 

[bac2therac]

yes, I think its here...its not a fluke, it should be a constant from here out, I think MSU might not be pretty so I can give them a pass if it is but I am expecting the rest of the year RU will be bringing it every night.

 

[Westcoast]

Its easy to see us being competitive in every game the rest of the year and winning a couple. But we could also lose every game. When we win, we just barely win. We can't blow anyone out which means we are always a fluke buzzer beater away from a loss - or just a regular made 3 in most cases.

 

[bac2therac]

good point...and that is why we are not quite there yet. Iowa is on a different level right now...yes RU played toe to toe with them but their acheivements and what they have shown this year show overall they are the better program at this point. Iowa can win by a few but they can also dominate their opponent. RU is just at the point where they are learning to win and learning to play with leads and learning not to blink for even two minutes in a game.

 

[GoodOl'Rutgers]

Agreed that if they can bring that intensity to every game... hell.. and at least half the practices... we'll be dancing sooner rather than later.

 

[RUHouston]

And considering the learning curve flattens out with each passing day and game. Going into next year adding two pieces (hopefully 3) instead of 4 should be that much smoother.

Plus, this team seems to be learning to play up to their competition rather than down.

 

[RUich]

Professional Tennis generally used the time worn system of ranking to look at opposing players. This was a number based on a total year's performance from the current date. Useful, but it did not show how the player was doing lately.
They now have a new number called the URL (I think) which is about what they have done lately! This is much more accurate in their testing since it shows who is hot and who is not.
This basketball team would be miles away from the typical look of what's your rank as opposed to what can we expect tonight! We've come a long way from Fordham.

 

[brad1218]

you have to play at a high level to win every night in the Big 10, RU is just getting to that point now where it realizes that.

I am not sure what this means. It’s just a thing people say like “learning how to win”. I played through college and played on winning and losing teams. We never had to learn how to win. We never came to the realization that we had to play at a high level every night. On both my winning and losing teams we brought it every night. For this RU team we are inconsistent because we lack talent. We have streaky shooters. We are last in shooting percentage from both the field and the line. That is why we are not consistent.

 

[BillyC80]

Brad, I get your point and it’s a good one. While we definitely have steaky shooters , I think “playing at a consistently high level” includes our defense. What we saw versus Iowa was our most consistently good defensive effort of the year, imo.

 

[RUChoppin]

I am not sure what this means. It’s just a thing people say like “learning how to win”. I played through college and played on winning and losing teams. We never had to learn how to win. We never came to the realization that we had to play at a high level every night. On both my winning and losing teams we brought it every night. For this RU team we are inconsistent because we lack talent. We have streaky shooters. We are last in shooting percentage from both the field and the line. That is why we are not consistent.

Consistency also comes from experience. New players are more prone to mental mistakes, especially in situations that are new or unfamiliar to them. Having just 1 freshman on a team full of upperclassmen limits the impact of those mental lapses... having four freshmen and a sophomore playing key minutes sometimes means those lapses occur in bunches, and can derail a game.

As the season has progressed, we're seeing fewer such lapses, and the freshmen are growing more consistent with more experience. Next year we're currently looking at just one freshman on a team full of guys that have played a full season or more in the trenches, which should mean more consistency game to game.

 

[RUJMM78]

you have to play at a high level to win every night in the Big 10, RU is just getting to that point now where it realizes that.

The defense is far more consistent compared to the offense which has kept them in games for longer periods of time .The offense still needs more consistency in the last five minutes to close out games .Making foul shots is critical .

 

[Scarlet83]

[QUOTE="RUHouston, post: 3739712, member: 3912

Plus, this team seems to be learning to play up to their competition rather than down.[/QUOTE]

That is so true.

 

[bac2therac]

I am not sure what this means. It’s just a thing people say like “learning how to win”. I played through college and played on winning and losing teams. We never had to learn how to win. We never came to the realization that we had to play at a high level every night. On both my winning and losing teams we brought it every night. For this RU team we are inconsistent because we lack talent. We have streaky shooters. We are last in shooting percentage from both the field and the line. That is why we are not consistent.

high level was the Iowa game...Northwestern was not high level, Illinois was high level....its great RU is playing better but their play has been spotty. Just because RU basically beat Iowa does not mean they are at the point where they are a NCAA team that string victories together. There was a difference in the Iowa and Illinois games that were not their in early games. Its being able to match a perceived better team shot for shot, stop for stop...we have seen previous RU teams do the past 15-20 years but not follow it up. In observing this team we are seeing the effort amped up, its not fluke Fred Hill or a fluke Eddie Jordan win. In the Rice years we were in a similar spot in playing these games at a high level but then we dropped in year 3.

I disagree with you on the talent...its young talent...we have two players that probably shouldnt be on the team and two coming in next year that will contributed. Getting the current young talent experience and bringing it every night is important. Its about the light kicking in for them. We saw inconsistent efforts early on become more consistent...Harper, Johnson, Caleb, Montez, even Geo. More experience helps but yes taking it to the next level every night is another story

 

[brad1218]

high level was the Iowa game...Northwestern was not high level, Illinois was high level....its great RU is playing better but their play has been spotty. Just because RU basically beat Iowa does not mean they are at the point where they are a NCAA team that string victories together. There was a difference in the Iowa and Illinois games that were not their in early games. Its being able to match a perceived better team shot for shot, stop for stop...we have seen previous RU teams do the past 15-20 years but not follow it up. In observing this team we are seeing the effort amped up, its not fluke Fred Hill or a fluke Eddie Jordan win. In the Rice years we were in a similar spot in playing these games at a high level but then we dropped in year 3.

I disagree with you on the talent...its young talent...we have two players that probably shouldnt be on the team and two coming in next year that will contributed. Getting the current young talent experience and bringing it every night is important. Its about the light kicking in for them. We saw inconsistent efforts early on become more consistent...Harper, Johnson, Caleb, Montez, even Geo. More experience helps but yes taking it to the next level every night is another story

But it is not a mental thing. You are making it sound like they can decide just to bring it at a higher level. That’s not how it works.

 

[bac2therac]

But it is not a mental thing. You are making it sound like they can decide just to bring it at a higher level. That’s not how it works.

not really...its part experience...they are just learning that they do have to bring it every night....thats my whole point. To become Iowa is not just about beating Iowa in a one game in a one game situation its about the mindset that to get there you must be playing at Iowa level every single night of the year and at the beginning of the season next year

 

[brad1218]

not really...its part experience...they are just learning that they do have to bring it every night....thats my whole point. To become Iowa is not just about beating Iowa in a one game in a one game situation its about the mindset that to get there you must be playing at Iowa level every single night of the year and at the beginning of the season next year

What does bring it every night mean? What are suggesting they are doing differently? Are you saying they don’t play hard every night?

 

[RUChoppin]

What does bring it every night mean? What are suggesting they are doing differently? Are you saying they don’t play hard every night?

There have been games this year where they came out of the locker room flat - either to start the game, or out of halftime. Lower energy, not as much fight for 50/50 balls, casual passes, etc. There are times when Pike has done a "line change" and swapped in 4 subs early to "wake up" the starters.

It takes practice to be "on" all the time. It's not a natural state to be that "in the moment" for a 2 hour game. It's partially why freshmen have more mental lapses than seniors - because they're either still stuck on the last play or call, or anticipating the next play, or are taking for granted an "easy" pass or bucket, or whatever. Experience improves overall consistency of effort and focus.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

We gave good effort against Northwestern. We just couldn’t score

 

[goru7]

The last 3 games we have brought back Pike’s defense against Illinois, Northwestern, and Iowa with Iowa being outstanding. The offensive scoring against Illinois and Iowa where we hit shots was great and Northwestern the offense was not bad we just missed open shots. The key is playing for 40 minutes. It is the hardest thing to get your team to do and even harder to get freshman to buy in and execute. We are finally seeing it and there is a noticeable difference in watching our team over the last 3 . The defense against Ohio State and Michigan was atrocious especially guarding the 3 . I am thinking that defense is gone and we have a team that has matured and really gotten better. It is not only experience in the usual sense because we have few juniors and seniors but more understanding by the freshman for what it takes to compete in this league, a full 40 minute effort on both ends.

 

[bac2therac]

The last 3 games we have brought back Pike’s defense against Illinois, Northwestern, and Iowa with Iowa being outstanding. The offensive scoring against Illinois and Iowa where we hit shots was great and Northwestern the offense was not bad we just missed open shots. The key is playing for 40 minutes. It is the hardest thing to get your team to do and even harder to get freshman to buy in and execute. We are finally seeing it and there is a noticeable difference in watching our team over the last 3 . The defense against Ohio State and Michigan was atrocious especially guarding the 3 . I am thinking that defense is gone and we have a team that has matured and really gotten better. It is not only experience in the usual sense because we have few juniors and seniors but more understanding by the freshman for what it takes to compete in this league, a full 40 minute effort on both ends.

exactly

 

[brad1218]

The last 3 games we have brought back Pike’s defense against Illinois, Northwestern, and Iowa with Iowa being outstanding. The offensive scoring against Illinois and Iowa where we hit shots was great and Northwestern the offense was not bad we just missed open shots. The key is playing for 40 minutes. It is the hardest thing to get your team to do and even harder to get freshman to buy in and execute. We are finally seeing it and there is a noticeable difference in watching our team over the last 3 . The defense against Ohio State and Michigan was atrocious especially guarding the 3 . I am thinking that defense is gone and we have a team that has matured and really gotten better. It is not only experience in the usual sense because we have few juniors and seniors but more understanding by the freshman for what it takes to compete in this league, a full 40 minute effort on both ends.

We have gave up over 90 against Illinois. Again it is purely talent. We are getting as much as you can get out of this group. We are overachieving. Bring in Paul and Young next year and find a very good player for the last ship and we have a chance at winning more next year. Continue to upgrade the talent each year and we will win more games. It’s that simple.

 

[dkostus]

First of all we're not the worst shooting team in the league, despite what some think. We're 10th out of 14 in league games. Not great, but not what some would have you believe.

Second, it's absolutely true that guys develop over time. We're not at a ceiling with this roster when you have 4 freshmen playing extended minutes next to a soph and junior in the main rotation.

And the mental aspect of the game is talked about by both players and coaches for a century, so I dont see how you (even as someone that's played) can just dismiss that. Maybe you just missed that part.

https://bigten.org/confstats.aspx/2018-19/mbb/confonly

 

[RUChoppin]

We have gave up over 90 against Illinois. Again it is purely talent. We are getting as much as you can get out of this group. We are overachieving. Bring in Paul and Young next year and find a very good player for the last ship and we have a chance at winning more next year. Continue to upgrade the talent each year and we will win more games. It’s that simple.

We gave up 86 to Illinois in regulation - who is 4th in the conference in scoring. Our other 80+ point conference opponents were Purdue (#2 scoring) and Minnesota (#5 scoring), both of which were without Omoruyi. We held Iowa (#3 scoring) to 71.

MSU is #1 in scoring in conference, but is without their #2 and #3 scoring options.

Guess we'll see what happens?

 

[brad1218]

First of all we're not the worst shooting team in the league, despite what some think. We're 10th out of 14 in league games. Not great, but not what some would have you believe.

Second, it's absolutely true that guys develop over time. We're not at a ceiling with this roster when you have 4 freshmen playing extended minutes next to a soph and junior in the main rotation.

And the mental aspect of the game is talked about by both players and coaches for a century, so I dont see how you (even as someone that's played) can just dismiss that. Maybe you just missed that part.

https://bigten.org/confstats.aspx/2018-19/mbb/confonly

I am not saying there is not a mental aspect to the game. Of course there is. We lost today because we lack skill. It had NOTHING to do with bringing it every night. Or learning how to win. It is plain and simple we lack talent. That is my point. I get this is a message board and it is meant to over analyze things, but it is really simple why we lose. We can’t score consistently.

 

[bac2therac]

We lost tonight because we are not ready to punch back after we were kicked in the teeth. We allowed MSU to get into their rhythm..what i talked about eariler rang true

 

[whofrewdatmataRU13]

Being a fan of football or basketball for this school is fcking miserable, beer and wine at upcoming sports events should be on the school until they can show any bit of competence

 

[brad1218]

We lost tonight because we are not ready to punch back after we were kicked in the teeth. We allowed MSU to get into their rhythm..what i talked about eariler rang true

What? Man you have no idea what you are talking about. That’s not what you said. You talked about guys having to be taken out right away because they didn’t know they had to bring it each night.

It’s not that we aren’t ready to punch back. We lack the talent to punch back.

 

[goru7]

We have gave up over 90 against Illinois. Again it is purely talent. We are getting as much as you can get out of this group. We are overachieving. Bring in Paul and Young next year and find a very good player for the last ship and we have a chance at winning more next year. Continue to upgrade the talent each year and we will win more games. It’s that simple.

Yeah but that doesn’t explain the Big 10 wins this year or the highly competitive games because we are outtakented every night in the Big 10

 

[bac2therac]

What? Man you have no idea what you are talking about. That’s not what you said. You talked about guys having to be taken out right away because they didn’t know they had to bring it each night.

It’s not that we aren’t ready to punch back. We lack the talent to punch back.

disagree, talent didnt let MSU have 5 shots at the basket on one possession, talent isnt Eugene missing two bunnies or players taking ill advised shots.

Of course MSU is more talented than RU and they should be beating. RU had enough talent to have an 11 point lead but outplaying a team for a stretch isnt winning. Its the whole point of what I am saying in this thread. This team has to go through the learning lessons and growing pains of what they need to do to actually win. Winning was on the table today for sure.

 

[BillyC80]

Talent is a huge factor of course, but it’s not the only factor. You need talent + experience + effort + coaching. As soon as anyone says we over-achieved, in any game (like say, the Iowa game for example) then it's an admission that things like effort and mental toughness, for 40 minutes, can help overcome a talent deficit and win you games.

 

[Loyal_2RU]

I am not sure what this means. It’s just a thing people say like “learning how to win”. I played through college and played on winning and losing teams. We never had to learn how to win. We never came to the realization that we had to play at a high level every night. On both my winning and losing teams we brought it every night. For this RU team we are inconsistent because we lack talent. We have streaky shooters. We are last in shooting percentage from both the field and the line. That is why we are not consistent.

Brad I played competitive tennis, won an age group state doubles tournament, and as a walk on was the last cut from the RU tennis team when I lost out to a scholarship player i had played even.

So not college level competition and more of an individual sport. Still, the hardest thing for me to learn was that the match was not over when I established dominance on the court. I lost far too many matches when I was the better player until I learned what competitiveness and championship play in tennis required. It was a different mindset and understanding in match milestones differently that was required. And I brought it every match. I just brought it smarter and more effectively at some point in time.

I think you are arguing this doesn't happen in hoops. Am I understanding you correctly?
Loyal