Suriano question

[Lyons212]

There is nothing misleading about what he wrote, you just don't believe it.

Its very simple. PSU supporters don't think PSU/Cael telling the Big Ten they supported a waiver of the BIg Ten transfer rule would have had any impact. The Rutgers side believes it would have. That's it.

It amazes me you guys still don't get this.

What is amazing is that this you are dealing with hypotheticals. Do you know how the waiver process works? If yes please provide the link to the documentation. Please answer the following:

1. Does Suriano have to be enrolled at Rutgers to apply for the waiver?
2. Is Suriano currently enrolled at Rutgers?
3. Does PSU get to review the waiver prior to agreeing to it?
4. Has the waiver application been provided to PSU?
5. Do you think it would be reasonable for PSU or any B1G school to support a waiver application that is critical of the previous school?

Micic's waiver request took about 3 months to get a decision.

You should save the PSU bashing until the time that Suriano is at Rutgers and has lost on the waiver application.

 

[matter7172]

There is nothing misleading about what he wrote, you just don't believe it.

Its very simple. PSU supporters don't think PSU/Cael telling the Big Ten they supported a waiver of the BIg Ten transfer rule would have had any impact. The Rutgers side believes it would have. That's it.

It amazes me you guys still don't get this.

As an attorney, I'm amazed that *you* don't get it.

 

[Ole Cabbagehead]

Another ignorant poster. Ugh

Not really. I am simply highlighting where the disagreement is. If you do not agree with my characterization of the disagreement feel free to tell me. I think at this point, we can find common ground on where the dispute is though.

What is amazing is that this you are dealing with hypotheticals. Do you know how the waiver process works? If yes please provide the link to the documentation. Please answer the following:

1. Does Suriano have to be enrolled at Rutgers to apply for the waiver?
2. Is Suriano currently enrolled at Rutgers?
3. Does PSU get to review the waiver prior to agreeing to it?
4. Has the waiver application been provided to PSU?
5. Do you think it would be reasonable for PSU or any B1G school to support a waiver application that is critical of the previous school?

Micic's waiver request took about 3 months to get a decision.

You should save the PSU bashing until the time that Suriano is at Rutgers and has lost on the waiver application.

I am not sure who you are responding to with this. I am stating that:

1. No one knows the rules for seeking a waiver of the transfer rule, and no one knows the criteria. Nothing on this procedure is in the public domain

2. No one knows whether the consent of PSU/Cael would be considered in granting or denying a waiver.

Do we agree on those 2 points? If we do, lets build from there. Because from there, we are both going to use different facts to support our viewpoints.

PS - As I have stated, I dont believe Suriano will be at RU.

 

[matter7172]

Not really. I am simply highlighting where the disagreement is. If you do not agree with my characterization of the disagreement feel free to tell me. I think at this point, we can find common ground on where the dispute is though.



I am not sure who you are responding to with this. I am stating that:

1. No one knows the rules for seeking a waiver of the transfer rule, and no one knows the criteria. Nothing on this procedure is in the public domain

2. No one knows whether the consent of PSU/Cael would be considered in granting or denying a waiver.

Do we agree on those 2 points? If we do, lets build from there. Because from there, we are both going to use different facts to support our viewpoints.

PS - As I have stated, I dont believe Suriano will be at RU.

Well, I think everyone understands the points of disagreement. And I agree with points one and two. But many people here, Politi and Dunleavy have stated in no uncertain terms that Penn State could and should support Suriano's waiver request and both statements are entirely fabricated. You seem to be in agreement, in the end, with the "Penn State posters".

 

[Ole Cabbagehead]

Well, I think everyone understands the points of disagreement. And I agree with points one and two. But many people here, Politi and Dunleavy have stated in no uncertain terms that Penn State could and should support Suriano's waiver request and both statements are entirely fabricated. You seem to be in agreement, in the end, with the "Penn State posters".

I am glad we agree on those points. Having distilled it to the 2 primary disagreements, I think we can agree on what the 2 sides are saying:

1. No one knows the rules or procedure

- Rutgers insiders have suggested that Nick is seeking an advance ruling. This is based only on rumors from people close to our program. We don't know if that's true or not, since no one has confirmed it is happening. It is simply a rumor.

- PSU posters, using Micic as an informative example, have suggested that the Big Ten conference may require Nick to transfer to Rutgers, and only then seek a waiver of the rule. We don't know if that is true or not, because we don't know if Micic was required to do it that way, or if that is just how it was done in his instance.

2. No one knows if PSU/Cael can "consent"


- Rutgers insiders and some reporters have suggested that, at a minimum, PSU's acquiescence to a waiver of the transfer rule would be critical to a granting of the waiver, and if given, may even make a waiver likely. We don't know if that's true or not, because, as per #1 above, the procedures and criteria for a waiver are unknown. This is all speculation.


- PSU posters have suggested that, PSU's acquiescence to a waiver of the transfer rule would be irrelevant to the granting of a waiver, and might not even be considered by the Big Ten committee making the decision. As with the prior point, we don't know if this is true or not, because the procedures/criteria are unknown. This is all speculation.


Do we still agree?

You will note I left out the PSU point that - If the hardship being claimed by Suriano implicates PSU in any way, PSU would never give its acquiescence/consent to the transfer, because it could be construed as admitting wrongdoing. I think anyone being honest can agree that would be the case. If Suriano's hardship claim suggested mishandling of a medical issue, or even other wrongdoing, PSU would obviously dispute that, and then would not consent.

 

[Lyons212]

I am glad we agree on those points. Having distilled it to the 2 primary disagreements, I think we can agree on what the 2 sides are saying:

1. No one knows the rules or procedure

- Rutgers insiders have suggested that Nick is seeking an advance ruling. This is based only on rumors from people close to our program. We don't know if that's true or not, since no one has confirmed it is happening. It is simply a rumor.

- PSU posters, using Micic as an informative example, have suggested that the Big Ten conference may require Nick to transfer to Rutgers, and only then seek a waiver of the rule. We don't know if that is true or not, because we don't know if Micic was required to do it that way, or if that is just how it was done in his instance.

2. No one knows if PSU/Cael can "consent"


- Rutgers insiders and some reporters have suggested that, at a minimum, PSU's acquiescence to a waiver of the transfer rule would be critical to a granting of the waiver, and if given, may even make a waiver likely. We don't know if that's true or not, because, as per #1 above, the procedures and criteria for a waiver are unknown. This is all speculation.


- PSU posters have suggested that, PSU's acquiescence to a waiver of the transfer rule would be irrelevant to the granting of a waiver, and might not even be considered by the Big Ten committee making the decision. As with the prior point, we don't know if this is true or not, because the procedures/criteria are unknown. This is all speculation.


Do we still agree?

You will note I left out the PSU point that - If the hardship being claimed by Suriano implicates PSU in any way, PSU would never give its acquiescence/consent to the transfer, because it could be construed as admitting wrongdoing. I think anyone being honest can agree that would be the case. If Suriano's hardship claim suggested mishandling of a medical issue, or even other wrongdoing, PSU would obviously dispute that, and then would not consent.

We agree on all those points. It seems that the only fact we know is that Nick requested a release from PSU to transfer to Rutgers and that the release was granted. Beyond that, none us know where Nick will be attending/wrestling in the fall, that might even include Nick.

 

[Ole Cabbagehead]

I am pleased we can hopefully stop going in circles. Now we wait for new information. Its been hinted that the Surianos are meeting with PSU Tuesday. I guess we will see what comes of that. I must admit, while I do not think Nick will wind up at RU, I will be stunned if he winds up back at PSU. Although I suppose the other kids on the team are probably a lot more understanding of this drama than fans might be.

I hope something that comes out of this is an understanding on the waiver criteria/process. Whatever it is and whatever the Big Ten position on intra-conference transfers, it should really be transparent process out of fairness to the athletes. They should know the deal when they initially commit to a Big Ten school.

 

[Lyons212]

I am pleased we can hopefully stop going in circles. Now we wait for new information. Its been hinted that the Surianos are meeting with PSU Tuesday. I guess we will see what comes of that. I must admit, while I do not think Nick will wind up at RU, I will be stunned if he winds up back at PSU. Although I suppose the other kids on the team are probably a lot more understanding of this drama than fans might be.

I hope something that comes out of this is an understanding on the waiver criteria/process. Whatever it is and whatever the Big Ten position on intra-conference transfers, it should really be transparent process out of fairness to the athletes. They should know the deal when they initially commit to a Big Ten school.

I think kids know the deal when they commit to a B1G school, if you transfer to another B1G school you lose a year of eligibility. In the case of Micic he was granted a waiver after redshirting his first year since the Northwestern coach was fired for cause and the program was in shambles...basically Micic would not have gone to Northwestern if he known about the mess he was walking in too.

 

[Ole Cabbagehead]

I think kids know the deal when they commit to a B1G school, if you transfer to another B1G school you lose a year of eligibility. In the case of Micic he was granted a waiver after redshirting his first year since the Northwestern coach was fired for cause and the program was in shambles...basically Micic would not have gone to Northwestern if he known about the mess he was walking in too.

Yeah, but the fact that there is a waiver process adds room for funny business. Recruiting is a dirty business, everywhere. You think if a kid from Chicago told Brands he was choosing between NW and Iowa, and was nervous about going so far from home, to a program where he might be recruited over, Brands wouldn't reassure him that if for some reason he couldn't adjust to life in a god forsaken cornfield, he could always transfer back home, and that there were ways around the Big Ten rule?

Recruiting, being what it is, tells me that the rules should be clear cut, and waiver processes should be well understood. Its the only way to make it fair. Plus, wiggle room does nothing but create animosity towards the conference, because it is always going to leave a perception the Big Ten is favoring some programs over others. I.e. - If we were Michigan or OSU, this would have turned out differently.

In fact, the second reason is precisely why I think they leave wiggle room. Which is BS.

 

[jerzey devil]

Thank you PAwreslersintn.

Jerzey your first post was incorrect that said in wrestling there are no grad transfers because of the one time transfer rule. If a wrestler transfers a 2nd time to another D1 school and has graduated he does not have to sit.
Pretty clear.

Ok...so then grad transfers are only for a 2nd transfer then?

 

[Ole Cabbagehead]

Ok...so then grad transfers are only for a 2nd transfer then?

If you competed 3 out of 4 and graduated, you would be able to compete in your 5th year under either rule. Its not like a waiver situation...you are just eligible.

 

[GOLDBANGER]

Yeah, but the fact that there is a waiver process adds room for funny business. Recruiting is a dirty business, everywhere. You think if a kid from Chicago told Brands he was choosing between NW and Iowa, and was nervous about going so far from home, to a program where he might be recruited over, Brands wouldn't reassure him that if for some reason he couldn't adjust to life in a god forsaken cornfield, he could always transfer back home, and that there were ways around the Big Ten rule?

Recruiting, being what it is, tells me that the rules should be clear cut, and waiver processes should be well understood. Its the only way to make it fair. Plus, wiggle room does nothing but create animosity towards the conference, because it is always going to leave a perception the Big Ten is favoring some programs over others. I.e. - If we were Michigan or OSU, this would have turned out differently.

In fact, the second reason is precisely why I think they leave wiggle room. Which is BS.

Ole Cabbagehead, thou may incur the wrath of HR with the "God forsaken cornfield" statement. Just sayin', thems fightin' words in South Minnesota.

 

[Ole Cabbagehead]

Ole Cabbagehead, thou may incur the wrath of HR with the "God forsaken cornfield" statement. Just sayin', thems fightin' words in South Minnesota.

Please....I've seen how you guys talk about New Jersey.

 

[matter7172]

Please....I've seen how you guys talk about New Jersey.

I constantly defend NJ and point out my current hometown: http://www.njskylands.com/tour-mount-tabor

:)

 

[GOLDBANGER]

Please....I've seen how you guys talk about New Jersey.

No malicious intent, apologies for my feeble attempt at humor.

 

[matter7172]

No malicious intent, apologies for my feeble attempt at humor.

I think he was kidding, too.

 

[Ole Cabbagehead]

No malicious intent, apologies for my feeble attempt at humor.

I was definitely joking. Its all good.

I constantly defend NJ and point out my current hometown: http://www.njskylands.com/tour-mount-tabor

:)

That's too funny. I live in Morris Plains probably 3 miles from you. Do you live on the hill? Some funky houses up there.

 

[matter7172]

I was definitely joking. Its all good.

That's too funny. I live in Morris Plains probably 3 miles from you. Do you live on the hill? Some funky houses up there.

Yup. A rock's throw from the old stone water tower just off St. James Park. It's different here, but I like it.

 

[koleszar]

I constantly defend NJ and point out my current hometown: http://www.njskylands.com/tour-mount-tabor

:)

I have a friend who grew up there so we took a drive to see his house. That is definitely one weird and probably the coolest place I've ever visited. It's looks like a bunch of hippies grew up and decide to build a commune of really cool looking houses on a hill.

 

[matter7172]

I have a friend who grew up there so we took a drive to see his house. That is definitely one weird and probably the coolest place I've ever visited. It's looks like a bunch of hippies grew up and decide to build a commune of really cool looking houses on a hill.

Ask your friend about Children's Day sometime. It's a great event over 3 days during the first weekend in August. It's been held every year since the town was established in 1869. People who have moved away come back for it.

 

[Abro1975]

http://www.atthetabernacle.com/wp/

 

[matter7172]

http://www.atthetabernacle.com/wp/

I literally walk down the hill in a minute for these shows. Out the back door, over to six sets of stairs, down the stairs and across the small Trinity Park to The Tabernacle. Hot Tuna was just added.

 

[newell138]

My 2 sisters both raised their families in Mt Tabor when I was living in Denville it really is a great little, unique community. My grand aunt also lived there forever. Loved children's day! Do they still have free beer at the firehouse for it?

 

[matter7172]

My 2 sisters both raised their families in Mt Tabor when I was living in Denville it really is a great little, unique community. My grand aunt also lived there forever. Loved children's day! Do they still have free beer at the firehouse for it?

Free beer has been discontinued. :(

 

[LETSGORU91]

Free beer has been discontinued. :(

Just read the article in The Neighbor News about the festivities.

 

[newell138]

Free beer has been discontinued. :(

 

[CerealNTacos]

I literally walk down the hill in a minute for these shows. Out the back door, over to six sets of stairs, down the stairs and across the small Trinity Park to The Tabernacle. Hot Tuna was just added.

Long time lurker here...

How long have you lived in Mt Tabor for? My friend lives there, he's a tabor legend apparently. He's lived there his whole life and I've been to Children's Day dozens of times. Never thought I'd be reading about Mt Tabor in a Rutgers wrestling forum.

 

[Fzacsattac]

Wow! Lol

 

[matter7172]

Long time lurker here...

How long have you lived in Mt Tabor for? My friend lives there, he's a tabor legend apparently. He's lived there his whole life and I've been to Children's Day dozens of times. Never thought I'd be reading about Mt Tabor in a Rutgers wrestling forum.

I just moved here in April and love it so far. I live in the old, camp meeting part right near St. James Park. The weather is a huge plus. Up here on the top of the mountain/hill, it is much cooler and there is almost always a nice breeze. It's a very chill and friendly community and the kind of place you don't worry about locking your door, which is a nice throwback feeling. On early weekday mornings, I can take a walk around town and through the golf course at the edge of town.

 

[Abro1975]

I just moved here in April and love it so far. I live in the old, camp meeting part right near St. James Park. The weather is a huge plus. Up here on the top of the mountain/hill, it is much cooler and there is almost always a nice breeze. It's a very chill and friendly community and the kind of place you don't worry about locking your door, which is a nice throwback feeling. On early weekday mornings, I can take a walk around town and through the golf course at the edge of town.

Plus you are close to Arthurs Steakhouse in Morris Plains. Maybe my favorite place for a burger and beer, or sometimes I'll splurge for a steak.

 

[Abro1975]

Aug 26 and still no real news? I'm guessing since NJ State colleges don't start classes until Tuesday Sept 5, that might be the day Suriano news comes out. I guess either Rutgers or Rider.

 

[obrats]

I'm hearing between RU and another school not Rider. I am leaving for a cruise so new will probably break when I have no internet access.

 

[matter7172]

I'm hearing between RU and another school not Rider. I am leaving for a cruise so new will probably break when I have no internet access.

That's inconsistent with the report that Nick was granted a release to Rutgers only.

 

[ScarletGrapfan]

That's inconsistent with the report that Nick was granted a release to Rutgers only.

True, but if he is going to transfer and his choices are this:

Rutgers-no Big waiver=sit this season and have 2 seasons left to compete
Any School outside the Big, no release=sit this season(uses redshirt) and have 3 seasons left to compete
He might be thinking he does not want to lose the year of competition.

I will just be glad when this is over.

 

[matter7172]

True, but if he is going to transfer and his choices are this:

Rutgers-no Big waiver=sit this season and have 2 seasons left to compete
Any School outside the Big, no release=sit this season(uses redshirt) and have 3 seasons left to compete
He might be thinking he does not want to lose the year of competition.

I will just be glad when this is over.

That makes thousands of us that just want this to be over. :)

Ah, I wasn't thinking about the second scenario. Transferring without the release would make some sense. Not that anyone thinks this way, but 125 looks to be an easier path this year than the following years.

 

[LETSGORU91]

That makes thousands of us that just want this to be over. :)

Ah, I wasn't thinking about the second scenario. Transferring without the release would make some sense. Not that anyone thinks this way, but 125 looks to be an easier path this year than the following years.

I don't think an easier path this year or any other year matters much to him based on his skill level and what he accomplished as a true freshman. That being said, is no news good news for Rutgers?

 

[KidDagger]

I'm hearing between RU and another school not Rider. I am leaving for a cruise so new will probably break when I have no internet access.

Incoming shitliner jokes

 

[obrats]

That's inconsistent with the report that Nick was granted a release to Rutgers only.

Matter I don't disagree with you on that. I'm not getting first hand info just things I'm hearing, very much unconfirmed.

 

[wngarbarini]

When this is over I will tell you why the delay.

 

[wngarbarini]

He has cleaned out all of his stuff from PSU and withdrew from there.