The up way too late game thread
- Thread starter Trekology
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This as of now is a bad TEAM there is more talent than last year but individual talent won't win you many ball games. Not sure which was more frustrating the wide open bigs down low or the wide open threes Creighton seem to have all night. About the only thing OBannon said that I agreed with was that Sanders looked like he was looking for fouls in the second half instead of worrying about finishing or dishing off.
VERY VERY bad 2nd Half. I think the team looked and played tired in the 2nd half. ; I saw a bunch of guys with hands on their knees breathing heavily. All you need to do is look at the one hardest working guy you'll see anywhere, on any team........Williams, he had no juice. They came across a team on 4 days rest. Sometimes, i's just that simple !!
Hopefully, they will be re-energized for the next game.
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Completely missed the game, however, isn't Creighton a pretty good squad? Just read they're 85th in the KenPom rankings, and we're 208th (yikes), so not exactly a "bad" loss, right (not thrilled with losing a game we led at half, again, don't get me wrong...).
It's amazing how some of you know NOTHING about hoops
It's not an excuse but the facts...10 years of division one hoops on this roster and 7 of them by your 9th and 11th players
Team defense and switching just doesn't happen...that happens from playing on the court together. The subtle movements of stepping up and down, timinig, positioning and spacing comes with game repetition and a lot of practice reps. And knowing the teammates (and trusting them) to do their part and you not overcompensating
And heaven, when you play zone, do you think you just walk on the court and play a 2-3 defense like Syracuse does without experience
Knock the coaching when it's due....and knock effort points when it's due...but anyone who really knows a thing about team defense in college basketball will tell you it takes time to gel...and likely more than a year
So let the ignorant just rant on the coaching who probably never played a second of competitive basketball in their life
Time to start using the ignore button with some people. Perfect feature
It's not an excuse but the facts...10 years of division one hoops on this roster and 7 of them by your 9th and 11th players
Team defense and switching just doesn't happen...that happens from playing on the court together. The subtle movements of stepping up and down, timinig, positioning and spacing comes with game repetition and a lot of practice reps. And knowing the teammates (and trusting them) to do their part and you not overcompensating
And heaven, when you play zone, do you think you just walk on the court and play a 2-3 defense like Syracuse does without experience
Knock the coaching when it's due....and knock effort points when it's due...but anyone who really knows a thing about team defense in college basketball will tell you it takes time to gel...and likely more than a year
So let the ignorant just rant on the coaching who probably never played a second of competitive basketball in their life
Time to start using the ignore button with some people. Perfect feature
I did not see the game but read the entire thread. Sounds like we played our best offensive game in the first half and then reverted to form in the second. Appears defense was a nightmare from start to finish with little in the way of effective adjustments to slow the blue jays down. Creighton was bad last year and we know St. John's is not very good. Some want to believe things are getting better but I doubt the record will show it this year. Let me know when it is finally ok to pin some of this on ej. Meanwhile lets talk up recruits we are competing with Delaware to attract.
Didn't you get the memo. Despite graduating its two best players, the team is better and the players that replaced them are better. This year.
of course we get Clemson at midnight again.
I hear what Shack is saying, but some players NEED to know they can't play if they don't show focus on the defensive end. Some players are playing too many consectutive minutes. Did Foreman sit out in 1st half?
I hear what Shack is saying, but some players NEED to know they can't play if they don't show focus on the defensive end. Some players are playing too many consectutive minutes. Did Foreman sit out in 1st half?
Woke up at 3AM to check game tracker and read through the thread. Very glad I didnt stay up for this one.
People seemed surprised. Last night wasnt a surprise if youve been honest about this team. We gave up 84 to Central Arky and struggled with Newark. . This team does not play defense and is mostly out of control on offense. The team is young and the coaching remains suspect so its going to be a looooong year of not paying to wins and losses but seeing if there is improvement by years end. Fans should be majorly worried about the lack of a big man. Lewis has been a big disappointment and Daniels erratic play probablywill not change at this juncture. One can hope the young players start catching on but really we could usecmore talent. Relying on Sanders and Freeman could really wear them down
People seemed surprised. Last night wasnt a surprise if youve been honest about this team. We gave up 84 to Central Arky and struggled with Newark. . This team does not play defense and is mostly out of control on offense. The team is young and the coaching remains suspect so its going to be a looooong year of not paying to wins and losses but seeing if there is improvement by years end. Fans should be majorly worried about the lack of a big man. Lewis has been a big disappointment and Daniels erratic play probablywill not change at this juncture. One can hope the young players start catching on but really we could usecmore talent. Relying on Sanders and Freeman could really wear them down
it was that scintillating win in the opener over underrated Rutgers Newark that put people over the top wasn't it. Look I know people want to be optimistic but declarations like this team is better than last year after just 2 or 3 games against weak sisters is way premature. Last year RU had some clunkers in the non conference season but beat Clemson so lets see how this years team does against Clemson
In fairness...many of the comments were made as the game was going on. Posting something within minutes of watching them get 3 consecutive layups vs. comments 24 hours later is different.
its not what I am expecting from this team. It is what I am expecting and very worried about in year 3 with this coach. Just not seeing the basics from him that I thought we'd see. What I call the "value-added" regardless of who is on your floor.
I guess if your system is just to let them play free and wild..ok..will take time to gel into whatever that is supposed to be. But I was really hoping to see a level of quality play that elevated the game vs. the crap we've been exposed to for so freakin long.
I just want them more dialed in defensively. I can accept losing games because of missed FT or point guards not getting them in to the offense. I am having a tough time with the last 2 games. We were more than good enough to win offensively vs. Creighton.
I do think college basketball is rapidly changing. The tempo of last game was high. More possessions equals more transitions which means our D has a tough time getting set and is starting each possession slightly winded. A lot easier playing D in a 65 possession game were teams are walking it up the court and the game is more "grinding"
I am pretty sure you can watch again on YouTube if you want to watch for yourself. Too many individuals not enough team play and very porous defense
Explain how Creighton who seem to be a mishmash of transfers have jelled so quickly. And please don't say they have college experience. These players nowadays come into college with hundreds of AAU games under their belts So it isn't like in the past when kids just came from HS and really did need to learn nuances of the game
The defense needs a lot of work and will be a work in process.
The whole team is gojng to be like this
We are going to have games where we look like a division 3 team and then look amazing. All in the same half
I get everyone's frustration of 25 years of no NCAA but this is beginning of year three of a 6 year fix (with no guarantees) and we are 3-2 and lead two big east teams at the half away from the RAC.
We will be major work in progress
If there ever was a year to judge on the macro and not on the micro...this is year.
We are progressing....that's what to judge. Sure we need a lot of work...but their is progress
And the progress may not look like a nice linear line up. It may go up and down
Look at the trend....judge by that
The whole team is gojng to be like this
We are going to have games where we look like a division 3 team and then look amazing. All in the same half
I get everyone's frustration of 25 years of no NCAA but this is beginning of year three of a 6 year fix (with no guarantees) and we are 3-2 and lead two big east teams at the half away from the RAC.
We will be major work in progress
If there ever was a year to judge on the macro and not on the micro...this is year.
We are progressing....that's what to judge. Sure we need a lot of work...but their is progress
And the progress may not look like a nice linear line up. It may go up and down
Look at the trend....judge by that
Shack - I respect your opinion and enjoy reading your posts.
That said, I am VERY concerned with the coaching (or lack thereof) demonstrated by Eddie and crew.
I dont expect these guys to be flawless switching, rotating perfectly, etc. But that's not what I am upset with. In the first half, it was clear that Creighton's philosophy after we scored was inbound the ball as fast as possible and beat us down the floor. imploring our guys to beat them back down the court is not Wooden type stuff. but we let them score numerous times with minimal effort. this is just maddening.
and I could write up pages of examples for how many WASTED offensive sets there were.
I will do my best to enjoy this season and watch this team - hopefully - grow and mature...but for me, Eddie is on the clock...as he is not doing some of the basic stuff I want our BBall coach to do. this is the critical year where he shows he is, or is not, the answer. I hope he is, and I am pulling for him...but stuff that concerns me continues to pile up. I will continue to root for him, and will be the first in line to say I was wrong if he turns this around (and I hope he does!!)
Feel free to ignore me...but hopefully you'll view this as a balanced post. From my vantage point, I have legitimate concerns.
I think we should look more micro and less macro.
Are we improving with all the little things that are needed to win....things like a jump stop used by a penetrator to prevent offensive fouls OR getting all 5 to get in to the same and right defense.
Are we improving with all the little things that are needed to win....things like a jump stop used by a penetrator to prevent offensive fouls OR getting all 5 to get in to the same and right defense.
LOL - my wife during the SJU game "who is that guy you called a turnover machine last year, is he still on the team?"
I haven't seen the game - but it sounds like our guys were gassed near the end. Did Creighton's early pace wear our guys out? Is it a conditioning issue, or possibly guys trying to work harder instead of smarter (trying to do too much themselves rather than trusting the defensive system, or overcommitting and not being in position for the fast break)?
I wasn't able to watch (I've only seen the SJU game so far), so I'm curious what others who have seen the team more think?
I wasn't able to watch (I've only seen the SJU game so far), so I'm curious what others who have seen the team more think?
Wait until the B1G season starts. It's the same thing it's always been. Too few good players.
Sorry, this is just a bad team from coaches to players. Almost zero improvement in year three under Eddie. Eddie just may not be cut out to coach any longer.
Just wait to those 4 recruits get here next year. Oh, wait, we don't even have a single verbal commitment.
The two guys they brought in (Huff and Watson) were team leaders on Div-I programs prior to coming to Creighton, and they had a full redshirt season with the team last year to learn the system and work on S&C. They're also going to need to gel over time, as they lost a ton of their starting minutes from last year - and they'll be inconsistent. It helps that only 29% of their minutes comes from underclassmen, while 63% of ours do.
It seems we were in front of them for a half, then got tired and fell into bad habits in the second half.
78 and 85 points are the last two opponents scores against RU. Anyone that pushes the tempo or is willing to do so, will score in college basketball. Indiana gave up 50 in the first half to Wake Forest in Maui, on their way to giving up 82 total points.....this would have been more if Wake Forest didn't have well over 20 turnovers.
The 30 second shot clock is 5 extra seconds each possession and it is going to be tougher for teams that lack the athletes, to get up and down the court and score in transition. Bishop Daniels in transition is a drastically different player vs a normal half court setting.
I don't know if RU can or wants to improve on defense, but my hope was that Williams and maybe Sanders with his quickness, would be a better defensive team and that kids like Foreman and Laurent grow up to be defensive first players. The coach and staff has to sell one or two additional players on this roster to guard first or defend first, so it becomes second nature. Williams cannot be the only one, in the proper stance most possessions. Daniels and Sanders possess the athleticism to each get a dunk in each half, if they got deflections and run-outs by playing better defense.
The only point is that RU and this staff need to decide how they want to build the roster and right now, we still need a perimeter shooter from the Small Forward/2 guard position.
The good news is that despite our top 2 scorers leaving last year, this team appears to be as good or better offensively now than last year. That was the biggest question was Mack and Jack are gone and RU is picked 14th out of 14 in the B1G....no surprise there.
RU may still finish 14th or only win a couple of B1G games, but it wont be from lack of scoring. I don't think a lot of teams are focused on defense right now, scoring is way, way up across the board. I'm shocked at the lack of defense at places like North Carolina, Indiana a lot of the schools we traditionally think of as great programs and they just outscore you most games. I just don't think this next generation of coaches wants to be that coach demanding defense each and every night. It is disappointing to see not just at RU but a lot of places where there isn't even an effort to stop the opponent.
But when you don't have 5 to 7 scorers at your disposal and you don't slow teams down, you have NO chance to win or upset teams that are better and have more talent than you do. I am not sure if we are asking Eddie to clean up the program and restock the roster first before demanding the roster of freshman to hold teams under 70 points most nights, but at some point, unless Daniels, Williams, Freeman and Sanders are clicking and all are knocking down shots, if you don't at least make an attempt to slow teams down, people will get into the 70's and 80's against RU and I don't think we have 80 points a night on our scoring averages to count on.
Once we get into December and January, things will likely slow down (I would hope) and most teams are not going to be freelancing like we have seen early this season. It still comes down to bodies that are athletic and capable and this next wave of recruiting between now and spring signing period will really define Eddie's tenure. Unlike a lot of the past coaches that have only really had one bonafide class during their tenure, there is a chance Eddie can capture another good class in 2016, which would finally restock a roster for now and the future, where RU isn't scrambling for able bodies.
It's really this spring signing period and what can Eddie add to Nigel Johnson, who is a definite plus.
The 30 second shot clock is 5 extra seconds each possession and it is going to be tougher for teams that lack the athletes, to get up and down the court and score in transition. Bishop Daniels in transition is a drastically different player vs a normal half court setting.
I don't know if RU can or wants to improve on defense, but my hope was that Williams and maybe Sanders with his quickness, would be a better defensive team and that kids like Foreman and Laurent grow up to be defensive first players. The coach and staff has to sell one or two additional players on this roster to guard first or defend first, so it becomes second nature. Williams cannot be the only one, in the proper stance most possessions. Daniels and Sanders possess the athleticism to each get a dunk in each half, if they got deflections and run-outs by playing better defense.
The only point is that RU and this staff need to decide how they want to build the roster and right now, we still need a perimeter shooter from the Small Forward/2 guard position.
The good news is that despite our top 2 scorers leaving last year, this team appears to be as good or better offensively now than last year. That was the biggest question was Mack and Jack are gone and RU is picked 14th out of 14 in the B1G....no surprise there.
RU may still finish 14th or only win a couple of B1G games, but it wont be from lack of scoring. I don't think a lot of teams are focused on defense right now, scoring is way, way up across the board. I'm shocked at the lack of defense at places like North Carolina, Indiana a lot of the schools we traditionally think of as great programs and they just outscore you most games. I just don't think this next generation of coaches wants to be that coach demanding defense each and every night. It is disappointing to see not just at RU but a lot of places where there isn't even an effort to stop the opponent.
But when you don't have 5 to 7 scorers at your disposal and you don't slow teams down, you have NO chance to win or upset teams that are better and have more talent than you do. I am not sure if we are asking Eddie to clean up the program and restock the roster first before demanding the roster of freshman to hold teams under 70 points most nights, but at some point, unless Daniels, Williams, Freeman and Sanders are clicking and all are knocking down shots, if you don't at least make an attempt to slow teams down, people will get into the 70's and 80's against RU and I don't think we have 80 points a night on our scoring averages to count on.
Once we get into December and January, things will likely slow down (I would hope) and most teams are not going to be freelancing like we have seen early this season. It still comes down to bodies that are athletic and capable and this next wave of recruiting between now and spring signing period will really define Eddie's tenure. Unlike a lot of the past coaches that have only really had one bonafide class during their tenure, there is a chance Eddie can capture another good class in 2016, which would finally restock a roster for now and the future, where RU isn't scrambling for able bodies.
It's really this spring signing period and what can Eddie add to Nigel Johnson, who is a definite plus.
He just took a real big swing and a miss in the fall period, which is where successful programs do almost all of their shopping.
Game threads are one the most useless things on this board. I think they are designed to give certain people a place to bitch about everything and not necessarily analyze what is actually happening on the court.
tough not being emotional during a game. if you didnt want to throw something at the TV when Bishop goes 1 on 3 down 3 in the middle of the 2nd half you don't care..............actually punch your laptop or tablet
Agree 100%. The only thing gained from reading this is entries to my ignore list. Someone in this thread has posted some form of "Jordan sucks" so many time I think he might have serious mental problems and Eddie needs to up his security. One of the main problems with this and the football board. Too many posters that think their opinion is so important they need to repeat it over and over.
Having said that, I agree with some that the offense looks much better, but needs to cut down on the sloppy play/turnovers. That might be some combination of youthful enthusiasm/inexperience. Sanders and Freeman are better than Mack and Jack, Williams is much improved. I thought Laurent looked like someone who is going to be a contributor soon. But I'm still frustrated by all the open 3 point looks. Not sure if that is on Eddie or if the players are screwing up. But I think they get better as the season goes on. We saw that stuff in the late stages last year, so I'm still optimistic.
