Trying to get my head around our secondary situation and the fact that we are still winning!?!?

[MikeRU1766]

So I just was brainstorming a "What-If" situation since despite ALL the odds being against us this season we are currently standing at 3-3 which our bowl hopes still very much alive. THAT IS DOWNRIGHT INCREDIBLE AND SHOWS THE TYPE OF COACHES AND PLAYERS THAT WE BRING IN / CREATE AT RUTGERS!

So I was thinking about our secondary which would look something like this:

CB: Boggs, Dailey, Wharton, James
FS: Stephenson, Cioffi, Hampton
SS: Jacobs, (Co) Hester / Hunt
CB: Barnwell, Austin, Adams
_________________________________________________________________________________

And currently this is the secondary that we have been playing that deserves A TON of credit for being thrown into the top conference in the country the BIG10 and doing a lot more bending than they are doing breaking.

CB: Wharton, James
FS: Cioffi, Hampton
SS: (Co) Jacobs / Hester, Hunt
CB: Austin, Adams
_________________________________________________________________________________

So basically we could say that we have lost our starting CB, our Starting FS, and our other Starting CB to career ending injuries during summer training camp (Boggs, Stephenson, and Barnwell). Then we also lost our Back-Up CB to a career ending injury as well (Dailey). And then we ALSO have had injuries to our starting AND backup SS (Jacobs and Hester) for games this season.

So how the heck are we 3-3?! Well first, we had a good schedule for our team up until this point which included Norfolk State, Kansas, and Indiana. BUT you MUST also give the coaches and players a TON of credit because besides the wins they also we very solid against #4 Michigan State.

Could we all just take a second and dream about how great our imaginary season would have been? We would have won our 3 wins and we also would have won against Washington State and I also would argue that we would have beaten Michigan State as well. And even against PSU, even though we got blown out this year, who knows how much the dynamics and play calling would have been changed if we had our proper secondary in place for the game?! 4-2 at worst, probably 5-1 and possibly 6-0!

But hey in 2-3 years we are going to have the best secondary in the BIG10! Mark my words right now!

 

[MikeRU1766]

Also, how good of shape must Wharton and Austin be in? Because who the heck is subbing in for these guys to get a breather? Ronnie James has only gotten in one game so far which was Norfolk State. That means it must be Jarius Adams being the sub for BOTH of them?! How the heck is this working out, am I missing something and somebody else is being rotated into the CB position that I am not noticing?

And either way, I think Wharton and Austin deserve a MAJOR shout out for doing what they are doing for our team! Keep up the good work and just know that your effort does not go un-noticed! (Also, the safeties deserve a shout out as well, but I was specifically talking about just the CB's in this 2nd post.)

 

[RUfromSoCal?]

Freshman corners........... Other than QB - hardest position on the field......

 

[AreYouNUTS]

How are we 3-3? I'm happy as a pig in shit that we are because I figured we'd be 2-4, as of now, following the PSU game, but...not for nothing, however, we've beaten:

2-4 Norfolk State (Sagarin 222nd)
0-6 Kansas (lowest rated P5 school @ 125th; 123rd Total D...out of 127), and
4-3 Indiana (77th...118th Total D nationally

...these are nothing but facts, not opinion, so try not to pile on too much fellas.

 

[MikeRU1766]

How are we 3-3? I'm happy as a pig in shit that we are because I figured we'd be 2-4, as of now, following the PSU game, but...not for nothing, however, we've beaten:

2-4 Norfolk State (Sagarin 222nd)
0-6 Kansas (lowest rated P5 school @ 125th; 123rd Total D...out of 127), and
4-3 Indiana (77th...118th Total D nationally

... othese are nothing but facts, not opinion, so try not to pile on too much fellas.

Agreed, we definitely have had a good schedule up until this point that helped us get some W's despite losing all the players on our roster especially in the secondary. I am relatively happy with the record, but more importantly I AM EXTREMELY HAPPY to see the amount of character these players have. We have players who are willing to not only play hard occasionally; we have players who play hard for a full 60 minutes. We also have shown that we aren't a New Orleans Saints type team who can only win when they get to play at home with the ridiculous "electric" home field advantage we get going, which is most famously showcased during the BlackOut Games and even commented on by the BTN commentators both this year and last. I was PROUD about a lot of things during the win over Indiana, but now that I have had some time to reflect I think I am most proud of them being able to pull out that comeback ON THE ROAD. They didn't have the 53,200 rabid fans, friends, family, etc. cheering them through the finish line and giving them that extra boost of energy and encouraging them to dig just a bit deeper for the fans. They motivated themselves all on their own! Some combination of self-motivation, the coaches properly motivating and keeping the players heads and attitude right, and the players on the sidelines line Darius Hamilton is where that final push came from and that is a great sign!

 

[AreYouNUTS]

Agreed, we definitely have had a good schedule up until this point that helped us get some W's despite losing all the players on our roster especially in the secondary. I am relatively happy with the record, but more importantly I AM EXTREMELY HAPPY to see the amount of character these players have. We have players who are willing to not only play hard occasionally; we have players who play hard for a full 60 minutes. We also have shown that we aren't a New Orleans Saints type team who can only win when they get to play at home with the ridiculous "electric" home field advantage we get going, which is most famously showcased during the BlackOut Games and even commented on by the BTN commentators both this year and last. I was PROUD about a lot of things during the win over Indiana, but now that I have had some time to reflect I think I am most proud of them being able to pull out that comeback ON THE ROAD. They didn't have the 53,200 rabid fans, friends, family, etc. cheering them through the finish line and giving them that extra boost of energy and encouraging them to dig just a bit deeper for the fans. They motivated themselves all on their own! Some combination of self-motivation, the coaches properly motivating and keeping the players heads and attitude right, and the players on the sidelines line Darius Hamilton is where that final push came from and that is a great sign!

Can't argue with any of this buddy!

 

[jellyman]

Also, how good of shape must Wharton and Austin be in? Because who the heck is subbing in for these guys to get a breather? Ronnie James has only gotten in one game so far which was Norfolk State. That means it must be Jarius Adams being the sub for BOTH of them?! How the heck is this working out, am I missing something and somebody else is being rotated into the CB position that I am not noticing?

And either way, I think Wharton and Austin deserve a MAJOR shout out for doing what they are doing for our team! Keep up the good work and just know that your effort do not go un-noticed! (Also, the safeties deserve a shout out as well, but I was specifically talking about just the CB's in this 2nd post.)

Remember that Adams has actually been hurt for the Penn State, Kansas and Michigan games, so was not even available.

Also remember that RU only returned 1 starting DB from 2014: Barnwell. That Stephenson and Boggs were back-ups (who played) last season. So compared to the 2014 secondary, RU lost 5 of its 2-deep at DB from 2014, comparable to the 2013 losses versus 2012 (in 2013 RU graduated 5 of its top 6 returning DB's). Though many of us thought that a 1-year more mature Jacobs plus even an inexperienced Hester would be an improvement and upgrade over Waters, which I think has been the case. But we also thought that a 1-year improved Boggs, backed up by Dailey, would be an improvement over Glashen (who was steady and better than expected, but limited in athleticism).

 

[shields]

Could be Georgia Tech. picked for top 20 I believe they are 2-5.

 

[RU1977]

Besides the wins, we did play well against Michigan State, that also counts for something (since we lost to them last year 45-3)....

 

[derleider]

So I just was brainstorming a "What-If" situation since despite ALL the odds being against us this season we are currently standing at 3-3 which our bowl hopes still very much alive. THAT IS DOWNRIGHT INCREDIBLE AND SHOWS THE TYPE OF COACHES AND PLAYERS THAT WE BRING IN / CREATE AT RUTGERS!

So I was thinking about our secondary which would look something like this:

CB: Boggs, Dailey, Wharton, James
FS: Stephenson, Cioffi, Hampton
SS: Jacobs, (Co) Hester / Hunt
CB: Barnwell, Austin, Adams
_________________________________________________________________________________

And currently this is the secondary that we have been playing that deserves A TON of credit for being thrown into the top conference in the country the BIG10 and doing a lot more bending than they are doing breaking.

CB: Wharton, James
FS: Cioffi, Hampton
SS: (Co) Jacobs / Hester, Hunt
CB: Austin, Adams
_________________________________________________________________________________

So basically we could say that we have lost our starting CB, our Starting FS, and our other Starting CB to career ending injuries during summer training camp (Boggs, Stephenson, and Barnwell). Then we also lost our Back-Up CB to a career ending injury as well (Dailey). And then we ALSO have had injuries to our starting AND backup SS (Jacobs and Hester) for games this season.

So how the heck are we 3-3?! Well first, we had a good schedule for our team up until this point which included Norfolk State, Kansas, and Indiana. BUT you MUST also give the coaches and players a TON of credit because besides the wins they also we very solid against #4 Michigan State.

Could we all just take a second and dream about how great our imaginary season would have been? We would have won our 3 wins and we also would have won against Washington State and I also would argue that we would have beaten Michigan State as well. And even against PSU, even though we got blown out this year, who knows how much the dynamics and play calling would have been changed if we had our proper secondary in place for the game?! 4-2 at worst, probably 5-1 and possibly 6-0!

But hey in 2-3 years we are going to have the best secondary in the BIG10! Mark my words right now!

Just to put a bit of a damper on it - we have WON three games - against a really bad D1AA, the worst FBS team, and in a shoot out against Indiana in which we gave up the 4th most points of the post-2004 era. So that pretty much explains how we are 3-3 - we played 2 REALLY bad teams, and one team with an equally bad defense.

Lets see how the next 3 go - if we play well in even two of the likely losses, then we can say MSU wasnt just a fluke of us being at home, coming off a buy week and them looking ahead to a much bigger game. In other words - so far the D has looked pretty bad against the 3 legit teams we played that arent MSU - so maybe MSU was just that one really flukey game every team has in a year.

 

[RCTrooper]

If we didn't score 4 TDs and a FG to close out the game, would we be extolling the virtues of our DB's. I know they picked Sudfield off twice late in the game but he still hung 4 TDs and over 450 yards on us and made one WR look like Julian Edelman.

 

[WhiteBus]

I love the spin on this board. Bowl hopes very much alive?
Great win last week. Great game against MSU but it was still a loss. The next 4 are no gimmies by a long stretch. Rutgers will be a dog in all of them and most likely double digits in each. So RU's bowl hopes are contigent on a big upset.
Possible? Absolutely. Likely? Can't say yes to that. That WSU game was critical to an easy path to a bowl game.

 

[RUBOB72]

Can't argue with any of this buddy!

And 2 of our 3 losses are to a still unbeaten Michigan State #4 and a Washington State team who is better at this juncture then most expected ...yes , they did lose to Portland State and a good Cal team...the Penn State loss a was a perfect storm for disaster...suspensions ... total program discord...media and fans bashing the team and school... Carroo our best player unable to play...a new young inexperienced secondary... a young D line with Hamilton at 25-30 %... a new O-line going against a very good front 7... a tough environment... a QB playing his 2nd game as a starter in Chris Laviano...could , woulda , shoulda...I don't believe in moral losses...predicted 5-7 but I I won't be disappointed with 6-6 and a bowl game ...remember this important fact...if you support the team's players you must support the staff until there is no chance in the season.

 

[WhiteBus]

And 2 of our 3 losses are to a still unbeaten Michigan State #4 and a Washington State team who is better at this juncture then most expected ...yes , they did lose to Portland State and a good Cal team...the Penn State loss a was a perfect storm for disaster...suspensions ... total program discord...media and fans bashing the team and school... Carroo our best player unable to play...a new young inexperienced secondary... a young D line with Hamilton at 25-30 %... a new O-line going against a very good front 7... a tough environment... a QB playing his 2nd game as a starter in Chris Laviano...could , woulda , shoulda...I don't believe in moral losses...predicted 5-7 but I I won't be disappointed with 6-6 and a bowl game ...remember this important fact...if you support the team's players you must support the staff until there is no chance in the season.

Certainly won't be disappointed at 6-6. But very disappointed at 5-7.
So how does Rutgers get to 6-6? Obviously Army and MD are in the W column. Don't see a win this week or at Michigan ...tough place to play, especially first visit. So the Nebraska and @Wisconsin are the best chances. Who you got?

 

[AreYouNUTS]

And 2 of our 3 losses are to a still unbeaten Michigan State #4 and a Washington State team who is better at this juncture then most expected ...yes , they did lose to Portland State and a good Cal team...the Penn State loss a was a perfect storm for disaster...suspensions ... total program discord...media and fans bashing the team and school... Carroo our best player unable to play...a new young inexperienced secondary... a young D line with Hamilton at 25-30 %... a new O-line going against a very good front 7... a tough environment... a QB playing his 2nd game as a starter in Chris Laviano...could , woulda , shoulda...I don't believe in moral losses...predicted 5-7 but I I won't be disappointed with 6-6 and a bowl game ...remember this important fact...if you support the team's players you must support the staff until there is no chance in the season.

There is no such rule in the "fan rule book" that says you EVER have to "support a staff" LET ALONE do so until there is "no chance in the season." It's been made up here on these boards, by people who THINK this is the case, to justify their own support for this staff (which, IMHO, is 100% unnecessary, you support a staff, to the bitter end, because you want to, and that's okay...). YOU SUPPORT THE PROGRAM AND THE TEAM ON THE FIELD 150%,

Just stop talking to me and life here will be a lot easier for everyone involved. Thank you.

 

[derleider]

I love the spin on this board. Bowl hopes very much alive?
Great win last week. Great game against MSU but it was still a loss. The next 4 are no gimmies by a long stretch. Rutgers will be a dog in all of them and most likely double digits in each. So RU's bowl hopes are contigent on a big upset.
Possible? Absolutely. Likely? Can't say yes to that. That WSU game was critical to an easy path to a bowl game.

Yes - but they are still alive. Nebraska is not Nebraska of last year. We will be dogs, but its not like it would have seemed after PSU, when the rest of the scehdule except Army looked virtually unwinnable to alot of this board (and hell - after Army stuck with PSU we had people saying we wouldnt win one more game all year.)

For that matter - even Wisconsin and Michigan arent out of reach like they would ahve seemed a month ao.

Yes - we will need to score an upset to get to a bowl. That has been the case since we lost to WSU in week 2. But the chances of scoring that upset look higher now that they did after that game or PSU.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

Yes - but they are still alive. Nebraska is not Nebraska of last year. We will be dogs, but its not like it would have seemed after PSU, when the rest of the scehdule except Army looked virtually unwinnable to alot of this board (and hell - after Army stuck with PSU we had people saying we wouldnt win one more game all year.)

For that matter - even Wisconsin and Michigan arent out of reach like they would ahve seemed a month ao.

.

Eh, not sure we match up vet well against either of them, and:

Wisconsin - #7 D and CC returning

Michigan - #2 D and, prior to a HUGE "rivalry" game, had shut out its 3 previous opponents and only given up 38 points all season.

 

[Scarlet16E]

I love the spin on this board. Bowl hopes very much alive?
Great win last week. Great game against MSU but it was still a loss. The next 4 are no gimmies by a long stretch. Rutgers will be a dog in all of them and most likely double digits in each. So RU's bowl hopes are contigent on a big upset.
Possible? Absolutely. Likely? Can't say yes to that. That WSU game was critical to an easy path to a bowl game.

Your kind of missing the point.
We lost the WSU game largely because we faced them early with our inexperienced secondary.
These guys are getting better each week. Played MSU, with their great QB & receivers, down to the wire. Beat IU, with a highly touted QB. We are giving up lots of yards to these guys, but we are improving.

On a related note: we are getting lots of pressure on the opposing QB's as of late. Sudfield and Cook both had hardly been sacked until we got to them. I'm very happy to see this.

 

[Ole Cabbagehead]

I love the spin on this board. Bowl hopes very much alive?
Great win last week. Great game against MSU but it was still a loss. The next 4 are no gimmies by a long stretch. Rutgers will be a dog in all of them and most likely double digits in each. So RU's bowl hopes are contigent on a big upset.
Possible? Absolutely. Likely? Can't say yes to that. That WSU game was critical to an easy path to a bowl game.

What is the point of this post? Isn't "Possible" the same as "hopes are alive"?

You criticize the post as spin, but then don't argue with it.

 

[WhiteBus]

What is the point of this post? Isn't "Possible" the same as "hopes are alive"?

You criticize the post as spin, but then don't argue with it.

First you didn't read the OP's quote accurately nor mine. You convienently left out "very". As is very much alive. No, that aren't very much alive. They are possible and alive but Rutgers doesn't have the easy road the OP is trying to say they have. It going to take a big upset to go 6-6.

 

[Ole Cabbagehead]

First you didn't read the OP's quote accurately nor mine. You convienently left out "very". As is very much alive. No, that aren't very much alive. They are possible and alive but Rutgers doesn't have the easy road the OP is trying to say they have. It going to take a big upset to go 6-6.

"Very much" is not a modifier...it doesn't change the meaning. Rather, it emphasizes the meaning. That's why I left it out. You are either alive or dead. You cannot be more alive, and you cannot be a little dead. The "very much" emphasizes that we are, in fact, alive in our hunt for a bowl. It has nothing to do with more or less likely.

Also, I disagree that beating Nebraska would be a huge upset. But thats for another thread.

 

[WhiteBus]

"Very much" is not a modifier...it doesn't change the meaning. Rather, it emphasizes the meaning. That's why I left it out. You are either alive or dead. You cannot be more alive, and you cannot be a little dead. The "very much" emphasizes that we are, in fact, alive in our hunt for a bowl. It has nothing to do with more or less likely.

Also, I disagree that beating Nebraska would be a huge upset. But thats for another thread.

It is a modifier. One you choose to ignore and one that I think is big. Either way by losing to WSU the easy road to a bowl game is gone. We can agree about Nebraska when the time comes but there is a zero chance that Rutgers will be favored. So any win against Nebraska will be an upset. I do agree that is the key game to win. Michigan at home and Wisconsin at home will not be considered close games prior to kickoff. Anything is possible but likely isn't an adjective for Rutgers getting to 6-6

 

[Ru2bnj]

Before the season I stated that RU would probably need a big upset to get to a bowl. I picked Nebraska as a possible win. Not because I thought they would get off to a slow start but because they host MSU the week before..which I believed would be a very big game for them. Thought they could be off their game the following week at RU. Adding in that RU would at that point be desperate for a win to get to bowl eligibility. You have to remember, Nebraska has lost 3 very close games..literally in the last seconds, so it's not like they are really getting beat up front or anything. They played very well last week and will be a different team down the stretch. It's a tough game but RU will need it. Don't think RU is winning any of the next 3 unfortunately.