Why not? UCLA was thought to be unbreakable from Cal. Oklahoma vs Oklahoma State. Happens all the time
West Coast View on Expansion
- Thread starter rucoe89
- Start date
Not that simple. With top 5 media markets already in the fold, adding lesser markets might shrink the share per university.
Agree. Hence why they have people researching this.
But to ask what OU and Wash bring is silly. They bring 2 top 25 media markets, great athletics, partners with the cal schools..as well as a Nike presence
Active rivalries:
USC annually since 1926, only missing games for WW2 and Covid.
Navy annually since 1927, missing only 2020 for Covid.
Stanford annually since 1988, missing three years in that time.
B1G rivalry games that ended when they made the deal with the ACC:
Purdue every year from 1946 until 2014
MSU every year from 1959 to 2013
Michigan in 31/36 years from 1978-2014
They've also had an on-again/off-again thing with PSU over the years
Getting ND in the door for the media rights package would mean another 6-10 nationally televised games every year. If it means taking Stanford along with them, that's not really a tough sell - Stanford is a prestigious academic institution, and it would give USC/UCLA another west coast program.
A 9-game conference slate, plus 3 OOC games against Navy and a rotation of BC/Pitt/Army/Air Force would be huge money from a media rights perspective.
If ND joins the B1G they become a second Nebraska. Living on reputation and past glory. Getting smoked each week as the season goes on because they are not used to the schedule and physicality of the B1G.
If ND won't budge, I see this as the likely next step.... in-state carriage fees for BTN for Washington (7.7M people; #12 Seattle/Tacoma media market) and Oregon (4.2M people; #21 Portland media market).
i don’t think BIG does any more without ND.
once ND agrees, they take Stanford, Wash and Ore.
If ND duesnt agree, they stay at 16
Well here's some more info in a Q&A from Canzano that wasn't in his article yesterday. If that's the case well then Stanford offers more from the biz perspective than some of us think, including myself. Just as a reminder from that article yesterday, the ex Fox sports prez thought Oregon/Wash were worth 60M.
Q: Who is more attractive to the Big Ten, Stanford or Oregon? — @williamswes
A: The ex-Fox Sports Network president, Bob Thompson, placed Oregon’s media-rights value at $30 million and Stanford’s at $45 million when I pressed him. That may be all that would normally matter to the Big Ten. However, I think Oregon’s national brand and Phil Knight’s clout give the Ducks the edge. If the Big Ten takes Oregon, I would expect there to be some sort of subsidy or waiting period (See: Maryland) before the Ducks are allowed to take a full conference media share.
Q: How will Cal ever pay off its stadium debt now? Getting into the Big Ten is a fantasy, so we'll be left with mid-major TV deal money. There's no way out of a $100M(?) debt with that. Do you think it's a possibility that Cal shuts down its football program within a few years? — @RuminatingOrion
A: There’s a lot of ball to play before we get to a “shut down” situation. Cal is paired with Stanford and sits in the Bay Area television market. Because of that former Fox Sports Network president Bob Thompson told me he believes Cal/Stanford are worth $90 million total in annual television revenue. That is a huge advantage.
www.johncanzano.com
Q: Who is more attractive to the Big Ten, Stanford or Oregon? — @williamswes
A: The ex-Fox Sports Network president, Bob Thompson, placed Oregon’s media-rights value at $30 million and Stanford’s at $45 million when I pressed him. That may be all that would normally matter to the Big Ten. However, I think Oregon’s national brand and Phil Knight’s clout give the Ducks the edge. If the Big Ten takes Oregon, I would expect there to be some sort of subsidy or waiting period (See: Maryland) before the Ducks are allowed to take a full conference media share.
Q: How will Cal ever pay off its stadium debt now? Getting into the Big Ten is a fantasy, so we'll be left with mid-major TV deal money. There's no way out of a $100M(?) debt with that. Do you think it's a possibility that Cal shuts down its football program within a few years? — @RuminatingOrion
A: There’s a lot of ball to play before we get to a “shut down” situation. Cal is paired with Stanford and sits in the Bay Area television market. Because of that former Fox Sports Network president Bob Thompson told me he believes Cal/Stanford are worth $90 million total in annual television revenue. That is a huge advantage.
Canzano: Mailbag deals with Pac-12's future, Oregon-Washington decision... and hotdogs
Your questions, my answers...
www.johncanzano.com
I expect that deal will be revised quickly adding money to the pot so Notre Dame can stay independent in football while its TV ( for non ACC games) rights money is pretty close to what the B1G gets .
The more I thionk of it the more I feel the B1G will only add Stanford and Cal at this time,
waiting to see if the SEC goes after some ACC teams and if they do go after North Carolina and Virginia , giving Notre Dame a chance to replace one of them .
If the Irish stay independent , both ACC schools will be added.if the SEC pries Clemson and FSU from the clutches of the ACC's GOR.
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UO isn't particularly notable for research and it definitely isn't in the same league as UW, nor any of the Cali schools. Geographically it pairs well with UW but that's about it. If you want a better option across most of the metrics you mentioned, it's Arizona State.
Yes, it is. I don't see their inclusion increasing the money pool enough to account for the dilution by their addition. If the Big 10 is looking national, then add a couple of southern schools, one in Texas and one in Florida. Not that I'm advocating that, but that would be less objectionably than adding 2 northwest schools who don't bring a lot to the table.
My wife is from LA so I’ve spent a fair amount of time there and know a handful of grads of both. Cali is spot on. USC owns LA.
Seattle & Portland TV markets
More west coast games to broadcast on prime time on west coast. Big state Universities with large fan bases. Gives both TV & streaming services more content, viewers, time slots to broadcast.
if BIG also doesn’t see that, they won’t invite them. But you asked what Specifically they bring..and it’s not difficult to see that. New markets, great programs, and geographic partners to ucla and usc.
where are you concluding the UNC and VA are leaving the ACC? If they leave then all of ACC implodes as Clemson is one foot out the door to SEC...You think UNC would leave wothout assurances that 2 OOO hoops games per year vs Duke are included in any scheduling... Also i would question that Duke has more national brand recognition than UVA ...and not really about TV markets...
ND would move the needle more than any other school...to all conferences...They will play the BIg 10 vs ACC for full amount on day one...
look at tv & streaming and their schedule...
- Ohio State — 5.22M
- Michigan — 4.74M
- Alabama — 4.64M
- Penn State — 3.87M
- Georgia — 3.61M
- Oklahoma — 3.46M
- Auburn — 3.22M
- Michigan State — 2.89M
- Notre Dame — 2.84M
- Oregon — 2.57M
everyone is focusing on national media rights since they have risen astronomically. But…
Cable subs are still part of the equation. Even in 2022.
USC and UCLA will get the higher rate per sub in the LA market for BTN, but maybe not in the San Fran market. Stanford and Cal, together would cement the entire state of California at the higher per sub rate. This is in addition to whatever value they add to the national media rights.
Since we’ve entered the CA market, let’s go ahead and monetize all of it.
Cable subs are still part of the equation. Even in 2022.
USC and UCLA will get the higher rate per sub in the LA market for BTN, but maybe not in the San Fran market. Stanford and Cal, together would cement the entire state of California at the higher per sub rate. This is in addition to whatever value they add to the national media rights.
Since we’ve entered the CA market, let’s go ahead and monetize all of it.
If the B1G isn't enough for ND I say leave them out. Let them stay indy.
God Damn. Just consider how lucky we were to get invited to the B1G back then.
I'm with you. ND doesn't have half the influence some think they do. ND and SEC (Or they can play with SYR in the Igloo Conference), perfect together!
ETA: I say we make them get rid of that racist Fighting Irish mascot too before they get invited.
The Big 12 is apparently set to meet with Arizona, Arizona State, Colorado, and Utah. Smart move by them to act quickly since the PAC 12 is currently paralyzed by not knowing who will remain in the league. The lingering ND decision is indirectly putting another nail in the PAC 12’s coffin.
I think it’s safe to say if FSU & Clemson bolt to the SEC, the ACC is done and ND goes to the BIG [unless it leaves first]. The following preferred schools UNC/UVA/Ga Tech/Miami apply to the BIG and/or SEC within days. Remaining ACC schools scatter amongst the B12/AAC/PAC.
ESPN will be behind the SEC product and Fox behind the BIG.
GO RU
ESPN will be behind the SEC product and Fox behind the BIG.
GO RU
I think that is totally wrong. it had to be part of the USC - UCLA deal that they would have at least two other West coast teams. i think the issue with N.D. coming or not is whether the BIG would go to 20 if they come or go to 18 for now if they don’t.
Seattle market for UW. National following for Oregon. Both have stronger name recognition than Rutgers right now.
None have lacrosse. Sport is just picking up out here. Wrestling is strong with some West Coast schools - Stanford, Cal-Poly, Fresno St., but not most of the PAC 12. My guess is that they will find homes in places like the WCC, but who knows. Right now, everyone is looking at the dollars and for the rest saying "we'll have enough money to figure out that other stuff later."
Who knows what those schools in the Mountain Time Zone choose to do, but IMO, the Pac 12 (adding, say San Diego State and UNLV) is still a more valuable product. I would like to see an alliance/merger between the ACC, Pac 12 and Big 12.
5th largest economy in the world with a near $100 budget surplus. Innovation and cultural capital of USA and the world. If that's lunatic, then I'm all in. (And yes, California has some real problems, but who doesn't?)
Each new member needs to bring 100 million plus in media rights or they're not getting invited. Do you think Ohio State, Michigan, Wisconsin etc would take a loss financially to add these teams.... Fuggeettaabboutit!!
Do they bring 100 million annually in media rights... If not it ain't happening... What don't you people understand???
Ding, ding, ding.... The Irish only care about themselves... And rightly so
You are focusing on minutia instead of the grand scheme of things. Think big my colleague not small
Not unless collectively they bring in 400 million annually in Media rights.... Not happenin'
