When does the ACC get the "Big East" treatment?

[buffalochicken21]

So, I didn't watch the bowl shows yesterday but I read this morning that UVA is in the Orange Bowl vs. Florida. I did a double take. This has shades of UConn vs Oklahoma in 2011 all over it, yet where is the outrage in the college football media?

I think some people on this board have forgotten, but I very clearly remember how relentless the ESPN pundits were in shredding the Big East. Even in the year when the BE had 3 top ten teams in 2006, it never ended. The narrative was constant, with loads of those commentators claiming the Mountain West deserved the Big East's automatic bid. The calls to remove the Big East's auto-bid were practically talking points of every college football show and left all the fanbases in fear of how it would all wind up, my best friend who's a lifelong WVU fan was just as worried as this board was at the end of the Big East in 2012-2013.

No one has called out that all this year the AAC had more ranked teams than the ACC. No one is calling for their bowl-bids to be stripped. I know they're an ESPN property but I find it pathetic that ESPN mobilized everyone against the BE and turns a blind eye to the ACC now. Clemson has actually taken the brunt of it but we only hear they're 'disrespected', we don't hear how shitty their schedule and their league is.

I know we all know why ESPN isn't talking about it, I just wanted to get it out there - #TheACCSucks.

 

[Queztastic]

I know they're an ESPN property .

There's your answer.

On top of that, wasn't ESPN negotiating TV contracts at the time and orchestrating things behind the scenes to build up the ACC and kill the Big East by getting Syracuse and Pitt to jump?

 

[KEEP CHOPPIN]

ESPN = the ACC & SEC biased-network. Period.

 

[RUfinal4]

So, I didn't watch the bowl shows yesterday but I read this morning that UVA is in the Orange Bowl vs. Florida. I did a double take. This has shades of UConn vs Oklahoma in 2011 all over it, yet where is the outrage in the college football media?

I think some people on this board have forgotten, but I very clearly remember how relentless the ESPN pundits were in shredding the Big East. Even in the year when the BE had 3 top ten teams in 2006, it never ended. The narrative was constant, with loads of those commentators claiming the Mountain West deserved the Big East's automatic bid. The calls to remove the Big East's auto-bid were practically talking points of every college football show and left all the fanbases in fear of how it would all wind up, my best friend who's a lifelong WVU fan was just as worried as this board was at the end of the Big East in 2012-2013.

No one has called out that all this year the AAC had more ranked teams than the ACC. No one is calling for their bowl-bids to be stripped. I know they're an ESPN property but I find it pathetic that ESPN mobilized everyone against the BE and turns a blind eye to the ACC now. Clemson has actually taken the brunt of it but we only hear they're 'disrespected', we don't hear how shitty their schedule and their league is.

I know we all know why ESPN isn't talking about it, I just wanted to get it out there - #TheACCSucks.

will take a few years of mediocre play. The ACC still has Clemson who is a legitimate top 4 team with recent championships. If UVA was the actual champion then it would be a different story but they are 2nd. Florida is 3rd or 4th in the SEC and will sell tickets in Miami

 

[LotusAggressor]

ESPN's empty-headed pundits were issued directives by the empty suits that run the network.

 

[krup]

I am not a big fan of conferences worrying too much about division imbalance, because things tend to even out over time. However, with all of the ACC's problems now, imagine how bad it is going to look for them when FSU recovers under Norvell but they are in the same division with Clemson and the ineptness of the other ACC division is even more obvious?

 

[MGSA99]

And now Fox's pregame show is more watched than ESPN. ESPN bias towards the ACC and SEC has something to do with that, but also politics has something to do with since people who watch college football, especially in the hotbed of the college football that is the SEC, tend to be more conservative, they trust FOX more than Disney-owned ESPN.

 

[RUChoppin]

I know they're an ESPN property

will take a few years of mediocre play.

It will take a few years of medicore play leading to slipping ratings, and then ESPN not renewing their contract with the ACC.... THEN you'll see the ESPN knives come out, but not before.

 

[Joey Bags]

This year’s UVA team would smoke the Uconn BCS team head to head.

 

[czxqa]

It will take a few years of medicore play leading to slipping ratings, and then ESPN not renewing their contract with the ACC.... THEN you'll see the ESPN knives come out, but not before.

Are they still dumping millions into the ACC network project? If they give up on that unicorn, it's the end for the All Cupcakes Conference.

 

[Wolv RU]

So, I didn't watch the bowl shows yesterday but I read this morning that UVA is in the Orange Bowl vs. Florida. I did a double take. This has shades of UConn vs Oklahoma in 2011 all over it, yet where is the outrage in the college football media?

I think some people on this board have forgotten, but I very clearly remember how relentless the ESPN pundits were in shredding the Big East. Even in the year when the BE had 3 top ten teams in 2006, it never ended. The narrative was constant, with loads of those commentators claiming the Mountain West deserved the Big East's automatic bid. The calls to remove the Big East's auto-bid were practically talking points of every college football show and left all the fanbases in fear of how it would all wind up, my best friend who's a lifelong WVU fan was just as worried as this board was at the end of the Big East in 2012-2013.

No one has called out that all this year the AAC had more ranked teams than the ACC. No one is calling for their bowl-bids to be stripped. I know they're an ESPN property but I find it pathetic that ESPN mobilized everyone against the BE and turns a blind eye to the ACC now. Clemson has actually taken the brunt of it but we only hear they're 'disrespected', we don't hear how shitty their schedule and their league is.

I know we all know why ESPN isn't talking about it, I just wanted to get it out there - #TheACCSucks.

There are no more automatic bids so there's one difference. In this instance, the Orange Bowl has voluntarily chosen to contract with the ACC. As have some other games. I haven't compared the ACC's bowl lineup starting in 2020 (the next cycle) to the one ending now but suspect it's very similar.

I do think the fact that Clemson never moved above #3 despite winning so many in a row and being defending champs shows that the ACC has been dogged a lot -- probably very similar to what you would have heard about Miami in the early 2000s.

 

[LC-88]

ESPN = the ACC & SEC biased-network. Period.

Your spellcheck must be broken. E$PN and $EC.

 

[sherrane]

will take a few years of mediocre play. The ACC still has Clemson who is a legitimate top 4 team with recent championships. If UVA was the actual champion then it would be a different story but they are 2nd. Florida is 3rd or 4th in the SEC and will sell tickets in Miami

A few years of mediocre play and stop winning playoff games. The anti-Big East rumblings started after Miami and VT left and they got louder after Pitt lost to Urban Meyer's Utah squad. They were silenced somewhat after WVU defeated Georgia in the displaces Sugar Bowl followed by Louisville beating Wake. Cincinnati then lost to Virginia Tech in the Orange followed by Florida in the Sugar. The next year unranked UConn winning the conference then laying an egg in the Fiesta. #23 WVU won the conference after that.

 

[ruman]

Never - they ran the big east out of business, they are protected

 

[ruman]

Are they still dumping millions into the ACC network project? If they give up on that unicorn, it's the end for the All Cupcakes Conference.

Its launched - the ACC is totally safe - the Big 12 would be the one to go if raiding happens

 

[ruman]

It will take a few years of medicore play leading to slipping ratings, and then ESPN not renewing their contract with the ACC.... THEN you'll see the ESPN knives come out, but not before.

They own the ACC network - don't hold your breath

 

[ruman]

UConn has something to complain about. The crap that ESPN and the ACC pulled left Rutgers laughing all the way to the bank.

For all the disasters that follow Rutgers, this was the ultimate blessed event

 

[RUSK97]

Never. Apples and oranges. The nACC is ESPN's progeny. The Big East was what they plotted to break up in order to produce that lovechild.

 

[buffalochicken21]

A few years of mediocre play and stop winning playoff games. The anti-Big East rumblings started after Miami and VT left and they got louder after Pitt lost to Urban Meyer's Utah squad. They were silenced somewhat after WVU defeated Georgia in the displaces Sugar Bowl followed by Louisville beating Wake. Cincinnati then lost to Virginia Tech in the Orange followed by Florida in the Sugar. The next year unranked UConn winning the conference then laying an egg in the Fiesta. #23 WVU won the conference after that.

I remember that WVU Georgia game. If I remember correct the commentators were stunned. Later WVU also de-pantsed Oklahoma in the 2008 Fiesta Bowl. I know both those examples use WVU but I think when we actually got better during our 'good years' it leveled up the conference and the Big East of '05 to '10 compares favorably to the current ACC.

 

[Panthergrowl13]

They never will.

If you think about it, the ACC is basically a combination of the Big East Football Schools and the Old ACC Football schools including Notre Dame.

The population base is too large to ignore. That is the reason ESPN agreed to sponsor the ACCN.

If any P-5 Conference is going to fold, it will be the B-12. The B-12 is the first conference to have their GOR's and TV Contracts expire in June 2025 and they are also the only P-5 Conference without their own TV Network..
The ACC TV/GOR do not expire until 2035. I suspect you will start hearing B-12 rumors start happening by 2022 or earlier.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

 

[RUChoppin]

They own the ACC network - don't hold your breath

Like I said, it'd take declining ratings and ESPN ending their relationship with the ACC before they turned on them. If the ACC network is a dog and is venting money by 2035, you can be sure ESPN will have the knives out.

 

[Section124]

OP needs to let it go. ACC has won 3 National titles in the last 5-6 years and played in 5. Big East is the AAC. A G5 conference. Relax. Things go in cycles. The B1G sucked until OSU won the 1st CFP.

 

[RUforlife]

This year’s UVA team would smoke the Uconn BCS team head to head.

That UConn team lost to Temple during the season. That UConn team was not BCS worthy.

 

[sherrane]

I remember that WVU Georgia game. If I remember correct the commentators were stunned. Later WVU also de-pantsed Oklahoma in the 2008 Fiesta Bowl. I know both those examples use WVU but I think when we actually got better during our 'good years' it leveled up the conference and the Big East of '05 to '10 compares favorably to the current ACC.

That Sugar Bowl was in the 2005 season, played January 2, 2006. Katrina forced the Sugar Bowl to Atlanta and everyone KNEW "Georgia was going to take the Big Least team to the woodshed". I agree with you about Nessler and Greiese sounding befuddled.

 

[buffalochicken21]

Fun fact, that BCS UConn team lost 2 games in conference that year (2010). One of them was us, in what I believe was the game with that Savage to Tim Wright dagger pass.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

Never - they ran the big east out of business, they are protected

In fairness, the Catholic BB schools did as good a job of running the BE out of business as did various monied interests (especially the glad handers in the ugly colored jackets). The bowl system is ridiculously, stupendously corrupt. East German swim team or Modern Russia Olympics corrupt.

 

[Mr Magoo]

For all the disasters that follow Rutgers, this was the ultimate blessed event

As someone said at the time, “Rutgers was trying to stay afloat and looking for a lifeboat. They got an ocean liner instead.”

 

[DJ Spanky]

And now Fox's pregame show is more watched than ESPN. ESPN bias towards the ACC and SEC has something to do with that, but also politics has something to do with since people who watch college football, especially in the hotbed of the college football that is the SEC, tend to be more conservative, they trust FOX more than Disney-owned ESPN.

I think it also has to do with where ESPN has gone with "sports". Poker? Spelling Bee? Tetris?

 

[RUbacker]

So, I didn't watch the bowl shows yesterday but I read this morning that UVA is in the Orange Bowl vs. Florida. I did a double take. This has shades of UConn vs Oklahoma in 2011 all over it, yet where is the outrage in the college football media?

I think some people on this board have forgotten, but I very clearly remember how relentless the ESPN pundits were in shredding the Big East. Even in the year when the BE had 3 top ten teams in 2006, it never ended. The narrative was constant, with loads of those commentators claiming the Mountain West deserved the Big East's automatic bid. The calls to remove the Big East's auto-bid were practically talking points of every college football show and left all the fanbases in fear of how it would all wind up, my best friend who's a lifelong WVU fan was just as worried as this board was at the end of the Big East in 2012-2013.

No one has called out that all this year the AAC had more ranked teams than the ACC. No one is calling for their bowl-bids to be stripped. I know they're an ESPN property but I find it pathetic that ESPN mobilized everyone against the BE and turns a blind eye to the ACC now. Clemson has actually taken the brunt of it but we only hear they're 'disrespected', we don't hear how shitty their schedule and their league is.

I know we all know why ESPN isn't talking about it, I just wanted to get it out there - #TheACCSucks.

ESPN =CNN

 

[ruman]

Fun fact, that BCS UConn team lost 2 games in conference that year (2010). One of them was us, in what I believe was the game with that Savage to Tim Wright dagger pass.

That was 09. We beat them in 10 with Chas Dodd having a good game

 

[sherrane]

In fairness, the Catholic BB schools did as good a job of running the BE out of business as did various monied interests (especially the glad handers in the ugly colored jackets). The bowl system is ridiculously, stupendously corrupt. East German swim team or Modern Russia Olympics corrupt.

The Big East only wanted football in order to keep their basketball conference together and I'm sure the Bowl Committees as well as the TV Network Execs were able to perceive this. The Big East was easily the worst managed conference in FBS and brought about their own demise. Tranghese approached the ACC about taking some or all of the Big East football teams. He thought the B1G was going to raid the Big East and take some of their more valuable basketball teams. But Miami and Syracuse liked the idea of going to the ACC more than staying in the Big East. Management's botched attempt to save the league ended up bringing about the destruction of it. I think it is time we should stop blaming ESPN or the bowls for the incompetence of Providence.

 

[ruman]

The Big East only wanted football in order to keep their basketball conference together and I'm sure the Bowl Committees as well as the TV Network Execs were able to perceive this. The Big East was easily the worst managed conference in FBS and brought about their own demise. Tranghese approached the ACC about taking some or all of the Big East football teams. He thought the B1G was going to raid the Big East and take some of their more valuable basketball teams. But Miami and Syracuse liked the idea of going to the ACC more than staying in the Big East. Management's botched attempt to save the league ended up bringing about the destruction of it. I think it is time we should stop blaming ESPN or the bowls for the incompetence of Providence.

Miami left in 04. Cuse In 2012. The two situations were separate

 

[sherrane]

Miami left in 04. Cuse In 2012. The two situations were separate

No, they weren't. Originally, the ACC was going to take Miami, Boston College, and Syracuse. The ACC schools wanted Miami and didn't want the northern schools. They then added Virginia Tech and dropped the northern schools. They later added BC when they couldn't get a waiver to hold a championship game with 11 football teams.

 

[ScarletCrimson]

The ACC is quite fortunate Clemson is not in the SEC.

 

[Scarlet_Scourge]

Uconn wasn't even ranked.

Uconn going to a BCS bowl game was the final straw, it is what ultimately lead to them getting rid of the BCS and kicking out the Big East/AAC as a Power conference.

As far as the ACC, the ACC is pretty much garbage for football (but great at all other sports except wrestling) but they do have some decent teams, one elite team and some traditional powers (Da'U and FSU) both of which happen to be bad right now. But that can't last forever right? To be honest, there are only two REAL Power Conferences and they are the Big Ten and SEC. Pac-12, Big12 and ACC and UND were just grandfathered in.

 

[sherrane]

Uconn wasn't even ranked.

Uconn going to a BCS bowl game was the final straw, it is what ultimately lead to them getting rid of the BCS and kicking out the Big East/AAC as a Power conference.

As far as the ACC, the ACC is pretty much garbage for football (but great at all other sports except wrestling) but they do have some decent teams, one elite team and some traditional powers (Da'U and FSU) both of which happen to be bad right now. But that can't last forever right? To be honest, there are only two REAL Power Conferences and they are the Big Ten and SEC. Pac-12, Big12 and ACC and UND were just grandfathered in.

This is reflected in the TV audience of the championship games.

SEC: 13.7 million viewers
B1G: 12.5 million viewers
P12: 5.2 million viewers
ACC: 3.7 million viewers

I did not see the Big 12 ratings for this past year, but I know they didn't exceed the 10.1 million viewers of last year's Oklahoma -- Texas game.

 

[GoodOl'Rutgers]

There's your answer.

On top of that, wasn't ESPN negotiating TV contracts at the time and orchestrating things behind the scenes to build up the ACC and kill the Big East by getting Syracuse and Pitt to jump?

To review.. ESPN built its value on Big East basketball. But over time and especially with the ABC merger, ESPN/ABC was invested heavily in Big Ten football and ACC Basketball. They had a lot of air time to fill with multiple channels to program.

I think they had a special relationship with the Providence "mob" who ran the Big East where their contract deals would favor basketball while they locked up football so they could make sure it did not compete, in the NYC and other big TV markets, with ABC/ESPN chosen featured programming. The big money from advertisers is in national broadcasts with big ratings in the NYC and other large TV markets.

ESPN/ABC would rather destroy Big East football than see it succeed. It sounds counter-intuitive since ESPN was the Big East's TV "partner".

Consider Rutgers. A successful Rutgers would lead to a demand in this lucrative NYC-Philly market to see Rutgers football. But Rutgers football has little appeal outside this area... even when good. But if NYC-Philly college football fans had no choice but to what a featured ACC game of the weak... Say, Florida State vs UVA... they could add the captured and controlled NYC-Philly markets to this game of a regional interest. That would do better for them than having an ACC game in ACC land and a Big East game in Big East land. They had incentive to add the NYC and Philly markets to whatever regional game they wanted to show and make it a national broadcast.

All you have to do is look at what they did.. Miami to ACC, VTECH and BC to ACC. Pitt to ACC. Syracuse to ACC. Louisville to AC came after. ACC football was struggling and there were fears that the dreaded "Syracuse/Big East rule" might apply to the ACC.. how embarrassing. The rule was a BCS game rule that a conference champion had to be top 15 to get a BCS game.. I think there was something about 2 years in a row, etc and the penalty of losing the guaranteed spot. Basically, ESPN kept advising the ACC to add Big East football teams that could help them avoid that penalty or even discussion of it.

And it worked. And after each raid.. ESPN would hammer the remaining Big East teams.. as described above.. and the Big East teams would largely win their OOC games and bowl games and embarrass ESPN's "experts".

Meanwhile. the new Big East had to go to FoxSports for a decent deal for them for basketball. ESPN did not have their back either.

 

[Queztastic]

No, they weren't. Originally, the ACC was going to take Miami, Boston College, and Syracuse. The ACC schools wanted Miami and didn't want the northern schools. They then added Virginia Tech and dropped the northern schools. They later added BC when they couldn't get a waiver to hold a championship game with 11 football teams.

In addition, UNC and Duke were strong no votes against expansion. Since the ACC needed yes votes from all other members to expand, UVA was voting no unless they took VATech instead of Syracuse.

 

[Scarlet_Scourge]

It was NOT all ESPN. The Big East tried to get rid of football twice!
Both times they wanted Big East to merge with the ACC.

 

[sherrane]

(edit to remove long text that I'm not commenting on)

All you have to do is look at what they did.. Miami to ACC, VTECH and BC to ACC. Pitt to ACC. Syracuse to ACC. Louisville to AC came after. ACC football was struggling and there were fears that the dreaded "Syracuse/Big East rule" might apply to the ACC.. how embarrassing. The rule was a BCS game rule that a conference champion had to be top 15 to get a BCS game.. I think there was something about 2 years in a row, etc and the penalty of losing the guaranteed spot. Basically, ESPN kept advising the ACC to add Big East football teams that could help them avoid that penalty or even discussion of it.

And it worked. And after each raid.. ESPN would hammer the remaining Big East teams.. as described above.. and the Big East teams would largely win their OOC games and bowl games and embarrass ESPN's "experts".

Meanwhile. the new Big East had to go to FoxSports for a decent deal for them for basketball. ESPN did not have their back either.

The BCS' "Big East Rule", which was passed after Syracuse won the Big East in 1998 (the first year of the BCS) when they were ranked #15 was that a conference champion had to average a #12 ranking over a floating 4-year period. The first four Big East champions in the BCS era were:
#15 Syracuse
#2 Virginia Tech
#3 Miami
#1 Miami

Interestingly, the BCS changed the wording of the rule from conference champion to highest ranked team despite the fact that it was the champion, rather than the highest ranked team, who earned the automatic bid. The reason for this change was that the ACC's automatic bid would have been under review after the 2008 season. ACC Champions from 2005 -- 2008 had an average rating of 14.5:

2005 #22 Florida State
2006 #14 Wake Forest
2007 #3 Virginia Tech
2008 #19 Virginia Tech

This rule was likely the justification the American Athletic Conference was not a Power 6 conference as the last four highest ranked teams in the Big East had an average rating of 17.25.

2009 #3 Cincinnati
2010 #22 West Virginia (Unranked UConn was champion)
2011 #23 West Virginia
2012 #21 Louisville