Bench and Recruting

[bac2therac]

my question is where is the bench? Why is there no bench? What happened to recruiting? Who backs up Laney? Who is there to replace Laney? It seems like CVS left a lot of holes out there recruiting again. People said Precious Person leaving was not that big of a deal but that's someone who we could have had here...ditto for Shakena Richardson who seems to still be struggling at FSU but she showed potential her sophomore year. To me we are getting nothing from Canty and you cant win like that. I realize she has been banged up but still...no bench. You cant have two players in at the same time who give nothing on offense in Canty and Davis...the Evans in at times is totally not an offensive threat. You cant get by with just 3 players as scoring threats

whats going on with recruiting for next year..who is coming in, mainly to replace Laney. That's a HUGE concern of mine. She is the leader and heart and sole of this team. Copper will fill her role as leader but she cannot do everything herself up as forward

 

[MC1974]

This year, I think Alexis Burke would have given us some quality minutes and score points on offense; also I was hoping for more offense from Rachel and Ariel.

I am very concerned that this season and the upcoming season have no blue chip recruits coming in, and several of the top 2016 high school players have committed to other schools. This is one reason why I react so strongly when we lose games, because this may be our last chance for a good run for a while.

I am projecting Aliyah Jeune to fill Laney's sneakers, as she brings size and athleticism, with an added bonus of being a good deeeep shooter. While she wasn't up high on rankings in high school, she has a huge upside. Her sister, Ashley, may be a shooter because she has a nice touch during pre game warm ups. We have recruited a decent point guard also. I think we will be strong at point guard next season. I hope they grant Alexis another year because she can also be our Laney (that is an oxymoron as you don't "replace" a Laney!!)

Two post players outside of the top one hundred are coming in next season, so we will have depth that includes two seniors. I think we should be fine in this position at least for next year, but would like to see more talent from the class of 2016.

I notice some teams are loaded with high school all-americans and are successful, but I also see many more teams with no-names who crack the top twenty repeatedly.

So, next season, we need to have someone who can play point and defend to replace Davis, and I think she(more than one) is already on the roster. We want Canty and Burke to return, healthy. It could be hard to replace Laney but we have options. With two new post players coming in we can fill Christa's role. I also see big improvements coming from Rachel and Ariel.

Actually, we could be a pretty good team next season. The above is based on my personal speculation and this is a nice topic for discussion going forward!!

 

[RU MAN]

Really good posts BAC and MC. We really lack depth and have lacked depth for several years now. I am really concerned who will fill Laney's shoes, because she's a warrior out there and I don't see anyone on the roster right now who can do what she does.

I hope the new bigs we have coming in can show the ability to score in the low post, but Hollivay and Butts and Evans have been too erratic and frankly kind of soft out there. We need in my view at least 12+ points out of that position every night as well as a ton of offensive rebounds for second and even third looks. In addition, we need a few more Cynthia Hernandez types who can come in off the bench and drain a few threes to open up our offense in the high and low posts. There still is too much passing out on the perimeter and not enough penetration to make the defense honest.

After the last two defeats, I am really concerned that we will not make one of our famous runs in both the B1G tourny and the the NCAA's. I hope I'm wrong. I hope our women and our coaching staff can turn this around. I'm hoping the last two defeats were just bad hiccups and being tired. But the way we lost to M State and especially the way we were blown out by Northwestern doesn't give me a lot of confidence at this point.

 

[RUJMM78]

I think its time for a shakeup on the coaching staff.Fresh blood might help with recruiting and certainly is needed in teaching fundamentals.The team needs major improvement in passing /dribbling which would help reduce the number of unforced turnovers and boxing out in rebounding to stop the opponent from getting so many second and third scoring possessions on missed shots.My comments get back to the need for better player development.

 

[MC1974]

Originally posted by RU-JMM78:
I think its time for a shakeup on the coaching staff.Fresh blood might help with recruiting and certainly is needed in teaching fundamentals.The team needs major improvement in passing /dribbling which would help reduce the number of unforced turnovers and boxing out in rebounding to stop the opponent from getting so many second and third scoring possessions on missed shots.My comments get back to the need for better player development.

I have been saying that I think we need to improve the "post coach" position and leave it at that.

 

[ChasRC69]

According to Coach Newton, one of the 6'3" players coming in is a real "banger" and should be a good rebounder and post defender, the second 6'3" player can do everything, the point guard reminds her of Tasha (except she can shoot) and she feels that Jeune is vastly underrated.

 

[dmd78]

Originally posted by bac2therac:

my question is where is the bench? Why is there no bench? What happened to recruiting? Who backs up Laney? Who is there to replace Laney? It seems like CVS left a lot of holes out there recruiting again. Precious Person leaving was not that big of a deal but that's someone who we could have had here...ditto for Shakena Richardson who seems to still be struggling at FSU but she showed potential her sophomore year. To me we are getting nothing from Canty and you cant win like that. I realize she has been banged up but still...no bench. You cant have two players in at the same time who give nothing on offense in Canty and Davis...the Evans in at times is totally not an offensive threat. You cant get by with just 3 players as scoring threats

whats going on with recruiting for next year..who is coming in, mainly to replace Laney. That's a HUGE concern of mine. She is the leader and heart and sole of this team. Copper will fill her role as leader but she cannot do everything herself up as forward

bac, most of what you said is fine, but you do lose some credibility when you make broad statements like "People said Precious Person leaving was not that big of a deal". Did anyone actually say that? I remember some speculation that she might not have gotten much playing time, but I don't think anyone was happy to see her go. Personally (pun unintended), I was very disappointed to see her leave.

Laney might be the heart and soul of the team, but Nike is the sole. LOL

I think the injuries to Burke and Canty made a huge difference in our depth for this season. I think that Burke would have seen a lot of minutes, and IMHO pre-injury Canty looked pretty good and was averaging close to 9 ppg.

Of course, all of us are puzzled by Scaife's struggles. That puts a lot of pressure on everyone else. And I think most of us expected more scoring from Hollivay.

 

[scarlettb]

Our bench - Parker is a freshman and I think she will be a bigger contributor in the coming seasons. Hernandez is one dimensional at this point as is Parsons - both brought in to be our 3 point threat. Cynthia will probably play more next season as she really learn our system, Parsons - who knows, she hasn't played enough to know. Alfa is a NJ girl, originally a walk-on and does not seem to me to ever be more than that. Burke is injured and would have been a valuable contributor - will be if she comes back next year. June is redshirting so she really doesn't count. Cant / Davis is our 6th man. Both good on D, less so on O - Canty has the injury excuse. Butts is fairly solid and much improved from last year IMO.

Recruiting was hurt, IMO, by the time it took to renew CViv's contract, the fact that going forward, she has a limted number of years left to coach and by not posting good results for several years. Success breeds success. We aren't getting HS All Americans like we used to, which can be a curse or a blessing as the most highly touted class of HS AA's we ever got turned out to be more problematic than beneficial to the success of the program. I'm hoping that one or more of the 2015 class turns out to be a diamond in the rough and that both Burke and Canty decide to come back and are 100% physically.

 

[RU Husky]

Is she worth it?

CVS

 

[MADHAT1]

Originally posted by RU Husky:
Is she worth it?

The complaint ( in that article) Carino had mainly was based on Vivian's contract extension structure, signed around 2007.
The deal Hermann gave CVS was more RU friendly salary wise with bonuses , if earned, that would give back most of what Stringer gave up in salary.
As far as Carino not liking the Sweet 16 performance bonus, if RU makes that round , I think most RU fans and supporters won't mind it being paid.

What Carino didn't bring up is: without that HOF HC ( he mentioned it when implying putting that Sweet 16 clause in the contrast was a bad move) Rutgers WBB probably would be in the same situation as it's MBB program.
That one-time bonus of $500,000 for making sweet 16 was to sweeten the deal so CVS wouldn't feel disrespected
and come back at a much lower base salary.
Bonuses based on performance are a part of HC's contracts and even in hard economic times, a must to keep a HC like Vivian
while offering her less money than what she was making on her old contract.

 

[Knight Time Fan]

What Madhat said.

There were articles recently in the Dallas newspaper (linked on another board) revealing the Men's and Women's Basketball head coaching salaries at the pubic institutions in the SEC and Big 12. This excluded Baylor, TCU and Vanderbilt, because they are not public and Mississippi State's payment structure prevents knowing what the coach actually earns. The article also listed the total "incentive" in their contracts, as well as what portion of that was for a national championship. And data on the team's success under the coach.

It was fascinating, with Calipari being several million ahead of the other high paid men's coaches in those conferences and I think 1.1 million was the highest women's salary, going down to much less.

I don't have the link, but easy to get to re: Google.

 

[redshoes]

Bac your points are well taken. Let me say I don't ever remember seeing a team implode as this team has. Reasons for this situation are many and varied. One reason I attribute to the number of minutes the starters logged during the regular season. And I fear Scafe may have just worn down, this sometimes happens to players.

The injury of Canty and Burke really effected and hurt our bench strength. And why one playe red shirted for the season is a mystery for the ages. Canty has not seemed to recover from her latest injury. She will be back next year, hopefully totally healed and ready to compete. As Burke participated in Sr night, makes me wonder,will she return next year?. Coming back from an ACL is always problematic. So if she returns will she be able to give quality minutes to the team next year?

True no one can replace the play of Laney. But remember, it has taken three years for Laney to evolve into the player we see today, and the Laney I watched in high school. Maybe, there is a Laney in the making on next years team.
Hopefully the two 6'3s coming in will have a quick learning curve and be able give solid minutes. As I keep saying "enough guards already" .

 

[RUJMM78]

Prior to the game Stringer mentioned all the travel for the two road games that have tired the players which impacted how the team performed.She also stated the zone defense used by opponents has limited Rutgers getting open jump shots.

 

[dmd78]

Burke did not participate in senior night. She wants to come back if she is granted a hardship year.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[RU MAN]

Originally posted by RU-JMM78:

Prior to the game Stringer mentioned all the travel for the two road games that have tired the players which impacted how the team performed.She also stated the zone defense used by opponents has limited Rutgers getting open jump shots.

And our opponents will continue to use a zone until we show that we can beat it.

 

[TRU2RU]

Originally posted by RU MAN:

Originally posted by RU-JMM78:

Prior to the game Stringer mentioned all the travel for the two road games that have tired the players which impacted how the team performed.She also stated the zone defense used by opponents has limited Rutgers getting open jump shots.

And our opponents will continue to use a zone until we show that we can beat it.

Pretty obvious that you don't watch the team play! We have no problem beating the zone but missing layups are a problem for this team, must have missed 10 layups today.

 

[MC1974]

Originally posted by TRU2RU:

Originally posted by RU MAN:

Originally posted by RU-JMM78:

Prior to the game Stringer mentioned all the travel for the two road games that have tired the players which impacted how the team performed.She also stated the zone defense used by opponents has limited Rutgers getting open jump shots.

And our opponents will continue to use a zone until we show that we can beat it.

Pretty obvious that you don't watch the team play! We have no problem beating the zone but missing layups are a problem for this team, must have missed 10 layups today.

I think a lot of those layups were difficult, but I feel they were attempting low percentage layups when there was an easy pass to be made to an open shooter. There were several fast break plays where Cynthia was standing behind the three point line without a defender in sight and she was ignored. Most teams generate wide open threes in transition but I can't recall the last time we tried this.

 

[RU MAN]

Originally posted by TRU2RU:

Originally posted by RU MAN:

Originally posted by RU-JMM78:

Prior to the game Stringer mentioned all the travel for the two road games that have tired the players which impacted how the team performed.She also stated the zone defense used by opponents has limited Rutgers getting open jump shots.

And our opponents will continue to use a zone until we show that we can beat it.

Pretty obvious that you don't watch the team play! We have no problem beating the zone but missing layups are a problem for this team, must have missed 10 layups today.

Pretty much know that you're a rude person and don't know what you're talking about! I know they miss layups, but we are also forced to hit too many jumpers and we end up with a lot of one and done and no offensive rebounds. Do you NOT SEE THAT? Or do you think it's ONLY about missing layups? Learn a little about BB before mouthing off.

This post was edited on 3/2 1:20 PM by RU MAN

 

[TRU2RU]

Originally posted by RU MAN:

Originally posted by TRU2RU:

Originally posted by RU MAN:

Originally posted by RU-JMM78:

Prior to the game Stringer mentioned all the travel for the two road games that have tired the players which impacted how the team performed.She also stated the zone defense used by opponents has limited Rutgers getting open jump shots.

And our opponents will continue to use a zone until we show that we can beat it.

Pretty obvious that you don't watch the team play! We have no problem beating the zone but missing layups are a problem for this team, must have missed 10 layups today.

Pretty much know that you're a rude person and don't know what you're talking about! I know they miss layups, but we are also forced to hit too many jumpers and we end up with a lot of one and done and no offensive rebounds. Do you NOT SEE THAT? Or do you think it's ONLY about missing layups? Learn a little about BB before mouthing off.

This post was edited on 3/2 1:20 PM by RU MAN

We all know you are a legend with your vast knowledge of everything, you complain we are forced to hit too many jumpers & your solution is to take more 3 pointers, to get a team out of the 2/3 zone! lol Nice try.

 

[RU MAN]

Originally posted by TRU2RU:

Originally posted by RU MAN:

Originally posted by TRU2RU:

Originally posted by RU MAN:

Originally posted by RU-JMM78:

Prior to the game Stringer mentioned all the travel for the two road games that have tired the players which impacted how the team performed.She also stated the zone defense used by opponents has limited Rutgers getting open jump shots.

And our opponents will continue to use a zone until we show that we can beat it.

Pretty obvious that you don't watch the team play! We have no problem beating the zone but missing layups are a problem for this team, must have missed 10 layups today.

Pretty much know that you're a rude person and don't know what you're talking about! I know they miss layups, but we are also forced to hit too many jumpers and we end up with a lot of one and done and no offensive rebounds. Do you NOT SEE THAT? Or do you think it's ONLY about missing layups? Learn a little about BB before mouthing off.

This post was edited on 3/2 1:20 PM by RU MAN

We all know you are a legend with your vast knowledge of everything, you complain we are forced to hit too many jumpers & your solution is to take more 3 pointers, to get a team out of the 2/3 zone! lol Nice try.

The fact that your buddy is BilloOrange tells me everything I want to know about you. And again, learn even a smidgen about BB before mouthing off. You obviously are clueless about the game.

 

[dmd78]

please chill, both of you, okay? thanks.

 

[TRU2RU]

Originally posted by RU MAN:
The fact that your buddy is BilloOrange tells me everything I want to know about you. And again, learn even a smidgen about BB before mouthing off. You obviously are clueless about the game.

I have no idea who BilloOrange is & I can assure you he is not a friend, since I don't know him

 

[HeyHuey]

Just watching the last few minutes of the Indiana game makes you worry for next year. Our Seniors will be hard to replace and it looks like the system will have to change a bit to account for the drop off.

 

[RU Husky]

Quite a second half against N'western -. Blew a 10 point lead and out scored 35-20. Wow.

 

[rucoe89]

CVS has established a reputation of not having a bench to speak of. Contrast UConn.

 

[BeKnighted]

Originally posted by rucoe89:
CVS has established a reputation of not having a bench to speak of. Contrast UConn.

Contrast *UConn*? Really? Geno has had years when he's only played 7 on a regular basis against real competition. Don't be fooled by his pulling the starters against AAC teams that can't play their way out of a paper bag.

 

[rucoe89]

Originally posted by BeKnighted:

Originally posted by rucoe89:
CVS has established a reputation of not having a bench to speak of. Contrast UConn.

Contrast *UConn*? Really? Geno has had years when he's only played 7 on a regular basis against real competition. Don't be fooled by his pulling the starters against AAC teams that can't play their way out of a paper bag.

But because his top 7 take care of business early, others get a chance to get on the court and get some experience. When has that last happened with CVS?

 

[BeKnighted]

Originally posted by rucoe89:

Originally posted by BeKnighted:

Originally posted by rucoe89:
CVS has established a reputation of not having a bench to speak of. Contrast UConn.

Contrast *UConn*? Really? Geno has had years when he's only played 7 on a regular basis against real competition. Don't be fooled by his pulling the starters against AAC teams that can't play their way out of a paper bag.

But because his top 7 take care of business early, others get a chance to get on the court and get some experience. When has that last happened with CVS?

I won't say that CVS has a great bench, but most good D-I teams don't go very deep. In any event, UConn is a very special case.

For comparison, here are some other B1G teams and what they did:

Maryland - 5 starters, 3 averaging 29+ minutes, 2 averaging 23 minutes (starters averaging 52.5 ppg collectively), 5 bench players averaging 10-14 minutes (and 21 ppg collectively).

Iowa - 5 starters, all averaging 30+ minutes (and 66.2 ppg collectively), 1 bench player averaging 16 minutes, 4 averaging 6-8.4 mpg (and collectively 13.7 ppg)

Northwestern - 5 starters, averaging 27 to 36 mpg (and 56.2 ppg), 2 bench players averaging around 21 mpg (and 15.4 ppg)

RU - 3 starters averaging 31 to 36 mpg (and 46.8 ppg), 3 players who started slightly more than half the games, averaging 19 to 27.7 mpg (and 16.2 ppg), 2 bench players (who actually got 13 starts between them), averaging around 10 mpg (and collectively 2.3 ppg).

Maryland had a lot of blowouts, but even so its 5 starters played about 3/4 of the team's minutes. Northwestern's starters had about 76% of the team's minutes. If you took out garbage time, the proportions would be higher.


For this year, my opinion is that it would have been nice to have had one more reliable bench player. CVS tried to get Hernandez and Parker into the flow early in the year (and Hernandez actually did provide some meaningful help in several games where it mattered). Ironically, the position where the team has the deepest rotation - post - also probably is the weakest one, and the one where the drop-off between the top player and the other two is greatest. If you could somehow have combined Christa and Ariel into one reliable bench player, the team would have been meaningfully stronger.