It's hard to say what Flood's job is on the line for. I'm under the impression that deep down, RU doesn't want to spend big money for a big time or qualified coach and is pretty happy being slightly above cellar dwellar status.
Carroo's lawyer says Leonte didn't touch victim (Video Link Included)
- Thread starter THERAC
- Start date
It's hard to say what Flood's job is on the line for. I'm under the impression that deep down, RU doesn't want to spend big money for a big time or qualified coach and is pretty happy being slightly above cellar dwellar status.
I can't watch the video, but if it shows the "victim" was indeed an aggressor, as it kind of sounds, it does change the dynamics quite a bit.
Did you watch the game last week? Do you think Rutgers has serious issues or was it just a bad game?
It doesn't definitely show much of anything.
And it cuts off WAY before anything could remotely be considered over.
Agree, in fact Flood did exactly what he was should have done, in my opinion, which was suspend Carroo immediately until he sorted out his legal issues. I've been critical of Flood for a lot of things, but not this situation.
Too early to judge really. If we are talking purely on field, after an 8-5 season, to begin "fire Flood" talk after game 3(and we all now it started before the season started, but for arguments sake) makes no sense.
So frustrating. Why can't people hold their phones sideways to record a video?
That is true. The bottom line is the win record. With Carroo they may win more games. Then they will say Flood paid the price for the grade tampering with the fine and suspension. They will probably need to win 5 or more games. Norfolk, Kansas, Indiana, Maryland, Army and maybe another one or two with luck.
Too early to tell?? 1/4 of the season has been played. They have played one good half in those 3 games. The DBacks are a mess. The vaunted running game hasn't arrived yet and the QB situation is really questionable so far.
Do you really think these 3 games, coming off an 8-5 season, is reason to fire Flood?
The only audio I can make out is someone saying "Come on, hold up, hold up". Everything else is high pitched women noise.
This may be just a sideshow to you, but I think it certainly matters to a young man whose reputation may/may not be on the line. Not that it really matters anyhow, nj.com has done such a fine job of condemning him that even if he was innocent, there's no salvaging his reputation.
Yes considering he f-up bad enough to warrant a 3 game suspension. You seem to keep forgetting that. And last year was a good season, not a great season. This season looks much worse already.
Jeeze take a chill pill and put what I said in the context of Floods job. Wow!! The poor reading comprehension skills from some on this site never ceases to amaze me!!
------
Yeah!.... Guilty till proven not guilty...... Then, still guilty!!!!! Nice country, America!
I don't always see "eye-to-eye" with Real but he is spot-on here and we all know that this lasted more than 16-seconds so let's sit back and relax people. The video doesn't prove a damn thing - EITHER WAY - in my eyes.
The video really show nothing but a bunch of people fighting. It doesn't show the start of things and it just a small clip. I think the most important testimony will be of the witness not connected to either parties.
Wrong, not nice country. See how they're treating that TCU player's case in DFW? Innocent until proven guilty. It's only here in NJ where you're guilty unless proven innocent beyond all doubt, then they might print one line and link it where no one will ever read it.
I speak with some authority on this subject as my ex has accused me of DV three separate times and filed three TRO's against me. All three complaints were dropped and I was never convicted of any crime. I also know many men who have had similar experiences. With that said, some things you should know about DV charges and TRO's and the judicial system we currently live under. In the civil courts where most DV and TRO's are adjudicated(as opposed to the criminal courts) the standard of evidence that is used is the "preponderance of the evidence" standard. This means that the evidence presented only has to be 50.001% believable in order for a judge to grant a TRO. In a sign of our times, a womans accusations are believed at a weighting of 90% versus a mans denials which are given a weighting of 20 - 40%; Effectively what this does is shift the burden of proof onto the accused. So in criminal court, The standard of guilt is "beyond a reasonable doubt" which means there likely has to be a 85% or better chance that a crime was committed. The preponderance standard obviously greatly lowers that standard.
Now, back to Carroo's situation and how all this applies to him. If it were just a he said, she said situation without witnesses; she wins every time.(This is the trap I was caught in). In a situation where we have witnesses, Carroo would likely have to have 3 witnesses for every one witness who took the female "victims" side of the story. Its just the times we live in where the pendulum has swung way to the side of favoring females. Now, the fact that there is video could help or hurt Carroo's case. If the video evidence, clearly shows Carroo to be telling the truth, then this will all be over shortly and I expect the university to do the right thing and reinstate Carroo effective immediately upon his being cleared of all wrongdoing. If however the video doesn't show Clearly that Carroo did not touch the victim then this will be a long drawn out process that will likely have Carroo missing the season. I really hope the videos support what is being reported that Carroo did not touch the "victim" and that he can go on with his life.
Just an FYI, False DV charges are one of the favorite tools of scumbag family law attorneys to keep litigants tied up in the family courts. Changing them should be something ALL Men should support because we are most vulnerable to their misuse. I could post dozens of articles showing you how False DV charges and TRO's have been misused to punish men for no other reason than the ex wife, ex girlfriend, or soon to be ex. decided to use it to punish the other person. One of the most abused "tools" of the legal system.
For extra reading here is an article called "The New Star Chamber- The New Jersey Family Court and the Prevention of Domestic Violence Act" This Article was published in the Rutgers Law Review Volume 57:3. The author writes: This essay is dedicated to my client, Timothy Rodgers, whose experience with the NJ Family Court introduced me to an area of law mired in intellectual dishonestly and injustice. Article was published in 2005 but it still is valid today, the injustice maybe even worse!
http://library.softgenx.com/Children/DV/newstarchamber.pdf
Now, back to Carroo's situation and how all this applies to him. If it were just a he said, she said situation without witnesses; she wins every time.(This is the trap I was caught in). In a situation where we have witnesses, Carroo would likely have to have 3 witnesses for every one witness who took the female "victims" side of the story. Its just the times we live in where the pendulum has swung way to the side of favoring females. Now, the fact that there is video could help or hurt Carroo's case. If the video evidence, clearly shows Carroo to be telling the truth, then this will all be over shortly and I expect the university to do the right thing and reinstate Carroo effective immediately upon his being cleared of all wrongdoing. If however the video doesn't show Clearly that Carroo did not touch the victim then this will be a long drawn out process that will likely have Carroo missing the season. I really hope the videos support what is being reported that Carroo did not touch the "victim" and that he can go on with his life.
Just an FYI, False DV charges are one of the favorite tools of scumbag family law attorneys to keep litigants tied up in the family courts. Changing them should be something ALL Men should support because we are most vulnerable to their misuse. I could post dozens of articles showing you how False DV charges and TRO's have been misused to punish men for no other reason than the ex wife, ex girlfriend, or soon to be ex. decided to use it to punish the other person. One of the most abused "tools" of the legal system.
For extra reading here is an article called "The New Star Chamber- The New Jersey Family Court and the Prevention of Domestic Violence Act" This Article was published in the Rutgers Law Review Volume 57:3. The author writes: This essay is dedicated to my client, Timothy Rodgers, whose experience with the NJ Family Court introduced me to an area of law mired in intellectual dishonestly and injustice. Article was published in 2005 but it still is valid today, the injustice maybe even worse!
http://library.softgenx.com/Children/DV/newstarchamber.pdf
Last edited:
But it's only 3 games deep. That's my point.
And let's be real, were you not beating the anti Flood drum following what you admit was a good season? But now you want to say firing Flood is only due to play on the field this year?
email to me is a minor infraction, the penalty to which was justly influenced by the bevy of arrests.
Imo the fire flood talk is a total package affair. And yeah play on field is part of it, as is emails, but the arrests are a very big piece of the puzzle as well.
It does corroborate Carroo's side of the story that he did not touch the victim, but pulled his girlfriend out of the fracas. If I see the video correctly, Carroo had just come out of the Hale Center, and pulled Ms. Vega in the white pants away from the alleged victim.
The question is, what happened before and after the 16 seconds of video? Something more, or was this the beginning and end of Carroo's involvement in the fracas? Best case for Carroo is this is all of it, and he defused the situation and gets a citizen's commendation. Worse case is that there is video of multiple witnesses saying he put his hands on the alleged victim.
So I agree, we need to sit back and relax, but I disagree that it does prove something if the 16 seconds is the extent of Carroo's involvement. I'm just happy we are agreeing more than disagreeing.
No. It corroborate's that LC didn't touch anyone in this 16 second clip.
How anyone can conclude anything definitively from that video is beyond me.
You did not read my whole post. It was qualified by the statement that if that 16 seconds was the beginning and end of his involvement. Several times. Reread what I wrote.
LOL, me too!
The only problem I have is that I don't believe it "corroborate's" anything other than what happens in that 16-seconds. Maybe Leonte got more "involved" following that clip, or after the person taking the video stopped, none of us know at this point.
Exactly! and this unfortunately is what the judge is thinking too! An incident like this usually doesn't last just 16 seconds, There is a buildup, the incident and then a let down or disolving of the tension. Something like this usually lasts somewhere around a couple of minutes. The judge is going to be asking the same question. I think this will come down to witnesses and that is bad for Carroo and RU Football. It means he is out for the season while evidence is gathered. It would suck if he is found not guilty after the season is over.
I did read that. Immediately after I read, "It does corroborate Carroo's side of the story that he did not touch the victim, but pulled his girlfriend out of the fracas. If I see the video correctly, Carroo had just come out of the Hale Center, and pulled Ms. Vega in the white pants away from the alleged victim."
The video doesn't corroborate anything. Well it does corroborate that the person shooting the video is obviously not a film student...but that's another story.
Do you mean to say that LC didn't touch the woman in the 16 second clip released? Then say that. Don't use the word corroborate. Makes the dopes among us conclude LC didn't do anything. And perhaps he didn't. I hope he didn't. But this video doesn't tell us that for sure--you know, like the word corroborate would infer.
I have not seen the video but if it exonerates LC I find it very troubling that some on this board say he should nonetheless not be reinstated because it would be a PR nightmare. RU has to remove the "kick me" sign taped to its back at some point.
Find no comfort in the fact that the video does no such thing.
It is clearly a snippet of the event. It shows no definitive start and no definitive end to the events. People are scrambling when the footage starts and they are scrambling when the footage ends.
yes, during the 16 second clip, LC does not hit or body slam the girl.
It's just one guy...one whose father should've pulled out. But nooooo.
To the contrary, I think that if there should ever arise definitive evidence that Carroo didn't hit anybody, it would be a PR windfall. We should take out full-page ads.
Yeah, I was marbled-mouthed, and it is a good thing I am not his defense attorney. I thought I made my point clear, but obviously not. And as I write this, I am preparing proofs for a client in a patent trial. Hope I do better at that!
The Bottom line is, Carroo should be reinstated. There are MANY players that play pending charges all the time around the NCAA.
The only reason Rutgers won't reinstate right now is they are scared.
Someone (like JH) needs to stand up a grow a pair, as there is enough evidence to at least reinstate him as of now.
Also, the girl who pressed the charges must be scared as she will be charged next. Should have just kept your mouth shut.
The only reason Rutgers won't reinstate right now is they are scared.
Someone (like JH) needs to stand up a grow a pair, as there is enough evidence to at least reinstate him as of now.
Also, the girl who pressed the charges must be scared as she will be charged next. Should have just kept your mouth shut.
Yup. [cheers]
I could not handle the drama of family law or criminal law on a daily bassi. Although when I retire from patents, I have toyed with the idea of taking on pro-bono cases of people who appear to be wrongly accused and getting railroaded on bogus charges. I did it once, got a guy's conviction overturned, and I had a pretty good time doing it --once.
I could be convinced to not disagree with him playing, but I think that "scared" is not the correct reason that he's not.
I think the reality is that Flood and the program are backed into a corner with Carroo. The guys who were arrested for the student assault and the home invasions were kicked off the team and kicked out of school. They haven't been convicted yet. So now you've got Carroo arrested for assault (on a girl) with a Domestic Violence component and there's no way that Flood can reasonably say, "Well, that's cool... he can play, even if we sent those other guys packing, because Draft Pick."
