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Give Goodale credit , no coach speak here

RC1978

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Feb 11, 2008
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I was going to post in the match thread that a lot of what we are seeing might be on the coach. After watching the post match presser I have to give him credit pulls no punches. Not going to quote line by line but you will see he saw what we saw and hopefully it gets corrected.

 
Comments made about practice room are worth a mention. “Not enough fight... too much technique... too much playing around and let’s flow wrestle.” That’s a indictment on both wrestlers and staff.

We lick our wounds and hopefully learn from this. I thought Turley came to wrestle and despite the close match Janzer was truly relentless today. If this guy develops some offense there is some real upside there. Thought Pagano wrestled a real good match up until the injury. He was right there.

Sammy doing Sammy things. Kid is the leader of this young squad.
 
jojo has lost 2 matches up 3-1 in the 3rd. is this growing pains or something else
 
jojo has lost 2 matches up 3-1 in the 3rd. is this growing pains or something else
It’s a true frosh going through his growing pains. Some guys, like Sammy, are ready to go right away and compete with the best guys in the country. Others need some time to adjust and work on their deficiencies to hit that upper echelon. JoJo is going out there and wrestling a Big Ten schedule while he still has some weaknesses. He’s working through a trial by fire.
 
I've only seen Goody's lip quiver once..when he was talking after Billy Smiths loss to the Lehigh kid in the blood round..he is pissssseddd off..that's for sure,and rightfully so! There are either going to be some changes made or some real miserable practices.
 
This is a bit of an overreaction IMO. Camp had a lot of issues off the mat. Can’t put JoJo in the same breath as Camp at this point.
Issues..every kid has issues.Being burnt out or loosing lack of interest happens to wrestlers with ideal and bad circumstances.If your mind and body say "i'm done",there is usually a downward spiral. Ok, scratch Camp ( maybe he was a bad example to cite) Kevin Mulligan and Anthony Giraldo..same face and look of boredom and defeat.
 
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Issues..every kid has issues.Being burnt out or loosing lack of interest happens to wrestlers with ideal and bad circumstances.If your mind and body say "i'm done",there is usually a downward spiral. Ok, scratch Camp ( maybe he was a bad example to cite) Kevin Mulligan and Anthony Giraldo..same face and look of boredom and defeat.
Don’t think we can make the judgement or assessment yet. Kids only little more than 1/2 way through his first season. Also by all accounts he wanted to be out there. I think we are seeing a kid who probably thought he could come in and have similar success to high school, probably drank the kool aid some with #1 ranking and is seeing the difference in college wrestling and having struggles. Lots of it mental as Goodale said. If we are seeing similar results this time next year I will be much more concerned. At some point would like to see him redshirt too.
 
It will be interesting to see JoJo vs Lipari in the Tider march. Peter is 6-0 so far for Rider. He has solidified their lineup as they had a big hole at 141 without him. They have won 6 in a row including beating #17 Virginia
 
It will be interesting to see JoJo vs Lipari in the Tider march. Peter is 6-0 so far for Rider. He has solidified their lineup as they had a big hole at 141 without him. They have won 6 in a row including beating #17 Virginia

JoJo might very well win the match as we will need it.Rider has you have mentioned is wrestling quite well as of late.To beat them we cannot slip up like we did against Purdue.
 
Goodale always seems to be very candid in an interview setting and this was no exception. Are wrestling coaches a different breed in this regard or is Scott unique? Most coaches including Schiano and Pikiell would never be so critical of an individual's performance even if it was obvious to everyone who watched. While I find very refreshing, does he have to worry about any repercussions from the kid or his family or is it just understood that this is the way it is in the wrestling community? To me some times tough love is the right approach but we seem to live in a very coddled age.
 
I think with JoJo, how can you not second guess about Lipari every time JoJo struggles? Its in human nature to do so. I can see that hurting Goodale as well. But he did make a mistake on this decision, and he's paying for it b/c he's the head guy. They make big bucks to make big decisions, and this one failed him.

Would Lipari have won in the same situation against Purdue? Who knows. But for one thing, his body language would have been much more strong. Going into OT, I knew both Correnti and JoJo would lose. The Purdue guys are fired up, and we were not. That's coaching too.

Goodale is a great coach for RU. I know that. He made this program from ashes. Miracle worker. And I'm proud to have him as our coach. But I am pissed for this match and Lipari decision. I'll get over it.
 
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Are we honestly suggesting JoJo is done with wrestling because he hasn’t wrestled well as a true freshman?
I don't think the jury is out whether he is done or not.He may not have been ready and what everyone says about him not redshirting maybe true.I personally think he is a little burnt.At first,I thought he looked very disinterested and didn't seem to have any sense of urgency to get out from bottom.I gave it some thought and maybe the pressure to perform as a freshman has a caused a mental block.Look,the kid is only freshman and wrestling in front of 5000 crazy fans.Its not like wrestling in front of 300 to 400 at Pope John.Also,the kid is under the microscope,because of his #1 recruit status and heir apparent to Ashnault. I think we as fans should just lay off the kid and give him some time.The coaches will talk to him.The wrestlers read these boards,and we don't need them feeling any worse than they already do.
 
Goodale always seems to be very candid in an interview setting and this was no exception. Are wrestling coaches a different breed in this regard or is Scott unique? Most coaches including Schiano and Pikiell would never be so critical of an individual's performance even if it was obvious to everyone who watched. While I find very refreshing, does he have to worry about any repercussions from the kid or his family or is it just understood that this is the way it is in the wrestling community? To me some times tough love is the right approach but we seem to live in a very coddled age.

Wrestling is a VERY different sport then basketball or football, the wrestler is on the mat with his opponent were everyone in attendance can see his every move, hard to sugar coat what everyone sees with their own eyes, also a match is very short compared to the other sports so every move is amplified on the mat. Also think most wrestling fans understand the sport & know what is happening & why, then other sports, so a Coach can't BS as easily.
 
I don't think the jury is out whether he is done or not.He may not have been ready and what everyone says about him not redshirting maybe true.I personally think he is a little burnt.At first,I thought he looked very disinterested and didn't seem to have any sense of urgency to get out from bottom.I gave it some thought and maybe the pressure to perform as a freshman has a caused a mental block.Look,the kid is only freshman and wrestling in front of 5000 crazy fans.Its not like wrestling in front of 300 to 400 at Pope John.Also,the kid is under the microscope,because of his #1 recruit status and heir apparent to Ashnault. I think we as fans should just lay off the kid and give him some time.The coaches will talk to him.The wrestlers read these boards,and we don't need them feeling any worse than they already do.

Agree with this. As a 17/18 year old sometimes you think you are prepared for more than you are capable of. Also, not every freshman is Kyle Dake. Even Ben Askren and David Taylor red shirted and I think Askren lost a ton of unattached matches his true freshman year.
 
I don't think the jury is out whether he is done or not.He may not have been ready and what everyone says about him not redshirting maybe true.I personally think he is a little burnt.At first,I thought he looked very disinterested and didn't seem to have any sense of urgency to get out from bottom.I gave it some thought and maybe the pressure to perform as a freshman has a caused a mental block.Look,the kid is only freshman and wrestling in front of 5000 crazy fans.Its not like wrestling in front of 300 to 400 at Pope John.Also,the kid is under the microscope,because of his #1 recruit status and heir apparent to Ashnault. I think we as fans should just lay off the kid and give him some time.The coaches will talk to him.The wrestlers read these boards,and we don't need them feeling any worse than they already do.
ok, who hijacked Creedo's handle?

Agree with this. As a 17/18 year old sometimes you think you are prepared for more than you are capable of. Also, not every freshman is Kyle Dake. Even Ben Askren and David Taylor red shirted and I think Askren lost a ton of unattached matches his true freshman year.
He's older. Your examples support redshirting, just like Ashnault did, because you're right, everyone isn't Dake or Lee or Suriano, so that redshirt year is great for development, S&C and taking some unattached lumps. On the flip side, the stupid redshirt rules that don't allow redshirts to travel with the team and force them to pay their own way and drive or fly themself are a big factor why some won't redshirt, as they need the structure of the every day activities to stay on track.
 
I was watching Goodale with Aragona - you could see he was yelling at him to just get up - you could see he was pissed at JoJo and he let him know it. I learned something about Goodale that I din't realize - he is brutally honest with his wrestlers and I think he recruits kids who can take it. I love it. We blew 2 matches but I do chalk that up to youth - it will only pay dividends later when they kids learn how to handle the pressure and they will handle it because he is instilling a toughness that they will eventually grasp.
 
ok, who hijacked Creedo's handle?

He's older. Your examples support redshirting, just like Ashnault did, because you're right, everyone isn't Dake or Lee or Suriano, so that redshirt year is great for development, S&C and taking some unattached lumps. On the flip side, the stupid redshirt rules that don't allow redshirts to travel with the team and force them to pay their own way and drive or fly themself are a big factor why some won't redshirt, as they need the structure of the every day activities to stay on track.

I was speaking more in general terms not necessarily Jo Jo... but point remains.

People forget Ashnault was only like 17 when he got to college which made the entire "Old Man Ashnault" thing kind of funny. And yes... I support red shirting for most kids who are coming in at 133 or higher. When I first stepped foot on a college mat I had no idea the kind of strength some of these guys had in a matter of just 1 or 2 college years. I still remember being a skinny 160 lb kid getting tooled on by guys. Separated my shoulder in the first few weeks (still hurts to this day) and told by Sacchi that my problem was I needed to get stronger. Thanks for the pep talk coach! (126 is the one area you can get away with it if the kid is physically mature enough). In the case of Jo Jo, I put faith in the staff on this one as sometimes we don't have all the details. I've heard a thing or two about certain situations which always make me go "Oh... I get it now".

Now Sammy is a damn outlier because he is game ready. Mature wrestler beyond his years. As I've said, makes the loss of Suriano easier and he's looking like the leader of this young crop. Knocking off Howard like that was no fluke. Kid is an absolute gamer and you can't teach that.

Edit: In my above examples, Dake and Askren are also highly intelligent guys (NOT saying other guys are dumb) who were emotionally mature beyond their years and Askren still redshirted. However, I can see how Dake pulled it off because he had the mental toughness and mat IQ to make the transition quicker than most kids. Guy just gets it. Askren despite his smart ass persona understood and was a student of the sport since High School and knew how to play guys to his advantage. He just needed that year with Eierman to adjust his funky style to the college game.
 
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ok, who hijacked Creedo's handle?

He's older. Your examples support redshirting, just like Ashnault did, because you're right, everyone isn't Dake or Lee or Suriano, so that redshirt year is great for development, S&C and taking some unattached lumps. On the flip side, the stupid redshirt rules that don't allow redshirts to travel with the team and force them to pay their own way and drive or fly themself are a big factor why some won't redshirt, as they need the structure of the every day activities to stay on track.
Ha..Leonard,I can be diplomatic( not often),so revel in the moment.I felt bad for Goody in his press conference.Salary,accolades,coaching prowess aside,the man loves this team and the sport of wrestling.He can go anywhere at this point in his career,but he's stayed true to this team and the RU community.That says alot about an individual.He was visually upset in this press conference,like I've never seen before.The man is human first, parent and husband second,and everything else can take a backseat.He does love this team,and cares about those kids.You don't react like that,and certainly can't hide those facial emotions.Also, Correnti did get tossed into the heavy role ..like last minute.Yes,he should know better and wrestle smarter,but he'll get it going.Remember that one year he was getting packed left and right and then came on late.Let's see what unfolds.Also,JoJo will find a way to get his ass off of the bottom.Remember Desanto getting wacked with 4 stall calls against Scotty D( hope Scotty D sent that ref a Christmas Basket),in the blood round.The Brands Midgets found a way to fix that,and now he is unstoppable.
 
Ha..Leonard,I can be diplomatic( not often),so revel in the moment.I felt bad for Goody in his press conference.Salary,accolades,coaching prowess aside,the man loves this team and the sport of wrestling.He can go anywhere at this point in his career,but he's stayed true to this team and the RU community.That says alot about an individual.He was visually upset in this press conference,like I've never seen before.The man is human first, parent and husband second,and everything else can take a backseat.He does love this team,and cares about those kids.You don't react like that,and certainly can't hide those facial emotions.Also, Correnti did get tossed into the heavy role ..like last minute.Yes,he should know better and wrestle smarter,but he'll get it going.Remember that one year he was getting packed left and right and then came on late.Let's see what unfolds.Also,JoJo will find a way to get his ass off of the bottom.Remember Desanto getting wacked with 4 stall calls against Scotty D( hope Scotty D sent that ref a Christmas Basket),in the blood round.The Brands Midgets found a way to fix that,and now he is unstoppable.

That was one of the strangest moments I've seen in college wrestling. Guy goes from pulling off a flying squirrel into a Kimona on Micic to literally playing dead with Scott. I know all about the guys situation with Asperger syndrome, but at that moment I thought he was going through some sort of mental break.
 
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We blew 2 matches but I do chalk that up to youth - it will only pay dividends later when they kids learn how to handle the pressure and they will handle it because he is instilling a toughness that they will eventually grasp.
Regarding one of the matches you alluded to, Correnti is not young. You can't even chalk that one up to him moving up to heavyweight. Kid only outweighed him by 6 lbs. We know because Goodale told us in the press conference. Correnti was just gassed and I said it in the match thread right before OT, that he was done.
 
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I was speaking more in general terms not necessarily Jo Jo... but point remains.

People forget Ashnault was only like 17 when he got to college which made the entire "Old Man Ashnault" thing kind of funny. And yes... I support red shirting for most kids who are coming in at 133 or higher. When I first stepped foot on a college mat I had no idea the kind of strength some of these guys had in a matter of just 1 or 2 college years. I still remember being a skinny 160 lb kid getting tooled on by guys. Separated my shoulder in the first few weeks (still hurts to this day) and told by Sacchi that my problem was I needed to get stronger. Thanks for the pep talk coach! (126 is the one area you can get away with it if the kid is physically mature enough). In the case of Jo Jo, I put faith in the staff on this one as sometimes we don't have all the details. I've heard a thing or two about certain situations which always make me go "Oh... I get it now".

Now Sammy is a damn outlier because he is game ready. Mature wrestler beyond his years. As I've said, makes the loss of Suriano easier and he's looking like the leader of this young crop. Knocking off Howard like that was no fluke. Kid is an absolute gamer and you can't teach that.

Edit: In my above examples, Dake and Askren are also highly intelligent guys (NOT saying other guys are dumb) who were emotionally mature beyond their years and Askren still redshirted. However, I can see how Dake pulled it off because he had the mental toughness and mat IQ to make the transition quicker than most kids. Guy just gets it. Askren despite his smart ass persona understood and was a student of the sport since High School and knew how to play guys to his advantage. He just needed that year with Eierman to adjust his funky style to the college game.
Yeah Ashnault was young and I hated that age nonsense for his 6th yr, especially when you have guys like Kolodzik, who was less than a year younger than Ashnault but a full 2 grades behind, and Stieber who won his last national title at 24 or 25...
 
I was watching Goodale with Aragona - you could see he was yelling at him to just get up - you could see he was pissed at JoJo and he let him know it. I learned something about Goodale that I din't realize - he is brutally honest with his wrestlers and I think he recruits kids who can take it. I love it. We blew 2 matches but I do chalk that up to youth - it will only pay dividends later when they kids learn how to handle the pressure and they will handle it because he is instilling a toughness that they will eventually grasp.

Yelling just get up is not enough either.It is also important for Goodale to give specific instructions on the mat.What JOJO should do technically to get up for the escape than "just yelling getup".
 
Yelling just get up is not enough either.It is also important for Goodale to give specific instructions on the mat.What JOJO should do technically to get up for the escape than "just yelling getup".
Have you ever wrestled? Your taught from day 1 to get to a base and get up (stand up) peel hands and get free (separate from opponent) not much more to say its a fight thats pretty simple.
 
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