OT: Electric vehicles

[WhichReligionIsRight]

Analysis: Musk's Tesla stock sale poll raises taxing questions

When Elon Musk asked his Twitter followers last weekend if he should sell 10% of his Tesla Inc stock, he said he was posing the question because "much is made lately of unrealized gains being a means of tax avoidance."

www.reuters.com

your hero never does these things without an angle. he also uses the teslarati to his benefit. when share prices fall, gains aren't as much, he doesn't have to pay as much in tax. he just has all of you guys wrapped around his little pinky.

I admire the man as an innovator and visionary. But he's really kind of a dickhead. Like Michael Jordan as basketball player versus him as a person.

 

[mdk01]

Analysis: Musk's Tesla stock sale poll raises taxing questions

When Elon Musk asked his Twitter followers last weekend if he should sell 10% of his Tesla Inc stock, he said he was posing the question because "much is made lately of unrealized gains being a means of tax avoidance."

www.reuters.com

your hero never does these things without an angle. he also uses the teslarati to his benefit. when share prices fall, gains aren't as much, he doesn't have to pay as much in tax. he just has all of you guys wrapped around his little pinky.

His income declines my more than the taxes he saves.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

Because that want to shut down currently operating nukes which achieves the opposite. Germany is touted for all the investments they made in wind in solar but they're burning more coal as well because they shut their nuclear plants early.

You are conflating two arguments - wanting to get a carbon neutral future versus the viability of nukes. Like it or not, new nuclear power is crazy expensive and there are legitimate safety concerns over the use and storage of plutonium. Germany is using more coal because wind patterns have been erratic the past year. If there were better energy storage and grid capabilities, the short term issues of using coal and other carbon based energy sources will be overcome.

 

[RUevolution36]

His income declines my more than the taxes he saves.

there is tax benefit to tesla as well. corporate tax is a very interesting space.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

Which Woke Wins?????

The duel of the politically correct. And do they say the the scientists from MIT and Stanford are liars?

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/sa...lifornia-hit-climate-goals-report-2021-11-08/

Who is calling the profs liars? They are basically correct in their calculations, but I doubt the plants will stay open past the shutdown date. The earthquake, water and storage issues are real.

What is your objective in calling people concerned with these issues woke? You want to just be angry old guy? Fine; Have at it. You're doing a great job of railing at shit where everyone rolls their eyes.

 

[mildone]

I hate those f*ckin' movies.

"You owe me a 10 second car."

Yeah, right. Like your little JDM Civic could ever crack 10.

I love those movies. Pure mindless feel-good escapist entertainment. Totally unrealistic. Perfect.

 

[mildone]

Neither one of these cars is street legal. The car in the movie was.

Meh. Those sorts of movies are definitely not rooted in any kind of logical realism. They're like the Marvel movies - suspension of reality zones. Emotional manipulation is a priority rather than accuracy.

 

[mildone]

The problem is there's a big, big difference in the power required to run a 12 and what's required to run a 10. For an average compact car (so, total unmodified weight of around 3,000 lbs) it take >650 hp to get to 10 seconds. You can't really get that kind of power from a 1.8 turbo 4 without modifications that run well into 6 figures.

Correct.

Lots of the Mazdaspeed crowd were doing engine builds as well as big turbo and other bolt-on builds, plus extreme individualized tuning. Some folks would spend more than half the cost of the car on this stuff, or more. Although the problem with FWD platforms and quarter mile times is always going to be launch traction. That's a problem for front-engine RWD cars too. So no matter how much power you stick in those platforms, the limiting factor in 0-60 and quarter mile times winds up being traction.

That's harder with smaller than 2.3L engines, of course. But as Revolution says, the hardcore tuners will do wholesale engine swaps.

And in both cases, they'd either do an inspection tune or line up "friendly" inspection shops to pass inspection.

 

[mildone]

Those were the good ol' days, right?

Many a time have I trundled off to my local, friendly garage and slipped the guy a little bit of legal tender in exchange for a current inspection sticker.

You can't do that anymore. Which is a little sad, but it just forces us to be more creative, or spend more money.

Personally, I have a reasonably low threshold of personal satisfaction when it comes to this sort of thing. I waited for my warranty to expire, then promptly dropped about $1500 for purely electronic upgrades that have given me a car that will outrun pretty much anything on the road that costs less than $75k brand new. It won't outrun @mildone and his awesome Carrera, but I'm okay with that. 😁

I went purist - manual and RWD - so my acceleration times, while not awful, aren't going to match the PDK equipped, AWD cars. Some guys will insist they can shift faster, but they're FOS. Nobody can shift faster than a good dual clutch transmission. And nobody's clutch sense is better than a well programmed ECU at traction control either.

So lots of cars with lesser performance specs will beat me in a 0-60 or quarter mile. But acceleration was never as important to me as maximized engagement (or I would've gone AWD and PDF, obviously).

Although, once they come out, if I manage to find 992 GT3RS allocation at or near MSRP (extremely unlikely unfortunately), I'd still jump all over it despite the lack of manuals in them. That's a different kind of engagement though, feeling one of the best dual clutch transmissions ever slam through the gears (up or down) with the engine wailing at 9000RPM? Maybe not as engaging as a manual, but still pretty damn engaging, IMO. The sounds alone are orgasmic for me.

 

[mildone]

Yes, truly an evil genius.
Does Elon Musk make the world a better place?

LOL. Elon Musk, even if he once set out to make the world a better place, no longer has that capacity while CEO of Tesla. If he wanted to make the world a better place, he would've remained a privately held company. Or better yet, he'd use his wealth to cure cancer or feed the starving or house the homeless.

He can (and does) do philanthropic work and should be commended for that. But that's the only way he's doing the world any favors.

 

[mildone]

Totally normal functioning adult stuff here. Imagine what this insufferable human is like in private.

I dunno. I like bathroom humor, so his pp comment was okay by me.

It's not him (or Tesla) that is irritating (for me, I mean). It's the cultish teslarati who engage in adoration which is mildly irritating because I hate seeing people behaving cultishly about anything.

 

[mildone]

I admire the man as an innovator and visionary. But he's really kind of a dickhead. Like Michael Jordan as basketball player versus him as a person.

I don't mind him being a dick, if that's what he is (I don't pay enough attention to him to really know). I'd only mind if he ran for public office since I think politicians are more effective leaders when they have good people skills (i.e. when they're not dickheads).

 

[eliminate2006]

I dunno. I like bathroom humor, so his pp comment was okay by me.

It's not him (or Tesla) that is irritating (for me, I mean). It's the cultish teslarati who engage in adoration which is mildly irritating because I hate seeing people behaving cultishly about anything.

Such a comment made to or about an employee would be illegal. It's 100% wrong to sexually harass someone or tell such "jokes" to someone who doesn't consent.

 

[mildone]

Such a comment made to or about an employee would be illegal. It's 100% wrong to sexually harass someone or tell such "jokes" to someone who doesn't consent.

Was he making it about an employee? I couldn't tell.

And while I work to avoid sexually harassing anybody (that I'm not friends with), I just want to say that in my particular case, bring on the sexual harassment. My hashtag is: #MeToo_____please.

 

[mdk01]

You are conflating two arguments - wanting to get a carbon neutral future versus the viability of nukes. Like it or not, new nuclear power is crazy expensive and there are legitimate safety concerns over the use and storage of plutonium. Germany is using more coal because wind patterns have been erratic the past year. If there were better energy storage and grid capabilities, the short term issues of using coal and other carbon based energy sources will be overcome.

The plants have been built and the plutonium, at least that which is currently in use, will need storage regardless. Actually you are the one conflating. New plants would indeed be "crazy" expensive. Currently operating plants would not, although they'd be more expensive than coal.

 

[RUevolution36]

Just another knock on effect of moving to a less carbon dependent world...this one seems pretty solvable, but, as with the mining of cobalt and other materials, there will be some short term egg breaking.

How the rise of copper reveals clean energy’s dark side

As the world shifts to wind energy and electric cars, demand for the conductive metal has increased. But mining copper brings its own environmental hazards

www.theguardian.com

 

[BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap]

No.

Accelerating the transition to sustainable energy isn't a good thing?
I realize your MO is "if it isn't perfect, it sucks", but try to think like a rational human for a few minutes.

 

[mildone]

Accelerating the transition to sustainable energy isn't a good thing?
I realize your MO is "if it isn't perfect, it sucks", but try to think like a rational human for a few minutes.

Not if that acceleration is driving the use of coal, or causing human rights violations around the world, etc.

 

[RUevolution36]

Accelerating the transition to sustainable energy isn't a good thing?
I realize your MO is "if it isn't perfect, it sucks", but try to think like a rational human for a few minutes.

Elon Musk is an opportunistic businessman...and a good one at that. But making the world a better place? That's something that needs to be assessed in 50 years, not in the moment.

 

[Bleem Phuppert]

Not if that acceleration is driving the use of coal, or causing human rights violations around the world, etc.

Unfortunately we don't have a comprehensive energy source that is free of both pollution and 3rd world human rights violations.

The guys digging out lithium in South America can definitely vouch for that.

 

[BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap]

Elon Musk is an opportunistic businessman...and a good one at that. But making the world a better place? That's something that needs to be assessed in 50 years, not in the moment.

50 years?? Lol. What horseshit. The acceleration of sustainable energy is happening right now. Is that a good thing?

 

[BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap]

Such a comment made to or about an employee would be illegal. It's 100% wrong to sexually harass someone or tell such "jokes" to someone who doesn't consent.

He's not an employee, so your point has zero relevance. If you're looking for a safe space, don't go on Twitter.

 

[Bleem Phuppert]

The acceleration of sustainable energy is happening right now.

I don't see that, so much. There's a bit more solar and some wind in the pipeline, but I wouldn't call the current rate of growth "acceleration".

 

[RUevolution36]

50 years?? Lol. What horseshit. The acceleration of sustainable energy is happening right now. Is that a good thing?

At different points in time, 8 track tapes, laser discs, and HD-DVD's were technological breakthroughs that were going to change the way that we consumed media. After WWII, private industry was trying to find ways to leverage nuclear bombs in construction. Only with the passage of time can you see the lasting effects of change.

 

[Bleem Phuppert]

At different points in time, 8 track tapes, laser discs, and HD-DVD's were technological breakthroughs that were going to change the way that we consumed media. After WWII, private industry was trying to find ways to leverage nuclear bombs in construction. Only with the passage of time can you see the lasting effects of change.

Hell, it was only a few short years ago that a sitting President inquired as to the feasibility of nuking a hurricane.

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

I don't see that, so much. There's a bit more solar and some wind in the pipeline, but I wouldn't call the current rate of growth "acceleration".

I do. First of all, solar and wind power have been growing at a remarkable rate.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-solutions/2021/11/09/renewable-energy-solar-wind-biden/

As for the future, the experts keep raising estimates for future solar and wind power.

‘Exceptional new normal’: IEA raises growth forecast for wind and solar by another 25%

A massive expansion of clean electricity is essential to giving the world a chance of achieving its net-zero goals, according to the IEA's chief executive.

www.weforum.org

• The International Energy Agency (IEA) has increased its forecast for the global growth of wind and solar by another 25% from the previous figures released 6 months ago.
• Its renewable energy market update forecasts nearly 40% higher growth than expected a year ago.
• Renewables accounted for 90% of new electricity generating capacity added globally last year, which is expected to continue over the next 2 years.

 

[mdk01]

He's not an employee, so your point has zero relevance. If you're looking for a safe space, don't go on Twitter.

How is he getting employee stock options if he is not an employee?

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

Tesla overtakes Mercedes Benz to claim 3rd spot in U.S. luxury vehicle registrations in 2021

After trailing Mercedes Benz for most of the year, a strong September has helped Tesla overtake the German automaker and claim the 3rd spot in luxury vehicle registrations in the US. According to data from […]

driveteslacanada.ca

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

 

[mdk01]

2:11AM? Influencer or, like Musk, an employee.

 

[mildone]

2:11AM? Influencer or, like Musk, an employee.

Paid shill? No marketing budget. LOL

 

[mdk01]

Paid shill? No marketing budget. LOL

I'm still waiting for the explanation of how Musk got at least 100,000 NQ employee stock options to Tesla shares if he wasn't an employee. And that was only 1 years grant.

 

[mildone]

Hell, it was only a few short years ago that a sitting President inquired as to the feasibility of nuking a hurricane.

He would’ve been the best nuker of hurricanes. His nukes are the biggest nukes. Well, were anyway.

 

[mildone]

I'm still waiting for the explanation of how Musk got at least 100,000 NQ employee stock options to Tesla shares if he wasn't an employee. And that was only 1 years grant.

He’s in it for the good of all mankind.

 

[mdk01]

He would’ve been the best nuker of hurricanes. His nukes are the biggest nukes. Well, were anyway.

Well we've now got a president who says a $3.7 billion spending bill won't cost anything.

 

[mildone]

Well we've now got a president who says a $3.7 billion spending bill won't cost anything.

Billions schmillions.

In all seriousness, it doesn’t really matter. Not anymore.

 

[RUevolution36]

Today's Reuters EV news roundup:

Rivian valued at over $100 bln in debut, after world's biggest IPO of 2021

Shares of Rivian Automotive Inc surged as much as 53% in its Nasdaq debut on Wednesday, giving the Amazon-backed electric vehicle maker a market valuation of more than $100 billion after the world's biggest initial public offering this year.

www.reuters.com

Exclusive: Global carmakers now target $515 billion for EVs, batteries

Global automakers are planning to spend more than half a trillion dollars on electric vehicles and batteries through 2030, according to a Reuters analysis, amping up investments aimed at weaning car buyers away from fossil fuels and meeting increasingly tough decarbonization targets.

www.reuters.com

Is your electric car as eco-friendly as you thought?

Electric vehicles (EVs) are a powerful weapon in the world's battle to beat global warming, yet their impact varies hugely from nation-to-nation and in some places they pollute more than gasoline models, data analysis shows.

www.reuters.com

 

[mildone]

Today's Reuters EV news roundup:

Rivian valued at over $100 bln in debut, after world's biggest IPO of 2021

Shares of Rivian Automotive Inc surged as much as 53% in its Nasdaq debut on Wednesday, giving the Amazon-backed electric vehicle maker a market valuation of more than $100 billion after the world's biggest initial public offering this year.

www.reuters.com

Exclusive: Global carmakers now target $515 billion for EVs, batteries

Global automakers are planning to spend more than half a trillion dollars on electric vehicles and batteries through 2030, according to a Reuters analysis, amping up investments aimed at weaning car buyers away from fossil fuels and meeting increasingly tough decarbonization targets.

www.reuters.com

Is your electric car as eco-friendly as you thought?

Electric vehicles (EVs) are a powerful weapon in the world's battle to beat global warming, yet their impact varies hugely from nation-to-nation and in some places they pollute more than gasoline models, data analysis shows.

www.reuters.com

Third article is a good one, at least upon a quick read.

 

[mdk01]

Billions schmillions.

In all seriousness, it doesn’t really matter. Not anymore.

OOPS. Not billions, trillions. Well updating the late great Everett Dirksen "A trillion here, a trillion there and pretty soon you're talking real money".

 

[mildone]

OOPS. Not billions, trillions. Well updating the late great Everett Dirksen "A trillion here, a trillion there and pretty soon you're talking real money".

I actually meant trillions. Our current economic model will not survive the looming tech-driven socioeconomic disruption. Everett was kind of right. But not for much longer.

Don't ask me what exactly will happen. I just know that our economic cycle of build -> sell -> buy will grind to a halt and need to be replaced by something. What that something is I have no idea.