OT: Stock and Investment Talk

[RUDead]

This is on FT.com behind a paywall but had to share. He borrowed money from the bank and invested in his own funds. Headline pretty much says it all:

Masayoshi Son owes $4.7bn to SoftBank following tech rout​

Market crash also wipes out value of Japanese founder’s stake in second Vision Fund

Subscribe to read

www.ft.com

 

[T2Kplus20]

This is on FT.com behind a paywall but had to share. He borrowed money from the bank and invested in his own funds. Headline pretty much says it all:

Masayoshi Son owes $4.7bn to SoftBank following tech rout​

Market crash also wipes out value of Japanese founder’s stake in second Vision Fund

Subscribe to read

www.ft.com

Lots of people doing stupid stuff recently.

 

[ScarletNut]

Overleveraging, borrowing, increased margins occur whenever bull markets are raging and inevitably are painful and "shocking" when the market sinks and the piper has to be paid. History repeats itself over and over to different degrees but always with similar results. Whether its tulips, dot coms (eyeballs were the new metric), credit swaps (thanks to subprime mortgages), crypto (shitcoins, unregulated centralized exchanges), greed takes over and rational thoughts are pushed aside.
There were winners when the dot com crash occurred, just as there were banking winners during the financial crisis and I guarantee there will be winners in the crypto world when the dust settles.

 

[RU-05]

Just spoke of the Chart Master Carter Worth in the BTC thread.

But he also noted that oil just broke its upward trend while simultaneously bouncing off relative performance resistance.

However Tim Seymour's final trade was the OIH, as he see's oil producers outperforming oil itself.

Carter Worth's final trade? Gold.

 

[jtung230]

Lots of people doing stupid stuff recently.

He must have read one of your post and didn’t want to miss out on the boom.

 

[T2Kplus20]

He must have read one of your post and didn’t want to miss out on the boom.

Taking out a 9-figure loan to invest = Only yourself to blame

 

[RUDead]

Taking out a 9-figure loan to invest = Only yourself to blame

Especially when you have that guy's track record. He should have shorted his own funds. Would have killed it!

 

[T2Kplus20]

Especially when you have that guy's track record. He should have shorted his own funds. Would have killed it!

Funny thing is, tech is only temporarily down 30-35%. That's significant, but it shouldn't bankrupt anyone. His fund must have really sucked!

 

[RUDead]

Funny thing is, tech is only temporarily down 30-35%. That's significant, but it shouldn't bankrupt anyone. His fund must have really sucked!

They are mostly private funds and they have been in multiple blowups, Wework and others.

 

[RUTGERS95]

Energy prices are fine. They have come down nicely since the peak and have been relatively flat for months. You are right about price elevation, but most prices have at least plateaued (which means inflation is zero).

no they are not, just look at your bills, gas bill filling up etc. many of us can afford these sticky increases but 60% living paycheck to paycheck, consumer revolving debt exploding and more. Granted, much of the latter is personal responsibilities and attitudes towards need vs want

you want to fix things, stop the green nonsense, open up drilling and loosen regulation on energy and things will begin to normalize.

until the fed aggressively diminishes money supply, gov't spending is cut by 25% and energy concerns are addressed, we will have a few tough years that will see real change.

 

[RUBlackout7]

“Green nonsense” is necessary and is in demand. That won’t stop.

lol @ thinking local regulation is the reason for global energy inflation. Smh

 

[RUTGERS95]

“Green nonsense” is necessary and is in demand. That won’t stop.

lol @ thinking local regulation is the reason for global energy inflation. Smh

it's not necessary, demand has been manufactured and the realities of the green nonsense are barely known. Lithium and precious metals mining does way more harm and we haven't even hit the magnitude of need that the greenies want. In Chile they are talking about destroying entire ranges to get to the stuff and are already seeing terrible environmental destruction of water resources. Don't even need to get into china

on top of that, its' not economically feasable without massive gov't aid not withstanding the economic dislocations that are sure to arise if we get even to 10% of all the autos, small motors, etc usage.

along a upward slope that is measured sure but not like this

 

[tom1944]

Isn’t there an issue with refinery capacity?

Are oil companies willing to build new refineries?

 

[RUAldo]

Gotta love karma. Musk’s ego will cost him billions and the time he’s spending on this Twitter mess does not bode well for Tesla.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/18/tech/twitter-employee-exodus-fallout/index.html

 

[Rutgers Chris]

Gotta love karma. Musk’s ego will cost him billions and the time he’s spending on this Twitter mess does not bode well for Tesla.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/18/tech/twitter-employee-exodus-fallout/index.html

He will take them public again within 3 years north of $100 billion

 

[RUBlackout]

He will take them public again within 3 years north of $100 billion

I believe he will get the ship righted on Twitter and transform it...will just take a lot of pain but when you are losing $4M per day you need to change things
As for Tesla..short term pain for this twitter mess but could be a good buying oppty as I am sure he has a masterplan to do something between both companies
I do own TSLA stock and drive a TSLA--far from being a fanboy though

 

[RUBlackout7]

Gotta love karma. Musk’s ego will cost him billions and the time he’s spending on this Twitter mess does not bode well for Tesla.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/18/tech/twitter-employee-exodus-fallout/index.html

I like Musk but he is completely fumbling the takeover.

 

[RUDead]

I like Musk but he is completely fumbling the takeover.

He needs to take out the trash before he can really fix that place. That's what he is doing now. If he really wants to change the culture there, he should move out of California as well. I'm sure that is in the works at some level.

 

[RUTGERS95]

Isn’t there an issue with refinery capacity?

Are oil companies willing to build new refineries?

regs, permits, gov't environment etc but make zero mistake, the issue with energy lies at the feet of the administration here

 

[RUTGERS95]

He needs to take out the trash before he can really fix that place. That's what he is doing now. If he really wants to change the culture there, he should move out of California as well. I'm sure that is in the works at some level.

spot on

clear house, will be some speedbumps on the way and then he'll right the ship.

 

[RUTGERS95]

Gotta love karma. Musk’s ego will cost him billions and the time he’s spending on this Twitter mess does not bode well for Tesla.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/18/tech/twitter-employee-exodus-fallout/index.html

stop

Tesla problem is it's still p/e of 60 with ever increasing comp, not twitter. Musk has other endeavors that bode very well

 

[RUBlackout7]

it's not necessary, demand has been manufactured and the realities of the green nonsense are barely known. Lithium and precious metals mining does way more harm and we haven't even hit the magnitude of need that the greenies want. In Chile they are talking about destroying entire ranges to get to the stuff and are already seeing terrible environmental destruction of water resources. Don't even need to get into china

on top of that, its' not economically feasable without massive gov't aid not withstanding the economic dislocations that are sure to arise if we get even to 10% of all the autos, small motors, etc usage.

along a upward slope that is measured sure but not like this

Demand is definitely not manufactured. People like electric cars, deal with it.

Also, there has always been mining for these materials. What, you want to ban all metal mining? It’s still better than cleaning up oil spills for 25 years across thousands of miles of earth and responsible for millions of wildlife deaths.

 

[Knight Owl]

I like how folks think another Twitter won’t be up and running very shortly. Folks can’t wait to jump ship from Twitter especially after Musk’s absolutely insane Paul Pelosi “joke.” 100 billion for a Twitter with few sane tweets? Lol

 

[RUBlackout7]

He needs to take out the trash before he can really fix that place. That's what he is doing now. If he really wants to change the culture there, he should move out of California as well. I'm sure that is in the works at some level.

Yeah but you cut fat in a strategic and calculated way. The way he’s doing it is a complete free for all. Seems very unorganized and reckless.

Changing culture is one thing, what he’s doing is destroying culture. As a leader you want to inspire, he just seems to be implementing toxic culture. What talented engineer is going to want to work there?

And then you have his handling of Twitter Blue, which has been an absolute disaster.

 

[jtung230]

Lesson for everyone. Don’t buy things on the internet when you are high.

 

[RU-05]

I like Musk but he is completely fumbling the takeover.

I jthink he paid way too much and that shines a negative light on these moves.

Now i think given his track record he gets the benefit of the doubt. But this is a much different business then ev or space rockets.

 

[RUDead]

Yeah but you cut fat in a strategic and calculated way. The way he’s doing it is a complete free for all. Seems very unorganized and reckless.

Changing culture is one thing, what he’s doing is destroying culture. As a leader you want to inspire, he just seems to be implementing toxic culture. What talented engineer is going to want to work there?

And then you have his handling of Twitter Blue, which has been an absolute disaster.

He is trying to destroy the culture. The previous culture of money losing woke activism is being ushered out and a new culture will be developed over time. It will take time to see if he is successful.

But one thing seems to be clear, he would have gone bankrupt if business as usual continued.

 

[RUAldo]

stop

Tesla problem is it's still p/e of 60 with ever increasing comp, not twitter. Musk has other endeavors that bode very well

Musk is a task master but there are recent articles on the time-suck Twitter is having on Musk. Twitter is a major distraction. He even has Tesla engineers working on Twitter stuff.

 

[Frida's Boss]

spot on

clear house, will be some speedbumps on the way and then he'll right the ship.

Senior buyout loans bid at 60.

 

[RUBlackout7]

He is trying to destroy the culture. The previous culture of money losing woke activism is being ushered out and a new culture will be developed over time. It will take time to see if he is successful.

But one thing seems to be clear, he would have gone bankrupt if business as usual continued.

You really think that was the culture amongst the army of developers? That may have been some of the culture of the senior executives, but definitely not the other 95% of the company. I’m talking about the culture that makes you want to work at a place. Yeah, that’s not so good right now.

 

[T2Kplus20]

The Fed tried to talk down stocks for the past few days and overall the market gave them the middle finger. Nice to see! Inflation data rules the day and the market will figure out the story well before the Fed admits to it.

 

[RUDead]

You really think that was the culture amongst the army of developers? That may have been some of the culture of the senior executives, but definitely not the other 95% of the company. I’m talking about the culture that makes you want to work at a place. Yeah, that’s not so good right now.

I think it was in every part of the company.

Those people would have never been happy and would have caused constant problems. Better to cut them now and hire like minded people.

 

[jtung230]

He is trying to destroy the culture. The previous culture of money losing woke activism is being ushered out and a new culture will be developed over time. It will take time to see if he is successful.

But one thing seems to be clear, he would have gone bankrupt if business as usual continued.

Now it’s just money losing at a much faster rate.

 

[RUBlackout7]

I think it was in every part of the company.

Those people would have never been happy and would have caused constant problems. Better to cut them now and hire like minded people.

You read too many headlines. Developers dgaf about wokeness and their job certainly has nothing to do with it. They care about working at a place that makes them happy.

Trying install a toxic culture of overworking is just about the dumbest thing I’ve ever seen. Must be his aspergers flaring up.

 

[RUDead]

You read too many headlines. Developers dgaf about wokeness and their job certainly has nothing to do with it. They care about working at a place that makes them happy.

Trying install a toxic culture of overworking is just about the dumbest thing I’ve ever seen. Must be his aspergers flaring up.

Ha, that's funny. You're the one getting all your info from the headlines. My thoughts are my own.

 

[RUBlackout7]

Ha, that's funny. You're the one getting all your info from the headlines. My thoughts are my own.

Bro, I work with developers. Nobody wants to touch them with a 10 foot pole, and not because of politics, but because it just seems like a crappy place to work.

 

[RUDead]

Bro, I work with developers. Nobody wants to touch them with a 10 foot pole, and not because of politics, but because it just seems like a crappy place to work.

Ok, but that doesn't change anything imo. Its way more than developers that I am referring to. I've been working with some tech firms the last couple years and what I see is a totally broken cultures where the employees think they run the company and just do whatever they want with no accountability.

It's like when a coach takes over a losing team. Lots of turnover and pain early on. He has to change so many things there its better to clean house and start over. Culture won't change overnight but if he gets the small group that is left working hard and having success people will want to work there again.

 

[RUBlackout7]

Ok, but that doesn't change anything imo. Its way more than developers that I am referring to. I've been working with some tech firms the last couple years and what I see is a totally broken cultures where the employees think they run the company and just do whatever they want with no accountability.

It's like when a coach takes over a losing team. Lots of turnover and pain early on. He has to change so many things there its better to clean house and start over. Culture won't change overnight but if he gets the small group that is left working hard and having success people will want to work there again.

It’s not the change that is bad, it’s how he’s doing it. I mean if he wasn’t CEO he would have been fired by now.

 

[RU-05]

Is the problem with twitter its wokeness?

Or it’s inability to monetize its significant user base?

The $9 a month move was certainly aimed at monetizing those users but may come with the consequence of undermining the trustworthiness of the information posted. Which itself will have a negative consequence.

 

[RUAldo]

SBF is toast. Holmes got 11 years and Theranos was only worth $9B. Amazing how nobody that I am aware of got any serious time arising out of the financial crisis.

Theranos founder Elizabeth Holmes sentenced to more than 11 years in prison

Former Theranos CEO Elizabeth Holmes was sentenced Friday in U.S. federal court. She faced a maximum of 20 years in prison for fraud.

www.cnbc.com