OT: The official ACC all things thread

[DJ Spanky]

Having lived in Houston I can attest to that! And it's reciprocated.

Just to give this a little bit of context, this was back a couple of decades ago when they were both in the Southwest Conference. I remember there was a lot of hard feelings between Horns and Aggies, I also seem to remember a bit of that between the Horns and Razorbacks.

Arkansas–Texas football rivalry

 

[Ridge 22]

Fair enough and respect the mindset behind your arguments.

I just read the following comments by SEC Sankey which state:

“Our presidents have been clear that I am not going to entangle us in litigation around expansion. So I pay attention, but I'm not engaged in those conversations. The broader implications, obviously if things change, then there's a new level of uncertainty. It already creates speculation that I think is counterproductive, but I don't spend an enormous amount of my time thinking about it. I certainly don't spend any time engaged in that recruiting activity because we're focused on our 16."

In his opening statement to kick off SEC media days, Sankey noted that "Sixteen is our today, and 16 is our tomorrow."

Asked later in his news conference whether tomorrow means staying at 16 for the long term, Sankey said, "Our focus is on our 16 members. I have a responsibility to pay attention, and I'm certainly not going to fuel speculation on what happens next. We can certainly remain at 16 for a long, long time and be incredibly successful."

Sankey on adding to SEC: 'I'm not a recruiter'

SEC commissioner Greg Sankey reiterated Monday that the league is focused on its 16 members and he is not recruiting any others, in his remarks to open SEC media days.

www.espn.com

This tells me the SEC wants nothing to do with considering schools that are caught in a web of litigation and that none of the college presidents want that stench on them; and that they are good where they are (16 schools) which tells the public that FSU and Clemson are not being considered for membership at this time. I would think the BIG has the same line of thinking.

Do you disagree with this assertion?

GO RU

I agree the new conferences do not want to get involved in the GOR dispute with the old conference. Bad look. I don't think it will matter much though. FSU and probably Clemson too, will settle relatively quickly. I think people will be surprised at that. FSU probably not before 8/15, but I don't think that impacts their decision. They will announce and it will get resolved. Clemson likely to settle quickly thereafter. Their legal arguments are similar. ACC is better off settling then setting a precedent. Plus discovery would be rough for them. Among other issues in proceeding.

Your larger point though is in essence the argument behind the Big12 hail Mary as I see it. Borrow gobs of PE money today to hand over to FSU and Clemson to cover their costs to leave and then watch the ACC implode and hope you are still relevant in 2030 when the bills come due and their new media rights deal would kick in. Just don't see it as viable, but I appreciate their balls to think outside the box. If Yormark was running the old Big East, it would still be here today in good shape i bet

 

[Scarlet83]

"Texas’ main rival is OU. By a long shot." that might be the reason for the Aggies hate for the Longhorns/
Texas treats A&M like it's nothing and acts like the boss of Texas' College Football and expects to be treated like one.
I'm of the opinion if that Aggie hate for Texas is strong enough and the B1G wants a foothold in Texas, the FSU situation might have a bearing on A&M leaving the SEC to get away from Texas like Nebraska left the Big 12 because of their feeling Texas was running that conference and wanting to get away from Texas' influence on B-12 policies

If FSU gets out of the ACC and asks for B1G membership the B1G might feel Texas A&M might be a better choice to come in with FSU then Clemson would because of gaining a foothold in the fertile Texas recruiting area along with the Florida one FSU will bring.

While I don’t want more B1G expansion, IMO, Clemson is behind FSU, UNC, TAM and UVA.

And Clemson is WAYYYY behind those schools. Clemson does not pay for themselves and their football program has been trending down.

 

[RUtrumpet92]

While I don’t want more B1G expansion, IMO, Clemson is behind FSU, UNC, TAM and UVA.

And Clemson is WAYYYY behind those schools. Clemson does not pay for themselves and their football program has been trending down.

I totally agree. Clemson brings nothing meaningful outside of football.

 

[JayDogSmooth]

While I don’t want more B1G expansion, IMO, Clemson is behind FSU, UNC, TAM and UVA.

And Clemson is WAYYYY behind those schools. Clemson does not pay for themselves and their football program has been trending down.

Will be interesting to see if Dabo can get them back on top - in a watered down ACC, that’s not hard to do

 

[JayDogSmooth]

McMurphy bringing the smoke

 

[Panthergrowl13]

i agree with you that the Big12 talk is nothing more than the Big12 throwing a hail Mary which is highly unlikely to work. The economics around it just make no sense. Like I have yet to see anyone even attempt to explain how the $ would work. Because it can't. That said, FSU and Clemson cannot and will not stay in the ACC. You don't go through that level of effort and acrimony to sue your conference to simply go back in the end. It is not possible at this point. The only question is where they land and when. B1G 85%, SEC 14%, Big 12 1%, ACC 0%.

Agree on many of your comments.

The only thing I might add is FSU and Clemson GOR lawsuits might be an attempt to prompt ESPN to seriously consider contract modifications in the 2025 look in period.

Much silence coming from ESPN/ACC during this rumor period.

I think all parties understand that the ACC/ESPN contract is significantly undervalued on the open market at this point in time.

The ACC is an important commodity for ESPN for profit and sports content.

Believe there are 3 court cases total in South Carolina, Florida and North Carolina. I don't think FSU/Clemson was unhappy in the ACC only the financial compensation. The ACC gives FSU/Clemson the opportunity to remain a Dominant Football Power in the conference (and they know it). Not so much in the B1G or SEC.

Speculation and reading tea leaves.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

 

[kupuna133]

McMurphy bringing the smoke

View embedded media

Disruptive partner has been an issue especially when it comes the B1G. I don’t see the B1G wanting to deal with someone that is litigious and boisterous in the press.

I understand why FSU needs to do what they are doing but it’s not the way the B1G operates.

 

[bigmatt718]

Will be interesting to see if Dabo can get them back on top - in a watered down ACC, that’s not hard to do

It's not at least on paper when after FSU, their biggest opposition in the ACC is...I guess Louisville? NC State? A perpetually overrated Miami? God the ACC is trash as a whole.

 

[Panthergrowl13]

Fair enough and respect the mindset behind your arguments.

I just read the following comments by SEC Sankey which state:

“Our presidents have been clear that I am not going to entangle us in litigation around expansion. So I pay attention, but I'm not engaged in those conversations. The broader implications, obviously if things change, then there's a new level of uncertainty. It already creates speculation that I think is counterproductive, but I don't spend an enormous amount of my time thinking about it. I certainly don't spend any time engaged in that recruiting activity because we're focused on our 16."

In his opening statement to kick off SEC media days, Sankey noted that "Sixteen is our today, and 16 is our tomorrow."

Asked later in his news conference whether tomorrow means staying at 16 for the long term, Sankey said, "Our focus is on our 16 members. I have a responsibility to pay attention, and I'm certainly not going to fuel speculation on what happens next. We can certainly remain at 16 for a long, long time and be incredibly successful."

Sankey on adding to SEC: 'I'm not a recruiter'

SEC commissioner Greg Sankey reiterated Monday that the league is focused on its 16 members and he is not recruiting any others, in his remarks to open SEC media days.

www.espn.com

This tells me the SEC wants nothing to do with considering schools that are caught in a web of litigation and that none of the college presidents want that stench on them; and that they are good where they are (16 schools) which tells the public that FSU and Clemson are not being considered for membership at this time. I would think the BIG has the same line of thinking.

Do you disagree with this assertion?

GO RU

Perfectly understandable.

ESPN has the SEC contract.

ESPN/ACC involved in court (GOR) proceedings.

What does ESPN have to gain by paying big money for FSU/Clemson to leave and go to the SEC.

ESPN would then have 2 schools in South Carolina and Florida which they already have with FSU/Clemson in the ACC.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

 

[RU_Goo]

wow, lots of posters gonna eat some crow on this one

 

[mosito]

This might be what we are looking at in 2030.
FSU, Miami, Clemson might eventually be in the P2 but might spend some years in the Big 12. Seems they will be willing to give them some type of additional money.
UNC and NC State might end up in the SEC if they are willing to take both. B10 will obviously want UNC, but not NCState

B10	SEC	B12	ACC
Illinois	Alabama	Arizona	BC
Indiana	Arkansas	Arizona St	Cal
Iowa	Auburn	Baylor	Duke
Maryland	Florida	BYU	Georgia Tech
Michigan	Georgia	Cincy	Pitt
Mich St	Kentucky	Colorado	SMU
Minnesota	LSU	Houston	Syracuse
Nebraska	Miss St	Kansas	Virginia Tech
Northwestern	Oklahoma	Kansas St	Wake Forest
Ohio State	Ole Miss	Oklahoma St	Louis/UVA/NCSt
Oregon	South Carolina	TCU
Penn St	Teneesee	Texas Tech	Some of Below
Purdue	Texas	UCF	East Carolina
Rutgers	Texas A&M	Utah	Memphis
UCLA	Vandy	West Vir	Oregon St
Washington	UNC	FSU	Tulane
Wisconsin	UVA or NCSt	Clemson	Tulsa
Notre Dame		Miami	USF
Stanford		Louisville or NCSt	Wash St

 

[JayDogSmooth]

Disruptive partner has been an issue especially when it comes the B1G. I don’t see the B1G wanting to deal with someone that is litigious and boisterous in the press.

I understand why FSU needs to do what they are doing but it’s not the way the B1G operates.

The thing is though, we were ideal conference partners for 30 years

Never complaining, trusting the process, winning, and most importantly, bringing in revenue and recognition

We only started making noise the last few years, because we finally realized we were getting played out by a bunch of corrupt idiots

 

[JayDogSmooth]

It's not at least on paper when after FSU, their biggest opposition in the ACC is...I guess Louisville? NC State? A perpetually overrated Miami? God the ACC is trash as a whole.

Exactly, the conference is predominantly trash

 

[JayDogSmooth]

wow, lots of posters gonna eat some crow on this one

I’ll be the first one to come on here and eat crow if FSU does not end up in the Big Ten or the SEC in the next one to two years

However, the crow will be a lot easier to eat if either the ACC steps up their monetary allotment per school (not going to happen), or they get into the big 12 with a package similar to that of the big 10 and SEC

 

[Ridge 22]

Agree on many of your comments.

The only thing I might add is FSU and Clemson GOR lawsuits might be an attempt to prompt ESPN to seriously consider contract modifications in the 2025 look in period.

Much silence coming from ESPN/ACC during this rumor period.

I think all parties understand that the ACC/ESPN contract is significantly undervalued on the open market at this point in time.

The ACC is an important commodity for ESPN for profit and sports content.

Believe there are 3 court cases total in South Carolina, Florida and North Carolina. I don't think FSU/Clemson was unhappy in the ACC only the financial compensation. The ACC gives FSU/Clemson the opportunity to remain a Dominant Football Power in the conference (and they know it). Not so much in the B1G or SEC.

Speculation and reading tea leaves.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

I don't see any path for FSU to remain in the ACC. Do you honestly think they went nuclear and sued their conference to get out without having a plan on where they are going? And how would staying in the ACC even for more money solve their problems? No school with a chance to join a P2 conference and ensure future stability is going to pass that up. To think FSU may stay in the ACC is both illogical and insane

 

[Panthergrowl13]

I don't see any path for FSU to remain in the ACC. Do you honestly think they went nuclear and sued their conference to get out without having a plan on where they are going? And how would staying in the ACC even for more money solve their problems? No school with a chance to join a P2 conference and ensure future stability is going to pass that up. To think FSU may stay in the ACC is both illogical and insane

Not so illogical.

FSU losses GOR lawsuit and has to pay several hundred million dollars to leave. SEC/B1G don't want to get involved (paying the GOR exit money for FSU and then paying B1G money for them to join.)

FSU can leave and play as an independent after paying the GOR money to the ACC or stay in the ACC.

What to do.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

 

[kupuna133]

The thing is though, we were ideal conference partners for 30 years

Never complaining, trusting the process, winning, and most importantly, bringing in revenue and recognition

We only started making noise the last few years, because we finally realized we were getting played out by a bunch of corrupt idiots

I understand why it was done. It’s not the way the B1G does things. And you can go back and see how i read this from the beginning, that being too disruptive would be the undoing for FSU and the B1G.
I think the ACC is getting what is due after how they gutted the Big East. FSU needs a new conference. That’s not debatable. I don’t think they played it correctly. Needed to be less visible. Now I fear their only options will be to stay in ACC (awful scenario) with increased rev sharing or move to b12. Which will be more of what they have in ACC, playing second fiddle to SEC and B1G.

 

[JayDogSmooth]

I understand why it was done. It’s not the way the B1G does things. And you can go back and see how i read this from the beginning, that being too disruptive would be the undoing for FSU and the B1G.
I think the ACC is getting what is due after how they gutted the Big East. FSU needs a new conference. That’s not debatable. I don’t think they played it correctly. Needed to be less visible. Now I fear their only options will be to stay in ACC (awful scenario) with increased rev sharing or move to b12. Which will be more of what they have in ACC, playing second fiddle to SEC and B1G.

That’s where we disagree

They tried doing it another radar for years, keeping things in-house, and attempting to work things out with the league, and it got them nowhere

They were left with no choice but to go balls of the wall, guns blazing out in public, and although that’s not the preferred method of how I like to see things being done, I understand why they did it

If they had a history of doing this in the previous 30 years of conference affiliation, then there would be reason for concern

But again, they were ideal partners for the duration of their time in the conference, and the ACC did not reciprocate on their end

Hence, if they wanted to remain elite and compete for championships, the only option was to go scorched earth

It’s unfortunate that it went this way, and I blame the FSU administration getting along for so long by the incompetent ACC

 

[mosito]

@JayDogSmooth

I think some of the issues have been outside FSU control. Like the attorney General butting in.
She should not have any involvement. Let the lawsuits play out. For many schools, all they see is, " Shit FSU unhappy so Florida Government getting involved. What if in the future FSU unhappy in B10 or SEC or wants unequal revenue". I know it would be different scenario being in ACC vs Power2.

Or some FSU folks saying we deserve more money because we are worth more. While that might be true, that has nothing to do with the litigation, so shut your trap.

I don't think you would need to eat crow. Up until the past few months all indications was both the SEC and B10 wanted FSU.

I think the main change is that if in fact the GOR gets trampled on, which after every instance of information coming out of the courts it appears that the GOR is not what we all thought it was. That means teams can leave for cheap,even for the B12. Big 12 can pluck first... potentially forcing ND hand. If B10 an get ND and another and get to 20, they might be ok (for now) and postpone Southeast expansion. SEC won't take both Miami and FSU or either, so B10 has options... they might focus on UNC.

Depending on what happens aabove the B10 can absorb everything and determine, do we want to go to 22/24 with FL teams. Who would come along. Whether FSU or Miami, who brings more value as a second. Maybe both? GT as a second? Is UVA still available?


Regardless of rumblings of FL not being a good partner, I think the main difference is that the B10 now thinks they can get ND to be #19.

 

[kupuna133]

That’s where we disagree

They tried doing it another radar for years, keeping things in-house, and attempting to work things out with the league, and it got them nowhere

They were left with no choice but to go balls of the wall, guns blazing out in public, and although that’s not the preferred method of how I like to see things being done, I understand why they did it

If they had a history of doing this in the previous 30 years of conference affiliation, then there would be reason for concern

But again, they were ideal partners for the duration of their time in the conference, and the ACC did not reciprocate on their end

Hence, if they wanted to remain elite and compete for championships, the only option was to go scorched earth

It’s unfortunate that it went this way, and I blame the FSU administration getting along for so long by the incompetent ACC

Again this has nothing to do with ideal partners and 30 years. I understand why they were forced to do what they did. This has to do with diminishing options once they went scorched earth. I have seen many a deal fall apart because someone was too aggressive with terms and playing things out in the media.
If the only goal was to be out of the ACC without a landing spot they could air all the dirty laundry. But they still needed to find a home and their desired location (SEC,B1G) sounds like don’t want the noise.

 

[Ridge 22]

Not so illogical.

FSU losses GOR lawsuit and has to pay several hundred million dollars to leave. SEC/B1G don't want to get involved (paying the GOR exit money for FSU and then paying B1G money for them to join.)

FSU can leave and play as an independent after paying the GOR money to the ACC or stay in the ACC.

What to do.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

It will never get to a trial. Too much at stake for all sides. There will be a settlement and FSU will move on.

 

[jaydogsmooth1]

@JayDogSmooth

I think some of the issues have been outside FSU control. Like the attorney General butting in.
She should not have any involvement. Let the lawsuits play out. For many schools, all they see is, " Shit FSU unhappy so Florida Government getting involved. What if in the future FSU unhappy in B10 or SEC or wants unequal revenue". I know it would be different scenario being in ACC vs Power2.

Or some FSU folks saying we deserve more money because we are worth more. While that might be true, that has nothing to do with the litigation, so shut your trap.

I don't think you would need to eat crow. Up until the past few months all indications was both the SEC and B10 wanted FSU.

I think the main change is that if in fact the GOR gets trampled on, which after every instance of information coming out of the courts it appears that the GOR is not what we all thought it was. That means teams can leave for cheap,even for the B12. Big 12 can pluck first... potentially forcing ND hand. If B10 an get ND and another and get to 20, they might be ok (for now) and postpone Southeast expansion. SEC won't take both Miami and FSU or either, so B10 has options... they might focus on UNC.

Depending on what happens aabove the B10 can absorb everything and determine, do we want to go to 22/24 with FL teams. Who would come along. Whether FSU or Miami, who brings more value as a second. Maybe both? GT as a second? Is UVA still available?


Regardless of rumblings of FL not being a good partner, I think the main difference is that the B10 now thinks they can get ND to be #19.

ND is the clear #1 choice
Getting them to play ball changes the entire landscape

What was in FSU's control and is frustrating is they stood by for years and took it in the ass, under the guise the league would step up
Incompetence, laziness, and resting on their laurels landed them in this position

All indications indicate a settlement being reached re. the GOR
Neither side wants to litigate it for fear of losing

 

[jaydogsmooth1]

Again this has nothing to do with ideal partners and 30 years. I understand why they were forced to do what they did. This has to do with diminishing options once they went scorched earth. I have seen many a deal fall apart because someone was too aggressive with terms and playing things out in the media.
If the only goal was to be out of the ACC without a landing spot they could air all the dirty laundry. But they still needed to find a home and their desired location (SEC,B1G) sounds like don’t want the noise.

That's my point - what other choice did they have?
They tried doing it behind closed doors to no avail

They saw the SEC and UF getting 40-50 mil per year, and got screwed out of the playoffs b/c they played in the ACC
What other choices did they have at their disposal?

 

[rutgersguy1]

I think disruptive partner etc..is mostly baloney. It's a convenient excuse imo. They might be but if they added enough dollars to the bottom line they would be taken. I've said this before, the media companies aren't bottomless pits of cash anymore like they used to be, specifically ESPN/Disney. See the reduced rate Oregon/Washington have to take. It would likely be similar for FSU and then what's the point of leaving the ACC paying massive exit costs and then possibly getting the same or maybe even less (Oregon/Washgington cut is less than ACC) than what they were in the ACC. If the networks wanted to pay up, most of these reasons would be brushed aside but if not then anything can pop up as a reason.

I've said before I don't think B12 is a realistic option, its not even close to their geographic footprint. The money at best will be a wash. If anything, I've mentioned it's more likely teams like WVU/UCF would move to the ACC down the line when the GOR is near expiration rather than the other way around because it fits their geography better.

PE news made me think there's a slight chance and light but don't hear much about that anymore and if there's really no money from the networks then that doesn't even matter.

FSU should do what I've said all along, bide your time try to dominate the ACC and when the GOR is near expiration in the 2030s move. It's not as if they've ever been hurting for money. They pay their HC a big salary (has been bumped up twice iirc) and have plenty of NIL in the war chest so what do they really need while they bide their time. Schools with less resources have and can achieve big things.

 

[kupuna133]

That's my point - what other choice did they have?
They tried doing it behind closed doors to no avail

They saw the SEC and UF getting 40-50 mil per year, and got screwed out of the playoffs b/c they played in the ACC
What other choices did they have at their disposal?

I dont envy their decision. But the only thing they could have done would be to be quiet until they had an ironclad invitation to the conference of their choice. Now they have to hope that those discussions can be resurrected at some point.

Otherwise they will have the same problems they have now. Being stuck in a second tier conference. Either a watered down b12 with minimal upside on revenue or in the ACC with unmotivated conference mates that will proverbially drink from their teet.

 

[rutgersguy1]

BTW, I should add it's impulsive actions and not biding their time and thinking thing through that got them in this mess anyway. FSU was perfectly fine and on board with making it extremely onerous to leave after Maryland left. Also if the ACC just bided their time and waited for a better moment to start their network (near the end of the contract) rather than wanting it instantly that extension might not have come into play. It's the need instant gratification that can cause the problems, rather than stepping back, thinking things through and potential unintended consequences.

 

[jaydogsmooth1]

I think disruptive partner etc..is mostly baloney. It's a convenient excuse imo. They might be but if they added enough dollars to the bottom line they would be taken. I've said this before, the media companies aren't bottomless pits of cash anymore like they used to be, specifically ESPN/Disney. See the reduced rate Oregon/Washington have to take. It would likely be similar for FSU and then what's the point of leaving the ACC paying massive exit costs and then possibly getting the same or maybe even less (Oregon/Washgington cut is less than ACC) than what they were in the ACC. If the networks wanted to pay up, most of these reasons would be brushed aside but if not then anything can pop up as a reason.

I've said before I don't think B12 is a realistic option, its not even close to their geographic footprint. The money at best will be a wash. If anything, I've mentioned it's more likely teams like WVU/UCF would move to the ACC down the line when the GOR is near expiration rather than the other way around because it fits their geography better.

PE news made me think there's a slight chance and light but don't hear much about that anymore and if there's really no money from the networks then that doesn't even matter.

FSU should do what I've said all along, bide your time try to dominate the ACC and when the GOR is near expiration in the 2030s move. It's not as if they've ever been hurting for money. They pay their HC a big salary (has been bumped up twice iirc) and have plenty of NIL in the war chest so what do they really need while they bide their time. Schools with less resources have and can achieve big things.

FSU cannot remain in the ACC if it wants to remain competitive and elite in football, and all other associated sports

We're already 25 mil/year behind our peers
With the new tv contract it'll be 40-50 mil / year behind, which, if they stayed til 2030, puts them 300 mil in the hole

Throwing all the money at football isn't an option as the other sports would suffer
Can't keep tapping Boosters and Battles End as they don't have a Phil Knight / SMU $$ level donors

Already behind the 8 ball as not co-ed until 1947, hence not generations of doctors / lawyers / successful people donating large sums of cash like other perennial powers

Have to get out and soon in order to remain elite - no other option

 

[jaydogsmooth1]

I dont envy their decision. But the only thing they could have done would be to be quiet until they had an ironclad invitation to the conference of their choice. Now they have to hope that those discussions can be resurrected at some point.

Otherwise they will have the same problems they have now. Being stuck in a second tier conference. Either a watered down b12 with minimal upside on revenue or in the ACC with unmotivated conference mates that will proverbially drink from their teet.

That was my preference, but the powers that be felt the best move was go to ape shit in public

 

[rutgersguy1]

That's my point - what other choice did they have?
They tried doing it behind closed doors to no avail

They saw the SEC and UF getting 40-50 mil per year, and got screwed out of the playoffs b/c they played in the ACC
What other choices did they have at their disposal?

I don't think the ACC got you out of the playoffs. That imo was the cherry on top. It's the qb injury that got you. If he was healthy you would have most likely been in. Also that problem doesn't exist anymore because all the P4 conference champs are virtually a lock to get in to the playoffs.

Not only that, you've got a higher chance for a bye being in the ACC.

 

[jaydogsmooth1]

BTW, I should add it's impulsive actions and not biding their time and thinking thing through that got them in this mess anyway. FSU was perfectly fine and on board with making it extremely onerous to leave after Maryland left. Also if the ACC just bided their time and waited for a better moment to start their network (near the end of the contract) rather than wanting it instantly that extension might not have come into play. It's the need instant gratification that can cause the problems, rather than stepping back, thinking things through and potential unintended consequences.

Actually, quite the opposite
It's the in component, lazy, unqualified people in charge that were grandfathered into positions they had no business being in that has led to this mess

Andy Miller, who built Seminole Boosters, ran it for 45 years
45 years!!!

Think about that - no organization should have someone running it for that long
Add in a bunch of other people who were allowed to stay far too long, bad hires, laziness, etc. and you have a shit sandwich

 

[rutgersguy1]

FSU cannot remain in the ACC if it wants to remain competitive and elite in football, and all other associated sports

We're already 25 mil/year behind our peers
With the new tv contract it'll be 40-50 mil / year behind, which, if they stayed til 2030, puts them 300 mil in the hole

Throwing all the money at football isn't an option as the other sports would suffer
Can't keep tapping Boosters and Battles End as they don't have a Phil Knight / SMU $$ level donors

Already behind the 8 ball as not co-ed until 1947, hence not generations of doctors / lawyers / successful people donating large sums of cash like other perennial powers

Have to get out and soon in order to remain elite - no other option

UConn just won 2 back to back basketball championships. Do they have resources on the level of Phil Knight. They also didn't lose their coach to the Lakers. FSU doesn't need all the money in the world to compete, they have enough.

 

[jaydogsmooth1]

I don't think the ACC got you out of the playoffs. That imo was the cherry on top. It's the qb injury that got you. If he was healthy you would have most likely been in. Also that problem doesn't exist anymore because all the P4 conference champs are virtually a lock to get in to the playoffs.

Not only that, you've got a higher chance for a bye being in the ACC.

QB yes but if they played in the SEC or B1G, they wouldn't have missed out

Sure, they have an easier road to the playoffs in the ACC, but at what cost?
The other sports would suffer greatly, and there's no guarantees that putting all the eggs in the football basket would pay dividends in order to keep up with schools 400 + million ahead

 

[jaydogsmooth1]

UConn just won 2 back to back basketball championships. Do they have resources on the level of Phil Knight. They also didn't lose their coach to the Lakers. FSU doesn't need all the money in the world to compete, they have enough.

That's bball
Different world than football

Also, you need 2-3 elite guys in hoops to win
FB you need way more

FB brings in 85 % of the athletic revenue $$ per year
Night and day compared w/hoops

 

[rutgersguy1]

Actually, quite the opposite
It's the in component, lazy, unqualified people in charge that were grandfathered into positions they had no business being in that has led to this mess

Andy Miller, who built Seminole Boosters, ran it for 45 years
45 years!!!

Think about that - no organization should have someone running it for that long
Add in a bunch of other people who were allowed to stay far too long, bad hires, laziness, etc. and you have a shit sandwich

Most of these people aren't people with the best acumen in business. The college presidents themselves aren't. These are often collegial boys club kind of things. I don't know how much acumen comes into play for any of these positions.

 

[jaydogsmooth1]

Most of these people aren't people with the best acumen in business. The college presidents themselves aren't. These are often collegial boys club kind of things. I don't know how much acumen comes into play for any of these positions.

True, but the amount of incompetence displayed was off the charts
David Hale wrote a great piece for ESPN about this a few years back
Long read, but details all of the nonsense

 

[rutgersguy1]

That's bball
Different world than football

Also, you need 2-3 elite guys in hoops to win
FB you need way more

FB brings in 85 % of the athletic revenue $$ per year
Night and day compared w/hoops

Yea and you have more money that supports football. I don't see FSU suffering anything by being in the ACC until the GOR is near expiration. If anything it can be a massive opportunity to dominate the same way Bowden did for so long.

As a practical matter the money isn't as big a deal as you think because the large majority of your competitors (the ACC members) will have less than you do. It's all relative. If you're any good you beat the crap out of them and get many many playoff opportunities and the like. It's the reverse of RU. On paper we'll get the same money as OSU/Michigan etc...from the B10 but do we have anywhere near the resources of those schools? No. Doesn't mean we should leave the B10, but the point is there is opportunity for FSU to win big things and it won't have to do with less money if they can't.

 

[jaydogsmooth1]

Yea and you have more money that supports football. I don't see FSU suffering anything by being in the ACC until the GOR is near expiration. If anything it can be a massive opportunity to dominate the same way Bowden did for so long.

As a practical matter the money isn't as big a deal as you think because the large majority of your competitors (the ACC members) will have less than you do. It's all relative. If you're any good you beat the crap out of them and get many many playoff opportunities and the like. It's the reverse of RU. On paper we'll get the same money as OSU/Michigan etc...from the B10 but do we have anywhere near the resources of those schools? No. Doesn't mean we should leave the B10, but the point is there is opportunity for FSU to win big things and it won't have to do with less money.

It's both a short and long term play in regard to staying elite
Short term they're fine - dominate a league with a bunch of misfits playing football while still excelling in other sports

Long term it's very problematic, and likely, catastrophic
You simply cannot fall that far behind your peers if you wish to compete and stay elite

 

[WhichReligionIsRight]

 

[MADHAT1]

McMurphy says the B1G adding FSU doesn't make financial success.
I disagree and feel FSU bringing in the Florida TV market makes membership a plus while adding a fertile recruiting ground as wEll .
As for disruptive, I doubt FSU would be even a minor irritant in the B1G because of the stratus of some B1G programs would put them in the middle class level , while in the ACC FSU was one of the top dogs and what they do/did made the people running the ACC worry more over FSU's actions than if Wake Forrest did the same.