In regard to point 2, the preference is the B1G then SEC. That's not debatebale
But the main goal is $$$
If that means going to the B12 and only being 5-10 million behind the SEC/B1G, they'll do it in a heartbeat
Need out of the ACC immediately
OT: The official ACC all things thread
- Thread starter JayDogSmooth
- Start date
But the main goal is $$$
If that means going to the B12 and only being 5-10 million behind the SEC/B1G, they'll do it in a heartbeat
Need out of the ACC immediately
For sure the B10 is their target and will do everything they can to get in.
Especially how Sankey keeps dogging FSU in public.
But i can see the B10 wanting to have a clearer picture on ND before committing to others. Which might result in a temporary home for FSU outside the P2. I believe UNC is the number 2 pick since SEC really wants them. But a Florida school in my opinion is 3rd target. I would go for both Miami and FSU. But i see others prefer different.
There's no love lost between the FSU and the SEC, the beef has been going on for over 3 decades
In regard to the B1G, they're smart and will do what's financially best for them
It's ND and the rest really; although UNC is a big-time brand that I assume would be coveted by both leagues
If the B12 rumors are true, I'd definitely be on board w/it as long as the money is right
$$$ is all it comes down to, and although I'd much prefer PWay, Ann Arbor, Madison, and Columbus to Aimes, Lubbock, Stillwater, Lawrence, etc., the goal is to get out of the ACC yesterday for the sake of football and the entire athletic department
The B12 just distributed sightly under 40M for its full members. The ACC distributed 45M to its 14 full members. The ACC distributed 700M to its members with 480 coming from tv.
Some projections put the B12 in the vicinity of up to 50M/yr when then new deal kicks in 2025/26 when adding in the CFP deal, etc... The ACC will also get a bump from the CFP deal and ACCN distribution in the new states. Like I said the ACC is either somewhat in front or just about par. Whatever it shakes out to be, whether the gap is ahead or behind...it's essentially negligible in both directions and not enough to move an ACC school out of a conference, especially one that's not a geographic fit.
I don't agree that Clemson/FSU will move to the B12 or go indy. They might be causing a big stink but I don't see them leaving without it being the SEC/B10.
I also don't see the B12 giving unequal revenue sharing, it didn't exist for Texas/OU (outside of LHN and similar networks) so I wouldn't expect it at all for FSU or anyone else. Plus why would B12 schools do that knowing that it would really be just a temporary home for their ultimate goal into a P2. No different than the ACC now having no motivation to give in knowing eventually they will leave anyway whenever the GOR stuff resolves, be it through litigation or expiration. Kowtowing to a school is a pointless endeavor as you see with Texas/OU, USC/UCLA or Miami back in the BE days. They will leave you regardless if its in their best interests.
I think if FSU and Clemson can add 5M per school to the overall contract. I think Brett Yormark can convince the B12 teams to only accept 2M more, give 3M each resulting in FSU and Clemson getting 15-20M. Pretty sure B12 believes that if they can make the ACC so weak, that give more windows to them making them more money in the long term by eliminating the competition, even if FSU is only there for 4-10 years.
Suck up the unequal revenue for more money anyway.
To quote Jeff Cameron... "the Big 12 would have to give FSU a billion dollars a year" for them to enter the conference
He's saying that in jest, but it's either under the assumption unequal revenue sharing will happen (highly unlikely), or bringing in a trio of FSU/Clemson/Miami would bump up the $$ per year significantly.
Add ND into the mix (no idea if that's even remotely possible), and it's even more $$ per year
FWIW, my guys are still saying B1G/SEC, and are dismissing B12 as rumors
Who knows what's true at this stage
How the Aggies looking this year?
It's too bad that Jimbo thing didn't work out...Neither did Sumlin...RC Slokium...or anyone really...ever.
At least your baseball coach stayed on board after that heartbreaking loss in the championship
Truly a man of his word, sticking around Aggieland and not succumbing to the temptation of coaching Big Brother in Austin
I know, I know...It's hard to believe
By all accounts, College Stadion is on par with Bora Bora. Tahiti. Maybe even the Maldives.
And the fans... completely normal!
Not a cult...not weird...not strange in the least bit!
You have a golf clap for me as well ????
I make two assumptions here. One the networks run the show, and two they want to maximize $$$$ - they don't give a crap about the schools or the athletes.
In my opinion FSU not getting into the playoffs was a false flag for E$PN to extract then top teams from the ACC and put them in the $EC and BIG 12. E$PN has $$$$ ties to both leagues.
Think of this as a layoff. How do you keep the best teams/properties in your portfolio, and ditch the dead weight? Break up the ACC. Let the remaining ACC teams and league file lawsuits. Big East found out how that went.
$EC and B1G both saying they won't get involved unless ACC ceases to exist. This is PAC-12 part two.
6-8 ACC teams to BIG 12, UNC to $EC or B1G for sure. Maybe one or more of the remaining AAU's to B1G. There will be a battle over NC and Virginia markets. Would $EC be satisfied with NC State or Dook, and Va Tech vs UNC and UVa?
Cut loose: Cuse, WF, BC, Cal, SMU and whoever $EC and B1G don't want. Save money. Spend it on $EC and Big 12.
I don't think $EC, B1G nor Big 12 will let ND park their olympic sports. Big East again - maybe. I think ND being "forced" to B1G.
Hopefully this will be over in the next couple of years.
In my opinion FSU not getting into the playoffs was a false flag for E$PN to extract then top teams from the ACC and put them in the $EC and BIG 12. E$PN has $$$$ ties to both leagues.
Think of this as a layoff. How do you keep the best teams/properties in your portfolio, and ditch the dead weight? Break up the ACC. Let the remaining ACC teams and league file lawsuits. Big East found out how that went.
$EC and B1G both saying they won't get involved unless ACC ceases to exist. This is PAC-12 part two.
6-8 ACC teams to BIG 12, UNC to $EC or B1G for sure. Maybe one or more of the remaining AAU's to B1G. There will be a battle over NC and Virginia markets. Would $EC be satisfied with NC State or Dook, and Va Tech vs UNC and UVa?
Cut loose: Cuse, WF, BC, Cal, SMU and whoever $EC and B1G don't want. Save money. Spend it on $EC and Big 12.
I don't think $EC, B1G nor Big 12 will let ND park their olympic sports. Big East again - maybe. I think ND being "forced" to B1G.
Hopefully this will be over in the next couple of years.
PAC would have been around but not with USC and UCLA. Larry Scott would have taken the offer after screwing up PAC12 Network endeavor without partners (EsPN/Fox). USC especially wanted no part of taking a deal that would have them fall further behind their perceived peers (OSU, Mich, GA, Bama, Tex) by getting revenue at the same level with Or St, WAZZU and other B12 schools. USC was no different than Tex in how they looked at most of their conference mates and probably held PAC12 leaders to the fire on a commitment to the conference. The PAC12’s death would have been slower with just USC/UCLA leaving and a deal that would have guaranteed $25-40MM per remaining members. USC wanted no part of that.
GO RU
I just don't get it. All this hand wringing to jump from one conference making $45 mil. to another conference making $40 mil.. Now sure, there will be a bump per team if FSU and Clemson join the Big 12. But with a 16 team conference or more it's not like the addition of these two is going to sweeten the pot by $20mil. per team. And even if it did, which would be a miracle they'd still be far behind.
It has nothing to do with
theyre not jumping conferences for equal or less money
ND is the big prize
North Carolina being a blue blood in basketball makes them a desired pick-up and the second choice because of that..
TAM is overrated, but has a State the B1G could use and the type of support that makes it worth considering
FSU is a notch below TAM in desirability to become B1G ,in my point of view, but would be a good program for the B1G to have if a deal could be worked out (one not based on revenue received while an ACC member)
I say that because I'm guessing TAM's boosters are far more generous than FSU's and to get away from Texas in the SEC would support the Aggies taking a smaller cut of the pie ( for a few years) to go B1G than the Seminoles would
ND yes
UNC being second but is it b/c of bball, when fb runs the show? Could be
Aggie yes - I believe they have a bunch of big $$ boosters and robust NIL program. One thing they're not short on is money
What's being floated in the media is the B12 as a stopgap for a few years then B1G or SEC - not the worst thing as long as the money is better and somewhat comparable to the Big 2
Your scenario is not at all a good solution for ESPN.
They need live content to fill their cable channels and +.
Eliminating the dead weight of 5-6 schools would not make up for having to give raises to others, and losing the live games of those 5-6 schools plus 50% of the games of the schools that go to the B12 (they share that contract).
I can't see the Vitamin (B-12) Conference as a serious alternative to the ACC, money gained not worth the cost to leave the ACC.
But I could see the Big 12 being used as a possible destination while the B1G and FSU discuss entrance though ""unofficial" third party talks .
The B1G will be claiming there will be no expansion in the foreseeable future and FSU threatens to become a Vitamin all the while those talks are going on.
The entrance might depend on how much FSU is willing to give op in revenue sharing and the amount of years they will accept less ( starting low and increasing every year until a full share is given to them )
I tend to agree that UNC and UVA (or VT) are the prime ACC targets. They represent new, untapped markets - especially for the SEC.
I haven’t been paying as close attention lately but I don’t see anything being floated in the media with regards to the B12 unless you’re talking about typical internet and twitter rumor mongers. I don’t think any CFB mainstream media has said anything of substance with regard to the ACC schools and the B12.
Yeah I highly doubt the B12 would be a long term situation - just not enough teams of value to keep the revenue gap minimal
Either way, FSU isn't going through all of this not to be in the P2 - but money talks, and if the B12 money is there, at least temporarily, I could see it happening until things get squared away with either the B1G or SEC
A couple of mainstream guys have reported on it
It's not all that far-fetched pending the $$ is right and it's not a permanent thing
Got links or tweets from Thamel, Dellenger, McMurphy, anyone form the Athletic etc..
To me it is fairly far fetched because the money difference wont be enough and the geography isn’t favorable either.
That kind of thing only happens in desperation like the PAC and SMU to the ACC or WVU to the B12…as in essentially no reasonable alternative. Sitting in the ACC despite all the infighting is a perfectly reasonable alternative to the B12.
Not if the B12 money is right
Pate and a few others had pods on it
Again, not saying it’s happening - but it’s not completely unreasonable
I think its pie in the sky dreaming if you think the B12 money will be appreciably better, as in 15-20M, than the ACC. It has to be an appreciable gap to motivate a move, especially when the geography isn’t favorable.
Desperation is the other motivation and that doesn’t apply to FSU as they have a perfectly fine home comparable or better than the B12.
The only way the money would be significantly different is if he bought him a bunch of elite programs, so I have to be FSU, Clemson, UNC and possibly Notre Dame.
Otherwise, to your point point I don’t see how the money could be any different, or that much different in order to make a move
As an ACC member, which conference teams will become Oregon State/Washington State if the ACC ends?
LOL!!!!
What you are hearing now is a bunch of nonsense.
If FSU and Clemson go to the Big 12 they will be getting the same or less money than in the ACC.
If they lose the GOR the Big 12 will not want them because they will not be able to afford it.
The ACC will remain a P-4 Conference and is not going away.
FSU and Clemson options are shrinking as the B1G and SEC are backing away.
HAIL TO PITT!!!!
Last edited:
Notre Dame is going to give up independence to join the (distant) 3rd best conference? To play Cincy, USF, Kansas, Utah, Arizona State, Texas Tech, West Virginia, Houston, Iowa State etc? What do they have in common with those schools and who wants to watch any of those matchups? If ND wanted more money they'd join the BIG or SEC now.
Cuse BC and wake are finished regardless of what happens
If anything they'll have a little better opportunity than now to raise their profile whenever the time comes and FSU leaves. It's no different than what I've said about the remaining B12 members now that Texas/OU have left. As long as they're a P4 conference and have an essentially locked spot in the playoffs, it's an opportunity for teams that haven't raised their profiles to do so
Like I've said it's all relative and the majority of the competitors on their schedules will have the same resources. It doesn't mean they will seize the opportunity but it's there and it's a little easier if heavyweights are removed from the picture.
Re your last sentence: the semester I visited at UNC I frequently saw bumper stickers saying, "I root for UNC and anyone playing NC State!" That's much more the way UF and FSU fans regard each other than the way those fans view UCF and USF. If there is a little brother relationship, it's much more like the one between Cal and UCLA, two schools in the same system that are fierce rivals.
Last edited:
In the context of college athletics, IMO, Little Brother refers to 2 big schools in the same state who are rivals and often times, one team dominates
Bama - Auburn
Michigan - Sparty
Washington - Wazzuu
Horns - Aggies
Oklahoma - Okie State
UNC - NC State
Georgia - Georgia Tech
All prime examples with the first team listed big brother and the second team little brother
Examples of teams who appear equal either w wins or fan support
Clemson - South Carolina
UVA - VT
FSU - UF
USC - UCLA
Kentucky - Louisville (debateable)
PSU - Pitt (debateable)
Ole Miss - Miss state
Until the GOR is resolved in Court or through a Negotiated Settlement most things you hear now is just noise.
Cuse, BC and Wake will remain in the ACC which will remain a P-4 Conference with CFP participation.
If FSU and Clemson leave (not so sure now because of the lack of financial reward) they will be replaced with new teams who will assume their role as a dominant football power in the ACC.
If FSU and Clemson really want to significantly increase their financial circumstances, they should put more emphasis/resources into becoming an AAU Research University.
Rutgers NOW has a combined Medical School and is putting funding into building new facilities (Hospital etc) which will increase their opportunity for getting more Research Grants in the future. Have to have the facilities in place to attract Research Funding.
As an example, the National Institute of Health (NIH) distributes approximately $47 Billion for Medical Research each year (about $30 Billion per year to Medical Schools).
The Top 5 NIH research funding recipients in 2023:
University of Pennsylvania: $703 Million
Duke University: $701 Million
University of Michigan: $698 Million
Mass General Hospital: $675 Million
University of Pittsburgh: $658 Million
I am fine with Pitt playing at Acrisure Stadium (Club Seats are great) and investing $1.5 Billion for a new 17 Story Transplant Hospital on the Oakland Campus to be opened in 2026 and $250 Million for a new BioForge Facility in Hazelwood. Penn State is investing $750 Million for renovating Beaver Stadium. (7 Football Games per year).
Just sit back and let it all play out.
HAIL TO PITT!!!!
Last edited:
No, I’m not going to sit back and let it all play out - that’s how we got into this perdictament to begin with
FSU will not be falling 500 million dollars behind their peers
There’s been a standard of excellence set within the program that will not be compromised
The goal remains the same every year in regard to champuonships
State
Conference
National
Falling that far behind money wise kills any hope of remaining elite, and not just in football
We’ve worked too hard to become subpar
and refuse to accept mediocrity
Bobby didn’t go on the road to play anyone, anywhere, anytime for us to settle back where we were in the early 70’s
If FSU loses the GOR or negotiates for maybe even a 50% GOR reduction FSU would still pay Millions to leave the ACC, who will give FSU that money and additional funding to join a new conference.
At this point in time FSU must wait until issues are resolved unless they choose to lose a lot of money.
HAIL TO PITT!!!!
Panthergrowl posted in a thread about programs leaving the ACC for better paying conferences
>"The Top 5 NIH research funding recipients in 2023:
University of Pennsylvania: $703 Million
Duke University: $701 Million
University of Michigan: $698 Million
Mass General Hospital: $675 Million
University of Pittsburgh: $658 Million"<
was nice, and we can The University of Alabama at Birmingham (UAB) Marnix E. Heersink School of Medicine received over $600 million in research funding from the National Institutes of Health (NIH) and non-NIH-related sources in 2023.
But how does that make a difference in FSU finding a new home.
More and more the sports revenue a school might bring to the conference and booster generosity are becoming the main factors when a conference looks at programs as possible members..
University of Pittsburgh is a fine school, but I doubt their research funding would give them an edge over FSU when it comes to which program the B1G would take .
Just like UAB's research funding wouldn't bring on SEC membership over VT
>"The Top 5 NIH research funding recipients in 2023:
University of Pennsylvania: $703 Million
Duke University: $701 Million
University of Michigan: $698 Million
Mass General Hospital: $675 Million
University of Pittsburgh: $658 Million"<
was nice, and we can The University of Alabama at Birmingham (UAB) Marnix E. Heersink School of Medicine received over $600 million in research funding from the National Institutes of Health (NIH) and non-NIH-related sources in 2023.
But how does that make a difference in FSU finding a new home.
More and more the sports revenue a school might bring to the conference and booster generosity are becoming the main factors when a conference looks at programs as possible members..
University of Pittsburgh is a fine school, but I doubt their research funding would give them an edge over FSU when it comes to which program the B1G would take .
Just like UAB's research funding wouldn't bring on SEC membership over VT
Last edited:
If they waited, it will be 2036 and by that point they will be a minimum of a half billion dollars behind, and I have no shot of competing anytime in either of our lifetimes
Hence, the need to act now and hopefully settle soon, to get out from under the ACC albatross
LOL!!!!
I am not saying that Research Funding would give Pitt an edge in getting into the B1G.
I am saying I prefer to have Pitt spend more on facilities which would enhance their research capabilities and bring in more money for the University now and in the future.
Pitt brings in more Research Funding (better ROI) than the Sports Programs because they have the facilities to attract the Research Dollars.
Pitt's Research Funding exceeds most B1G Schools.
The difference in funding between the ACC and B1G may be $30/40 million per year which is actually small compared to annual research expenditure numbers we are discussing.
Attracting just one additional Research Grant could exceed that difference.
For Pitt better ROI for spending on research vs Sports.
HAIL TO PITT!!!!
Last edited:
