Of course nobody is getting fired now, I was only responding to the post saying the program is terrible because of the associate head coach and not the coach.
Happy St. Patty’s Day!
Rutgers men's soccer...Donigan...
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Happy St. Patty’s Day!
Donigan puts a minimum into the promotion of the program. (not sure he puts much effort into the other parts of the program either)
A real opportunity is being missed by the administration. Look no further then our wrestling program for an example of how it can be done.
There is no one behind the scenes running the program. Donigan now works for PDA south but that is a head scratcher too.
PDA South is not part of the academy system, his access to the top players will not come from the PDA South connection.
The volunteer coach on staff from PDA is not pulling any strings
The failures can be directly related to recruiting.
NY Redbulls and PDA are stocked with the best players in the country, they are both within 20 minutes of campus
3 Top PDA or NYRB academy players a year gets you into the top 20 annually
In my years at NY RB , I never saw DD at one practice
0 wins over the last 2 years in the Big Ten is beyond embarrassing
Rutgers is an easy place to win at in mens' soccer
A real opportunity is being missed by the administration. Look no further then our wrestling program for an example of how it can be done.
There is no one behind the scenes running the program. Donigan now works for PDA south but that is a head scratcher too.
PDA South is not part of the academy system, his access to the top players will not come from the PDA South connection.
The volunteer coach on staff from PDA is not pulling any strings
The failures can be directly related to recruiting.
NY Redbulls and PDA are stocked with the best players in the country, they are both within 20 minutes of campus
3 Top PDA or NYRB academy players a year gets you into the top 20 annually
In my years at NY RB , I never saw DD at one practice
0 wins over the last 2 years in the Big Ten is beyond embarrassing
Rutgers is an easy place to win at in mens' soccer
I see Dave Masur around often, I don’t know what you guys think of him, but he’d love to come home.
Literally almost anyone will be an upgrade. Earning a single conference victory will be an upgrade.
I don't dispute any of your points. but here's the thing...I trust Pat Hobbs. The man has shown me that he is very good at what he does. And so if he decided it wasn't the right move to fire DD last year, then I am going to trust that decision.
I will admit that I don't see a reason/rationale for keeping him...but again, I will defer to Hobbs as he has seemed to make all the right moves so far.
We shall see how this plays out...and whether or not that trust is warranted.
Zappa is that personal knowledge about Masur or just that you see him around; He is also the assistant AD at St. Johns so I am not sure what it would take to bring him back. I would take him in a heartbeat
He’s a friend of mine.
To get him you have to make him a legit offer.
He loves RU
Dave Masur is a great guy and has done great things as a head coach on the collegiate level. He is personable, a tireless recruiter and of course a Rutgers Grad.
The time to bring Masur back was when we hired DD and I think that time may have passed. As accomplished as he is, an older coach at this point is a bit of a gamble.
I believe that Masur is an AD at St Johns also. Masur's coaching style was pretty tough in his day, I don't know if he has mellowed a bit.
He would win for sure but I still believe that a younger guy would be the right move.
Rutgers soccer has the potential to be something special. The youth soccer culture in NJ is very much like the wrestling culture in NJ although it has exponentially more people to it.
I never understood the desire to travel on Labor Day Weekend to begin the season. We should be playing on Friday and Sunday at home on that weekend.
All of our players should be sent in pairs to all the Labor Day weekend soccer tournaments on Saturday.
In Rutgers warmups, set up a table, pass out schedules and sign posters.
Younger youth players will eat this up
The NJ Cup should be held every year on this weekend. Invite three each year from Seton Hall, Rider, Monmouth, Princeton, Saint Peters , NJIT and Rider.
A tournament like this would generate a ton of interest in the youth soccer community of NJ
The time to bring Masur back was when we hired DD and I think that time may have passed. As accomplished as he is, an older coach at this point is a bit of a gamble.
I believe that Masur is an AD at St Johns also. Masur's coaching style was pretty tough in his day, I don't know if he has mellowed a bit.
He would win for sure but I still believe that a younger guy would be the right move.
Rutgers soccer has the potential to be something special. The youth soccer culture in NJ is very much like the wrestling culture in NJ although it has exponentially more people to it.
I never understood the desire to travel on Labor Day Weekend to begin the season. We should be playing on Friday and Sunday at home on that weekend.
All of our players should be sent in pairs to all the Labor Day weekend soccer tournaments on Saturday.
In Rutgers warmups, set up a table, pass out schedules and sign posters.
Younger youth players will eat this up
The NJ Cup should be held every year on this weekend. Invite three each year from Seton Hall, Rider, Monmouth, Princeton, Saint Peters , NJIT and Rider.
A tournament like this would generate a ton of interest in the youth soccer community of NJ
Snowboarder-
I totally agree, every time I speak with him I think to myself he might be a bit to old.
I totally agree, every time I speak with him I think to myself he might be a bit to old.
What about Wandling from Benedict’s . . . Would be a jump up to collegiate but that team is run at a very high level.
I sense that nothing is going to happen in M Soccer until the B1G money is in; that’s two years away. Sure, ‘the damage will be done by then’, but our ability to really make a go of hiring a new person or a new staff is really hinged upon our ability to, ya know, actually pay for it. No sense in making a move and replacing with a lesser tier person when you can wait two years and make a stronger offer to a higher caliber coach/ assistants.
Day 143 of the Donigan hostage crisis...
That's pretty ridiculous, shortsighted and pathetic, if that happens, as we're talking about very little $.
Yep. Agree with you on that. We’re not talking football or basketball coaching $ here. No bankbreaking going on. Just wasting time I guess. Look at temple, they just hired a Maryland assistant to take over their program. That’s a proactive AD they have there.
This would have been a beautiful news item to read on the RU MSOC website:
http://owlsports.com/news/2017/12/21/brian-rowland-named-temple-mens-soccer-head-coach.aspx
http://owlsports.com/news/2017/12/21/brian-rowland-named-temple-mens-soccer-head-coach.aspx
In my opinion, making a move now would be making a move just for the sake of it and 'short-sided'. Consider this view point.
The difference between the right hire and wrong hire is not $50k a year. It's not likely $100k a year. It' probably much more, when you add in properly funding ass't coaches. The right coach that you want to lead this program is going to want money in their pockets AND money in their ass't coaches' pockets. he is also going to need that money to entice the best assistant coaches to join him on this project. I know that this may come as a shock to many, but the soccer world does, in fact, exist beyond the borders of New Jersey. There are TONS of great coaches and assistant coaches who would look at the cost of living in NJ, look at the proposed salaries being offered by RU, shudder, and stay where they are. OR go to another school where $$$ and cost of living make more sense. It's, like, a real thing.
So, right now, if you axe Donigan you're stuck with rolling the dice with XYZ replacement and probably making *another move* within five years because you hired the less expensive replacement for Donigan. That's a decent reason to sit tight, take what you get out of Donigan, and then have the full allotment of funding that the MILLIONS that is coming to RU in 2021 via the Big Ten contract and hire the right guy and the right assistants.
I hear you, for sure. You are right that hiring a new coach is more expensive than just the salary of that individual. There is the salary of the new staff, as you point out, and If it’s done right, you also need to factor in the cost of the actual national search too—which isn’t bankbreaking, but is significant. I guess I’m not so optimistic about the overall picture regarding this 2021 big ten windfall though. I’m sure most of you know these details better than I, but I was reading this https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.on...out-the-money-pat-hobbs-robert-barchi-big-ten
And the njcom piece by Seargent that is linked within the piece, and it seems like the financial picture in 2021 might be mitigated by internal Rutgers financial issues that have to do with Barchi’s dealings with the faculty council and the desire to reduce the commitment from academic student fees to athletics. It’s hard to completely follow because, as is often the case, a great deal of the picture is shrouded in confidentiality, but my point is, in terms of this discussion, holding off until the windfall to address Soccer may be kind of an empty hope/flawed plan. If there is such a degree of conviction about the windfall, on the other hand, then why not act now with a contract that goes through 2021 and is backloaded with higher yearly payouts once the windfall happens. I don’t think that there is time to sit and wait for more money to rescue the program. It is irrelevant in elite youth soccer circles. Other than a random Red Bull kid now and then and the PDA connection, who is coming to RU? Isn’t it odd that there has never been a union recruit or one from any of the NY academies? And the best N.J. kids are consistently going elsewhere. It just seems like another couple of years of the current situation may make things irreparable for some time. Who knows though, maybe Donigan has a great year and turns things around? Stranger things have happened I guess. I’m just not optimistic.
I wouldn't wait, as the money is peanuts, and we're making things much worse by not making a move. Below is a sample of some of the top coaches' and B1G coaches' salaries that I could find. Outside of Maryland, nothing is high or should force us to wait.
Maryland (FY2016):
Sasho Cirovski $602,000 (won 2005 and 2008 national titles)
Assistant Brian Rowland $65,000
Assistant Scott Buete $55,000
Total Mens Soccer Coach's Salaries: $722,000
Total Assistant Salaries: $120,000 Avg. Assistant Salaries: $60,000
Source: https://maryland.247sports.com/Board/67/Contents/Maryland-Athletics-Coachs-Salaries--53195515
Indiana (FY2018)
Head coach: Todd Yeagley: $216,487 (won 2012 national title)
Associate head coach: Brian Maisonneuve: $88,610
Assistant coach Kevin Robson: $48,960
Source: https://www.hoosiersportsreport.com...rsity-coaching-salaries-for-2018-fiscal-year/
UVA (FY2015)
George Gelnovatch $125,700
(won 2014 and 2009 national titles)
Source: http://cs1110.cs.virginia.edu/files/uva2015/george-gelnovatch
tOSU (FY2016)
$220,473 - Ohio State men's soccer, John Bluem
Source: http://www.cleveland.com/datacentral/index.ssf/2016/03/50_ohio_college_head_coaching.html
UNC (FY2016 or 17)
Carlos Somoano $125,000 (won 2011 national title)
Assistant Grant Porter $47,390
Source: newsobserver.com
Michigan (FY2018)
Chaka Daley $149,000
Source: http://www.umsalary.info/deptsearch.php?Dept=athletics
Wisconsin (FY2017)
Men's head coach John Trask $151,263
Source: http://host.madison.com/wsj/sports/...cle_0ee25325-318c-52ee-8ee5-aec494841e65.html
These numbers are helpful, but you’re neglecting to include a) our numbers b) our comparative cost of living index and c) the numbers that would be compelling for a coach AND his assistants to come and live in Central Jersey. That’s a huge factor: you have to convince somebody to come coach here. There are two types: the ones you want and the ones you get. With our current, real, actual dollars available, we are in a tough spot to get the one we want and will more likely get the one we get. Where this comes back to bite us is that we are not the only program in the nation and there are other soccer programs that they can go to (or stay at) that are in a better financial spot right now.
Regardless, we are CLEARLY sitting tight right now. Clearly. The evidence is that no move has been made. CLEARLY. We have our coach for the time being. Moreover, are we really ‘making things worse’? Unless we plan on cutting the program in a couple of years, or sports cease to exist, I think we will be OK waiting a little while longer to make a smarter, more well-funded move. It’s sort of a stick with the devil you know type of situation.
Regardless, we are CLEARLY sitting tight right now. Clearly. The evidence is that no move has been made. CLEARLY. We have our coach for the time being. Moreover, are we really ‘making things worse’? Unless we plan on cutting the program in a couple of years, or sports cease to exist, I think we will be OK waiting a little while longer to make a smarter, more well-funded move. It’s sort of a stick with the devil you know type of situation.
I didn't neglect anything, as I've posted numerous times on here that Donigan makes $140,000, which is peanuts. Entire staff 2017 salaries:
Dan Donigan $140,000
Dave Beck $66,285
Tyler Stakiwicz $35,000
Bryant Knibbs $37,485
Total staff: $278,770
We really don't have another $150,000-$300,000 to use to stop this trainwreck? Sad.
The athletic department just paid $500,000 to UCLA to get out of the 2 game series with them. Evidently our HC who preaches competition wasn't ready to compete against Chip Kelly and his Bruins. Forget about holes, we like to dig ourselves craters to get out from. The soccer program should be at the very least a Top 20 team year in and year out.
The devil we know is killing us. Don’t think making a move can make the situation worse. You are right that CLEARLY we aren’t making a move this year—and that’s sad. I can’t honestly say that I have confidence in Hobbs’s commitment to MSOC based on this inaction and lack of vision—from what I can see.
Based on that, it's going to cost more than that to get a competent staff.
Yes, RU soccer SHOULD be a top-20 program year in, year out. In truth, not many programs are top-20 programs year in, year out. It’s a stark minority, annual top-20 status. And Rutgers has not been one of those in nearly two decades, so clearly the challenges are complex.
Again: it comes down to priorities. If you deem addressing the soccer program NOW and only NOW over tending to one of two revenue generators in the department, then great. Knock yourself out. Clearly this athletic department made a different decision and has opted to feed a different beast.
As for football not playing UCLA, it has everything to do with the idea that Ash does not want to play west coast teams. Ever travel over three time zones? Now, imagine doing that and then strapping on some pads a day after landing. It’s not good. Ash got to live it first hand with the Wazzu and UW games and feels that they are better off scheduling teams closer to home. For what it’s worth, all of those west coast games were scheduled with different FB coaches and different AD’s at the helm.
Just like people consistently post that we are screwed, I will keep coming back here and reminding everyone that our athletic director is not a bozo...he knows what he's doing.
So if we still have our coach there's a reason for it ( and to be clear I have no idea what that reason is either but that doesn't mean I then default to assuming he's a bozo).
But carry on believing that mens soccer is the ONLY sport hobbs doesn't give a sh!t about.
So if we still have our coach there's a reason for it ( and to be clear I have no idea what that reason is either but that doesn't mean I then default to assuming he's a bozo).
But carry on believing that mens soccer is the ONLY sport hobbs doesn't give a sh!t about.
No one has posted that Hobbs is a bozo. We all love Hobbs. He's been tremendous, but he missed the boat here.
Yea no one is saying Hobb's is a clown or doesn't have a reason why he didn't make a move. But there comes a time where you have to make a move for the good of the program. Obviously he isn't making a move this year which is a shame because the program slides further into irrelevancy and makes it that much harder for the next guy to recruit. How many times has this school done this? Just look at basketball and how hard a climb it is. Does anyone think the top players in this state want anything to do with this program with this coach and the current state of affairs? It's over here. Even if Donigan were to miraculously pull out a .500 record, he's just proven that he's not the right fit here.
Youre suggesting hes a bozo by saying he missed the boat.
Otherwise whats your reasoning for repeating its a hostage crisis?
At least own you suggesting the AD is a bozo/moron/incompetent...whatever
Or use different language ... otherwise your suggestwd intent seems very aligned with hobbs being a bozo
See above . I've got no problem debating whether or not he made the right move here.
But the repeated suggesting that it's a simple fix and he just refuses to do it suggests he's a bozo.
Wrong. I'm not. I can disagree with him not making the move and like everything else he's done, so stop trying to make it something more.
Thank you! Especially for the “2 decades” comment. Many here forget that the program Reasso left behind was a mere “shell” of what he had originally built.
Anyone advocating and demanding change better be donating to make that happen.
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