B12 Expansion Is A GO

mosito

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Boise state and Colorado st are silly in my opinion... Houston make no sense for big12

Cincy UCF BYU are my pics
 

RUScrew85

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UConn just popped a Woody. How disappointed might they become ?
No one is taking those losers. What do they bring to the table? Men's hoops cheated and is back to average. FB is pathetic. B12 need women's hoops schools? I don't think so.
 

Leonard23

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Yeah, but the metro area for those cities are just as big as the entire state of Idaho and Utah. You can't just discount Houston, Cincinnati and UCF as if they don't have fans and impact the viewership in their cities. Who had the NY Times article that gave the breakdown of fans for each school in their TV market? Can we bring that back to compare some actual numbers.

Cincinnati metro: 2.1 million
Houston metro: 6.6 million
Orlando metro: 2.3 million
Idaho (entire state): 1.7 million
Idaho (entire state): 2.8 million
http://thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/20...ege-football-fans-and-realignment-chaos/?_r=0



According to SI:

The leaders in the clubhouse for Big 12 expansion remain BYU, Cincinnati and Connecticut. The next tier includes South Florida, Central Florida, Memphis, Colorado State, Houston, Boise State and Tulane. If the league does add four schools, there’s really no standout candidate for that fourth slot. (Houston has the best program and television market of available schools, but there’s still some hesitancy within the state of Texas to allow the Cougars to use the Big 12 to potentially leap over current members). Schools like Temple, San Diego State and Northern Illinois don’t really have a chance, but will give it a shot anyway. “They’re going to open it up like an auction,” one Big 12 source said. “They don’t want it to be like they’re out there soliciting schools.”

And Gary Parrish of CBS tweeted that Memphis big donors are very confident.

I'm terms of TV DMA size:

#9 Houston 2,373,700 (Houston)
#19 Orland/Daytona Beach 1,489,710 (UCF)
#28 San Diego 1,055,030 (SDSU)
#30 Hartford/New Haven 944,250 (UConn)
#34 Salt Lake City 884,900 (BYU)
#36 Cincy 868,900 (Cincy)

#50 Memphis 636,140 (Memphis)
 

Scarlet_Scourge

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For what is coming out of the actually Big 12 and not this board, I would say that BYU and Cincy will get in 1st.

If they stop at 12 that will be it.

BYU screwed up this thing so many times, this will be their final chance. They are the biggest brand with the biggest fan following and the biggest stadium and they have a very good football program that can hang and beat the teams in the Big12. The Big12 is full of religious schools so they can work around the whole Sunday thing. They are used to dealing with that.

Cincy - Pretty solid in all sports, big market but overshadowed by OSU and they are in the Mid West (Big12 used to have 5 Mid West schools, now they have 3). They also will make life easier for WVU and vice versa. They recently upgraded their stadium as well.

Those are the two biggest and strongest brands not in a Power 5 conference.

Things go downhill pretty fast after that.

Memphis - Terrible football, great MBB, Big money backers but they don't add much to the Big12. They only hope is that they can buy their way into a Power 5 slot.

Uconn, - Putrid football, great MBB. A non player in this market. Uconn only hope is that can sucker the Big 12 into thinking that they matter in this market.

USF - Great market.... terrible football and ok MBB. No name school and was a scam in the Big East, no one can be dumb enough to still think they actually bring anything of worth anymore right? It will be pretty funny if they get added.

UCF - Great market.... the end. That had one good run in football and nothing before that or since. Terrible MBB. Big Commuter school. Like Uconn their best bet is the sucker the Big 12 into thinking that anyone in Florida actually gives a sheet about any school not named UF, FSU and Da'U.
 

Abro1975

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"UCF - Great market.... the end. That had one good run in football and nothing before that or since. Terrible MBB"

Sounds like Rutgers when Delaney shrewdly picked RU. Plus UCF opens up the fertile Florida recruiting grounds. And Destination city w big airport.
 
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MozRU

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Three things

1. Houston - You either keep TEXAS HIGH SCHOOL TALENT IN YOUR CONFERENCE OR YOU LET THE PAC12 IN. The B12 better tell Texas to stand down and take Houston.

2. Memphis. They have major money behind them and have shown they will do whatever it takes to win.

3. The B12 should go right to 16 teams

Locks to get in:
Houston
Memphis
Cincy
BYU

They should look at
**UCF (But geographically INSANE)
**USF (If you take UCF might as well make it worth your while in flying in the soccer team to play someone else on that road trip)
**Northern Illinois
**CSU


B12 current foot print
 

AreYouNUTS

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This 16-team thing is going to turn expansion into a joke. Memphis? Tulane? Colorado State? I mean I'll take ANY of the 3 over Yuke-On, don't get me wrong, lol!
 
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greenknight

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The only conference that UConn can go to us the ACC. There is no way the B1G is going that far NE w/o anyone for them to play locally outside of WVU
 

mdh2003

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If they haven't already, I would expect uconn to spread like a $10 whore for their Texas overlords.
 
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cubuffsdoug

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Houston in The B12 would be a waist and a way for B12 cock blocks everyone.
That could be the reason Houston met with the Pac 12 reps.
This 16-team thing is going to turn expansion into a joke. Memphis? Tulane? Colorado State? I mean I'll take ANY of the 3 over Yuke-On, don't get me wrong, lol!
As much as I'm against expanding leagues to 16 teams because you'll never play every member during your time in college, but it's likely going to happen. There is 6 degrees of separation. Example: Arizona and Arizona State was part of the WAC where they were rivals of Utah. Before UA and ASU joined the WAC schools those schools went by name Mountain State Conference. Mountain State Conference member Utah's biggest league rivalry was with Colorado and Colorado State. Now 4 of the 5 schools I've just mentioned are a part of the Pac 12. Hell, Montana left the Pacific Coast Conference (Pac 12) and ended up in the WAC. Yes, that same WAC league as UA, ASU, and Utah. Here's one more. Nebraska had been trying to get into the B1G since 1910. They scheduled games against several B1G members with the hope it would help their cause. In fact, Iowa held dual membership in the B1G and Missouri Valley Intercollegiate Athletic Association (Missouri Valley Conference) with Nebraska, Iowa State, Kansas, Kansas State, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State and Missouri Those teams seem very familiar... oh, 7 of the 8 original Big 8 members. This is the natural state of college football that takes place every decade as team jump ship to meet their needs and desires.
 

cubuffsdoug

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The only conference that UConn can go to us the ACC. There is no way the B1G is going that far NE w/o anyone for them to play locally outside of WVU
If you go to UConn's site (boneyard.com) that is what they are saying, it's to the ACC and they are pretty sure about it. They believe ND will be forced to join the ACC with the recent Big 12 announcement and the ACC will need a 16th member (UConn) to complete the move. Plus, they are saying the ACC wants to put the final nail in the coffin of the B1G/Rutgers for the rights to the NYC market.
 

srru86

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If there's a bad decision to be made, the Big 12 will be right there to make it.
from the article "One thing is certain: this is the Big 12 we’re talking about. No amount of craziness is off the table here."
Or with apologies to Abba Eban they "never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity."
 
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ru8081

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I don't think that the B12 will make the same mistake again. They should have taken Louisville instead of WVU. Can't see them taking UCONN.
 

RURM85

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Oh, there's a difference. As bad as CU has been, CSU best teams have always played the second class citizen role with the Denver media. It been hard to get excited about CSU playing Wyoming, Air Force and Utah State vs. Nebraska, Oklahoma or Texas back in the Big 8/Big 12 days. Even now in the Pac 12 CU has Oregon, USC and Stanford visiting Boulder while CSU has who? CSU doesn't have the same appeal kind of like UConn to the B1G when comparing them to Rutgers.
OT - All good and fair points. No question about the much tougher Pac12 Conference compared to a MWC schedule. Also, the Rocky Mountain Showdown overall has been lopsided.

The key words in my sentence are "at this time" meaning very recent. Colorado State has played in 3 bowl games the past 3 seasons, including a 10 wins season 2 years ago,although getting blown out by the Utes in the bowl game that year. I can't remember the last time Colorado made a bowl game, certainly not while in the Pac12.

Watched the Rocky Mountain Showdown last year. I root for the Buffs. Went in thinking that Colorado would dominate because of their play makers. IIRC Colorado State was the better team in the 1st half with Colorado dominating the second half, leading to a late TD by CSU to send the game into OT. The game was hard fought and very competitive. A fun game to watch and both teams looked competititve.

I'm rooting for the Buffs and am hoping they're on the right path. I'll try to catch as many games as possible this upcoming season time permitting.
 
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RU#1fan

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I just forgot about BYU. Boise St. brings an entire states market. Same can't be said for teams like Houston, Cincinnati or UCF. Nobody cares about those schools outside of alumni mostly and geographically Boise makes more sense than others.
I like Boise St. a lot but their "entire state" does not mean much. Idaho has about as many people as Middlesex County....about 700,000. Not a media juggernaut .
 

cubuffsdoug

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OT - All good and fair points. No question about the much tougher Pac12 Conference compared to a MWC schedule. Also, the Rocky Mountain Showdown overall has been lopsided.

The key words in my sentence are "at this time" meaning very recent. Colorado State has played in 3 bowl games the past 3 seasons, including a 10 wins season 2 years ago,although getting blown out by the Utes in the bowl game that year. I can't remember the last time Colorado made a bowl game, certainly not while in the Pac12.

Watched the Rocky Mountain Showdown last year. I root for the Buffs. Went in thinking that Colorado would dominate because of their play makers. IIRC Colorado State was the better team in the 1st half with Colorado dominating the second half, leading to a late TD by CSU to send the game into OT. The game was hard fought and very competitive. A fun game to watch and both teams looked competititve.

I'm rooting for the Buffs and am hoping they're on the right path. I'll try to catch as many games as possible this upcoming season time permitting.
The pecking order was established a long time ago in Denver and CU was the chosen one. CU leads the series 63-22-2. CSU best stretch in the series has been in the last few years. CSU has won 4 of the last 10 games. In the state of Colorado, CU is the blue blood while CSU is the upstart. CSU is trying to gain respect the same way Rutgers fans question idiots in the media and regional schools (SU, BC, UConn, etc.) of why do you still believe in the myth (Rutgers forever losing) when Rutgers has gone bowling 9 of the last 11 years.

Btw, I hate CSU like I hate SU and PSU, so there might be a little hate in my response to the answer.[winking]
 
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RU_Goo

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I personally think Delany is going to scoup Texas and Oklahoma before the Big 12 can act, and the rest of the Big 12 will merge with the ACC and / or Pac 12, things are going to happen real quick

but if I was the commish of the big 12, id add colorado state, ucf or usf, memphis and byu.
 

rutgersguy1

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from the article "One thing is certain: this is the Big 12 we’re talking about. No amount of craziness is off the table here."
Or with apologies to Abba Eban they "never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity."
They already have when they passed over Louisville when they and WVU were having a tug of war over the 10th spot. The B12 could have just taken them both. It's a better overall AD than most of the other options on the table now. Still might have needed one more team but at least it would have been a solid fill for open spot.

As of now I see it as wide open, couldn't really tell you who the favorites (even though perception might suggest otherwise) are and it also depends on how many they want to accept 12 or 14.

I also wouldn't say it suggests Texas/OU leaving down the line. It's a possibility but I wouldn't say a lock. Originally, I thought whenever the LHN ran its course, Texas would leave but it occurred to me they could do some sort of tiered revenue sharing on any new media deals in the future similar to what the BE did at one time. They and OU have the leverage because without them the conference falls apart. I think it's safe to say Texas likes to rule the roost too and they can do that in the B12 but not so much in other conferences. So even when the LHN expires, they don't necessarily have to fall behind the rest financially in that scenario and they get to stay put. I'd think that scenario makes the probability of staying equal to that of leaving.
 

rutgersguy1

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I personally think Delany is going to scoup Texas and Oklahoma before the Big 12 can act, and the rest of the Big 12 will merge with the ACC and / or Pac 12, things are going to happen real quick

but if I was the commish of the big 12, id add colorado state, ucf or usf, memphis and byu.
For that to happen then we'd have to see a challenge of the GOR. Even if successful would that resolve itself that quickly?
 

RU_Goo

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For that to happen then we'd have to see a challenge of the GOR. Even if successful would that resolve itself that quickly?
GOR doesnt mean anything at this point, UMD left after that was in place, they just had to pay a lot, i dont think texas or oklahoma is going to let a GOR stop them from a move like this.
 

rutgersguy1

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If you go to UConn's site (boneyard.com) that is what they are saying, it's to the ACC and they are pretty sure about it. They believe ND will be forced to join the ACC with the recent Big 12 announcement and the ACC will need a 16th member (UConn) to complete the move. Plus, they are saying the ACC wants to put the final nail in the coffin of the B1G/Rutgers for the rights to the NYC market.
What is the reasoning ND being forced to join? What does the B12 expanding have to do with ND joining the ACC? If they do I agree UConn is the logical choice for 16 but what makes them so sure it would happen any time soon?
 

rutgersguy1

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GOR doesnt mean anything at this point, UMD left after that was in place, they just had to pay a lot, i dont think texas or oklahoma is going to let a GOR stop them from a move like this.
Actually the ACC didn't have a GOR in place when Maryland left, just an exit fee which was increased before they officially left IIRC. I think they had to pay a figure higher than the old exit fee but lower than newly approved one.
 
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RU_Goo

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What is the reasoning ND being forced to join? What does the B12 expanding have to do with ND joining the ACC? If they do I agree UConn is the logical choice for 16 but what makes them so sure it would happen any time soon?
ND will be forced to join a conference as everyone keeps expanding. if all the conferences go to 16 teams, and lock into 9 conference games or more a season, how is ND going to make themselves an indy schedule to make themselves relevant? playing army, navy, idaho, etc. there wont be any P5 teams for them to schedule, however the ACC gave them that sweetheart deal so they can sustain indy for now, but eventually they will be forced into somewhere
 

cubuffsdoug

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What is the reasoning ND being forced to join? What does the B12 expanding have to do with ND joining the ACC? If they do I agree UConn is the logical choice for 16 but what makes them so sure it would happen any time soon?
I think it more of the UConn fans dreaming, then reality. The sense is ND doesn't want to be left out of the Playoffs. The Big 12 is beneath them. The B1G has moved on. Unless the ACC can give ND more money than they make from NBC, it doesn't make sense to join a league. For a team like UConn on the outside looking in, they need a partner to join a P5 conference to justify their inclusion.
 

rutgersguy1

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ND will be forced to join a conference as everyone keeps expanding. if all the conferences go to 16 teams, and lock into 9 conference games or more a season, how is ND going to make themselves an indy schedule to make themselves relevant? playing army, navy, idaho, etc. there wont be any P5 teams for them to schedule, however the ACC gave them that sweetheart deal so they can sustain indy for now, but eventually they will be forced into somewhere
I actually have said that I think ND will eventually join a conference (likely the ACC) down the line but I couldn't say how far out that would be. In 5 years, in 20 years I don't know. Does the B12 expanding push up the time table? I don't know, it's still a P5. If the playoff ever go to just conference champions that's when I could see it but is that on the near horizon?
 

RU_Goo

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uconn could have been an ACC target but they went with pitt and cuse, the rumor was that BC and fsu blocked uconn....which makes sense because fsu wants a football first program and bc doesnt want that competition there. uconn cut a lot of corners to build their athletics and it came back to bite them...they arent going to the big, but they may go to the acc in the future. the big 12 wont take them, too far
 

RU_Goo

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I actually have said that I think ND will eventually join a conference (likely the ACC) down the line but I couldn't say how far out that would be. In 5 years, in 20 years I don't know. Does the B12 expanding push up the time table? I don't know, it's still a P5. If the playoff ever go to just conference champions that's when I could see it but is that on the near horizon?
honestly, i remember speaking to a lot of higher ups within RUs AD at the time when we were trying to get into a conference, what i remember is all these conferences will eventually be going to an NFL set up. pods of teams, internal playoffs, possibly 16-20 team conferences so yea, eventually ND will join but not until the last second. could be our lifetimes, maybe not, but one day
 

wcicci

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ND will be forced to join a conference as everyone keeps expanding. if all the conferences go to 16 teams, and lock into 9 conference games or more a season, how is ND going to make themselves an indy schedule to make themselves relevant? playing army, navy, idaho, etc. there wont be any P5 teams for them to schedule, however the ACC gave them that sweetheart deal so they can sustain indy for now, but eventually they will be forced into somewhere
Initial reports make it sound like ND will stay independent or have to join ACC for all sports. I doubt that. If/when ND joins a conference, the TV $ all change. I hate ND, but It's reality. If ND joined ACC for all sports, UConn would not be 16th team. That would be a game changer and ACC would get a much bigger name. Bigger than BIG poaching Maryland
 

RU_Goo

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Initial reports make it sound like ND will stay independent or have to join ACC for all sports. I doubt that. If/when ND joins a conference, the TV $ all change. I hate ND, but It's reality. If ND joined ACC for all sports, UConn would not be 16th team. That would be a game changer and ACC would get a much bigger name. Bigger than BIG poaching Maryland
I hate to admit it but ND is such a big fish that they could probably tell the ACC who they want to bring, could be someone they want to keep history with, like Navy
 
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cubuffsdoug

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honestly, i remember speaking to a lot of higher ups within RUs AD at the time when we were trying to get into a conference, what i remember is all these conferences will eventually be going to an NFL set up. pods of teams, internal playoffs, possibly 16-20 team conferences so yea, eventually ND will join but not until the last second. could be our lifetimes, maybe not, but one day
I don't like the pod setup. The NFL is the NFL because there are a limit amount of teams (32). College football has more teams with long history with one another, so by going to pod you kill tradition. There are teams out there who will fight change because they would have to give up a lot of history to make the pod work. To make the pod system work you have to give up your identity for more money. Yes, most of the college teams are chasing the dollar, but I have to believe only to a point. Your identity is your word, your worth, etc.
 

RU_Goo

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I don't like the pod setup. The NFL is the NFL because there are a limit amount of teams (32). College football has more teams with long history with one another, so by going to pod you kill tradition. There are teams out there who will fight change because they would have to give up a lot of history to make the pod work. To make the pod system work you have to give up your identity for more money. Yes, most of the college teams are chasing the dollar, but I have to believe only to a point. Your identity is your word, your worth, etc.
meh , gotta look out for yourself or you could be left out in the cold. we were rivals with lehigh for a long time or something like that lol
 

cubuffsdoug

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You know what's really fun about this whole thing, reading the sites of certain schools who continue to throw Rutgers under the bus as an inferior program and playing a major role in conference expansion for money. We expect that from Syracuse and UConn, but to read message boards for schools like Iowa State and Kansas State mocking us is a joke. Several ISU fans mocked Iowa at Rutgers expense. They made claims that Rutgers is a nobody and an easy game for Iowa. Yet, in the same thread some fans claimed playing potential Big 12 candidates (Cincy, Memphis, USF & UConn) would make for a harder schedule then Iowa's current one.:eek: This is the same Rutgers program that beat the crap out of Iowa State a few years ago. The same goes for Kansas State. Btw, Rutgers has more all-time total wins for football and higher winning percentage than either ISU or KSU. Talk about throwing rock while living in a glass house.:chairshot: