Get used to this: Steve Pikiell Team’s, High Floor, Low Ceiling

[AshCatchEm]

These threads are eerily similar to my 2017 threads saying that Ash was a dead man walking and would never get it done at RU. I had pitch forks turned my way and was called an idiot up and down. Now I'm not saying the same about Pike. I really think that just making one change on his staff will work wonders for RU and revolutionize our game planning on offense into the 21st century. But if Pike is stubborn and doesn't make changes on offense, people are going to slowly start seeing the same thing I with others have been seeing.

You're talking about a guy as dead man walking who could easily win big ten coach of the year still.

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

You're talking about a guy as dead man walking who could easily win big ten coach of the year still.

i'm not at all. I'm saying that he really needs to make a change on his offensive philosophy and staff this off-season. Everything else is fine.

However, if he doesn't make that change then yes, I will say that I think the clock is ticking before the fan base starts to say to themselves, this ceiling is better than sucking but we can do better.

 

[AreYouNUTS]

i'm not at all. I'm saying that he really needs to make a change on his offensive philosophy and staff this off-season. Everything else is fine.

However, if he doesn't make that change then yes, I will say that I think the clock is ticking before the fan base starts to say to themselves, this ceiling is better than sucking but we can do better.

If we had one pure shooter, running the same O, we'd (likely) have 3 more wins. Maybe more. .

 

[Scangg]

See I disagree about offensive talent. I think there is offensive talent on the team, I just think it's being held back by our lack of sets that we run. Do we run motion with any intent? Are we running horns with any intent?

Look at how Iowa generates Luka Garza good post looks, aka put him in position to catch the ball with his guy buried on the block as opposed to 8-10 feet out like which happens with myles regularly. We have guys who can shoot 3's and nail catch and shoot 3's but we really don't generate many catch and shoot opportunities, our guys are often putting up contested 3's. If Caleb, Yeboah, Geo or Ron catch and are open, their %'s would go way up from 3, they can nail open 3's in catch and shoot situations, we just don't generate those type of looks. Put it this way, if RU and Iowa traded rosters, if our guys just traded jersey's, Fran would have our guys beating the piss out of his guys by an ugly ugly margin imo.

I really agree on running these plays with "intent". Ok, so technically we are "running an offense" at times but people are just going through the motions. The weave at the top is lackadaisical at best. I also agree we don't do a good enough job of getting players touches where they are comfortable and can score. I don't think we exploit mismatches enough either. There is obviously room for improvement on offense. Just don't agree at all about the ceiling. I do agree about bringing on an offensive minded assistant and let them run the offense. Heard a while back Hobbs runs the offense. Might be time to change that up.

 

[blockm2]

See I disagree about offensive talent. I think there is offensive talent on the team, I just think it's being held back by our lack of sets that we run. Do we run motion with any intent? Are we running horns with any intent?

Look at how Iowa generates Luka Garza good post looks, aka put him in position to catch the ball with his guy buried on the block as opposed to 8-10 feet out like which happens with myles regularly. We have guys who can shoot 3's and nail catch and shoot 3's but we really don't generate many catch and shoot opportunities, our guys are often putting up contested 3's. If Caleb, Yeboah, Geo or Ron catch and are open, their %'s would go way up from 3, they can nail open 3's in catch and shoot situations, we just don't generate those type of looks. Put it this way, if RU and Iowa traded rosters, if our guys just traded jersey's, Fran would have our guys beating the piss out of his guys by an ugly ugly margin imo.

It is just hard for me to disagree more. Fran is an extremely mediocre coach. This is his 4th straight year with a sub 100 defense on KenPom. Rutgers has guys that have defensive talent and hustle, but they have almost no offensive skill especially compared to your average top 25 team.

What evidence do you have that the Rutgers roster is full of offensive skill? I mean it certainly isn't their recruiting rankings nor would it seem to be any data gathered from games played over their careers.

 

[RutgersMO]

The style that pike plays is a style that gives you a really high floor because you play balls to the wall every possession every night and that always gives you a chance in the case a team has an off night or doesnt have their legs. However, him totally ignoring offense and analytics and still treating the game like it’s the 80’s will keep the ceiling very low, in fact I think this year right now is just about the ceiling.

the reason we go into long scoring droughts is because when you dont run an offense the only thing you can rely on is your guys winning one on one matchups and often times just playing one on one leads to lower % shots later in the shot clock. If teams prevent us from getting out and running this happens alot.

love pike, think hes a great guy but he really needs to just do some soul searching and realize offensive basketball isnt his thing and he needs to bring in an offensive mind as an assistant. Ideally its done this off-season so he can take his next step as a coach and RU’s next step as a program

High floors,low ceiling ...what about the walls?

MO

 

[RU-05]

I really agree on running these plays with "intent". Ok, so technically we are "running an offense" at times but people are just going through the motions. The weave at the top is lackadaisical at best. I also agree we don't do a good enough job of getting players touches where they are comfortable and can score. I don't think we exploit mismatches enough either. There is obviously room for improvement on offense. Just don't agree at all about the ceiling. I do agree about bringing on an offensive minded assistant and let them run the offense. Heard a while back Hobbs runs the offense. Might be time to change that up.

Given the results we have already seen I don't think a change is warranted in any way.

If we make the tourney and we then fire coaches I don't think we could make a worse decision.

 

[RU-05]

High floors,low ceiling ...what about the walls?

MO

Walls have been overlooked far too long.

 

[NewJerseyHawk]

Iowa (to me) runs the most offense in the league and clearly spends the least amount of time on remedial basic defense. There's a reason why Ron Harper's 2 best games are at Iowa....actually Issa Thiam had his 2 best games vs Iowa 2 years ago at the RAC, and last year at Iowa.

I consider that horrible coaching when basic scouting reports allow shooters to get shots off....and Issa Thiam was a truly 1 dimensional player....if that's the coaching style of all focus on offense and no defense, it depends on what you think wins....no focus on defense is a losing formula for college basketball.....

 

[biazza38]

I didn’t read this a whole thread, but you just compared it to a thread about Ash so I’m out lol

 

[RU-05]

Iowa (to me) runs the most offense in the league and clearly spends the least amount of time on remedial basic defense. There's a reason why Ron Harper's 2 best games are at Iowa....actually Issa Thiam had his 2 best games vs Iowa 2 years ago at the RAC, and last year at Iowa.

I consider that horrible coaching when basic scouting reports allow shooters to get shots off....and Issa Thiam was a truly 1 dimensional player....if that's the coaching style of all focus on offense and no defense, it depends on what you think wins....no focus on defense is a losing formula for college basketball.....

I think this also shows that teams also have identities, and if you are an energy team that clamps down on D and on rebounding, then you will often sacrifice some offense in the process. Iowa does the opposite.

 

[blockm2]

I think this also shows that teams also have identities, and if you are an energy team that clamps down on D and on rebounding, then you will often sacrifice some offense in the process. Iowa does the opposite.

Iowa almost doesn't even try on defense

 

[RuWishBone]

And interestingly, Rutgers' offensive efficiency in Big Ten play this year is better than it was last year per KenPom and this despite the Big Ten having many more good defenses than last season.


I get criticism of Rutgers' offense. It is not good. But what I don't get is pretending it is a schematic issue. There is very little offensive talent on the team, especially when it comes to having players that can shoot the ball. The way they survive on offense is being running in transition as often as possible and crashing the glass for second chance points. That's it. There is no scheme that is going to get them to make open shots, especially when teams know they can sag off the line and clog the lane.

Do you think that defenses are playing at the same level they did last year against us? Teams need to play better D now to beat us so they player harder. we are not slouches any more. I take and being up the level of play

 

[blockm2]

Do you think that defenses are playing at the same level they did last year against us? Teams need to play better D now to beat us so they player harder. we are not slouches any more. I take and being up the level of play

I cannot pretend to read the minds of teams and how hard they may or may not be playing. Just pointing out that Rutgers team wide offensive efficiency has improved in conference play this year compared to last and they are doing so in a conference that has far more good defenses in it than last season and in a college hoops season where team wide efficiency is way down from previous (I assume from moving the 3 pt line back).

 

[Mbash93]

Well here's my question I guess. Has Ron Harper gotten better since March of 2019? Has Caleb McConnell gotten better since March of 2019? Has Geo Baker gotten better since March 2019? Has Montez gotten better since March 2019? Has Myles gotten better since March 2019? If so, what has gotten better about their games?

I think Montez has definitely gotten better, when he takes a 3pt this year I think he has a good chance of making them.

Johnson I think we all agree on has taken a step forward this year.

Baker is pretty similar to last year.

McConnell and Harper have shown slight improvements but remain inconsistent as players

 

[S.W.A.I.N]

I think Montez has definitely gotten better, when he takes a 3pt this year I think he has a good chance of making them.

Johnson I think we all agree on has taken a step forward this year.

Baker is pretty similar to last year.

McConnell and Harper have shown slight improvements but remain inconsistent as players

Oddly, Baker's athleticism has taken the biggest leap forward...

 

[tjb]

Good podcast with Fran Fraschilla and Jordan Sperber of Hoop Vision.

Takeaways include: you have to pick just a few things to teach that become your identity, and offense is harder to teach than defense.

 

[bethlehemfan]

If you don’t think our players get better and are being developed you’re a flat out imbecile.

 

[phlop87]

Like the rec teams you played for?

come on. Vegas. He didn’t just play on them, He dominated on them

 

[NickRU714]

I think Montez has definitely gotten better, when he takes a 3pt this year I think he has a good chance of making them.

Johnson I think we all agree on has taken a step forward this year.

Baker is pretty similar to last year.

McConnell and Harper have shown slight improvements but remain inconsistent as players

I think Montez actually has the lowest 3pt shooting % on the team.

 

[Vegas pj]

High floors,low ceiling ...what about the walls?

MO

Kyk's beer tent doesn't have walls - it allows all the hot air to escape.

 

[S.W.A.I.N]

Lol what?? Baker could barely dunk freshman year and now he is posterizing people. That dunk against Indiana was big time athleticism. He didnt have that when he first got here. His athleticism has improved more than anyone else's. It would be the shining example

Lol what indeed...thats exactly what I said. His athleticism has taken a bigger leap than the rest of his game. Slow down there champ.

 

[Scangg]

Lol what indeed...thats exactly what I said. His athleticism has taken a bigger leap than the rest of his game. Slow down there champ.

My bad misread! You're spot on!

 

[TODDB33]

When will you enter the poster transfer portal?

Maybe he can apply for a job in the athletic dept as a roving coach. He seems to know all about football game planning, coaching and recruiting and now he is telling anyone who will listen, based on his self perceived knowledge of how to run a program, what an established coaching staff needs to change to get better. And all this coming from his vast knowledge of all sports in general.

 

[TODDB33]

We dont run an offense. The only offense we run is motion, horns and pick and roll. Stuff elementary school girls rec teams run

We don't run an offense. The only offense we run is...... Well Kyk what is it - do we or don't we run AN OFFENSE

 

[TODDB33]

I'll say yes to every one of those. Stats say so. Teams record says so.

The answer is so obvious it's a pretty odd question.

And don't forget coaching staff says so also. But what do they know

 

[dpwhite]

I think Montez actually has the lowest 3pt shooting % on the team.

Wrong... before last night he actually had the highest 3 pt shooting percentage in conference on the team, just beating Akwasi by .004.

 

[RUInsanity]

Is Pete Carril still alive?

Seriously.....we have progressed every year under Pike after decades and decades of being at the bottom of the NCAA heap.....have not sniffed the tourney in over 40 years and have a good young core and all the OP can obsess about is the fanbase getting fat and happy if we get 4 straight NIT appearances and Pike's his coaching ceiling. Cant make this stuff up even if you tried.

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

Wrong... before last night he actually had the highest 3 pt shooting percentage in conference on the team, just beating Akwasi by .004.

Not gonna start a separate thread on this but theres some influential people in tez’s ear who have encouraged him to transfer. Not saying id def happens but its in the cards. Really not happy that he rarely ever plays final 5 mins

 

[RUtrumpet92]

Flame bait OP and it worked very well.

If our ceiling is a team that breaks the top 25 and is projected to be in the NCAAs with six games to go, I will take that every season. No reason to think we cannot improve in future seasons, too, especially if we bring in someone like Cliff.

 

[RU89]

Not gonna start a separate thread on this but theres some influential people in tez’s ear who have encouraged him to transfer. Not saying id def happens but its in the cards. Really not happy that he rarely ever plays final 5 mins

You're a narcissist. There are no influential people in his ear and even if true you wouldn't know about it. Your need for self importance is embarrassing. Go away. You offer nothing of value even though in your mind you're the most valuable poster in this boards history.

 

[Vegas pj]

Not gonna start a separate thread on this but theres some influential people in tez’s ear who have encouraged him to transfer. Not saying id def happens but its in the cards. Really not happy that he rarely ever plays final 5 mins

There you go again. First it was Jr. Heading to the NBA after this season. Then it was Powell didn't have a concussion. Now "influential people in Tex's ear". When does it ever end?

 

[RU-Choppin-Ohio]

There you go again. First it was Jr. Heading to the NBA after this season. Then it was Powell didn't have a concussion. Now "influential people in Tex's ear". When does it ever end?

It ends when he stops drinking and drunk posting.

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

You're a narcissist. There are no influential people in his ear and even if true you wouldn't know about it. Your need for self importance is embarrassing. Go away. You offer nothing of value even though in your mind you're the most valuable poster in this boards history.

Valuable and prominent. U guys can shoot the messanger all you want but ill add you to my ignore list now

 

[blockm2]

Valuable and prominent. U guys can shoot the messanger all you want but ill add you to my ignore list now

Here's the thing with high major hoops. Literally every player on the team is going to consider going pro early or transferring. All of them. Every year.

If you are Montez Mathis, you have the lowest O-rating on the Rutgers roster amongst perimeter players other than Young and you are not nearly as good as him defensively. Your shooting numbers inside, outside, and at the line are all terrible for a guard. Your assist rate is horrible. Where exactly are you going to go? You probably wish you were better, but until you show it on the court probably not worth complaining about.

 

[RU89]

Valuable and prominent. U guys can shoot the messanger all you want but ill add you to my ignore list now

Valuable and prominent. The narcissist adds another positive adjective to describe himself. Get help my friend.

 

[Groz]

Not gonna start a separate thread on this but theres some influential people in tez’s ear who have encouraged him to transfer. Not saying id def happens but its in the cards. Really not happy that he rarely ever plays final 5 mins

Even if it is true, what good is it that you wrote it on our message board at this time? Just to say, "look at me, I have inside info!"

You try to act like you are a fan of Rutgers, but you really act like a moron most of the time with your posts.

Best of Luck,
Groz

 

[dpwhite]

Kyk's posts are here act like it's the final year of the Eddie Jordan era and the wheels are falling off rather than the most exciting season in years and no matter the outcome of the season, another step in the build. Maybe people are in Montez's ear, maybe not. But the apocalyptic tone of your posts are over the top.

 

[RUInsanity]

Even if it is true, what good is it that you wrote it on our message board at this time? Just to say, "look at me, I have inside info!"

You try to act like you are a fan of Rutgers, but you really act like a moron most of the time with your posts.

Best of Luck,
Groz

The only one he is a fan of appears to be himself.

 

[blockm2]

Kyk's posts are here act like it's the final year of the Eddie Jordan era and the wheels are falling off rather than the most exciting season in years and no matter the outcome of the season, another step in the build. Maybe people are in Montez's ear, maybe not. But the apocalyptic tone of your posts are over the top.

Michigan never faced a drought like Rutgers but did have a decade in the darkness of never sniffing a tourney appearance. And I will say if as a Rutgers fan you can't simply bask in the enjoyment of this season you will never be happy watching it. The seasons of exceeding expectations and having increasing program success are about as good as it gets as a fan. As your program gets better and you get burdened with higher expectations, you get less joy out of each win and it simply turns more and more to relief of avoiding disappointment.