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No. 16 Rutgers Wrestling Hosts No. 21 Illinois Friday Night at Jersey Mike's Arena / Match Thread

Illinois will be favored at 125, 133, 165, and 285
RU will be favored at 141, 149, 174, 184, and 197
Toss Ups: 157

Like most of the B1G duals it's going to come down to performance at 149, 157, and 174. If we take care of business at these weights we should win by a solid margin.

Clark was majored by Braunagel earlier this year 13-0, so hopefully we can see some improvement and keep it to a decision there.
 
Going to be a tough meet.
It could be. A lot depends on who they send out. Looking at the probables from their website, we are favored at 141, 149, 184 and 197 for sure. We should be slightly favored at 174 and 157 (just don’t know what we get from our guys at 157 and 174). 125 is a slight lean Illinois. At 133, 165 and HWT, Illinois is favored. Now if Mike Carr wrestles for Illinois at 149, they will be favored there but he isn’t listed. Dylan Duncan also might limit 141 to a decision for Rivera. We need to wrestle well but we should win a minimum of 5 matches with bonus potential at 141, 149, 184 and 197. Illinois has solid wrestlers at 184 and 197 but our guys are wrestling very well there. We would have to wrestle very poorly to lose this one. I don’t see where they get bonus points and we should win some of the close ones and get some bonus points as well.
 
Wrestlestat also ranks Olivieri, a true freshman, 4th in the country at 133 with three losses to the #6, #22 and #90th ranked wrestlers according to them. If all goes right, we could win 7 bouts but that is unlikely.
 
Is new transfer Edmond Ruth wrestling for Illinois? If so that'll make things interesting at 174.
 
Wrestlestat has us 25-9....are they really that far off ?
WS has Oliveri beating Byrd which is very unlikely. Plus it has us winning all of the swing matches at 149 & 157 and Clark keeping to a 1 point loss (even though he lost to him 13-0 two weeks ago). Any of those go the other way and it’s a much closer dual.
 
Wrestlestat also ranks Olivieri, a true freshman, 4th in the country at 133 with three losses to the #6, #22 and #90th ranked wrestlers according to them. If all goes right, we could win 7 bouts but that is unlikely.
Not sure how the 4 ranking makes any sense rn..
 
Not sure how the 4 ranking makes any sense rn..
It doesn’t. The algorithm (I imagine) needs a ton of data to even things out. An example. Alvarez lost to Carter Bailey (pinned but really med df). Olivieri beat Bailey 16-3. Alvarez beat Phillipi in the past. Olivieri lost 2-0 to Phillipi. Phillipi beat Dayton Fix in the past. Somehow, the limited data bolsters up Olivieri due to margin of victory and cumulative records of others and others who have beaten others. Really doesn’t make sense to me. Wrestlestat is an amazing resource for looking up wrestlers and wrestling results. I have never used it’s predictions because they more often then not seem to make no sense especially in regards to head to head match ups ie. Phillippi who beat Olivieri is ranked #6 and Olivieri is #4.
 
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It doesn’t. The algorithm (I imagine) needs a ton of data to even things out. An example. Alvarez lost to Carter Bailey (pinned but really med df). Olivieri beat Bailey 16-3. Alvarez beat Phillipi in the past. Olivieri lost 2-0 to Phillipi. Phillipi beat Dayton Fix in the past. Somehow, the limited data bolsters up Olivieri due to margin of victory and cumulative records of others and others who have beaten others. Really doesn’t make sense to me. Wrestlestat is an amazing resource for looking up wrestlers and wrestling results. I have never used it’s predictions because they more often then not seem to make no sense especially in regards to head to head match ups ie. Phillippi who beat Olivieri is ranked #6 and Olivieri is #4.
Here's why... when WS started, it took a lot of matches (18, maybe?) for the algorithm to allow a good freshman to move up the ranks. I think Retherford might have been a glaring example. People complained, WS listened, and they tweaked the algorithm to move new wrestlers up faster. Did they go too far? Perhaps. Off the top of my head, though, I can't think of any young guys that shot up the rankings, then dropped way back off.

I think Alvarez's rank history is pretty reasonable, and he jumped to 7 after 9 weeks as a freshman.



 
Yeah Olivieri’s ranking makes no sense but an algorithm is always going to have errors when ranking someone with little sample size. You’re either going to under rank a stud or over rank someone else
 
Here's why... when WS started, it took a lot of matches (18, maybe?) for the algorithm to allow a good freshman to move up the ranks. I think Retherford might have been a glaring example. People complained, WS listened, and they tweaked the algorithm to move new wrestlers up faster. Did they go too far? Perhaps. Off the top of my head, though, I can't think of any young guys that shot up the rankings, then dropped way back off.

I think Alvarez's rank history is pretty reasonable, and he jumped to 7 after 9 weeks as a freshman.



If that is the case then they made it worse. As a freshman, Zain was undefeated up until Big 10’s. In his first 15 matches alone he beat several ranked guys including Logan Steiber. He finished the year with 3 losses, 2 to Steiber and one to Mitchell Port. As stated above, Joey O. has 3 losses already and zero comparable wins. I think he will be great but nothing in his current resume puts him at #4 or ahead of a guy Phillipi, that he lost to head to head and is benefiting from his prior victories and losses.
 
If that is the case then they made it worse. As a freshman, Zain was undefeated up until Big 10’s. In his first 15 matches alone he beat several ranked guys including Logan Steiber. He finished the year with 3 losses, 2 to Steiber and one to Mitchell Port. As stated above, Joey O. has 3 losses already and zero comparable wins. I think he will be great but nothing in his current resume puts him at #4 or ahead of a guy Phillipi, that he lost to head to head and is benefiting from his prior victories and losses.
I'm not following you. Without Zain's WS rank history, I'm not sure where he was ranked through his freshman season. It's been 8 years, and I can't remember what I had for lunch.

I think that the gripe was that Zain had all of those wins, yet wasn't moving up the WS rankings very quickly. In Olivieri's case, for the most part, when his ELO was low, he beat some guys and lost to some guys with higher ELO scores. Beating a guy with a higher score really helps, while losing to a guy with a higher score doesn't hurt. Then, since he has moved up to a higher ELO, he hasn't lost to anyone with a much lower ELO, which really hurts.

I agree that he likely jumped a little too high, too quickly, but I also think that with the wins he has had, and the close losses to some top guys, some people would be questioning why he was wasn't higher, like the old algorithm would've done. No biggie, just trying to give a sense of how the score came about.
 
With Turley being out this dual will really come down to 149, 157, and 174... Need to win all 3 unless Rivera or Bulsak can get big bonus points (TF or Fall)
 
It could be. A lot depends on who they send out. Looking at the probables from their website, we are favored at 141, 149, 184 and 197 for sure. We should be slightly favored at 174 and 157 (just don’t know what we get from our guys at 157 and 174). 125 is a slight lean Illinois. At 133, 165 and HWT, Illinois is favored. Now if Mike Carr wrestles for Illinois at 149, they will be favored there but he isn’t listed. Dylan Duncan also might limit 141 to a decision for Rivera. We need to wrestle well but we should win a minimum of 5 matches with bonus potential at 141, 149, 184 and 197. Illinois has solid wrestlers at 184 and 197 but our guys are wrestling very well there. We would have to wrestle very poorly to lose this one. I don’t see where they get bonus points and we should win some of the close ones and get some bonus points as well.
Agree..Mike Carr is out for season and I would be pretty surprised if Duncan opens his season with 1st match against Rivera and his 2nd match Sunday against Iowa- Eriemen...Could be wrong
 
He looked really goo, but have no idea who his opponent was.
He seemed very good on top

Reicin RSFR 11 -12 record, 3rd season at Illinois
 
It’s a shame that Poz is in the same graduating class as Brooks and Ferrari because he’s a national champ caliber talent but might still be behind two all timers depending on weight class
 
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