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OT: Electric vehicles

BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap said:
Traditional media is in freefall. X is the closest thing we have to a free speech platform and it's popularity is skyrocketing. More and more people are waking up to the fact that our government, corporations, and mainstream media have become one giant conglomerate. Controlling the narrative is the objective, not truth. Anyone who disobeys is censored, marginalized, and labeled a "conspiracy theorist". I can tell you don't go into much depth with your research into Musk. Probably just read headlines. Your list above is absurd.
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LOL. I mean you can literally see the tweets Musk put up. I watched the segment of the Musk show where he had Alex Jones on and Musk made one comment to Jones about what he did with Sandy Hook and then proceeded to let Jones re-write history about it without any real pushback.

The cynic in me says he does this not because that's really his belief system but rather he wants the clicks and views and believes any PR is good PR for X. I think he underestimated the pushback from major companies who advertised with Twitter but his logic is that eventually they will all come back as more and more users turn to X for entertainment, news, etc.
 
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BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap said:
Traditional media is in freefall. X is the closest thing we have to a free speech platform and it's popularity is skyrocketing. More and more people are waking up to the fact that our government, corporations, and mainstream media have become one giant conglomerate. Controlling the narrative is the objective, not truth. Anyone who disobeys is censored, marginalized, and labeled a "conspiracy theorist". I can tell you don't go into much depth with your research into Musk. Probably just read headlines. Your list above is absurd.
Click to expand...
Twitter and all other social media are fun and can be useful if approached with massive levels of skepticism. But more than any other aspect of the internet, social media is also extremely dangerous due to its capability for broadly disseminating disinformation/misinformation. Doesn't matter how popular it is. Popularity doesn't equate to goodness or correctness.

The rest of your post about corporations/government/media is filled with self-contradictory nonsense. There's a grand conspiracy between "corporations, the media and government" but Musk and his companies can be trusted not to be part of that conspiracy? Musk ensures they don't engage in narrative and always speak the absolute truth? 🤣

Not to mention that you're trying to sell a narrative here and while complaining about the conspiracists controlling the narrative. I mean, if they're controlling the narrative, why are you allowed to spread this counter-narrative of yours? 😀

Step back from the abyss.
 
Ty Webb said:
LOL. I mean you can literally see the tweets Musk put up. I watched the segment of the Musk show where he had Alex Jones on and Musk made one comment to Jones about what he did with Sandy Hook and then proceeded to let Jones re-write history about it without any real pushback.

The cynic in me says he does this not because that's really his belief system but rather he wants the clicks and views and believes any PR is good PR for X. I think he underestimated the pushback from major companies who advertised with Twitter but his logic is that eventually they will all come back as more and more users turn to X for entertainment, news, etc.
Click to expand...
They won't admit it to themselves, but it's easy to when people cross into cultishness about a public figure. It's when they form a weirdly emotional/illogical attachment to someone who doesn't even know they exist and then habitually ignore or deny the problematic stuff their leader says or does as if it doesn't exist, despite there being many millions of witnesses.
 
Ty Webb said:
LOL. I mean you can literally see the tweets Musk put up. I watched the segment of the Musk show where he had Alex Jones on and Musk made one comment to Jones about what he did with Sandy Hook and then proceeded to let Jones re-write history about it without any real pushback.

The cynic in me says he does this not because that's really his belief system but rather he wants the clicks and views and believes any PR is good PR for X. I think he underestimated the pushback from major companies who advertised with Twitter but his logic is that eventually they will all come back as more and more users turn to X for entertainment, news, etc.
Click to expand...
I read his posts, not editorials about them.

Elon isn't a court of law. Giving Jones his access back to X isn't an endorsement for what Jones says. You don't understand free speech.
Someone you hate must be allowed to say something you hate. That's how it works. Popular speech doesn't need protection.
 
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mildone said:
Twitter and all other social media are fun and can be useful if approached with massive levels of skepticism. But more than any other aspect of the internet, social media is also extremely dangerous due to its capability for broadly disseminating disinformation/misinformation. Doesn't matter how popular it is. Popularity doesn't equate to goodness or correctness.

The rest of your post about corporations/government/media is filled with self-contradictory nonsense. There's a grand conspiracy between "corporations, the media and government" but Musk and his companies can be trusted not to be part of that conspiracy? Musk ensures they don't engage in narrative and always speak the absolute truth? 🤣

Not to mention that you're trying to sell a narrative here and while complaining about the conspiracists controlling the narrative. I mean, if they're controlling the narrative, why are you allowed to spread this counter-narrative of yours? 😀

Step back from the abyss.
Click to expand...
So the Democratic party wasn't working directly with old Twitter to censor or amplify specific news stories and tweets?
 
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BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap said:
I read his posts, not editorials about them.

Elon isn't a court of law. Giving Jones his access back to X isn't an endorsement for what Jones says. You don't understand free speech.
Someone you hate must be allowed to say something you hate. That's how it works. Popular speech doesn't need protection.
Click to expand...
But an unchallenged interview is akin to advertising.
 
BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap said:
I read his posts, not editorials about them.

Elon isn't a court of law. Giving Jones his access back to X isn't an endorsement for what Jones says. You don't understand free speech.
Someone you hate must be allowed to say something you hate. That's how it works. Popular speech doesn't need protection.
Click to expand...

He could have given Jones his account back. But he went above and beyond that. He immediately then put him on a livestream and asked him to explain that "whole Sandy Hook thing" and then let Jones ramble off more lies and BS about what happened and his role in it with no pushback. Musk had a platform to call out Jones for the lies he was telling but Musk said nothing.

All he had to do was give Jones his account back. But as I said, the cynic in me says Musk did this for clicks and eyeballs.
 
RU-05 said:
But an unchallenged interview is akin to advertising.
Click to expand...
Ty Webb said:
He could have given Jones his account back. But he went above and beyond that. He immediately then put him on a livestream and asked him to explain that "whole Sandy Hook thing" and then let Jones ramble off more lies and BS about what happened and his role in it with no pushback. Musk had a platform to call out Jones for the lies he was telling but Musk said nothing.

All he had to do was give Jones his account back. But as I said, the cynic in me says Musk did this for clicks and eyeballs.
Click to expand...
You're both free to go on X and ask Alex Jones anything you'd like.
 
BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap said:
So the Democratic party wasn't working directly with old Twitter to censor or amplify specific news stories and tweets?
Click to expand...
Earlier, you posted about attempts by government/corporations/media to control the narrative. And now, only a handful of hours later, you're bringing up the single-most obvious example of Musk attempting to disseminate a obviously and laughably false narrative through his failed "Twitter Files" misinformation campaign?

You're actually building a stronger case against Musk than anybody else here.
 
Ty Webb said:
Like the look a bit better.

I assume similar dimensions, just a facelift to the exterior?
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Same dimensions.
Video goes over most of the upgrades. More than exterior. Biggest issues with previous M3 was ride comfort and cabin noise. Both addressed. Rear seats also improved. Front ventilated seats added, interior lighting, more trunk space , drivetrain efficiency.

Sound system also updated, which is nuts considering how good Tesla's sound system already is.
 
mildone said:
Earlier, you posted about attempts by government/corporations/media to control the narrative. And now, only a handful of hours later, you're bringing up the single-most obvious example of Musk attempting to disseminate a obviously and laughably false narrative through his failed "Twitter Files" misinformation campaign?

You're actually building a stronger case against Musk than anybody else here.
Click to expand...
Failed? Lol. The soaring popularity of X as a trustworthy news source says otherwise. So the emails were all fabricated? How about the censorship of Covid matters, Biden's laptop, Russian collusion, shadow bans, etc ...I could go on if I cared, but I have no interest in debating this with you.
 
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mildone said:
Earlier, you posted about attempts by government/corporations/media to control the narrative. And now, only a handful of hours later, you're bringing up the single-most obvious example of Musk attempting to disseminate a obviously and laughably false narrative through his failed "Twitter Files" misinformation campaign?

You're actually building a stronger case against Musk than anybody else here.
Click to expand...
More "misinformation", right?
 
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BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap said:
Same dimensions.
Video goes over most of the upgrades. More than exterior. Biggest issues with previous M3 was ride comfort and cabin noise. Both addressed. Rear seats also improved. Front ventilated seats added, interior lighting, more trunk space , drivetrain efficiency.

Sound system also updated, which is nuts considering how good Tesla's sound system already is.
Click to expand...

I am still waffling on the EV for our 2nd car. I was going to look at a Nissan Ariya because they were running some ridiculously stupid lease deals - 18 months, low payment. I could live with an EV for a year and half and see if I like it or don't. But Nissan's deals are regional specific and north jersey is in the program, southern new jersey is not.

Eventually I'd want something bigger like the Rivian but instead of spending all that money now, let me live with an EV for a bit and see if it's worth the investment at that time.
 
BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap said:
I read his posts, not editorials about them.

Elon isn't a court of law. Giving Jones his access back to X isn't an endorsement for what Jones says. You don't understand free speech.
Someone you hate must be allowed to say something you hate. That's how it works. Popular speech doesn't need protection.
Click to expand...
Your love for QAnon and extreme right wing ideology is eroding away your common sense. When Musk took over twitter, he refused to give Alex Jones his account back because of his involvement with the Sandy Hook murders. Once twitter starting loosing all kinds of advertisers and became a failing entity that is worth a fraction of what Elon paid for, he realized that the most faithful followers were right wing nut jobs and now he is courting Alex Jones back (despite Alex Jones not showing any remorse for spreading conspiracy theories surrounding Sandy Hook). Why was free speech not enough to give Alex Jones his account 3 years ago, but suddenly now is the reason to give him back his twitter account is the question you should be asking? Elon Musk has become obsessed with money and has lost his way. You can try to spin it whichever way you want, but the truth is what it is.

Elon Musk is no champion of free speech. he is just another in a long line of people (Trump, Ramaswamy, etc) who have found a way to siphon and grift money from gullible right wingers like yourself.

now if you want to talk about Tesla, we can continue.
 
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Ty Webb said:
I am still waffling on the EV for our 2nd car. I was going to look at a Nissan Ariya because they were running some ridiculously stupid lease deals - 18 months, low payment. I could live with an EV for a year and half and see if I like it or don't. But Nissan's deals are regional specific and north jersey is in the program, southern new jersey is not.

Eventually I'd want something bigger like the Rivian but instead of spending all that money now, let me live with an EV for a bit and see if it's worth the investment at that time.
Click to expand...
At the moment, Tesla is by far the best EV out there with Rivian a distant second. A little disappointed that Tesla has not made more advances in the auto driving arena especially given the tremendous lead it had a few years ago. Waymo has caught up to Tesla and in some ways surpassed it. Tesla needs to switch the focus back to innovation and advancing technology. It has become too much of a car company.
 
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jtung230 said:
You do understand what preliminary injunction means right? Look up Terrance Shannon Jr on Illinois basketball team. Yes, more misinformation.
Click to expand...
That's a pretty lame comeback. That preliminary injunction is significant. It's another wound on the party that purportedly once stood for free speech. Now they are the party of weaponizing corporations, the courts and their current control of the government to maintain their control over the government. Banana republic level stuff. Let's avoid derailing this thread, and I ain't gonna waste my money or time on the CE board arguing with people who are stuck or influenced by one-sided media or blinded by party loyalty. We are headed to another election where the two major party choices suck worse than the other. Yet the party in control is afraid of a viable third party candidate.
 
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rurahrah000 said:
At the moment, Tesla is by far the best EV out there with Rivian a distant second. A little disappointed that Tesla has not made more advances in the auto driving arena especially given the tremendous lead it had a few years ago. Waymo has caught up to Tesla and in some ways surpassed it. Tesla needs to switch the focus back to innovation and advancing technology. It has become too much of a car company.
Click to expand...
By what standards? Yours? Those are pretty rich declarations without any basis. Rivian. Ha ha. Don't sleep on what the legacy auto companies are doing with EVs, particularly Hyundai and Kia. And the Ford F150 Lightning hands down blows away the competition in pickup trucks. The weak point for now is the app and the software, and the huge question for Ford generally is their commitment to EVs.
 
Knight Shift said:
By what standards? Yours? Those are pretty rich declarations without any basis. Rivian. Ha ha. Don't sleep on what the legacy auto companies are doing with EVs, particularly Hyundai and Kia. And the Ford F150 Lightning hands down blows away the competition in pickup trucks. The weak point for now is the app and the software, and the huge question for Ford generally is their commitment to EVs.
Click to expand...
Yes, my standards. There are no official and reliable standards available to quote.
 
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BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap said:
Failed? Lol. The soaring popularity of X as a trustworthy news source says otherwise. So the emails were all fabricated? How about the censorship of Covid matters, Biden's laptop, Russian collusion, shadow bans, etc ...I could go on if I cared, but I have no interest in debating this with you.
Click to expand...
It’s good that you don’t want to debate it. The facts don’t support your narrative.

Also, read more closely. I never said Twitter failed.
 
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jtung230 said:
This will help sales. 7500 is a lot of money to front. However, I think a lot of people will be pissed when they realize they didn’t fully qualify for the full amount.
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Why did you refer to the 7500 as a "POS" credit. I have lost track due to lack of interest/need. Is the credit now means tested based on income, or on the total price of the vehicle? Have said before that I feel conflicted on this. Seems the wealthy are getting a tax break on very expensive vehicles. On the flip side, if one believes EVs are saving the world from environmental catastrophe, then the credit is helping to foster a worthwhile societal goal, much like many other tax policies, which people will often disagree on.
 
Knight Shift said:
Why did you refer to the 7500 as a "POS" credit. I have lost track due to lack of interest/need. Is the credit now means tested based on income, or on the total price of the vehicle? Have said before that I feel conflicted on this. Seems the wealthy are getting a tax break on very expensive vehicles. On the flip side, if one believes EVs are saving the world from environmental catastrophe, then the credit is helping to foster a worthwhile societal goal, much like many other tax policies, which people will often disagree on.
Click to expand...
Point of sale. Rather than putting the money out yourself then getting it back on taxes, dealers can take it off the price at the time of sale.
 
Knight Shift said:
Why did you refer to the 7500 as a "POS" credit. I have lost track due to lack of interest/need. Is the credit now means tested based on income, or on the total price of the vehicle? Have said before that I feel conflicted on this. Seems the wealthy are getting a tax break on very expensive vehicles. On the flip side, if one believes EVs are saving the world from environmental catastrophe, then the credit is helping to foster a worthwhile societal goal, much like many other tax policies, which people will often disagree on.
Click to expand...
There is an income limit and MSRP limit.
 
Rutgers Chris said:
Point of sale. Rather than putting the money out yourself then getting it back on taxes, dealers can take it off the price at the time of sale.
Click to expand...
Got it. POS has a more common meaning, at least in saltier circles. See below. Smart to give it back at the time of sale. We were quite happy to claim $15,000 in tax credits in 2022 when we purchased a Plug-in Hyrid and a full EV. Anything to give less of our money to the government is a good thing.
jtung230 said:
There is an income limit and MSRP limit.
Click to expand...
LOL. Thought POS meant Piece of Sheet. 🤦‍♂️
 
rurahrah000 said:
Your love for QAnon and extreme right wing ideology is eroding away your common sense. When Musk took over twitter, he refused to give Alex Jones his account back because of his involvement with the Sandy Hook murders. Once twitter starting loosing all kinds of advertisers and became a failing entity that is worth a fraction of what Elon paid for, he realized that the most faithful followers were right wing nut jobs and now he is courting Alex Jones back (despite Alex Jones not showing any remorse for spreading conspiracy theories surrounding Sandy Hook). Why was free speech not enough to give Alex Jones his account 3 years ago, but suddenly now is the reason to give him back his twitter account is the question you should be asking? Elon Musk has become obsessed with money and has lost his way. You can try to spin it whichever way you want, but the truth is what it is.

Elon Musk is no champion of free speech. he is just another in a long line of people (Trump, Ramaswamy, etc) who have found a way to siphon and grift money from gullible right wingers like yourself.

now if you want to talk about Tesla, we can continue.
Click to expand...
First time in my life I've ever been called a right winger. QAnon too! Elon obsessed with money?!? He's been working for free for the last 5 years at Tesla. Lol .. you're too much.
 
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