OT: For sale by owner ?

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

Yeah. I'd check on the sponsors of those "studies." I certainly understand that there are plenty of very capable sales professionals. But the basic challenge to the whole industry is that the fees are just too high for what's involved, opening the door for capable and motivated individuals to bypass the traditional broker approach to selling, or buying for that matter. I self-managed the sale of my home in Cary NC to an IBM procurement director 20 years ago. We both felt the same about the traditional sales channels. She did not work with an agent. Nor did I.

There’s a reason when I’m buy I ALWAYS try to buy fsbo’s. You can really bend them over and fvck em without them realizing theyre being fvcked.

Im not here to try to change your mind, that wont be possible. Im just hear to state the facts.

Dave Ramsey the head man of the cheap crowd says list with an agent. Most recent study shows identical fsbo’s sold for 11% less than those listed with an agent. It used to be 17% and im skeptical that it’s only 11% on this market thought itd be higher. Stats and Ramsey’s take here https://www.ramseysolutions.com/real-estate/for-sale-by-owner

 

[RUinPinehurst]

There’s a reason when I’m buy I ALWAYS try to buy fsbo’s. You can really bend them over and fvck em without them realizing theyre being fvcked.

Im not here to try to change your mind, that wont be possible. Im just hear to state the facts.

Dave Ramsey the head man of the cheap crowd says list with an agent. Most recent study shows identical fsbo’s sold for 11% less than those listed with an agent. It used to be 17% and im skeptical that it’s only 11% on this market thought itd be higher. Stats and Ramsey’s take here https://www.ramseysolutions.com/real-estate/for-sale-by-owner

I think your argument and choice of language are telling. Nothing personal. In any case, if a seller is knowledgeable, competent, and experienced, determining the real market value of any residential property is pretty easy, as is managing the sale without a broker.

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

I think your argument and choice of language are telling. Nothing personal. In any case, if a seller is knowledgeable, competent, and experienced, determining the real market value of any residential property is pretty easy, as is managing the sale without a broker.

I agree on both.

1) finding the price isnt hard
2) having an attorney manage the sale isnt hard

Maximizing value is where you left money on the table though. Thats something you as an owner are not capable of. If you are, lay it out to me.

 

[RUinPinehurst]

I agree on both.

1) finding the price isnt hard
2) having an attorney manage the sale isnt hard

Maximizing value is where you left money on the table though. Thats something you as an owner are not capable of. If you are, lay it out to me.

Look at current listings. Get an appraisal. Look at recent sales comps in the immediate area. Check on prices via recent transactions via your county's tax/deed outlets. Determine your price and add some wiggle room.

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

Look at current listings. Get an appraisal. Look at recent sales comps in the immediate area. Check on prices via recent transactions via your county's tax/deed outlets. Determine your price and add some wiggle room.

Again, finding the list price isnt hard haha.

How are you maximizing value to ensure youre not leaving money on the table?

 

[RUinPinehurst]

Again, finding the list price isnt hard haha.

How are you maximizing value to ensure youre not leaving money on the table?

Maybe, I don't know, see what the spread is in the immediate area/neighborhood between recent asking vs selling price? This is not difficult.

After determine the "maximum value" price, then it's best to consider/address curb appeal, decluttering/cleaning, eliminating personal materials in view, etc.

But, please, share exactly and specifically what you do to address same.

 

[yesrutgers01]

Again, finding the list price isnt hard haha.

How are you maximizing value to ensure youre not leaving money on the table?

I think you and skoolie are wasting your breath here. RUinpine obviously knows better and not going to change his mind.
Hell, my wife is a mortgage advisor in 15 states and we certainly used a realtor when selling. And I venture to guess my wife would be much more qualified to do a fsbo than pinehurst is. She just doesn't like losing money and or time in the sale which is also money.

 

[RutgersUnion]

As a broker there is nothing wrong with FSBO. I've turned down my share of customers over the years. It works both ways.

Some agents try to make up for social ineptitude with over coaching...

 

[RU Cheese]

I've always used and will always use a realtor - primarily because I'm lazy and it's not worth it not to.

However, I agree with the point @RUAldo is trying to make. Historically, a huge part of a Realtor's value proposition was knowing which houses were on the market, finding the right ones to show you, etc. You couldn't just go online to see pictures, comps, stats, etc. In those days, let's use 1992 as an example, the average realtor commission was 6%.

30 years later and the biggest value prop is gone. You can easily find houses on market, see pictures, etc. courtesy a myriad of sites. And yet Realtors still command 5%. I am not saying they aren't valuable nor am I shitting on anyone's profession. But I am highly surprised that figure hasn't dropped a lot more than it has...

EDIT: The 2020 average was 5.7% so it's barely moved.

 

[yesrutgers01]

I've always used and will always use a realtor - primarily because I'm lazy and it's not worth it not to.

However, I agree with the point @RUAldo is trying to make. Historically, a huge part of a Realtor's value proposition was knowing which houses were on the market, finding the right ones to show you, etc. You couldn't just go online to see pictures, comps, stats, etc. In those days, let's use 1992 as an example, the average realtor commission was 6%.

30 years later and the biggest value prop is gone. You can easily find houses on market, see pictures, etc. courtesy a myriad of sites. And yet Realtors still command 5%. I am not saying they aren't valuable nor am I shitting on anyone's profession. But I am highly surprised that figure hasn't dropped a lot more than it has...

In my are in Bergen Co...there is also a lot of houses that get sold without ever being on the market and you are not finding those on zillow. When we put our last house on the market, we used the top agent in the area(wife has known here for 30 years) never put up for sale signs and it was a private listing)...

 

[RU205]

In my are in Bergen Co...there is also a lot of houses that get sold without ever being on the market and you are not finding those on zillow. When we put our last house on the market, we used the top agent in the area(wife has known here for 30 years) never put up for sale signs and it was a private listing)...

This is accurate. I know a realtor that works for ReMax in NJ. She has a list of clients currently looking for houses. When a house is going on the market, especially Remax but other companies as well, she knows about it before a sign is up or it is posted online. I find it crazy, but offers are coming in before a sign is on the front lawn.

 

[RU Cheese]

In my are in Bergen Co...there is also a lot of houses that get sold without ever being on the market and you are not finding those on zillow. When we put our last house on the market, we used the top agent in the area(wife has known here for 30 years) never put up for sale signs and it was a private listing)...

That's a good counter, and it's certainly relevant in today's market from a buyers perspective. I don't see how that helps the seller maximize value though, nor justify the 5-6%.

 

[yesrutgers01]

That's a good counter, and it's certainly relevant in today's market from a buyers perspective. I don't see how that helps the seller maximize value though, nor justify the 5-6%.

Time is money…and if it is selling before listing…you are usually getting top dollar and it is obviously a quick sale.

 

[jtung230]

I’ll settle this

YMMV

 

[mildone]

I’ll settle this

YMMV

Hard to argue that. LOL

 

[RUskoolie]

Yeah. I'd check on the sponsors of those "studies." I certainly understand that there are plenty of very capable sales professionals. But the basic challenge to the whole industry is that the fees are just too high for what's involved, opening the door for capable and motivated individuals to bypass the traditional broker approach to selling, or buying for that matter. I self-managed the sale of my home in Cary NC to an IBM procurement director 20 years ago. We both felt the same about the traditional sales channels. She did not work with an agent. Nor did I.

I invite you to be a realtor and you will soon realize how ignorant just "opening a door" sounds. I have to do so much babysitting, psychologist, fire inspector, home inspector, attorney at times (because they can't do their job correct half the time) during each deal. Get your license and DM me and I'll interview you to join my brokerage.

 

[RUskoolie]

Wrong ! The secret is out. All pricing and closing information readily available for whoever wants it. If someone does the research beforehand and knows how to show and negotiate, no money need be lost.
In my case, all the realtors I spoke to said it was overpriced. But, I sold it without their “help” for the top price in my neighborhood. Much more than their listings sold for. That was 6 months ago and all sales since have been for less (using realtors). So it’s clear that I did not cost myself, rather it was a huge financial gain.

Then that was a good job, well done. But most do not do that. You're assuming the average human is financially savy and intelligent on top of it with experience in marketing and negotiation.

 

[yesrutgers01]

Then that was a good job, well done. But most do not do that. You're assuming the average human is financially savy and intelligent on top of it with experience in marketing and negotiation.

I think the problem I see when reading this thread is that some people have worked with crappy realtors. And we all know those people are out there.
But a good realtor can really be worth their money and more. And maybe a few people can navigate fsbo like you mention here but most likely 7-10 that try fsbo really shouldn't.
Our last house cost me about 80k in realtor fees and I can say it was worth every penny. There is no way either my wife or I could have brought in the right traffic to have done as well ourselves.

 

[RUinPinehurst]

I invite you to be a realtor and you will soon realize how ignorant just "opening a door" sounds. I have to do so much babysitting, psychologist, fire inspector, home inspector, attorney at times (because they can't do their job correct half the time) during each deal. Get your license and DM me and I'll interview you to join my brokerage.

I held a real-estate sales license in NJ (Colonia Century 21) during my junior and senior years at RU. It was lucrative but not exactly fulfilling otherwise, to me. It's a hustle. Not to diminish the value it offers to most sellers, but my point is many RU grads can do it themselves should they have business experience. Don't take it as a personal slight. As I admitted, the last home I sold via a very effective broker was worth the commission, as I didn't have the time to handle it myself, and I was residing a couple hundred miles away.

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

I held a real-estate sales license in NJ (Colonia Century 21) during my junior and senior years at RU. It was lucrative but not exactly fulfilling otherwise, to me. It's a hustle. Not to diminish the value it offers to most sellers, but my point is many RU grads can do it themselves should they have business experience. Don't take it as a personal slight. As I admitted, the last home I sold via a very effective broker was worth the commission, as I didn't have the time to handle it myself, and I was residing a couple hundred miles away.

youve yet to lay out how youd maximize value as a fsbo besides saying you can figure out the range of the list price.

Again, im telling you, ANYONE can sell a house for sale by owner, ANYONE. A good realtor maximizes your value and nets you more money than if you go fsbo. Fsbo’s have zero clue how to handle bidding wars let alone generate them.

 

[RUinPinehurst]

youve yet to lay out how youd maximize value as a fsbo besides saying you can figure out the range of the list price.

Again, im telling you, ANYONE can sell a house for sale by owner, ANYONE. A good realtor maximizes your value and nets you more money than if you go fsbo. Fsbo’s have zero clue how to handle bidding wars let alone generate them.

You must have overlooked my earlier post, at the completion of which I asked you to reciprocate and share the recipe for your secret sauce.

 

[yesrutgers01]

You must have overlooked my earlier post, at the completion of which I asked you to reciprocate and share the recipe for your secret sauce.

kyk and his family have been doing this for years- skoolie has quickly gotten to the point of being a broker/owner...they are not your 20 y/o RE agent that you were.
Hell- I have done some pretty good things for my self in the legal area when I wanted to go that way. You can almost google anything. I had a situation where I found a Statute of Limitation that the opposing council was not aware. But in another situation, I had council that knew who he knew, also, how to just play the bargaining game and got me better than I ever could have hoped for.

So, in real estate- maybe well worth the while to fsbo if you are flipping and have a good head on your shoulders. but an realtor is an investment if you are selling a home over 500k that you owned for 10 years and want to maximize and sell quick.

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

You must have overlooked my earlier post, at the completion of which I asked you to reciprocate and share the recipe for your secret sauce.

Id like you to first answer then I will

 

[RUskoolie]

This is accurate. I know a realtor that works for ReMax in NJ. She has a list of clients currently looking for houses. When a house is going on the market, especially Remax but other companies as well, she knows about it before a sign is up or it is posted online. I find it crazy, but offers are coming in before a sign is on the front lawn.

And that's exactly why realtors have value. The one listing I am fighting to get in Perth Amboy I am going to contact all my agents, and agents I know who have buyers looking in Perth Amboy before a stake even goes in the ground. Because of relationship building, their clients will get a chance to buy it first and maybe the seller will just take the offer or we''ll do open houses anyway. So I am helping my seller by getting them the value I told them we could get (or possibly more) and I am helping my network out.

A lot of realtors are not bright but the ignoramuses who think you just open a door and that's it, damn that bothers me.