ADVERTISEMENT

OT: Minor to Moderate Snowfall for Most Fri Night/Sat morning; then a frigid few days

RU848789

Legend
Gold Member
Jul 27, 2001
62,525
41,490
113
Metuchen, NJ
Normally, I might not start a thread for a minor event like this, but since the vast majority of the Philly-NJ-NYC area (outside of parts of NWNJ/NEPA/Hudson Valley, where several inches or more at the higher elevations have fallen) has received nada or just a dusting so far this winter (a miniscule 1/4" here in Metuchen) thought folks would be interested in the possibility of getting the first inch or so of snow this winter.

We have an approaching weak clipper system, which is forecast to interact with a low pressure system well offshore (via an inverted trough feature) bringing precip to the area from late Friday afternoon through Saturday morning, with areas well NW of 95 starting off as light snow, but temps will be above freezing everywhere else, so precip will likely start as light rain for everyone else, likely changing to snow by late Friday night as colder air moves in (except maybe at/near the coast, where the changeover will be hours later).

There isn't that much precip forecast (maybe 0.1-0.2"), so snowfall amounts will likely be in the 0.5-1.0" along/SE of 95 and maybe 1-2" NW of 95, especially N of 78/NW of 287 where there will be less rain; the NBM (National Blend of Models) snowfall forecast is below; the NWS discussion through Friday night (note that for the NWS Friday night means 6 pm Friday through 6 am Saturday) below is similar. Note that temps almost everywhere will be below 32F by late Friday night, so any snow that falls will likely also accumulate on paved surfaces, so driving Saturday morning could be slippery. Also, it's still quite possible that this system fizzles bringing very little precip/snow (as per a few models) and overperforming is also possible, bringing 2-3" for most (as per at least one model).

After this minor event, it's gonna get pretty damn cold with temps generally 10-15F below normal, i.e., with Saturday's highs around freezing and Sunday's highs in the 20s and Monday's highs around 30F, while lows Saturday and Sunday nights will be in the teens (and single digits well NW); wind chills most of this time will be about 10F colder than the air temps.

https://forecast.weather.gov/produc...&format=CI&version=1&glossary=1&highlight=off

Area Forecast Discussion
National Weather Service Mount Holly NJ
632 AM EST Wed Dec 18 2024

SHORT TERM /THURSDAY THROUGH FRIDAY NIGHT/...

Our attention then turns for the Friday through Friday night period
as our next weather system takes aim at the area. A deepening upper
trough will be approaching the area to close the week, which will be
accompanied with several shortwaves embedded in the flow. At the
surface, low pressure originating over the High Plains will traverse
across the southern Great Lakes region and approach our region by
Friday afternoon. Forecast guidance continues to trend a little
deeper with the primary shortwave, so as the low approaches, some
precipitation is expected to overspread the area. At the same time,
a secondary low will be developing a couple hundred miles off the
Mid-Atlantic coast and deepen rapidly as it lifts northeast;
enhanced by speed max rounding base of the upper trough.

With the low offshore remaining in `close enough` proximity to the
area, it is looking more likely that there will be some areas of
light rain and snow across the area on Friday into Friday night as
the initial low transitions its energy to the offshore low. As a
result, PoPs have increased slightly (~40-60%). In addition, some
forecast guidance indicates the development of an inverted /
Norlun trough set-up on the northwest side of the offshore low.
This would enhance precipitation across portions of the area,
however, it is uncertain where or if this feature is to even
develop at this time. For now, the best chance of observing
accumulating snow will be across the Lehigh Valley, northern New
Jersey and in the Poconos where temperatures will be cooler
through the duration of the event. Snow totals in these areas
will range between 1-2", locally up to 3". Light accumulations
of a dusting up to 1" are possible across the remainder of New
Jersey, Pennsylvania and northern Delaware as rain transitions
to snow on Friday night as temperatures cool below/near
freezing.


PMyZPm8.png
 
Last edited:
definitely worth the thread given the potential for an inch or two even in the northern parts, as you said, it could fizzle too but peeps should have the heads up given the possibility to get some accumulating snow to impact travel Friday night.
 
  • Like
Reactions: RU848789
Zarrow

There is also a chance for some "enhanced dynamics" over New Jersey. In other words, a pocket of juicy air, conducive to brief pockets of heavier snow.

At the moment, I am thinking widespread light snow accumulations are likely across the state, on the order of 1-2". Higher amounts are possible, especially if colder temperatures prevail and/or that heavier snow band possibility sets up. (I will hold off on drawing a specific snow map for another day — let's see how things continue to develop.)

All in all, this potential snow event is minor. An inch or two is hardly anything to make a fuss over. However, this increasing chance of snow/ice warrants extra attention for two reasons. First, the timing — Friday is a big getaway day and a big travel day, heading into the last weekend before Christmas. And second, it is our best chance of widespread snow so far this season. That alone justifies some raised eyebrows and added excitement.
 
Be nice to get a bit of snow for the Christmas season as long as it doesn't become the good ol' Jersey Ice.
 
definitely worth the thread given the potential for an inch or two even in the northern parts, as you said, it could fizzle too but peeps should have the heads up given the possibility to get some accumulating snow to impact travel Friday night.
I remember that one in November a couple of years back that people underestimated. It hit during mid-afternoon through rush hour and everything was a mess. Think it overperformed too.
 
I remember that one in November a couple of years back that people underestimated. It hit during mid-afternoon through rush hour and everything was a mess. Think it overperformed too.

If that's the one I remember, it was in 2018. I left my office in Summit late afternoon, maybe 3:30pm, and it took me almost 5 hours to get home to just Scotch Plains by North Edison.

That was a mess. They had done nothing to treat the roads. I wound up stopping for gas in New Providence a couple hours into my trip and then if I recall somewhere around Berkeley Heights a train hit a car to boot. I wound up back in Summit and none of the hilly roads to go down from the 78 area to the 22 area were open or passable or had accidents. Wound up going all the way to Bridgewater to get to 22 and go home. Nightmare trip!
 
If that's the one I remember, it was in 2018. I left my office in Summit late afternoon, maybe 3:30pm, and it took me almost 5 hours to get home to just Scotch Plains by North Edison.

That was a mess. They had done nothing to treat the roads. I wound up stopping for gas in New Providence a couple hours into my trip and then if I recall somewhere around Berkeley Heights a train hit a car to boot. I wound up back in Summit and none of the hilly roads to go down from the 78 area to the 22 area were open or passable or had accidents. Wound up going all the way to Bridgewater to get to 22 and go home. Nightmare trip!
That's the one!
 
  • Like
Reactions: MulletCork
I remember that one in November a couple of years back that people underestimated. It hit during mid-afternoon through rush hour and everything was a mess. Think it overperformed too.
There's about zero likelihood (ok, maybe 0.01%) of this storm overperforming like the Nov-2018 storm (which delivered 5-8" for most, all during the afternoon making the mess you mentioned) or like this past February's inverted trough deathband storm that gave folks 8-13" between roughly 78 and a Ewing to Long Branch line, but only 3-6" for almost everyone else. Overperforming for this one looks like 2-3".
 
definitely worth the thread given the potential for an inch or two even in the northern parts, as you said, it could fizzle too but peeps should have the heads up given the possibility to get some accumulating snow to impact travel Friday night.
Hope you make as much $ possible this winter. Just keep it north of here and all is good.
 
There's about zero likelihood (ok, maybe 0.01%) of this storm overperforming like the Nov-2018 storm (which delivered 5-8" for most, all during the afternoon making the mess you mentioned) or like this past February's inverted trough deathband storm that gave folks 8-13" between roughly 78 and a Ewing to Long Branch line, but only 3-6" for almost everyone else. Overperforming for this one looks like 2-3".
Was that February storm the one that fell Friday night into Saturday morning? It melted from the roads pretty quickly if I remember correctly.
 
Almost no chance of no snow in Philly but let's talk about the winds on Saturday. Sustained winds in the 20/30 mph range. I could make a bike ride from Lindenwold to AC in under 2 hours if I was crazy. Sometimes I am. But too cold for that nonsense.
 
Was that February storm the one that fell Friday night into Saturday morning? It melted from the roads pretty quickly if I remember correctly.
Was a Friday night into Saturday morning (mostly 2/17). Here's the thread if you want to relive it. Top 5 all-time storm for me, partly because it was a huge unexpected positive bust (and I like snow, duh) and partly because for several hours it was some of the highest intensity, fluffiest snow I've ever seen.

https://rutgers.forums.rivals.com/t...expect-slick-roads.273969/page-5#post-6704479

snow_20240216_20240217.png
 
Last edited:
Was a Thursday night into Friday morning (mostly 2/17). Here's the thread if you want to relive it. Top 5 all-time storm for me, partly because it was a huge unexpected positive bust (and I like snow, duh) and partly because for several hours it was some of the highest intensity, fluffiest snow I've ever seen.

https://rutgers.forums.rivals.com/t...expect-slick-roads.273969/page-5#post-6704479

snow_20240216_20240217.png
Quick look, you just scared the crap out of me. Flying out of Newark 8 a.m. Saturday. No snow, please!!!
 
Latest NWS snowfall prediction map; still looking like a <1" event for everyone S of 78 and E of 287 between 78 and NY, with 1-2" likely N of 78/NW of 287 and 2-3" for far NWNJ/Poconos/Catskills. However, the NBM (model blend) map shows greater snowfall across the board, although the NWS does discuss the potential for this storm to overperform and deliver 3-4" for areas that get great banding due to the inverted trough feature (that's what drove the big snows in Feb-2024, although this system looks a lot less powerful than that one.

PHI_Snow.png


snowfall_acc-imp.us_ma.png
 
  • Like
Reactions: Knight Shift
I should do that more often, lol. You'll likely have light snow falling at 8 am Sat at EWR, but nothing that should impact flights.
Good to hear. Mid to high 60s where we are heading in Arizona. Still undecided on slogging 2 hours to PHX and 2 hours back to Sedona for bowl game. Have a lot of other stuff planned with family.
 
Was a Thursday night into Friday morning (mostly 2/17). Here's the thread if you want to relive it. Top 5 all-time storm for me, partly because it was a huge unexpected positive bust (and I like snow, duh) and partly because for several hours it was some of the highest intensity, fluffiest snow I've ever seen.

https://rutgers.forums.rivals.com/t...expect-slick-roads.273969/page-5#post-6704479

snow_20240216_20240217.png
February 17, 2024 was a Saturday. We had a big blood drive starting that morning and remember being concerned about the numbers because of the surprise storm.
 
  • Like
Reactions: RU848789
Zarrow 101.5 No Jersey 1-2 maybe 3-4 localized
Central 1 in or possibly more localized
So Jersey Dusting

MILF's at Hillsborough Deli not impressed this morning.
 
News12 is calling for 1-2" for most of cnj/nenj/NYC (except <1" at the nj coast) and 2-4" N and W of 287 (N of 78). NBM looks similar as do most models, but not all as some are showing 1/2"-1" for most, which is likely why the NWS is on the low side.

1-2" seems like a good call for most, at this time, but I suspect we'll see some 3-4" amounts where the best bands set up and if that occurs (far from certain) impacts will be more significant with temps around 32F leading to road accumulations through the morning.
 
News12 is calling for 1-2" for most of cnj/nenj/NYC (except <1" at the nj coast) and 2-4" N and W of 287 (N of 78). NBM looks similar as do most models, but not all as some are showing 1/2"-1" for most, which is likely why the NWS is on the low side.

1-2" seems like a good call for most, at this time, but I suspect we'll see some 3-4" amounts where the best bands set up and if that occurs (far from certain) impacts will be more significant with temps around 32F leading to road accumulations through the morning.
No major changes in the NWS forecast with the 1" line going from near Reading PA to about Bridgewater and then NE somewhat along 287 to Rdigewood and then over to Nyack, NY, with 1-2" N/W of that arc and <1" S/E of that arc, but their discussion still talks about the possibility for 1-2" for most of the 95 corridor, even to the coast and 2-4" for areas along/N of 78 (and NW of 287), which would be more like what News12 and Zarrow are saying, as well as what the NBM is showing. Lee Goldberg's forecast is very similar to the NWS forecast.

At the very least, it looks like the first accumulating snow for most along and SE of 95 in NJ and SEPA, even if it's only 1/2-1", but the error bars on the snowfall forecast at this time are probably as much as the forecast for most, i.e., a 1" +/-1" forecast means anything from 0-2" could fall and not be a major surprise. My NWS forecast is for 0.8" in Metuchen.

oHSue0q.png
 
Normally, I might not start a thread for a minor event like this, but since the vast majority of the Philly-NJ-NYC area (outside of parts of NWNJ/NEPA/Hudson Valley, where several inches or more at the higher elevations have fallen) has received nada or just a dusting so far this winter (a miniscule 1/4" here in Metuchen) thought folks would be interested in the possibility of getting the first inch or so of snow this winter.

We have an approaching weak clipper system, which is forecast to interact with a low pressure system well offshore (via an inverted trough feature) bringing precip to the area from late Friday afternoon through Saturday morning, with areas well NW of 95 starting off as light snow, but temps will be above freezing everywhere else, so precip will likely start as light rain for everyone else, likely changing to snow by late Friday night as colder air moves in (except maybe at/near the coast, where the changeover will be hours later).

There isn't that much precip forecast (maybe 0.1-0.2"), so snowfall amounts will likely be in the 0.5-1.0" along/SE of 95 and maybe 1-2" NW of 95, especially N of 78/NW of 287 where there will be less rain; the NBM (National Blend of Models) snowfall forecast is below; the NWS discussion through Friday night (note that for the NWS Friday night means 6 pm Friday through 6 am Saturday) below is similar. Note that temps almost everywhere will be below 32F by late Friday night, so any snow that falls will likely also accumulate on paved surfaces, so driving Saturday morning could be slippery. Also, it's still quite possible that this system fizzles bringing very little precip/snow (as per a few models) and overperforming is also possible, bringing 2-3" for most (as per at least one model).

After this minor event, it's gonna get pretty damn cold with temps generally 10-15F below normal, i.e., with Saturday's highs around freezing and Sunday's highs in the 20s and Monday's highs around 30F, while lows Saturday and Sunday nights will be in the teens (and single digits well NW); wind chills most of this time will be about 10F colder than the air temps.

https://forecast.weather.gov/produc...&format=CI&version=1&glossary=1&highlight=off

Area Forecast Discussion
National Weather Service Mount Holly NJ
632 AM EST Wed Dec 18 2024

SHORT TERM /THURSDAY THROUGH FRIDAY NIGHT/...

Our attention then turns for the Friday through Friday night period
as our next weather system takes aim at the area. A deepening upper
trough will be approaching the area to close the week, which will be
accompanied with several shortwaves embedded in the flow. At the
surface, low pressure originating over the High Plains will traverse
across the southern Great Lakes region and approach our region by
Friday afternoon. Forecast guidance continues to trend a little
deeper with the primary shortwave, so as the low approaches, some
precipitation is expected to overspread the area. At the same time,
a secondary low will be developing a couple hundred miles off the
Mid-Atlantic coast and deepen rapidly as it lifts northeast;
enhanced by speed max rounding base of the upper trough.

With the low offshore remaining in `close enough` proximity to the
area, it is looking more likely that there will be some areas of
light rain and snow across the area on Friday into Friday night as
the initial low transitions its energy to the offshore low. As a
result, PoPs have increased slightly (~40-60%). In addition, some
forecast guidance indicates the development of an inverted /
Norlun trough set-up on the northwest side of the offshore low.
This would enhance precipitation across portions of the area,
however, it is uncertain where or if this feature is to even
develop at this time. For now, the best chance of observing
accumulating snow will be across the Lehigh Valley, northern New
Jersey and in the Poconos where temperatures will be cooler
through the duration of the event. Snow totals in these areas
will range between 1-2", locally up to 3". Light accumulations
of a dusting up to 1" are possible across the remainder of New
Jersey, Pennsylvania and northern Delaware as rain transitions
to snow on Friday night as temperatures cool below/near
freezing.


PMyZPm8.png
Thread for a dusting?

serious-jeffrey-dean-morgan.gif


Almost not worth trolling. Almost.
 
Thread for a dusting?

serious-jeffrey-dean-morgan.gif


Almost not worth trolling. Almost.
No, the last two threads started by your buddy Tango were for dustings for 90% of this region. This thread is for much more than a dusting (1/2" to an inch or more, which is still not a lot, but way more than s dusting) for just about everyone in the region. C'mon, you know you're excited for this one.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Knight Shift
Interested to see if it hangs on the lawns through Christmas Eve.
My guess is anything over 1" will still leave some cover on lawns in some shade through Christmas Eve, given temps below 32F through Tuesday at noon and then only going into the mid/upper 30s Tues afternoon. There will be lots of sun though for this stretch, so unlikely snow in direct sun for much of the day will survive (unless it's 2+"). There's also the chance for 1" or so of snow on Christmas Eve afternoon, mostly N of 78.
 
  • Like
Reactions: RUPete
My guess is anything over 1" will still leave some cover on lawns in some shade through Christmas Eve, given temps below 32F through Tuesday at noon and then only going into the mid/upper 30s Tues afternoon. There will be lots of sun though for this stretch, so unlikely snow in direct sun for much of the day will survive (unless it's 2+"). There's also the chance for 1" or so of snow on Christmas Eve afternoon, mostly N of 78.
Hope we get 2 so it hangs on but I doubt that will happen by me - No. Plfd.
 
Going to be interesting to see what the NWS and other forecasters do with the latest model info. While the 12Z and 18Z models were all over the place between very little snow for most in this area (especially CNJ) to 1-2" for most, tonight's 0Z models are coming in with close to a consensus, so far, of 1-2" with spots up to 3" for pretty much everywhere from 276/195 northward through all of EPA/NJ/NYC metro (so far that includes the NAM, HRRR, GFS, CMC, RDPS and HRDPS; UK/Euro still not out yet).

Note that for anyone near and along the 95 corridor any snow that falls in the late afternoon through probably mid-evening tomorrow will likely not accumulate with above 32F temps and lighter intensity; areas N of 78/NW of 287 might see some slushy accumulations and areas well NW will definitely see some minor accumulations. The main window for accumulating snow for most of CNJ/NENJ/NYC is after about 11 pm through 8-9 am, as temps drop towards 32F. And the big wildcard is where the more intense snowbands set up. Might be a general 1-1.5" snowfall for most but 2-3"+ where those bands hit.

Lee Goldberg expanded his 1-3" area a bit, now including northern Mercer and all of Somerset/Hunterdon/Morris/Passaic/NW Bergen and N and W of those counties, with <1" for the rest of CNJ (including the coast) and into SNJ, plus NENJ along and SE of 95 and NYC/LI. I predict the NWS will also expand their 1-2" areas SE-ward to the 95 corridor from Trenton to NYC. We'll see in a few hours.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Knight Shift
I've stopped private forecasting for a couple years now. Being on the outside looking in, it's clear how many people put out forecasts to try to maintain relevance in the space. You back out and watch the scene from 1000' and it becomes pretty clear. Tomorrow is a great example. It's going to snow a little bit. Anyone driving with a shred of common sense and or experience with a mundane mid-Atlantic winter will shrug and get on with their afternoon and evening.
 
I've stopped private forecasting for a couple years now. Being on the outside looking in, it's clear how many people put out forecasts to try to maintain relevance in the space. You back out and watch the scene from 1000' and it becomes pretty clear. Tomorrow is a great example. It's going to snow a little bit. Anyone driving with a shred of common sense and or experience with a mundane mid-Atlantic winter will shrug and get on with their afternoon and evening.

You say that as if NJ drivers are known for common sense 😄
 
  • Haha
Reactions: RU848789
Going from Somerset County, to Queens, to Patterson then back home to Monmouth County today from 9am-5pm
The joys of sales lol
How will the roads be?
 
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT