Hmmm
I did not know he said that
Nothing in todays world of college athletics would be surprising
But UF leaving, at least on the surface, would shock me
Pac12 dissolution discussion
- Thread starter rotorocker
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I did not know he said that
Nothing in todays world of college athletics would be surprising
But UF leaving, at least on the surface, would shock me
It's always about $$$, but if the B1G can be so big that it controls most of the county and most of the larger markets and brands, then it begins to dictate things. IMO, you need at least 4 schools out west. that would be USC-UCLA, then pick 2. Washington brings AAU, the largest market and traditional football success. How much of the PAC12 $$$ flows to the B1G if you also add Oregon and 1/2 more?? When the major networks aren't paying for the ACC and the PAC, does that $$ get distributed to the B1G/SEC when they've swallowed the larger brands? That would offset some of the extra mouths to feed. Also, will the presidents not look at every dollar when consolidating some of the best academic/athletic schools in the nation. Overall $$$ increases, but per school drops 10% for example.
If/when the ACC GOR expires in the future, you said the B1G would look south. UNC is the obvious first choice. Despite what you think, I'll bet you $100 that if/when UNC goes to B1G, UVA will also.
national titles in Baksetball-2019, Lacrosse-2021/2019/2011, Baseball-2015, Soccer-2014 and several more in Tennis/Rowing/Swimming, along with being a top 5 public school in a growing state with growing demographics.
All this will force the hand of ND, but even without them I believe 2-4 more schools would be in the mix for a magic number of 24. at that point the B1G can do whatever it wants with scheduling/contracts etc as it will control most of the country, along with the finest academic and athletic brands.
Almost most every post with speculation about adding teams is making the assumption that state schools can be split, with one getting the W and the other a big L. I am talking about Wash/WashST, Oregon/OreST, Az/AzST, NC/NcST, UVA/VaTech. Doesn't anyone foresee a battle like UCLA had? Wasn't there a recent article posted where one of the state schools, maybe AZ, said they were tied to the other state school?
Your post made me realize that Notre Dame is not an AAU institution. I doubt that would matter to the Big Ten because the school is elite in other ways, for instance, its focus on undergraduate education and, it's, er, Notre Dame, not just some garden variety applicant. But who knows?
Cal and UCLA both are governed by the Regents of the University of California, and so the Regents thought about what was best for both schools. I think this is a distinctive set-up - that in Washington, for instance, Washington and Washington State are wholly separate.
seems to me they have the same governor and legislature. Do you remember the VA/VaTech dust up over VA Tech getting into the ACC?
Good point -- yes, I do. That was a somewhat different situation as I recall. U.Va. was already in the ACC and pressure was put on it to make sure that Va. Tech got into the ACC when Miami and Boston College jumped from the Big East. The result was that Syracuse didn't get into the ACC when Miami and BC did. Perhaps similarly the, say, Washington legislature would say to U. Washington that you aren't going anywhere without Washington State.
Exactly. But maybe the legislature and governor would be willing to pay that price -- to say to one school, "you can't jump the Pac-10 and leave the other school in the lurch." It's more likely that what will happen would be what happened in California, where UCLA got to jump, but has to pay Cal for at least some of the damage Cal will suffer. Similarly, U. Washington might have to pay for some of the damage Washington State would suffer. After all, the Regents weren't willing to veto UCLA to protect Cal, and the same would likely happen elsewhere.
If California didn’t do it,Washington, Oregon, North Carolina and Virginia aren’t doing it. This is a different animal from Va.- Va tech. Virginia was a voting member who could block the other schools from getting in. They could have blocked all ACC expansion. Letting one of the best teams in the Big East in early,not a big deal.
At this point it is a lifeline for any school getting an invite. The school left behind might get some financial benefits from the school that got the nod.
The stakes are to high for any school or state to say no. Just look what membership has done for Rutgers and the State of NJ.
At this point it is a lifeline for any school getting an invite. The school left behind might get some financial benefits from the school that got the nod.
The stakes are to high for any school or state to say no. Just look what membership has done for Rutgers and the State of NJ.
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Westerners are asking the same question. But there will always be somewhere to go, even if it's the Mountain West conference.
Not sure what you mean by “whole”.
I’m sure you’d agree that Miami brings a great market that extends the BIG footprint, impressive academics, outstanding sports including an historic football program and an athlete rich area that all teams could better mine for BIG players
The Big Ten should be open to non-AAU universities under the right circumstances
AAU Membership is valuable but should not serve as a gatekeeper.
www.thechampaignroom.com
Old news and disseminated way before this was written. Texas hip tied to OK is interestingCame across this article from a couple years ago. If true it explains why Texas went to the SEC with Oklahoma. A package deal.The Big Ten should be open to non-AAU universities under the right circumstances
AAU Membership is valuable but should not serve as a gatekeeper.
Very poorly written and researched article as well
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I would agree with you that Miami wouldn’t be at the front of the B1G expansion list, however, why not give some logic and reason as to why not. Better still, give YOUR perspective as to what schools would be on the list and why. You’ve made claims to having friends in The B1G office, but you haven’t said what you think will happen. You said the B1G would look south to expand without naming schools. Do you think other western schools will eventually be added? What do you think the number is when GOR dust settles? I’ve stated my view at 24 and offered thoughts as to why
Why you have to be condescending to anyone offering THEIR OPINION. That’s what a message board if for. If you truly have some amazing insight, then let’s hear it instead of trashing everyone else’s opinion
Yea, it’s not the same. UVA’s vote was critical and necessary to ACC expansion back then. There were two other no votes IIRC and UVA’s would’ve been a third and blocked expansion. They had leverage to get VT in.
There’s no such leverage play from any school within the conference to block a move and there would be no motive for one either.
Only state politics can make a huff but it would likely be inconsequential. Oklahoma left, USC and UCLA are leaving, Texas left so it’s not likely anything would stop a move.
What I gather reading the UNC boards, they believe as long as North Carolina State ends up in a good conference, they should be alright to make a move. They (UNC) knows they are tied to NC State through the legislature. And the legislature will NOT allow UNC to do something that could harm NC State.
IF, a big if, if UNC went to the Big 10 and NC State could go to the SEC. They believe it could fly. But if UNC went SEC and the only option is the Big 12 for NC State, not so much.
I believe the SEC desires UNC but would be willing to take NC State. Gets their foot in the door of the state. NC State might be a better fit (football wise).
I believe is the same for Virginia and Virginia Tech. As long as Virginia Tech has a good landing spot, they are good (see NC State). The major difference is that I just don't believe Virginia would ever go to the SEC. Have read on their boards, they are the home of the honor code and they take that very seriously. Commenters on there board believe they would go independent before going to the SEC. They prefer the ACC and I believe they would stay there if possible. Next preference is the Big 10, better fit academically and better fit for their Olympic sports.
IF, a big if, if UNC went to the Big 10 and NC State could go to the SEC. They believe it could fly. But if UNC went SEC and the only option is the Big 12 for NC State, not so much.
I believe the SEC desires UNC but would be willing to take NC State. Gets their foot in the door of the state. NC State might be a better fit (football wise).
I believe is the same for Virginia and Virginia Tech. As long as Virginia Tech has a good landing spot, they are good (see NC State). The major difference is that I just don't believe Virginia would ever go to the SEC. Have read on their boards, they are the home of the honor code and they take that very seriously. Commenters on there board believe they would go independent before going to the SEC. They prefer the ACC and I believe they would stay there if possible. Next preference is the Big 10, better fit academically and better fit for their Olympic sports.
Independent? It seems to me that only school with storied traditions like Army and Notre Dame can survive as independent. Lots of schools are willing to schedule teams like that. Who will care about playing Virginia? They need the ACC to survive or for the Big Ten to want them.
Edit: BTW, UNC and NC State are part of a common system run by a single Board of Trustees, so it's a situation like Cal and UCLA where the governing board cares about both schools. That makes it easier for one school to have leverage over the other. https://catalog.unc.edu/about/unc-system/
LOL on UVA.....OK so what are your schools if the B1G expands? Let's hear your thoughts on what the next 2-4-6-8 schools will be, given those expansion choices. Instead of mocking everyone's picks, let's hear yours.......
I asked this and he replied FSU UNC ND Stanford which I think is a realistic scenario if they stop at 20.
I think anything from 20-24 is possible when all is said and done.
Wow didn’t realize you were such a know it all douchebag
Guys like you are almost always wrong , then hide
Lol they park their hoops and Olympic teams in the BE and once Mora gets poached away if they eke their way to another meaningless bowl game, they'll be back to being irrelevant in football.
that combination of schools is the only that adds to the value for each school. No other combo, realistic combo, keeps the member schools whole.
Blown away that people simply don't understand this here.
As I said before, there are 3 schools that would add value (equal to or greater than $75 Million). That would be Notre Dame, Texas and Texas A&M. UNC and FSU would be nice adds BUT no way equal to or greater than $75 million. We know for a fact that Stanford isn't anywhere close or they would have been added.
Stanford doesn't add anywhere close to $75-80 mil in value. ND is the only school out there that brings that type of value left to be poached, now if they insist on bringing a Stanford with them then you can live with it.
I know people are cutting the cord, but people still have cable. Doesn't Stanford give us a higher premium in Northern California or do the LA Schools cover the state?
If cables still count and we would get a higher carriage fee in San Fran area, plus their Academic clout is through the roof, wouldn't they make more sense than Washington or Oregon?
If cables still count and we would get a higher carriage fee in San Fran area, plus their Academic clout is through the roof, wouldn't they make more sense than Washington or Oregon?
mosito, from what I have read. Washington and Oregon are the next in value in the PAC, and they are only worth about $80 million for the two of them. Meaning Stanford is less than that.
The remaining PAC schools have been valued in $25 million per school from what has been reported. The high end might be as high as $31 million IF Apple buys the package. And that would be limited and streaming (low visibility). And that is with Washington and Oregon valued in the $40 million range a piece.
Those schools, maybe not Stanford so much, do add individual value but I don't just look at that only. Like I said why is the NFL in Jacksonville? Why does hockey have teams in some warm weather climates? The pro leagues have teams in small markets or places you might not expect and they still make a ton of money. Why do they do that? I don't know but I just look at it in simple terms of having greater reach and trying to touch all corners of the country.
I see some above talking about how if the school doesn't add 75M then it's not on the list etc...I think that's part of it but also that's a basic way of looking at it. That number will grow with each contract regardless. Next would it be, if they don't add 85M then it's not on the list and so on with each contract...
I look at it more holistically beyond just the individual current value. I look at it as can this candidate increase our reach and coverage of the country and can they add to the value collective as a whole vs the individual value they bring. For west coast schools, if you only have 2 or 3 schools, you probably don't have enough inventory for a late night package that could be sold to the networks. However, if you had 4-5 west coast schools then you probably would have enough inventory to sell such a package. An example of bringing value to the whole where individually they might not. If you have enough schools and inventory maybe you can also add a Friday night package to sell. Again a possible benefit when taken as a whole vs the individual.
IMO, it all depends on how bold they're willing to be. If you're going to be national then "be national". They've already gone a step in the direction of the NFL with regards to how they distributed their inventory across the 3 broadcast networks. It can be taken further both structurally and how things are marketed and sold. The NFL has a bunch of teams across the country in big and small markets and slices and dices their inventory across many packages out for bid. The B10 can follow suit and IMO it would be lucrative as well. It's just a matter of whether they're willing to take further steps and be that bold. College presidents are generally conservative so I don't know.
Let me add that football is a lot more important to U.Va than it is to U. Conn. U.Conn does play a decent schedule, but I don't know whether that kind of schedule would satisfy U.Va fans. U. Va has a long rivalry with U.Md and U.NC (both contiguous states), and I don't know if being an independent would let U.Va fans continue to be rivals with those schools the way they'd like to be.
I feel, eventually there will be 24 B1G members and it might look like this :
East: Rutgers- Penn St -Ohio State- Michigan State, Indiana & Purdue,
Midwest : Northwestern, Iowa , Minnesota , Wisconsin , Nebraska, & Notre Dame
West UCLA ,USC Cal, Stanford , Oregon & Washington
South: Maryland ,Virginia ,Georgia Tech , North Carolina ,Clemson & FSU
I think they are relegated to being a basketball school. They will never be relevant in football.
Yes in the context of this thread your right that is not a viable option for Virginia.
guess I missed a big one, sorry about that, how about scratching Notre Dame who will fight to be independent in football and put Michigan in the midwest
I like who you have (maybe Miami vs Clemson). But I believe they will go division less. Take the top 8 teams, seed them 1 thru 8 and have your own playoff. 3 more weeks of games, 7 more total games - how much more would that generate. By taking the top 8 schools, it leaves hope and chance to the last week a school could still qualify for the conference playoffs.
With a conference of 24 schools, you could add Friday & Saturday night games. Again how much more would this generate.
Fine by me as long as both Clemson and FSU end up in AAU within 5 years of entry.
